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Electric vehicles => Electric cars => Topic started by: armagdn03 on October 11, 2007, 05:18:19 PM

Title: Teslas electric car
Post by: armagdn03 on October 11, 2007, 05:18:19 PM
I have heard alot of discusion lately about teslas famed electric car. The consensus seems to be that he had some sort of on board power source that powered the car.

Is there any actual evedence of this? Tesla was a master of transmiting energy to distant locations, so would it not be more likely that he had some sort of reciever in the car and that its source of power was back in his lab?

Just wondered what you all thought
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: hansvonlieven on October 11, 2007, 10:40:01 PM
G'day all,

Far from being a forgotten technology, as Mr. Trinkaus claims, magnetic amplifiers are still extensively used in industry. For a general rundown on the device I have included a few links for those of you that are interested. Hope you find this helpful.

Hans von Lieven

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_amplifier   (general desription)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_amplifier   (amplifier design)

http://www.elnamagnetics.com/library/square.pdf      (supply of specialised toroids includes circuit diagram)

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 22, 2011, 05:52:37 AM
This topic was brought up on another thread and I thought this thread should be brought back to life to keep the other thread from becoming hijacked. Here is the information I have at this time.

Tesla's Electric Car

Excerpt from: "The Forgotten Art of Electric-Powered Automobiles" by Arthur Abrom

..But, back to our electric automobiles -- in 1931, under the financing of Pierce-Arrow and George Westinghouse, a 1931 Pierce-Arrow was selected to be tested at the factory grounds in Buffalo, NY. The standard internal combustion engine was removed and an 80-hp 1800  rpm electric motor installed to the clutch and transmission. The AC motor measured 40 inches long and 30 inches in diameter and the power leads were left standing in the air -- no external power source!

At the appointed time, Nikola Tesla  arrived from New York City and inspected the Pierce-Arrow automobile.  He then went to a local radio store and purchased a handful of tubes (12), wires and assorted resistors. A box measuring 24 inches long, 12 inches wide and 6 inches high was assembled housing the circuit. The box was placed on the front  seat and had its wires connected to the air-cooled, brushless motor. Two rods 1/4" in diameter stuck out of the box about 3" in length.

Mr. Tesla got into the driver's seat, pushed the two rods in and stated, "We now have power". He put the car into gear and it moved forward! This vehicle, powered by an AC  motor, was driven to speeds of 90 mph. and  performed better than any internal combustion engine of its day! One week was spent testing the vehicle.  Several newspapers in Buffalo reported this test. When asked where the power came from, Tesla replied, "From the ethers all around us". Several people suggested that Tesla was mad and somehow in league with sinister forces of the universe. He became incensed, removed his mysterious box from the vehicle and returned to his laboratory in New York City. His secret died with him!

It is speculated that Nikola Tesla was able to somehow harness the earth's magnetic field that encompasses our planet. And, he somehow was able to draw tremendous amounts of power by cutting these lines of force or causing them to be multiplied together. The exact nature of his device remains a mystery but it did actually function by powering the 80 hp AC motor in the Pierce Arrow at speeds up to 90 m.p.h. and no recharging was ever necessary!

~~~~~~~

"Information about an Invention by Dr. Nikola Tesla, which is said to have harnessed Cosmic Energy" (Unidentified document circulated in the early 1980s)

The following is a summary of an interview on 16 September 1967 of Peter Savo, a nephew of Dr. Nikola Tesla, by Derek Ahlers, an aeronautical engineer. An attempt was made to record Peter's answers to 36 questions prepared in advance. However, Peter talked very freely, in a somewhat rambling fashion, and repeatedly provided the answers before the questions were asked. In addition, since Mr Savo and Mr Ahlers have known each other for some 10 years, the subject had previously been discussed and some of this earlier information is included.

Peter Savo was born in Knim, Yugoslavia, just before the turn of the century. As Yugoslavia was then a part of Austria, he entered the Austrian army and learned to fly at the military flying school at Wiener Neustadt. After World War 1 he emigrated to Italy.

Dr Nikola Tesla was Peter's uncle on his mother's side. It was he who suggested that Peter come to the United States. He met Peter at the boat on arrival and seems to have taken a fatherly interest in him until his death…

Sometime in 1931, Dr Tesla took Peter to Buffalo, NY for the unveiling and final testing of a new kind of automobile. Dr. Tesla acted somewhat mysteriously about it, would tell Peter nothing in advance, and even after he had seen the car, answered some of his questions with "Don't as any questions".

The car turned out to be a standard Pierce Arrow, with the engine removed and certain other components installed instead. The standard Clutch, gear box and drive train remained installed.

Under the hood, there was a brushless electric motor, connected to the engine [?]. The engine was said to measure 40" long by 28" diameter. However, some of these figures may be estimates. Tesla would not divulge who made the motor.

Set into the dash was a "power receiver" consisting of a box measuring about 24" long by 10" wide by 6" high, containing 12 radio tubes. Three of these tubes were model 70-L-7. A vertical antenna consisting of a 6-foot rod, was installed and connected to the power receiver.

The receiver, in turn, was connected to the motor by two heavy, conspicuous cables. Two "spindles" (rods?) about 1/4" diameter by 3" long protruded form the receiver towards the driver. Tesla pushed these in before starting and said: "We now have power". These spindles were in line with the two power cables coming out of the back of the unit and presumable worked to separate power switches.

There was a 12-volt Willard battery installed in the car, but it was for the lights only and much too small to run the car. In any case, the motor was an AC motor.

Peter said that Dr Tesla had built the power receiver himself in his hotel room, and carried it to Buffalo. The motor was built for him by some unknown company. The motor was completely enclosed and when Peter first saw it, it was stopped. Later, after the engine was running, Dr Tesla asked Peter to look under the hood to check whether the fan was running. Peter asked what the fan was for and was told that "The engine is running pretty hot". Maximum engine speed was 1800 rpm. Power rating was 80 hp.

To start the car, Dr Tesla handed Peter an ignition-type key. Peter inserted it and a green light came on, on the dash. Dr Tesla thereupon said: "The engine is now in motion". The engine could not be heard from the driver's seat at all. When listening under the hood with the engine on, there was a slight hum. The standard accelerator pedal was used to control engine speed. Clutch, brake and gearshift were unchanged.

The instruments on the dash appeared to be standard ones. However, there was a voltmeter which was used to measure output of the receiver. Dr Tesla commented that the receiver had enough reserve power so that you could drive the car next to a house, connect the wiring, and light up the whole house. There was also some kind of hydraulic pressure gauge on the dash. Peter asked its purpose but Dr Tesla would not tell him.

Peter drove the car for about 50 miles at speeds up to 90 mph (the speedometer was calibrated to 120 mph). Power seemed at least as good as the normal Pierce Arrow engine. Acceleration in second gear seemed particularly good. Shifting gears seemed somewhat smoother than with a normal engine.

Dr Tesla seemed enthusiastic on the first test ride and said, "Peter, this day will make history!" When Peter questioned the source of the energy to drive the car, Dr Tesla said: "It is a mysterious radiation that comes out of the ether." He said that he did not know where it came from but that it seemed to be available in limitless quantitites and that mankind should be thankful for it as it would soon drive boats, cars, trains and planes. Dr Tesla and Peter spent 8 days in Buffalo, testing the car. Peter described on incident where they stopped the car at a traffic light and a bystander commented that he could see no smoke coming from the exhaust. Peter replied to him: "We don't have an engine". When they left Buffalo, Dr Tesla removed the "ignition" key and the radio tubes and took them with him. The car was left at a farmhouse some 20 miles from Buffalo, not far from Niagara Falls.

The car was kept under tight security and this was the reason for keeping it at such a remote spot. Peter heard a rumor that a secretary of Tesla's broke security and told General Electric about it and promptly got fired. Dr Tesla acted somewhat mysterious and would not answer many of Peter's questions. However, Peter considers this merely part of security measures and categorically ruled out any possibility of a hoax or practical joke.

Peter knows of no specific persons to whom the car was shown. However, about a month after the Buffalo trip e got a phone call form Dr Lee De Forest who asked him: "How did you like that car?" Peter expressed his enthusiasm and De Forest then called Tesla one of the greatest living scientists.

About 7 years ago Peter was approached by a Yugoslav diplomat then at the United Nations (Peter could not remember the name but has a record of it) who asked if he could find the engine and power receiver of that car. He dropped the name Rockefeller and said that they "could make millions" if they had this engine to copy. Peter made some attempts to comply, but without results. Peter is very anti-Tito and probably did not try very hard. The diplomat died about two years ago.

Asked whether he knew of any other applications of this type of power, Peter said that Tesla was negotiating with some big shipbuilding concern to build a boat with such an engine. However, when he asked questions about this, Dr Tesla got annoyed and Peter never found out who the company was.

When asked whatever happened to the car, Peter said that he had heard that it had been shipped to Yugoslavia. However, he has written to friends in Yugoslavia about this and they replied that nothing ever arrived.

Upon being asked whether there was any possibility that drawings of the car might be in existence somewhere, Peter said there was a man in some town in Pennsylvania who might just have such information.

Peter Savo is a lonely, bored old man, living in a cheap Manhattan hotel and supported by his two sons who are US Navy pilots in Viet Nam. His idleness and worries have induced a nervous condition with certain accompanying physical symptoms. I told Peter that he needed an aim and purpose in life and that reconstructing the facts of Dr Tesla's invention and giving them to eh world would be such a purpose, to say nothing of a probable financial reward. Peter thereupon said that he would phone the man in Pennsylvania and would phone others in Akron Ohio and in Chicago. He will also write to his relatives in Yugoslavia, who are surviving members of the Tesla family, to get all possible information.

Since Peter was very poorly off financially, I gave his $20 out of my own pocket for the phone calls and postage. Peter is quite intelligent but lacks a formal education and has quite a thick accent. It is possible that he may be unable to reach the people he has in mind. However, in that event, it is still possible that a search by an experienced investigator who visits the places mentioned above, might locate them. However, this would of course cost more money and the question would then arise as to who has sufficient interest in this information to pay the expenses…

Excerpts from Keelynet BBS Posts on this topic ~

Some fellow called up from Indiana or somewhere like that.. He says he has a  fairly  detailed article on the TESLA mystery power box as detailed in TESLAFE.ZIP... claims there were only three tubes and they were all BEAM RECTIFIER TYPES, hell he even  gave us the tube  numbers (70L7GT)...

Re: The beam  rectifier  tubes  reportedly  used  in  Tesla's  box...  rectification implies the reception of an AC signal, which might imply that Tesla had another "toy" nearby broadcasting power, albeit on a smaller scale than some of his earlier projects. We believe this to indicate a smaller Wardenclyffe  but there is no evidence of this....

The following data  is copied  verbatim from the 1964 RCA Receiving Tube Manual. The 70L7GT is listed as a discontinued type so the wonderful descriptions of other tubes in the manual is unavailable for this type; however, a table of discontinued types at the back of the manual provided  the following. The diagram is, of course, irreproducible in ASCII but it looks like a very ordinary keyed octal glass tube of its period, at 1-3/16" diameter, 2-7/8" high (above chassis). It does not possess a metal "tit" at the top. It appears that it's a dedicated-application tube for radio receivers (it both rectifies and amplifies, cutting down on tube count and saving manufacturing dollars), so I am  immediately skeptical about any real significance to this  type. There are related types, including the 117L7GT, but no direct substitution. Antique Electronic Supply in Tempe AZ apparently stocks this tube.   The tube, used as indicated, appears very ordinary, however we can assume that Tesla did not exactly follow RCA recommended application tolerances (i.e. he hacked it).

70L7GT : RECTIFIER - BEAM POWER TUBE
Heater Voltage: 70 V
Heater Current: 150 mA

Use(s): Amplifier Unit as Class A Amplifier... Half Wave Rectifier

CHARACTERISTICS AS AMPLIFIER

Plate Supply         : 110 V
Grid Bias Volts      : -7.5 V
Screen Supply        : 110 V
Screen Current       : 3.0 mA
Plate Current        : 40.0 mA
AC Plate Resistance  : 15000 ohm
Transconductance     : 7500 microomhs
Amplification Factor :
       Load for Power Output: 2000 ohm
       Power Output         : 1.8 W

CHARACTERISTICS AS RECTIFIER

Max. Peak Inverse Volts: 350 V
Max. DC Output mA      : 70 mA
Max. Peak Plate mA     : 420 mA
Minimum Total Effective
Plate Supply Impedance : 10 ohm

The following are the details as removed from the file TESLAFE1 :

The standard internal combustion engine was removed and an 80-HP 1800 rpm electric motor installed to the clutch and transmission. The AC motor  measured 40 inches long and 30 inches in diameter and the power leads were left standing in the air --- no external power source!

He then went to a local radio store and purchased a handful of tubes (12), wires and assorted resistors. A box measuring 24 inches long, 12 inches wide and 6 inches high was assembled housing the circuit. The box was placed on the front seat and had its wires connected to the air-cooled, brushless motor. Two rods 1/4" in diameter stuck out of the box about 3" in length."

We will first of all note the use of an AC coil motor. This alone tells us that the Tesla device was superior and not so dependent on tuning as was  Moray's machine which could only power RESISTIVE loads. All universal energy moves in WAVES and so is essentially for alternating current (AC).  That is why Moray called his book "THE SEA OF ENERGY IN WHICH THE EARTH FLOATS". The entire universe is continually bathed in these AC energies and they cover the entire frequency spectrum.

What intrigues the  hell out of me was how Tesla could use "off-the-shelf" vacuum tubes and other components, put them together in the correct configuration and make it work.

Another point we should note is the list of components :
1)  12 Vacuum Tubes
2)  Wires
3)  Assorted Resistors
4)  1/4" diameter rods 3" in length

NOTE, NO CAPACITORS! The wires could have been simply for connection or wound as coils. The 1/4" rods were either BUS BARS for power output taps OR more likely ANTENNAS! Resonant circuits can be constructed using several techniques. You can achieve the same effect from :
1)  Resistors AND capacitors
2)  Capacitors AND coils
3)  Coils AND resistors

So, in the case of the Tesla Power Box, he either wound his own coils or simply used the wire to connect the resistors with the vacuum tubes. I am of  the opinion that he used the wire ONLY for connection and DID NOT USE COILS! I also think he used a DIODE somewhere in the circuit in order to tap ONLY one polarity.

We have no specifications for the AC motor that Tesla used in the auto, so we have no idea if it was single or polyphase. In the case of a single phase  motor, it only requires a single winding which projects a magnetic field that rotates according to the increase or decrease of the alternating current.

A polyphase (poly = two or more) motor uses multiple windings which are fed by phased input currents that alternate in such a manner as to reinforce each other. In the case of a 3 phase motor, the currents are phased 120 degrees apart. This gives much greater torque to the motor but requires 3 times the current because it uses 3 times the input energy.

Since the box powered an AC (coil) motor, it is probable it was TUNED to one or more frequencies, most likely polyphased frequencies. So, if the 3"  long rods were in fact ANTENNAS, we can calculate their frequency by using the following :

(I cannot express Lambda here so we will use w for wavelength)

w = wavelength
v = velocity of propagation
f = signal frequency

A short example:  w = v / f = wavelength in feet
w = 984,000,000/1,500,000 = 656 feet
f = 984,000,000/656 = 1,500,000 or 1.5 MHZ

3 inches x 4  = 1 foot
984,000,000/1 = 984,000,000
984,000,000/4 = 246,000,000 or 246 MHZ

This would indicate the 3" rods (if they were truly 3" in length and functioning as antennas) would resonate at 246 MHZ.

Because of the  parts  list description, I am of the opinion that it was a DUAL circuit. That is, 6 vacuum tubes and one 1/4" diameter 3" rod along with assorted resistors were to pick up and "pump" ONLY the positive going signals, while the other 6 vacuum  tubes, rod and resistors did the same for  the negative going signals. Such a scheme could either use PARALLEL or SERIAL connections of the vacuum tubes. Since current conduction is proportional to surface area, one would think that a parallel arrangement of the vacuum tubes with all INPUTS connected to one antenna source and all OUTPUTS connected to a common terminal attached to the load, would provide for the MAXIMUM current flow from incoming energy waves.

The nature of these "energy waves" is the question here. Are they cosmic rays, electrostatic, Schumann peaks, magnetic force, something "other" or Aether flow into the neutral centers of mass as per Keely.

Vacuum tube construction takes several  forms. Of these, the simplest is two plates separated by a grid wire. When the bottom plate is heated, thermally induced ions (thermionic emissions) are emitted by the bottom plate. The grid can be biased by the application of voltage to increase,  decrease or halt the flow of these ions to the upper plate.

Other forms include more plates with more grids to allow better control of the ion  flow. By proper biasing, vacuum tubes can be operated as switches, modulators or amplifiers among other uses.

Vacuum tubes operate primarily with high voltages that control the ion flows. Modern transistors are equivalent to vacuum tubes except that they operate using CURRENT instead of voltage. Transistors equate to Vacuum tubes by the following comparisons :

Vacuum Tube ~ Transistor ~ Polarity
Voltage ~ Current
Lower plate ~ Emitter ~  negative-cathode
Grid ~ Base ~ neutral
Upper plate ~ Collector ~ Positive-anode

In the case of the Tesla Power Box, the vacuum tube appears to function as a "pump", collecting incoming current in the form of ion intensification.  Once this "compressed" ion field reaches a certain density, the pump allows it to be released into the next stage of the circuit, be it the actual load or another vacuum tube.

So if the circuit is 6 vacuum tubes in parallel, all fed from a common antenna, outputting to a common load terminal, then the common antenna input would feed all vacuum tubes with the same wave. This would give the greatest CURRENT accumulation because of the EXPANDED SURFACE AREA of the paralleled tubes.

Note, these vacuum tubes most likely operate in the "cold cathode" mode since the heaters of  the vacuum tubes were not fed by any outside voltage to provide the heat for the more orthodox therionic emission.

If the vacuum tubes are hooked in series, then one "pump" would feed another "pump" to get successively higher densities of electrons. This would give higher VOLTAGES because of increased PRESSURE.

Keep in mind that electricity is much like air or water. We can think of voltage as pounds per square inch (PSI) and current as cubic feet per minute (CFM). That is PSI is pressure, CFM is flow. Another analog is comparing a river to electricity. In such a comparison, the speed of the river is the VOLTAGE or pressure while the width of the river is the CURRENT or rate of flow. Such a comparison shows WHY current requires THE GREATEST SURFACE AREA for the maximum flow. Fuses function on just this principle, when the current flows over the surface of the fuse, it  creates heat. If too much current flows, it creates too much heat causing the fuse to melt and separate. The  more surface area the fuse, the greater the amount of current can flow, another reason to not place a penny in a fuse socket.

So we have two antennas (1/4" diameter, 3" long rods), two sets of 6  vacuum tubes connected together by wire and assorted resistors. As the waves of energy are collected by the 3" rods, positive on one, negative on another, the energy builds up in the form of  increased ions in each of the paralleled  vacuum tubes. As in Moray's generator, the circuit will feed whatever load is attached as long as it does not EXCEED the current carrying capacity  of  the circuit components. What we have is an energy pumping system.

Excerpt: Secrets of Cold War Technology --- Project HAARP and Beyond, by Gerry Vassilatos (ISBN 0-945685-20-3); "Tesla's Electric Car" (page 91)

Tesla had already considered the condition of charged particles, each representing a tightly constricted whorl of aether. The force necessarily exerted at close distances by such aetheric constrictions was incalculably large. Aetheric ponderance maintained particulate stability.

Crystalline lattices were therefore places within which one could expect to find unexpected voltages. Indeed, the high voltages inherent in certain metallic lattices, intra-atomic field energies, are enormous. The close Coulomb gradient between atomic centers are electrostatic potentials reaching humanly unattainable levels.

By comparison, the voltages which Tesla once succeeded in releasing were quite insignificant. In these balanced lattices, Tesla sought the voltages needed to initiate directed aetheric streams in matter.

Once such a flow began, one could simply tap the stream for power.

In certain materials, these ether streams might automatically produce the contaminating electrons, a source of energy for existing appliances. One could theoretically then "tailor" the materials needed to produce unexpected aetheric power with or without the attendant detrimental particles.

Tesla did mention the latent aetheric power of charged forces, the explosive potentials of bound Ether, and the aetheric power inherent in matter.

By these studies, Tesla sought replacement for the 100,000,000 volt initiating pulses which natural law required for the implementation of space Ether. Tesla had long been forced to abandon those gigantic means by other, less natural laws.

Thereafter, Tesla shifted his attentions from the appreciation of the gigantic to an appreciation of the miniature. He sought a means for proliferating an immense number of small and compact aether power receivers.

With one such device, Tesla succeeded in obtaining power to drive am electric car. But for the exceptional account which follows, we would have little information on this last period in Tesla's productive life, one which very apparently did not cease its prolific streams of creativity to his last breath.

The information comes through an unlikely source, one rarely mentioned by Tesla biographers. It chanced that an aeronautical engineer, Derek Ahlers, met with one of Tesla's nephews then living in New York. Theirs was an acquaintance lasting some 10 years, consisting largely of anecdotal commentaries on Dr. Tesla. Mr. Savo provided an enormous fund of knowledge concerning many episodes in Tesla's last years.

Himself an Austrian military man and a trained aviator, Mr. Savo was extremely open about certain long-cherished incidents in which his uncle's genius was consistency made manifest. Mr. Savo reported that in 1931, he participated in an experiment involving aetheric power. Unexpectedly, almost inappropriately, he was asked to accompany his uncle on a long train ride to Buffalo.

A few times in this journey, Mr. Savo asked the nature of their journey. Dr. Tesla remained unwilling to disclose any information, speaking rather directly to this issue. Taken into a small garage, Dr. Tesla walked directly to a Pierce Arrow, opened the hood and began making a few adjustments. In place of the engine, there was an AC motor.

This measured a little more than 3 feet long, and a little more than 2 feet in diameter. From it trailed two very thick cables which connected with the dashboard. In addition, there was an ordinary 12 volt storage battery. The motor was rated at 80 horsepower.

Maximum rotor speed was stated to be 30 turns per second. A 6 foot antenna rod was fitted into the rear section of the car.

Dr. Tesla stepped into the passenger side and began making adjustments on a "power receiver" which had been built directly into the dashboard.

The receiver, no larger than a short-wave radio of the day, used 12 special tubes which Dr. Tesla brought with him in a boxlike case.

The device had been prefitted into the dashboard, no larger than a short-wave receiver. Mr. Savo told Mr. Ahler that Dr. Tesla built the receiver in his hotel room, a device 2 feet in length, nearly 1 foot wide, a 1/2 foot high.

These curiously constructed tubes having been properly installed in their sockets, Dr. Tesla pushed in 2 contact rods and informed Peter that power was now available to drive.

Several additional meters read values which Dr. Tesla would not explain. Not sound was heard. Dr. Tesla handed Mr. Savo the ignition key and told him to start the engine, which he promptly did. Yet hearing nothing, the accelerator was applied, and the car instantly moved. Tesla's nephew drove this vehicle without other fuel for an undetermined long interval.

Mr. Savo drove a distance of 50 miles through the city and out to the surrounding countryside. The car was tested to speeds of 90 mph, with the speedometer rated to 120.

After a time, and with increasing distance from the city itself, Dr. Tesla felt free enough to speak. Having now become sufficiently impressed with the performance of both his device and the automobile.

Dr. Tesla informed his nephew that the device could not only supply the needs of the car forever, but could also supply the needs of a household - with power to spare. When originally asked how the device worked, Tesla was initially adamant and refused to speak.

Many who have read this "apocryphal account" have stated it to be the result of an "energy broadcast". This misinterpretation has simply caused further confusions concerning this stage of Tesla's work. He had very obviously succeeded in performing, with this small and compact device, what he had learned in Colorado and Shoreham.

As soon as they were on the country roads, clear of the more congested areas, Tesla began to lecture on the subject. Of the motive source he referred to "a mysterious radiation which comes out of the aether". The small device very obviously and effectively appropriated this energy.

Tesla also spoke very glowingly of this providence, saying of the energy itself that "it is available in limitless quantities".

Dr. Tesla stated that although "he did not know where it came from, mankind should be very grateful for its presence".

The two remained in Buffalo for 8 days, rigorously testing the car in the city and countryside. Dr. Tesla also told Mr. Savo that the device would soon be used to drive boats, planes, trains, and other automobiles. Once, just before leaving the city limits, they stopped at a streetlight and a bystander joyfully commented concerning their lack of exhaust fumes.

Mr. Savo spoke up whimsically, saying that they had "no engine". They left Buffalo and traveled to a predetermined location which Dr. Tesla knew, an old farmhouse barn some 20 miles from Buffalo. Dr. Tesla and Mr. Savo left the car in this barn, took the 12 tubes and the ignition key, and departed.

Later on, Mr. Savo heard a rumor that a secretary had spoken candidly about both the receiver and the test run, being promptly fired for the security breach. About a month after the incident, Mr. Savo received a call from a man who identified himself as Lee De Forest, who asked how he enjoyed the car.

Mr. Savo expressed his joy over the mysterious affair, and Mr. de Forest declared Tesla the greatest living scientist in the world. Later, Mr. Savo asked his uncle whether or not the power receiver was being used in other applications.

He was informed that Dr. Tesla had been negotiating with a major shipbuilding company to build a boat with a similarly outfitted engine. Asked additional questions, Dr. Tesla became annoyed. Highly concerned and personally strained over the security of this design, it seems obvious that Tesla was performing these tests in a desperate degree of secrecy for good reasons.

Tesla had already been the victim of several manipulations, deadly actions entirely sourced in a single financial house. For this reason, secrecy and care had become his only recent excess.

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 22, 2011, 05:55:09 AM
 Other related information on antenna usage for collecting energy.

 "Antenna claimed to amplify energy from mystery source"
(Unidentified source, early 1980s)

A Connecticut research company, Xtec Inc of New Britain, has announced the development of an invention that is claimed to have demonstrated the ability to amplify energy from conventional sources by using a specially-designed antenna to gather external power from the environment.

According to an independent consultant who has reviewed the Xtech research to date: " What has been witnessed appears to be an energy absorption effect with the capability of tapping energy from an as yet unidentified outside source to do the required work. Proper understanding and useful application of this device will require more precise and quantitative investigation and experimentation."

Xtec describes its "energy amplifier" as a relatively simple device which extracts energy from the environment and utilizes it to supplement or amplify the power from an independent power supply such as a battery. "It uses a specially-designed antenna to gather this external power, which has been successfully applied in laboratory tests to power a metal-cutting lathe and an industrial tricycle." A patent application has been filed with the US Patent Office, and additional patent coverage is in preparation for all major industrial nations on a worldwide basis.

Extec [sic] says that utilizing an antenna to draw in or amplify power is well known, and quotes US Patent  # 2,813,242 [L.R. Crump: Powering Electrical Devices with Energy Abstracted from the Atmosphere]  as demonstrating that energy can be extracted from the atmosphere through a properly designed antenna to provide useful power. Also that this patent shows that electromagnetic energy was captured in sufficient quantities to drive a transistor circuit.

In the Xtec device an antenna operates as an dependent power supply for the system. An input signal turns on the power amplifying antenna which draws on the potential between two points in the environment to complete a circuit through a form of inductive coupling. The result is amplified energy for the load to be driven. It has been postulated that the energy being tapped exists between the antenna and either low frequency ground currents, or an external pulsing magnetic field. This has yet to be proven, and Xtec has initiated a full-scale research program to investigate the phenomenon.

Xtec says that tests of this previously unknown principle were not intended to prove theories underlying the energy amplifier in a controlled, rigorously scientific manner, but that they do demonstrate a definite energy enhancement as well as the ability to recharge the batteries being used as the independent power supply to drive the energy amplifier.

The ongoing research program seeks to define this phenomenon further and to indicate direction for practical commercial development of the enhanced energy which the amplifier produces.

Xtec Incorporated is a privately held research firm currently engaged in several energy-saving projects. It is supported by Stampede Internal Resources, Ltd., a publicly-held company with extensive interests in natural gas exploration and in industrial energy-saving technology through its subsidiary Turbotech Products Inc.

X-Tech: 533 John Downey Drive, New Britain, CT 06051; 203-224-3148/203-224-2409

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 22, 2011, 06:09:13 AM
 I tried to do some research on Xtec and I find that they are now in Florida but are now working with our government with security products. When I did my search I also found that their old location now houses another company that works with our government.
 They were supported by Stampede Internal Resources, Ltd who I cant seem to find anything about and I also couldn't find anything on Turbotech Products Inc.
 Not sure what happened to those companys but I would like to.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Qwert on April 22, 2011, 09:53:36 AM
Hi.
I'm in possession of the "Magnetic Amplifiers" document in pdf, of which the first page is shown at the beginning of this thread. I don't know how to upload it here, it cannot by sent as attachment, it's oversized, over 7M. Any help?
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: MrMag on April 22, 2011, 10:26:03 AM
I think you may need to upload it to a file sharing site. You can then give us a link to download it from there.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Qwert on April 22, 2011, 11:17:06 AM
Thanks, MrMag. Here it is: https://rapidshare.com/files/458617810/Magnetic_Amplifiers.pdf
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Sprocket on April 22, 2011, 01:06:46 PM
Completely unrelated, but whatever happened to Hans Von Lieven?  He was a prolific poster here for a long time, with a very broad knowledge-base.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: ramset on April 22, 2011, 01:47:32 PM
Nightlife
Thank you for sharing that info.

I have a home less than a 1/2 hour from that New Britain location,
I'm working in NY this week , Perhaps on the way home I'll swing by for a look,
At the very least I will make a point of stopping in [next week or so].

Who knows??

I do "Cold calls" very well!! I Think this one will be Xtra chilly.

No stone left unturned!!
Chet



Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 22, 2011, 03:16:04 PM
 Hans did have his own website and I thought it was Keely.net but when I do a search, it shows that site to be owned by someone else. I believe Hans got frustrated with all the ignorance within many members here, including myself. Many of us are very stuburn which is an ignorance that some find aggravating. As I get older, I see how my own ignorance can and did aggravate others. The more I learn, the less ignorant I become but I still have a long way to go.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 22, 2011, 03:18:55 PM
 Hi Chet,
  That, would be interesting to know what is exactly happening there. I have a feeling it will be a secured location.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 22, 2011, 04:01:27 PM
70L7

it is an double system tube.
1 part ist Audio output pentode (to drive the loudspeacker,
the DIODE  ist an one way rectifier  to rectifie the 110volts ACc (MAINPOWER) TO  (ABOUT 150VOLTS). So that was usual to use no Power transformers in radio receiver, so it was uses an 70 Volt heating filament.

70L7 need 70Volt  115L7  115Volt AC to heat up  to becomes electron flow between cathode and anode of the tube.

(70 volts used in receivers if som other receiving tubes was added in serie to total 115volt)   115L7 was used in singel tubes amplifiers (phono ).
-I am born 1941 and working from 1950 beginnig 1950 in my fathers radio repair shop)  So i know the technik my whole life on beginning..)

BUT WHY Tesla use 70volt burning filaments, IF it was also 12 volt types wit - als the others SAME caracteristics on the marked =!=!. I showed all european and us types !!

So another secret must be inckude-
Tesla have -sure- nit used 12 volt to invert that first ti 70 volts !!,

So the tubes was used colf (without heating=)
or undergliwed with only dark-red heating with 12 volts ???

So also you must understand that this tube habe only 2-3 watt powerdissipation, and can never  power an motor. als 10 or ore underheatet /an underpowered( tubes cant work as an
amplifier ??

I have brocken my head over years for this ask.

I belive you are an an good way to find this out with your
cakculations. The secret it is to find (i think so) in the electron flow of the cathode.
the ether give an lot of RF Power over an spectrum of waves to the antenna, that give (as mix) an lot of nois.frequencies.
Pehaps that are or will be mixed with the waves outvoming
of the cathodes ot the tubes.

(I remember an electronic tube cirvuit wit 5R4 5U4 rectifier tubes from SM (that was for short tim to see in WEB. (5-6 years ago) in this page he found an unknow additinally power, that he could not explain, BUT so i have understand this circuit
he find an power because he use 2 transformers that have disparated anode and cathode circuit in two parts...

Offcause this circuit was deleted (i think so) very fast from the web. It MUST have some interesting details...

Sorry my english... but i think the information is better than an perfect english language

G Pese
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 22, 2011, 04:49:40 PM
....The secret it is to find (i think so) in the electron flow of the cathode.
the ether give an lot of RF Power over an spectrum of waves to the antenna, that give (as mix) an lot of nois.frequencies.
Pehaps that are or will be mixed with the waves outvoming
of the cathodes ot the tubes.

(I remember an electronic tube cirvuit wit 5R4 5U4 rectifier tubes from SM (that was for short tim to see in WEB. (5-6 years ago) in this page he found an unknow additinally power, that he could not explain, BUT so i have understand this circuit
he find an power because he use 2 transformers that have disparated anode and cathode circuit in two parts...

Offcause this circuit was deleted (i think so) very fast from the web. It MUST have some interesting details...

Sorry my english... but i think the information is better than an perfect english language

G Pese
you refer to this:

*********************************************************** SM's  words ***************
I have made a great study of Vacuum tube power supplies as I have told you. It is all very interesting. Please remind me to tell you why Nicola Tesla used Vacuum tubes in his most powerful demonstrations of his power conversion technologies.
Anyway, I have taken a high voltage power supply as follows:
500 v-0-500 v  300 mV plate transformer run it through a full wave silicon circuit then run it through a 5U4 electron tube rectifier. Now you know that the 5U4 requires 5 volts AC at 3 amps for its heater to gather the electrons and complete the circuit. Well, I measured the output from the tube and the result is 500 volts DC at 250 mV. The loss is due to the high impedance of the tube and its limited ability to dissipate more than 250 mA.. The point I wish to make here is that also along with the 500 volt DC is, yes, you guessed it, the 5 volts three amp AC current! They are both completely independent of each other except for some very interesting things I will mention to you some other time..
First of all, obviously you can have several different output components in the power output signal. You can have DC and AC together without any problem. Why did that mystery person claim that it was a foolish to say DC output with a 5k Hz component? Because he was deliberately trying to mislead anyone who might want to figure out what I was doing.
*******************************************************************************************
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Qwert on April 22, 2011, 06:15:00 PM
Hansvonlieven site: http://www.keelytech.com/
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Sprocket on April 22, 2011, 06:33:36 PM
Thanks for that, I had forgotten about his site.  It doesn't seem to have been updated in a long time though.  Included in his "to be published" list, is Cold Fusion.  Given the current news it would have been interesting to get his take on it.  He always struck me as a truth-seeker rather than a debunker - and Lord knows there are enough of the latter on this forum!  Hope he's still alive & kicking.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 22, 2011, 07:42:11 PM
you refer to this:

*********************************************************** SM's  words ***************
I have made a great study of Vacuum tube power supplies as I have told you. It is all very interesting. Please remind me to tell you why Nicola Tesla used Vacuum tubes in his most powerful demonstrations of his power conversion technologies.
Anyway, I have taken a high voltage power supply as follows:
500 v-0-500 v  300 mV plate transformer run it through a full wave silicon circuit then run it through a 5U4 electron tube rectifier. Now you know that the 5U4 requires 5 volts AC at 3 amps for its heater to gather the electrons and complete the circuit. Well, I measured the output from the tube and the result is 500 volts DC at 250 mV. The loss is due to the high impedance of the tube and its limited ability to dissipate more than 250 mA.. The point I wish to make here is that also along with the 500 volt DC is, yes, you guessed it, the 5 volts three amp AC current! They are both completely independent of each other except for some very interesting things I will mention to you some other time..
First of all, obviously you can have several different output components in the power output signal. You can have DC and AC together without any problem. Why did that mystery person claim that it was a foolish to say DC output with a 5k Hz component? Because he was deliberately trying to mislead anyone who might want to figure out what I was doing.
*******************************************************************************************

YES  BINGO

that was it. BUT NOT THE TEXT, that i seen With the ecactly circuit, within.

It was say´d exactly that he have found en EXTRA ENERGY betwenn the both secindry windings of two seoarated transformers (!)  Ine that produce the 2x anodes-voltage, and anther that only transform the main supply to the 5 volts heater.  I Know this tubes. I habe in fron of me and in my stocklist /in WEB). 
.
Possibly  the radiation from cathode (barium)
produce very high frquencies and produce energy
that Tesla know to use them.
Pese

P.S.

Magnetic Amplifiers (Transductors)
i also worked with them, are not the solution for Tesla car,
BUT possibly that was GABRIEL KRON  have found, and forbidden to publishing. ( G. Kron was Engineer from G.E,)
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 22, 2011, 08:53:14 PM
YES  BINGO

that was it. BUT NOT THE TEXT, that i seen With the ecactly circuit, within.

It was say´d exactly that he have found en EXTRA ENERGY betwenn the both secindry windings of two seoarated transformers (!)  Ine that produce the 2x anodes-voltage, and anther that only transform the main supply to the 5 volts heater.  I Know this tubes. I habe in fron of me and in my stocklist /in WEB). 
.
Possibly  the radiation from cathode (barium)
produce very high frquencies and produce energy
that Tesla know to use them.
Pese

P.S.

Magnetic Amplifiers (Transductors)
i also worked with them, are not the solution for Tesla car,
BUT possibly that was GABRIEL KRON  have found, and forbidden to publishing. ( G. Kron was Engineer from G.E,)

Electrical oscillations without employment of electricity?

"Generally the trend goes to ever smaller operating voltages. The processor in the PC runs today already with less than 3 V, and digital electronics aims on a long-term basis at the 1-Volt-Durchbruch. Also attempts with electron tubes are ever more frequently accomplished with small tensions. The absolute record succeeded to me now with a UHF triode PC86: A high frequency oscillator with an anode voltage of 0.000 V. This ZVO (zero VOL days oscillator) will surely revolutionize the technology."

http://www.b-kainka.de/bastel87.htm
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 22, 2011, 09:28:13 PM
Electrical oscillations without employment of electricity?

"Generally the trend goes to ever smaller operating voltages. The processor in the PC runs today already with less than 3 V, and digital electronics aims on a long-term basis at the 1-Volt-Durchbruch. Also attempts with electron tubes are ever more frequently accomplished with small tensions. The absolute record succeeded to me now with a UHF triode PC86: A high frequency oscillator with an anode voltage of 0.000 V. This ZVO (zero VOL days oscillator) will surely revolutionize the technology."

http://www.b-kainka.de/bastel87.htm

I forgot the transmitter:

http://www.mindfully.org/Technology/Magnetospheric-Power-Line19may78.htm

Military has had radiant conveyance for years...

http://www.pureenergysystems.com/news/exclusive/wireless_transformer/

http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=getRecord&metadataPrefix=html&identifier=ADA052353
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 22, 2011, 10:47:22 PM
Electrical oscillations without employment of electricity?

"Generally the trend goes to ever smaller operating voltages. The processor in the PC runs today already with less than 3 V, and digital electronics aims on a long-term basis at the 1-Volt-Durchbruch. Also attempts with electron tubes are ever more frequently accomplished with small tensions. The absolute record succeeded to me now with a UHF triode PC86: A high frequency oscillator with an anode voltage of 0.000 V. This ZVO (zero VOL days oscillator) will surely revolutionize the technology."

http://www.b-kainka.de/bastel87.htm

Oscillation is an wrong explaining. possibly the "radiant" electrone lawines that is delivered from the cathode- emitted from BARIUM = radiant materials"  produce "energy" with the resonating frequecies of barium material.
(nothing to do with vhf/uhf frequencies that can produced with
PC86, or microwaves (Klystrons), SM have found (amother way) and possibly not understand. Possibly it comes "nearby" to Tesla "unknow" invention
Pese
-----------
2.
Ref:
Military has had radiant conveyance for years...

Yes its sure, but this sources (shown in the link" are NOT the
knowledges, that TESLA have opend.

If there are know to military , it will also never published.

---------------
TESLA asked some millions USD  to sell
his knowledge to govermentm possibly followimg
(see links) was an cheaper way to take all informations
 
http://www.google.de/#q=tesla+murdered+1943&bav=on.2,or.&fp=58b7d217b58a1b52&hl=de


www.alt-nrg.de/pppp   
some german and engl.
alternatibe links, collected over years..
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 22, 2011, 11:00:41 PM

Transmitting tube hot cathode characteristics
Material    
Oscillation is an wrong explaining. possibly the "radiant" electrone lawines that is delivered from the cathode- emitted from BARIUM = radiant materials"  produce "energy" with the resonating frequecies of barium material.
(nothih to do with vhf/uhf frequencies that can produced with
PC86, or microwaves (Klystrons), SM have found (amother way) and possibly not understand. Possibly it comes "nearby" to Tesla "unknow" invention
Pese
-----------

www.alt-nrg.de/pppp   
some german and engl.
alternatibe links, collected over years..
                                Operating temperature    Emission efficacy    Specific emission
Tungsten                    2500 K                          5 mA/                       500 mA/cm2
Thoriated tungsten    2000 K                            100 mA/W              5 A/cm2
Oxide coated            1100 K                            500 mA/W              10 A/cm2
Barium aluminate     1300 K                            400 mA/W              4 A/cm2

it seem that thoriated or oxide coated filament have better efficiency

Tesla's "1930 Pierce Arrow" Electric Automoblie at this time ....
http://www.r-type.org/exhib/aaj0163.htm
The DET1, designed around 1924, was the first dull emitter, thoriated tungsten filament transmitting valve, certainly in the UK, possibly in the world. It was a conventional triode with flat nickel anode, ribbed for strength and capable of dissipating a power of 35 watts at anything up to 1,000 volts. The cathode operated at 6 Volt, 1.9 Amp.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 22, 2011, 11:19:57 PM
So, (i am not specialized)

but some guys have tired some Kilowatts from small amount of radium, thorium, and other materials
so barium tunszen (wolfram) have also more
energy, IF "we can "pic up" them in an usual way.
(also we must see: meyer hendershot morey to understand
possibly also Tesla)

Pese

P.S.
it have nothing to do with usual transmittimg tubes, nire this know technic,  - The last, i know.
But not, what Tesla (and some european Inventors!) have done.
/All -unwillcome- surpressed informations/
 
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 22, 2011, 11:49:25 PM
you refer to this:

*********************************************************** SM's  words ***************
I have made a great study of Vacuum tube power supplies as I have told you. It is all very interesting. Please remind me to tell you why Nicola Tesla used Vacuum tubes in his most powerful demonstrations of his power conversion technologies.
Anyway, I have taken a high voltage power supply as follows:
500 v-0-500 v  300 mV plate transformer run it through a full wave silicon circuit then run it through a 5U4 electron tube rectifier. Now you know that the 5U4 requires 5 volts AC at 3 amps for its heater to gather the electrons and complete the circuit. Well, I measured the output from the tube and the result is 500 volts DC at 250 mV. The loss is due to the high impedance of the tube and its limited ability to dissipate more than 250 mA.. The point I wish to make here is that also along with the 500 volt DC is, yes, you guessed it, the 5 volts three amp AC current! They are both completely independent of each other except for some very interesting things I will mention to you some other time..
First of all, obviously you can have several different output components in the power output signal. You can have DC and AC together without any problem. Why did that mystery person claim that it was a foolish to say DC output with a 5k Hz component? Because he was deliberately trying to mislead anyone who might want to figure out what I was doing.
*******************************************************************************************
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=7046.msg174142#msg174142
SM's words:

"Now the high voltage power goes through the cathode and travels through the coils of the 5 volt transformer along with the 5 volt AC.
If the plate voltage is not rectified then it is AC with a potential 60 Hz frequency.
That combines with the 5 volt 60 Hz in the coil of the htr transformer and generally amounts to nothing. In fact the power of the 5 volt transformer amounts to nothing.
It is an insignificant power supply except when the two transformers get slightly out of phase with each other, or when they are connected in reverse of one another.
Then you can measure all kinds of things going on.
You can generate all kinds of hash and multiple frequencies, and I do mean all kinds.
What I measured during this process was very interesting.
All these frequencies occasionally met at the same time with a much larger kick at the output.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 23, 2011, 01:53:46 AM
Hans had posted this a few years back on another thread.

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3691.0

Tate Power from the air

    Tate Ambient Power Module. Joseph Tate Last Known Address 760 Waldo Point Sausalito Ca (4965) 415 331 8150 332 9918 U.S. Patent 4,628,299



    This design converts radio frequency energy to power that can be usefully applied in power devices such as clocks,radios and smoke detectors.

    This design makes use of a doubler, splitter and rectifier.

    The device has been known to give 36 volt/9 watts.

    This devices does away for the need for batteries by extracting energy from natural and man made radio waves.

    THe device uses a coil made of the following design 479 turns of #22 wire on a 3" plastic tube, the coil should be loosely wound as a close wound coil tends to reduce power collection. One end should be connected to unit at antenna connection point and the other to an antenna of your choice .

    Other coil types could be used in your experiments such as sliding induction coils that is inside one another and find the best position by moving them in different positions.

    Other coil types can be found by referencing any good book on radio fundamentals. Check out the Telsa type coils as well.

    Power could be also enhanced by placing a tin foil pyramid under the coil as this seems to also improve power.

    The power produced also seems to improve near bridges,ships and any thing containing a great deal of metal.

    A high antenna wire seems to improve the running of unit although a 7 foot whip antenna worked reasonably well too.

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 23, 2011, 02:01:02 AM
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=7046.msg174142#msg174142
SM's words:

"Now the high voltage power goes through the cathode and travels through the coils of the 5 volt transformer along with the 5 volt AC.
If the plate voltage is not rectified then it is AC with a potential 60 Hz frequency.
That combines with the 5 volt 60 Hz in the coil of the htr transformer and generally amounts to nothing. In fact the power of the 5 volt transformer amounts to nothing.
It is an insignificant power supply except when the two transformers get slightly out of phase with each other, or when they are connected in reverse of one another.
Then you can measure all kinds of things going on.
You can generate all kinds of hash and multiple frequencies, and I do mean all kinds.
What I measured during this process was very interesting.
All these frequencies occasionally met at the same time with a much larger kick at the output.



Yes , this come more "nearby" that was i read , years ago.  Not in overunity.

BUT it MUST be the following experiments,
because  he "find interessantly things" ,
so his words (your found text)

Pese

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 23, 2011, 02:22:14 AM
Hans had posted this a few years back on another thread.

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3691.0

Tate Power from the air

    Tate Ambient Power Module. Joseph Tate Last Known Address 760 Waldo Point Sausalito Ca (4965) 415 331 8150 332 9918 U.S. Patent 4,628,299



    This design converts radio frequency energy to power that can be usefully applied in power devices such as clocks,radios and smoke detectors.

    This design makes use of a doubler, splitter and rectifier.

    The device has been known to give 36 volt/9 watts.

    This devices does away for the need for batteries by extracting energy from natural and man made radio waves.

    THe device uses a coil made of the following design 479 turns of #22 wire on a 3" plastic tube, the coil should be loosely wound as a close wound coil tends to reduce power collection. One end should be connected to unit at antenna connection point and the other to an antenna of your choice .

    Other coil types could be used in your experiments such as sliding induction coils that is inside one another and find the best position by moving them in different positions.

    Other coil types can be found by referencing any good book on radio fundamentals. Check out the Telsa type coils as well.

    Power could be also enhanced by placing a tin foil pyramid under the coil as this seems to also improve power.

    The power produced also seems to improve near bridges,ships and any thing containing a great deal of metal.

    A high antenna wire seems to improve the running of unit although a 7 foot whip antenna worked reasonably well too.

NON-SENS.
You cant find such extremly power in natural enbiroment !
in Front of an AM Radio statuon you can find such power.
I done this 1955 (yes, i was 14 ! old).
next 1m34 are detectin diodes fpr use in transistorized receiver, an can never use to rectify 9watt  at 36volts (equal to 300mAmps. !.
1N34 are (i have them) for using typical  lower than 1mA. in receivers. or up to 50mA applications.

For  sucht circuit, as in patent.  1n270 , 1n277 germanium gold bonded diodes are fpr the needed current usefully, BUT the  circuit, is never usefull in any normally condition (as offered).
pese

THIS is NOT the way, to drive an electric car , like tesla!
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: e2matrix on April 23, 2011, 02:45:29 AM
70L7

it is an double system tube.
1 part ist Audio output pentode (to drive the loudspeacker,
the DIODE  ist an one way rectifier  to rectifie the 110volts ACc (MAINPOWER) TO  (ABOUT 150VOLTS). So that was usual to use no Power transformers in radio receiver, so it was uses an 70 Volt heating filament.

70L7 need 70Volt  115L7  115Volt AC to heat up  to becomes electron flow between cathode and anode of the tube.

(70 volts used in receivers if som other receiving tubes was added in serie to total 115volt)   115L7 was used in singel tubes amplifiers (phono ).
-I am born 1941 and working from 1950 beginnig 1950 in my fathers radio repair shop)  So i know the technik my whole life on beginning..)

BUT WHY Tesla use 70volt burning filaments, IF it was also 12 volt types wit - als the others SAME caracteristics on the marked =!=!. I showed all european and us types !!

So another secret must be inckude-
Tesla have -sure- nit used 12 volt to invert that first ti 70 volts !!,

So the tubes was used colf (without heating=)
or undergliwed with only dark-red heating with 12 volts ???

So also you must understand that this tube habe only 2-3 watt powerdissipation, and can never  power an motor. als 10 or ore underheatet /an underpowered( tubes cant work as an
amplifier ??

I have brocken my head over years for this ask.

I belive you are an an good way to find this out with your
cakculations. The secret it is to find (i think so) in the electron flow of the cathode.
the ether give an lot of RF Power over an spectrum of waves to the antenna, that give (as mix) an lot of nois.frequencies.
Pehaps that are or will be mixed with the waves outvoming
of the cathodes ot the tubes.

(I remember an electronic tube cirvuit wit 5R4 5U4 rectifier tubes from SM (that was for short tim to see in WEB. (5-6 years ago) in this page he found an unknow additinally power, that he could not explain, BUT so i have understand this circuit
he find an power because he use 2 transformers that have disparated anode and cathode circuit in two parts...

Offcause this circuit was deleted (i think so) very fast from the web. It MUST have some interesting details...

Sorry my english... but i think the information is better than an perfect english language

G Pese
Pese,  I don't like to think I just wasted money buying some 70L7-GT tubes I was planning on experimenting with as I thought there might be something to look at with them (and I got a good deal on some).  But after buying them I found some info that makes it perplexing how Tesla could have used this particular tube.  There is a message thread on OU here about it as someone looked into it even deeper than I had.  The problem is they GE, Raytheon and other tube makers did not even make this particular tube until years after Tesla was said to have used them in the Pierce Arrow electric car demo.  So unless Tesla had some time travel machine or maybe an insider in a tube manufacturing company it seems unlikely he used this particular tube.  This leads me to wonder if these are the correct number or if there was some 'data cleaning' done by the FBI or the PTB concerning the actual tube numbers.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: nightlife on April 23, 2011, 03:18:32 AM
Pese, I do understand that and I was not looking at it as if it could. I thought it may help myself and or others come up with ways to do so.

 That design does collect energy from frequencies, not as much as we need but there maybe another natural frequency and or multiples of others that when combined, say 12, maybe able to supply enough power.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: wings on April 23, 2011, 08:15:00 AM

Yes , this come more "nearby" that was i read , years ago.  Not in overunity.

BUT it MUST be the following experiments,
because  he "find interessantly things" ,
so his words (your found text)

Pese



in these post:

http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=7046.msg174677#msg174677
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: pese on April 24, 2011, 09:53:07 AM
Pese,  I don't like to think I just wasted money buying some 70L7-GT tubes I was planning on experimenting with as I thought there might be something to look at with them (and I got a good deal on some).   
Sure , it is not waste.
Any experiment can help to understand
I try  to let you know, thatt possibly each other tu, do the same
also the system beam-pentode and rect-diode you find a lot of types (in singe tubes and separate (2) tubes.
I think that  teslo NOT used them in "normal configution" as amplifier or rectifier.
Why he have not used 12 volt tubes ??  (12 volt need for filament heaters ! He have not 70volt on his
car-battery !  Why ? 
Have he "underheated" the cathode ?   Have he only used
the cathode,-electron flow ? The emitted wave from tge dark.red kightning ? The waves coming from the  wolfram (bismuth) ? The waves emitting from the cathode-barium ??

It give more to think... not only to electron receiver tube ! Tesla have found and work something withit THAN IS UNUSUAL, so you (we) must  think no the small area of 70L7 Datasheets.  - Including that what SM done with his 5u4  2way rect.tube
- only the emitting electrons have him give (possibly) additional (unusual) energies, that he tried to understand.
(he have stop it, because ununderstanding or surpressing ?)

Pese

P.S.

IF Tesla have used this "noisy" electron flow...
What he have done with this ?

And why the "antenna" on the car ?


Both frequencies (from receiving antenna and the tubes"
was used and important for him.

so he have used the tube  to emitting rf noise in a very wide range of frequencies OR in the range of emmitting barium or bismuth catode.

(As Oscillator?) to mix them with the endless power of ether that received from antenna?

On such things we must possible think also, BECAUSE sucht tube only CAN NOT HANDLE  an small amount of power that was need for the motor..
The secret is never the electronic tube circuit... , we must also see other unusal possibilities to youse the tubes.

Tesla, have he used the resonance frequency from the vacuum (inner the tubes) - cold ? not heating the tubes?.  12 tubes (parallel?) instead of one (with bigger electronic power) !! Why ?
(Only an idea to show over the limits of educated physics).
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: thx1138 on September 19, 2013, 02:23:25 PM
An all together different perspective. The car was powered by an atomic battery. Tesla believed that if radioactive materials could be shielded from cosmic rays the material would no longer be radioactive thus the cosmic rays were what activated radiation by impinging upon raioactive materials. Radium and other radioactive materials were available at the time and had no restrictions on their use. In the New York Times, July 11, 1937 article he spoke of producing radium for a dollar a pound. Why would that be important? Because radium was very rare and cost about 1,000 British Pounds per gram [font=]and a cheap supply would be needed if cars were to be powered with it. Take a look at page 13 at the following link. That is essentially Tesla's radiant energy patent without the condenser, the Sr-90 supplying the radiant energy and no need for a ground connection:  http://homepages.cae.wisc.edu/~blanchar/res/BlanchardKorea.pdf (http://homepages.cae.wisc.edu/~blanchar/res/BlanchardKorea.pdf)[/font]
[font=][/font]
[font=][/font]The government didn't get into regulating nuclear materials until after the WW II atomic bombs. Personaly I think this is why he opposed the Manhattan project - it would weaponize radioactive materials and make then unavailable to the public but that's pure conjecture on my part.
 
The battery was said to be a "normal" 12V battery but how would anyone recognize the difference at the time, especially since the difference would be internal? It was also said to be capable of lighting a house when not in use as a vehicle.
 
The motor was said to be specially built for the project. How about 6 or more phases, the tubes used in phase change circuits for a multi-phase motor? I don't know enough about tube circuits to know if this could be done using 12 tubes or less. Some may have been needed for other purposes.
 
I still have a problem with the "normal" car controls. To what was the accelerator connected?
 
I don't think it was transmitted power because his air transmission was to be done between balloons at 30,000 feet (which he never tried) or through the ground (which he did accomplish) so how would a moving car have a ground connection on an unprepared roadway? The antenna could well have been a decoy and not in use at all because Tesla was very, very cautious at this time, i.e. the story about the secretary.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on September 19, 2013, 09:27:26 PM
I disagree completely.  >:(  Tesla was clear enough , don't try to distort his statements !
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: thx1138 on September 20, 2013, 01:11:50 AM
Most everything I've seen on Tesla's car was someone saying what they or someone else said about the car. I've not seen much about what Tesla himself actually said about it except the following
----------------
Question : Will not wireless transmission of energy result in time in the moving of practically all means of transportation with electrical energy from central power stations?
 
MR. TESLA : No, I do not expect that such will be the case, for the transportation systems now used present certain important practical advantages which cannot be disregarded.

Question: Will not automobiles, for instance, be operated merely by the operative "cutting in" on electrical energy supplied by wireless from power stations?

MR. TESLA : I fear we shall not live to see the wireless system in general use for this purpose.  It is difficult to propel an automobile by the new method for reasons with which experts are familiar. Success can be much more easily achieved in the case of airships.

In time to come it is possible that some form of automobile may be perfected that will enable this propulsion of such vehicles to be effected by power drawn from the ambient medium. [Glass, J. P. , "Tremendous Possibilities of Radio, An Interview With Nikola Tesla," Radio News, November 1922.]
------------------
Cosmic rays would qualify as part of the "ambient medium" and Tesla believed they are what made radioactive materials radioactive. And in 1932 he said, ”I have harnessed the cosmic rays and caused them to operate a motive device. ... More than 25 years ago I began my efforts to harness the cosmic rays and I can now state that I have succeeded in operating a motive device by means of them.” - “Tesla Cosmic Ray Motor May Transmit Power ‘Round Earth”, by John A. O’NEILL for Brooklin Eagle
Note that he says "...by means of them." not that they powered the device directly.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on September 20, 2013, 09:05:46 AM
http://www.tesla-coil-builder.com/Articles/jul_11_1937.htm (http://www.tesla-coil-builder.com/Articles/jul_11_1937.htm)


there is even a better statement but I can't find it right now. Essentially what Tesla stated is that radioactivity is a process of transforming cosmic rays into lower frequency which interacts with atoms. In other words : by knowing the principle he was able to do transmutation of stable elements which is impossible according to current theories. However the most surprising is the fact that theories are not violated, they are too simplified and not taking into consideration the simple fact : energy is coming to Earth from cosmos and gravity is the result of it. Radium and other radioactive matter has a curious property of traceiving this energy into lower frequency and thus break its bonds in the same manner as any other substance when heated enough....
In other words : he found a way to use that energy as the beam to smash atoms....the same way as used in accelerators spending a lot of power.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: thx1138 on September 20, 2013, 02:31:35 PM
I read that aticle in my earlier studies but had forgotten it. From the article: "In a ten-page typewritten statement outlining his discoveries, Dr. Tesla gave a    resume of his work in the fields of gravity and cosmic rays." Have you ever seen that 10 page document on the web? I don't remember it.
 
This may be a stretch but another aspect that we often discount is his Turbine. In the patent he specifically states "...the particles of the fluid...", i.e. a particle accelerator. Air can be considered a fluid and, to stretch it even further, so can aether. So his turbine could be related to this staement in the article: "It employs more than three dozen of my inventions, it    is a complex apparatus, an agglomeration of parts."
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: quantumtangles on May 25, 2014, 02:48:44 PM
The answer is 1 minute and forty seconds into this youtube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atVSxvbiPg0

Ben Kraznow is an applied scientist. He shows how powerful external radio frequency waves can be used to induce current in a proximate plasma cleaner.

This does not mean Tesla was not a clever man. But it does mean...case solved.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: thx1138 on May 26, 2014, 04:38:40 AM
The answer is 1 minute and forty seconds into this youtube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atVSxvbiPg0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atVSxvbiPg0)

Ben Kraznow is an applied scientist. He shows how powerful external radio frequency waves can be used to induce current in a proximate plasma cleaner.

This does not mean Tesla was not a clever man. But it does mean...case solved.
Proximate being the key word. I don't get it. Maybe you can draw me a picture. Where did Tesla get the power to drive the coil and how did the plasma create kinetic energy to move the car?
 
Case solved?
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: tturner on May 26, 2014, 11:41:18 PM
@forest and everyone else
i just started a thread under tesla technology called "tesla zpr generator cosmic energy" that has a complete description and links to the cosmic ray therory and even a attachment called free energy suprise with plans how to build a devisr with huge outputs
the page is not getting much attention but i feel it needs a fair look from the group
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Jimboot on April 28, 2017, 02:04:35 PM
I went Googling for old Buffalo newspaper articles on this to show a friend and could find none. Now it all seems to be fake news about how this was a hoax concocted in the 60s. Yet I have seen newspaper articles from the time that he did it. If anyone has them or links please post them here. I intend to fix Google. :)
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: thx1138 on April 28, 2017, 08:44:31 PM
You probably won't find anything in the Buffalo, NY newspapers. All of the info about the electric car came, one way or another, from Peter Salvo, Tesla's nephew. Some say he was, at that time, a lonely man looking for attention. Could be. Maybe not. but since there's really no evidence to back it up, it really comes down to belief. Personally, I was intrigued by the article that said the car could be used to power a home when not in use as a vehicle. That kind of points away from transmitted power because anyone could just as well put a receiver on the house as well. Tesla never tried to transmit power through the air as far as I know. His initial patents were to transmit power between balloons at 30,000 feet. It's right there in the patents if you look for it. He did, however, accomplish transmitting power through the ground in Colorado Springs. See his Colorado Springs notes of July 4, 1899. That's when he saw power being transmitted through the ground by lightning. He didn't immediately recognize what he was seeing because the next day's notes are talking about extracting hydrogen from the atmosphere for the balloons. We surely would have photos if he ever tried to maintain balloons at 30,000 feet. It would have been a major undertaking and I've never seen any photos of such. Somewhere along the line he realized that he could use the ground and do away with the balloons. That's what Wardenclyffe was about. When the July 4, 1899 notes are fresh in your mind picture lightning striking the ground at the same place every time and under controlled frequency and duration to set up standing waves. That's what Wardenclyffe was about.

But how do you power a moving car that requires an attachment to the ground? You don't.

Another man named Arthur Matthews, who claimed to be Tesla's son, also talked about an electric car with a new kind of "primary battery" that any 15 year old boy could replenish with new plates when the battery ran down. The problem with him, however, is that he claimed Tesla was from Venus so he's considered a whacko.

At any rate, nuclear batteries are in use today. They are used in applications where longevity is needed and no maintenance is possible or extremely difficult. The Russians used them to power lighthouses around the arctic circle. They are also what powers the Voyager space probes that were launched in the late 70's and are still transmitting data back today as they reach the edge of the solar system and start out into interstellar space.

But to understand Tesla's discovery you have to understand the times. There were no regulations on working with nuclear material until the 1950's - after it was proven that nuclear energy could be weaponized by the atomic bombs in Japan. So in the 1930's the field was wide open. What today is called "radiation" is what Tesla meant by "radiant energy". He didn't even coin the term. It was Michael Faraday that proposed "radiant matter" and Crooke's was the first one that I know of that used the term "radiant energy".

Also understand that when Tesla first mentioned "radiant energy" the atom was thought to be the indivisible minima of matter. Scientists of that day didn't just think that electrons didn't exist, but thought they couldn't exist. They also thought that all of those twinkles in the night sky were sun's just like ours. It wasn't until the 1930's that it was recognized that galaxies existed and that our sun is just one star in one galaxy that has roughly a hundred billion stars.

That's just a couple of examples of what I mean about understanding the times that Tesla worked in. A lot of what we take for granted today was unknown during Tesla's time.

See the attached file. It also has a lot of links to info the about these claims.

If you still want to pursue Tesla's electric car though news reports see if you can find a copy of John Ratzlaff's "Tesla Said". That is a 300 page compilation of articles and presentations by Tesla.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Jimboot on April 29, 2017, 01:29:29 AM
You probably won't find anything in the Buffalo, NY newspapers. All of the info about the electric car came, one way or another, from Peter Salvo, Tesla's nephew. Some say he was, at that time, a lonely man looking for attention. Could be. Maybe not. but since there's really no evidence to back it up, it really comes down to belief. Personally, I was intrigued by the article that said the car could be used to power a home when not in use as a vehicle. That kind of points away from transmitted power because anyone could just as well put a receiver on the house as well. Tesla never tried to transmit power through the air as far as I know. His initial patents were to transmit power between balloons at 30,000 feet. It's right there in the patents if you look for it. He did, however, accomplish transmitting power through the ground in Colorado Springs. See his Colorado Springs notes of July 4, 1899. That's when he saw power being transmitted through the ground by lightning. He didn't immediately recognize what he was seeing because the next day's notes are talking about extracting hydrogen from the atmosphere for the balloons. We surely would have photos if he ever tried to maintain balloons at 30,000 feet. It would have been a major undertaking and I've never seen any photos of such. Somewhere along the line he realized that he could use the ground and do away with the balloons. That's what Wardenclyffe was about. When the July 4, 1899 notes are fresh in your mind picture lightning striking the ground at the same place every time and under controlled frequency and duration to set up standing waves. That's what Wardenclyffe was about.

But how do you power a moving car that requires an attachment to the ground? You don't.

Another man named Arthur Matthews, who claimed to be Tesla's son, also talked about an electric car with a new kind of "primary battery" that any 15 year old boy could replenish with new plates when the battery ran down. The problem with him, however, is that he claimed Tesla was from Venus so he's considered a whacko.

At any rate, nuclear batteries are in use today. They are used in applications where longevity is needed and no maintenance is possible or extremely difficult. The Russians used them to power lighthouses around the arctic circle. They are also what powers the Voyager space probes that were launched in the late 70's and are still transmitting data back today as they reach the edge of the solar system and start out into interstellar space.

But to understand Tesla's discovery you have to understand the times. There were no regulations on working with nuclear material until the 1950's - after it was proven that nuclear energy could be weaponized by the atomic bombs in Japan. So in the 1930's the field was wide open. What today is called "radiation" is what Tesla meant by "radiant energy". He didn't even coin the term. It was Michael Faraday that proposed "radiant matter" and Crooke's was the first one that I know of that used the term "radiant energy".

Also understand that when Tesla first mentioned "radiant energy" the atom was thought to be the indivisible minima of matter. Scientists of that day didn't just think that electrons didn't exist, but thought they couldn't exist. They also thought that all of those twinkles in the night sky were sun's just like ours. It wasn't until the 1930's that it was recognized that galaxies existed and that our sun is just one star in one galaxy that has roughly a hundred billion stars.

That's just a couple of examples of what I mean about understanding the times that Tesla worked in. A lot of what we take for granted today was unknown during Tesla's time.

See the attached file. It also has a lot of links to info the about these claims.

If you still want to pursue Tesla's electric car though news reports see if you can find a copy of John Ratzlaff's "Tesla Said". That is a 300 page compilation of articles and presentations by Tesla.




No you are incorrect. There are newspaper articles from the 1930s. I have read them. Even if I have to travel to NY and go to libraries I will find them. This Salvo thing is a recent fake news.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: sm0ky2 on April 29, 2017, 04:53:55 AM
I've rummaged through something close to 3,000
newspaper articles from 1891-1938 concerning Mr. T.
With an exception of an electric "death ray" of 50MV,
and plans to deliver it to Geneva just before the Fed's
ramsacked his lab... 
there was nothing of particular interest found in any of
the articles. Most certainly no mention of an electric
automobile.


I did however come across two variations of a photograph
IN a car, I'm not sure which one is the real image and which
one is the 'mirror' image.
Nor is there any indication that this is or may be the electric one.





Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Jimboot on April 29, 2017, 07:27:25 AM
Thanks Smoky, that was not the car it was a Pierce Arrow. When I find the article(s) I will post them here.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Cherryman on April 29, 2017, 10:27:30 AM
Doing some searching myself...


A lot seems to have vanished indeed... 


here is a mention in Italian about a newspaper in 1931


"Il New York Daily News del 2 aprile 1934 riportava un articolo intitolato "Il sogno di Tesla di un'energia senza fili vicino alla realtŕ", che descriveva un "esperimento programmato per spingere un'automobile utilizzando la trasmissione senza fili di energia elettrica". Questo successe dopo l'episodio e non vi era menzione di "free energy".[/size] "


Edit:


I added a PDF about the car, still not the newspaper




Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Cherryman on April 29, 2017, 10:36:39 AM

"CAR NIKOLA TESLA


1930 Tesla called his cousin, Peter Sava, who was born in Yugoslavia in 1899, to come to New York. Peter was 43 years younger than his uncle. Until that day he lived under difficult conditions in Yugoslavia, a country where he was born Tesla. During the year 1931, Tesla took his cousin in Buffalo to discover and test the new car. Tesla has developed its own means.


It was a Pierce Arrow, one of the luxury cars of that period. The engine was removed, leaving the clutch, gearbox and laptop to the rear wheels undisturbed. The petrol engine is switched round, totally enclosed electric motor 1m and a length of approximately 65cm diameter, with a cooling fan at the front. They say that he had no distributor. Tesla was not willing to say who produced the engine. It is possible that this was one of the sectors of company Westinghouse.


Tesla have made "energy receiver" (gravitational energy converter). Dimensions converter housing were approximately 60 x 25 x 15cm. He was installed in front of the dashboard. Among other things, the transducer 12 is contained vacuum tube, of which three were L-type 70 +7. Severe Antenna Long about 1.8 meters out from the converters. This antenna is apparently had the same function as the one in Moray converters. In addition, the two fat blends are sticking out approximately 10cm from the converter housing. Tesla them stuffed saying "Now we have the energy." The engine, it reached a maximum of 1800 rpm.


Tesla said it was pretty hot when working, and therefore the cooling fan was required. For the rest, he said that there is enough power in the converter to illuminate the entire cab and started the engine. The car was tested one week, reaching a top speed of 90 miles per hour without problems. Data about its effect were at least the same as those cars that have used petrol. The sign to stop a passer-by is noted that in muffler do not put the exhaust gas. Peter answered, "We have no engine". The car he was held on a farm, maybe 20 miles from Bufala, not far from Niagara Falls.


Couple months after his car tested, and because of the then economic crisis, she had to stop production of cars Pierce Arrow. It is likely that the correlation between the electric motor and gear train is in radial. Tools autobomila Pierce Arrow has taken firm Studebaker, South Bend-in. About 30 years later, the company has also disappeared, and formed the company American Motors, together with the company Nash. Later, some of his obozavacoci trying to revive the car Pierce Arrow. Unfortunately, they did not have success.


Thus, today the name of the company in the mausoleum, along with others such as Horch, Maybach, Hispano-Suiza, Bugatti and Isotta Fraschini."
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on April 29, 2017, 06:42:00 PM
Between 1919 and 1928 there was a lot of inventors who built electric car powered by cosmic energy.!

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: NickZ on April 30, 2017, 01:02:59 AM
  Perhaps you can place a link or two... of the other guys that had self running electric cars, back then, or even now.
  Cars, or other solid state generators or contraptions that can harvest cosmic energy, and convert it to use able energy.
  The technology may not be new, but it's still new to us.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Vortex1 on April 30, 2017, 02:46:10 AM
 From an article I found on the web. You asked so here's one:
Sorry if this has already been posted..then just delete it.
----------------------------------------------------------
Quote
           C. Earl Ammann’s Cosmic Electric Generator

 In 1918, while doing painting and decorating, I was hired to paper several bedrooms in a large two-story house. While at this work I went down to the back porch to pick up some materials. I happened to glance at the light meter and saw it was not moving.
I opened the fuse box and saw the main power fuses had been removed. It took only a minute to make sure the line had not been taped beyond the meter.
The only member of the family at home at the time was a young man in his early twenties. I asked him, “Earl, where do you get your juice? I noticed it does not come from the power lines”.
“Come along and I’ll show you”, he said. He led me up to the attic. He placed some steel bars on a work table and picked up a coil which looked like a loose coupler. After placing the coils on the steel rods he touched the opposite terminal. The bell rang with great force, and there was quite a spark, too.
 
 I picked up the coils to make sure there was no contact with other appliances. I could see right through them. There was no battery inside. The bell rang just as vigorously. The wire was iron.
In the basement Earl had what he called an Activator Transformer, the size of two fists, which had to be within 10 miles of the radius of the generator coils. The activator was not in contact with any visible wires or appliances. It was activated by the electric currents which surge around the earth and activate the compass needle. By cutting into these currents, earl said, we can obtain unlimited power.
A year later Earl demonstrated his Cosmo Electric Generator in Denver. He had placed two copper spheres on the front fenders of his car in place of the headlights. From these copper spheres he obtained enough power to drive that old jalopy all over Denver as reported in the Denver Post at the time.   [see Tesla’s Electric Car]
While Earl was demonstrating his invention all over the streets of Denver, the power had been cut off in the foothills. In spite of this, when he went to Washington DC shortly afterward to try to obtain a patent on his Cosmo Electric Generator, he found that charges had been filed against him claiming he had a device to steal power from the power lines.
K. H. Isselstein,
 Spokane, WA

 
  Denver Post (Monday, August 8, 1921)
   Denver Man, C. Earl Ammann, Invents Generator That
 Takes Electricity From Air and Propels Automobile  Believes He has Apparatus that will Revolutionize Power & Lighting & Gives it a Test on Streets of City
Has an invention been made that will revolutionize the electrical world? Will the apparatus conceived by a Denver man light buildings, run automobiles, battleships, power plants by the unlimited supply of electricity in the air? Denver electrical experts say “yes”, and the young inventor, C. Earl Ammann, today, demonstrated his invention by attaching it to an old automobile and running it about the city.
An atmospheric generator is the name of Ammann’s apparatus. It is a compact, cylindrical object with two small brass spheres protruding from the top. Inside, Ammann says, is an arrangement of steel wires and minerals, so fixed as to draw the electricity from the air, condense it and utilize it for driving power.
The automobile which Ammann used for his demonstration Monday was the body and chassis of an electric vehicle. There are said to be no batteries in the car. It propelled itself with remarkable speed at the touch of the foot, climbed hills and glided through a maze of traffic under easy control.
Ammann, Careful To Conceal His Invention
When asked by skeptical persons if he had a storage battery concealed inside of the power cylinder, Ammann said:
“As badly as I would like to show the inside of my invention, I can’t, for I have not yet obtained the patent rights. It would be exposing the result of seven years of work to open the cylinder. I leave for Washington this week to obtain the patent rights. When I return I will gladly show everything and I can only say, wait until then and time will tell.
“I have bucked every law of the textbooks to perfect the invention. It appears on the order of the wireless telephone but it is decidedly different, except that the electricity is derived from the air. It will run anywhere except under water.
The automobile is only a simple test. The generator will light buildings, do away with steam turbines, and, in fact, propel any kind of engine motor”.
J. N. Davis, the proprietor of the Davis Electric Garage company, at 921 East 14th Avenue, and one of the oldest electrical men in Denver, made a thorough study of the generator.
Electrical Man Has Faith In It
“I believe that Mr. Ammann has at least made the invention which will revolutionize power”, Mr. Davis said. “Of course, we don’t know what is inside of the generator and the inventor would be foolish to show us. We have long known that certain minerals exist, which if properly arranged together, would furnish power. That, in substance, according to the blueprints of the invention, is the basis of the whole thing.
“If the generator has been perfected to the extent that it will propel an automobile, the rest of its work is assured. It will be the greatest invention of the age. The electricity obtained from the air, first passing through the generator, would be available for any use”. So impressed was Mr. Davis that he offered the use of his building for Mr. Ammann’s headquarters. Ammann, who is but 28 years old, came to Denver from Spokane, Washington. He is an electrical engineer and lives at the Argonaut Hotel.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As a kid in the 50's I watched these wide eyed, interested in science as I was.
Was the guy in this movie Tesla, Mr. Amman or an alien?
Grab some popcorn and enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2Xukp9gUZI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2Xukp9gUZI)
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on April 30, 2017, 11:19:39 AM
What I would like to tell you is that the Amman device is the same as Hendershot device ,which is the same as Hubbard device which is the same as Perrigo device which is probably a spin off from Daniel Mc Farland cook device and many Earth batteries. It all works by tapping the cosmic energy which is the magnetic field and particularly the magnetic field of Earth.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Jimboot on April 30, 2017, 11:45:24 AM
I'm looking for the newspaper clippings of the day and they seem to have vanished. So any news stories of the day about long range electric cars that got their power via an aerial, will do :)
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on April 30, 2017, 11:59:24 AM
http://www.rexresearch.com/perrigo/perrig.htm compare the device to the Amman one.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on April 30, 2017, 12:06:18 PM
I'm looking for the newspaper clippings of the day and they seem to have vanished. So any news stories of the day about long range electric cars that got their power via an aerial, will do :)


If you have a spare hours... http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/newspapers/
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on April 30, 2017, 12:31:53 PM
Also if you have access to this http://archives.kcstar.com/ would be great to get a copies of Kansas City Times with articles about H.Perrigo
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: vasik041 on April 30, 2017, 07:49:19 PM
Not sure if this related but anyway

https://artojh.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/tesla-art1933-1.jpg (https://artojh.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/tesla-art1933-1.jpg)

Quote
The Sydney Morning Herald, NSW, Friday 3 November 1933
COSMIC ENERGY
To Drive World Machinery.
INVENTOR’S CLAIM.
 NEW YORK. NOV. 1.
Nikola Tesla, a well-known physicist and inventor, in a signed statement today, announced the discovery of a principle whereby power for driving the machinery of the world may be derived from the cosmic energy operating the universe.
 The principle, which taps the source of power described as “everywhere present In unlimited quantities,” and which may be transmitted by wire or wireless from a central plant in any part of the globe, will, he says, eliminate the need for coal, oil, gas, or any other common fuels, and will soon be ready for use, and, while the present form will require central plants employing vast machinery, he popes to work out a plan for its use by Individuals.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: vasik041 on April 30, 2017, 08:25:34 PM
PS I found it here https://artojh.wordpress.com/2014/03/17/tesla-newspaper-articles-i/ (https://artojh.wordpress.com/2014/03/17/tesla-newspaper-articles-i/)
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on May 01, 2017, 07:23:01 AM
Only iron and wire, nothing more is required....
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Magluvin on May 01, 2017, 07:49:44 AM
Read an article years ago about electric cars. They were out since 1838.  The first car dealerships were electric cars. The History channel story on cars did not reflect that info and only said they tried to compete with combustion engines but didnt muster the speed.  When really it was that people didnt like the loud noise and smoke from the fire breathing cars. 

If there was electric cars that could harvest energy to run, then yeah the oil companies had to boost the gas cars above electrics before the free running cars became mainstream.

Mags
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: forest on May 01, 2017, 09:02:39 AM
Hubbard,Amman,Perrigo - they all had electric car running on cosmic energy before 1930 with newspapers following their progress, so it was not surprise Tesla could do it also.



Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Jimboot on May 01, 2017, 11:28:49 PM
Thanks but it does not mention the car. Good finds though. I will keep looking.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: endlessoceans on May 02, 2017, 01:01:47 AM
Between 1919 and 1928 there was a lot of inventors who built electric car powered by cosmic energy.!


Yeh?  Like who?


When discussing scientific matters and searching for TRUTH please provide PROOFS.  Facts and patents to support wild claims.  We all want to investigate further
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: endlessoceans on May 02, 2017, 01:11:07 AM
Hubbard,Amman,Perrigo - they all had electric car running on cosmic energy before 1930 with newspapers following their progress, so it was not surprise Tesla could do it also.

Such Vague claims Forest or whatever other name you go under

1)  Hubbard had access to radioactive materials of which there are well know principles to 'amplify ' electricity

2)  Perrigo was thoroughly investigated, resisted all attempts at looking at his car and was later found to be a fraud with a large 12v battery hidden under the seat of the vehicle

3)  Amman admitted to using 'minerals' in his device.   Minerals = Fuel of some sort.

4)  All in all unless there is further EVIDENCE that points otherwise, making big claims that all these devices "are the same' serves no purpose

All that is needs is iron and wire you say?  PLease by all means explain.
Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: endlessoceans on May 02, 2017, 01:22:37 AM
Read an article years ago about electric cars. They were out since 1838.  The first car dealerships were electric cars. The History channel story on cars did not reflect that info and only said they tried to compete with combustion engines but didnt muster the speed.  When really it was that people didnt like the loud noise and smoke from the fire breathing cars. 

If there was electric cars that could harvest energy to run, then yeah the oil companies had to boost the gas cars above electrics before the free running cars became mainstream.

Mags

Yes electric cars and advancements in electric motors were rapid but they all fell short in one respect......energy source.  It was only the invention of the lead acid cell in commercial quantities that made the electric car viable.

However lets not get carried away with speculation as to why they died out. 

NONE....I repeat...NONE of the commercial electric cars were running on cosmic energy.  They all used a battery of some kind.  They didn't die out because of some terrible oil industry conspiracy. 

1)  Electric Cars were twice the expense of Fuel driven

2)  Their weight and efficiency was terrible.

3)  The invention of the electric starter in fuel cars made them more popular so people didn't have to break their backs in bad weather cranking them up. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_electric_vehicle


Stick to the facts and we can find TRUTH of all sorts.

So what happened to Amman?  As the story goes he was "off to Washington to file a patent".  Did he get lost along the way?  Murdered?  What?

So far every one of these claims has been debunked and the inventors +98% were shown to be frauds.  The math doesn't stack up.

There are some excellent methods of power utilization that are certainly not being used today but all that can be supported with good experimentation and replicable bench tests.

Title: Re: Teslas electric car
Post by: Magluvin on May 02, 2017, 07:09:24 AM
Yes electric cars and advancements in electric motors were rapid but they all fell short in one respect......energy source.  It was only the invention of the lead acid cell in commercial quantities that made the electric car viable.

However lets not get carried away with speculation as to why they died out. 

NONE....I repeat...NONE of the commercial electric cars were running on cosmic energy.  They all used a battery of some kind.  They didn't die out because of some terrible oil industry conspiracy. 

1)  Electric Cars were twice the expense of Fuel driven

2)  Their weight and efficiency was terrible.

3)  The invention of the electric starter in fuel cars made them more popular so people didn't have to break their backs in bad weather cranking them up. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_electric_vehicle (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_electric_vehicle)


Stick to the facts and we can find TRUTH of all sorts.

So what happened to Amman?  As the story goes he was "off to Washington to file a patent".  Did he get lost along the way?  Murdered?  What?

So far every one of these claims has been debunked and the inventors +98% were shown to be frauds.  The math doesn't stack up.

There are some excellent methods of power utilization that are certainly not being used today but all that can be supported with good experimentation and replicable bench tests.


". Sadly, it is soon destroyed by railway workers who see it as a potential threat to their livelihood"

https://cleantechnica.com/2015/04/26/electric-car-history/


"This impressive performance so alarmed railway workers (who saw it as a threat to their jobs tending steam engines) that they destroyed Davidson’s devil machine, which he’d named "Galvani.""


http://www.caranddriver.com/flipbook/worth-the-watt-a-brief-history-of-the-electric-car-1830-to-present



Now if the railroad thought it was a threat to their industry, then the propaganda against electric, whether it was viable or not, by the oil companies Im sure was null in your viewpoint. ::)

Mags