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Author Topic: Control Inside?  (Read 29283 times)

BEP

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Control Inside?
« on: September 11, 2007, 07:44:24 PM »
References to the control being inside? I have the impression the goal will not be realized until the control is inside. Why?
There is mention about electronic noise. I can believe that. There must be something else.

Speculation: Since time distortion does occur with similar devices (more than I have done this - Thankfully.. This has been done at Universities and by folks with resonable credentials) - Would it not make sense to put the control inside - where the control is in the same time domain/plane/reference as the magnetic fields it controls?

This would be very important if wave interference/summation/etc/etc is supposed to happen.

If my speculation is correct any device using external controls would need to be extremely complex to make up the difference. This would be a good reason to also put tube controls inside - as it appears in the 97 volt TPU.

EMdevices

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2007, 10:14:45 PM »
In the videos,  SM is holding a small pickup loop oriented normal to a vertical plane passing through the center fo the TPU, and the loop is located just OUTSIDE the large TPU.  He is measuring the intensity of the fields.

That fact coupled with some common sense electronics tells us that there could be serious interference to  control circuitry placed outside IF IT'S NOT PROPERLY PROTECTED of course.

Magnetic fields have a nasty habit of induceing voltages in PC boards   :)

But at the center of the TPU,  the fields are almost zero, why?   Vectorial component cancelation, that's why.   Does that tell us anything about the field pattern?   Even lobes? Odd lobes?   :)

There are so many clues in the videos

EM

BEP

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2007, 11:29:47 PM »
@EM

Often I think I've missed out on clues. I thought I had seen all the videos now. I don't recall that one - with the loop and measuring.
I don't recall seeing any with external controls. Are there any with external controls?

It takes me half an hour to view a 30 second clip so I probably missed it.

BEP

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2007, 06:04:34 AM »
@EM

I appreciate your thoughts on my question. I see you as having your Elec theory down pat.

Now after having time to relax and get some chow I fired up an old friend (coil) because your mention of strong outside field didn't sound right. Yes, it is right but not for this old freind of mine. Indeed it was as I remembered. There is very little field outside the coil. Almost all measurable field is along the vertical axis and strongest in the center (using a pickup loop -- diode to meter).

It does nothing except create heat if fed for more than several seconds. It was meant for short bursts.

Is it possible SM was using the loop to look for unwanted magnetic field on the outside?


EMdevices

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2007, 04:49:39 PM »
I have 4 SM videos saved on my computer and one of them shows the pickup loop (I think it's the main UEC video, and it's a long video !!)

You are correct about a "conventional" coil, or loop (or even solenoid),  the magnetic field is the strongest INSIDE.      So what does that tell us about the TPU coils  :)     They are UNCOVENTIONAL, and the largest current flows where?  On the vertical TOROIDAL winding, that's the main one that builds up the STANDING WAVE RESONANCE, and judging by his statements, he would have to use even lobes (so they come in pairs and cancel the fields at the center, if indeed it's so problematic as he claims)

But there are ways to get around the interference problem.   A good book on EMC will reveal a number of "tricks" once can use to supress radiated emissions and succeptability to receiving them.  There are good design practices and codes to follow.   But to answer your question I haven't seen a TPU with the control on the OUTSIDE, except the smaller TPUs and it was probably a switch that was on the outside.

EM

P.S.  Oh and by the way, if we place the electronics FAR FAR away from the TPU, again that should be ok, The fields have a donut shape just like the toroid albeit an inflated donut where in the center you're protected only because the fields cancel but in the vicinity of the TPU on the outside,  you will be hit by the rotating waves, unless ofcourse we move far far away from it.
« Last Edit: September 12, 2007, 05:14:32 PM by EMdevices »

MACEDONIA CD

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #5 on: September 12, 2007, 09:38:31 PM »

 HEY  TO ALL
  a like to say to all  everubody  is  put me down   
but im  good man  and  i teling you    when  S.M said  earth elktromagne  fild  ho is move  the elktrones in the wire   
 for all ho whant to read  please 
  S.M said  6000 cicle  <<6000Hz>>  whit  dc voltage    <<  way is teling this  >>  :o
i teling  you   if you have  a simple radio  FM  and find  where is not  be  a stations  i mean beatveane  2 stations    you can listen  a  noise  i   that noise  is  about  6000 Hz    anther time  i whill send  to all to see  way is like that  S.M said  his divices is like  a recivers  S.M  said  if you  tune  clouse to the raid frek  then hi whill get burn itself 
i said  is like this if you have noise  6000  that nois  is smaler  voltage but  is constant  whit no   variable  voltage  ,, if  yo put in the raid fre.  whit  variable  nf nose   then whill hapend this   
in 1 second  the voltage whill be a big  then in the  anther  second  whill be  small 

that is the reason way is  a stability is hi divices is   if S.M catch  the raid station  his voltage whill be variable    A NOISE  OF 6000 CICLE  <<FREK.>>  IS PERFEKT  FOR THIS    DIVICES  NO VARIABLE   
way dc voltage   the ansver  is  so simple  if you have  high frek  whit  audio  modulation  insaid  the high frek   yuo  put  only  a simple  diode  you then  whill separated  the high frek.   of  audio frek     the simple diode  whill be  to  provide  dc  voltage  from hihg frekk  , but  whit  6000  hz  insaid   
imagen  if you have osciloscope  if you put dc  in to  the scale whill up  but if you put in this dc voltage  nois  whit 6000 hz  the  osciloscope be like this   
the dc whill be  up of  +   whit  sinuse noise
is obviuse   is so simple    S.M  said   
THE WIRE IS  IMPORTANT  AND COIL OPERATIONS  <<WAY>>  man S.M said golden  thing   if you thing  and thing  there is the ansver


 in the  end i said this DC VOLTAGE  WHITT 6000 CICLE
                                 WIRE IS IMPORTANT   COIL OPERATIONS 
                                EARTH ELEKTROMAGNET FILD
                                 TELLING  THE TRUE     
 MY LITLE HELP IS  IF YOU MUVE SMALL  MAGNET  WHIT HIGH SPEED  TO  A SIMPLE WIRE  YOU GET  THE MORE POWER   OF THE SIMPLE WIRE  <<<< IF YOU CHANGE  MAGNET  IN TO A HIGH SMALL ELKTROMAGNET WAVE  THEN YOU GET THE POWER  >>
VERY SMALL ELKTROMAGNET WAVE  WHIT HIGH SPEED  IS LIKE  BOMB   YOU THEN  WHILL MOVE ELEKTRONES WHIT  VERY HIGH SPEED  IMAGEN THIS  IS NO NEED BATERY FOR  THIS DIVICES   HI ONLY  NEED A ELEKTROMAGNET  WAVE  WHIT VERY VERY SMALL OR MICRO VOLTAGE  BUT  MUST BE WHIT  HIGH FREK  .. THEN YOU GET THE IF YOU NEED  A 1000 OF AMP   HAT IS THE ANSVER   TO ALL  SECRETS  OF DIVICES 
S.M  is teling the true  but whit  secret in his worlds  the key is thi
 EARTH ELEKTROMAGNET WAVE   
 WIRES  IS IMPORTANT  COIL IN OPERATIONS 
 AND 6000 HZ  WHIT DC VOLTAGE 
I  WHIL SEND TO ALL TO SEE  THIS   IN THE VIDEO CLIP TO PRUVET  HIS DIVICES  IS  POSIBLE  AND IS SO  SIMPLE    SEE YOU  AND THING IF YOU ANDRSTEND SOME OF THIS  I HAVE TELL YOU  NO BATERY NO CIRCUITS WHIT TRASISTORS  ONLY WIRES  AND COILS  WHIT DIODE  THAT IS ANSVER   
BY FROM MACEDONIA

EMdevices

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2007, 12:29:14 AM »
Hi Macedonia CD,

I like what you are saying !! 

 I hope you don't mind, but I want to retype your text.  It helps me understand it better as well.   You are improving your English and I admire your efforts to type in another language, so continue posting.


===================================================================================

HEY  TO ALL,
 
I  would like to say to all,   Everybody  is  puting me down !  

But I'm a good man,  and  I'm telling you that  when  S.M says:  "the earth's electromagnetic  field   is moving  the electrons in the wire"  (he means it)     For all that want to read (his words/letters to verify the statement),  please do.

S.M mentions  6000 cycles  << or 6000 Hz>>  with a dc voltage    <<  why is he saying this?  >> 

I'm telling  you that  if you have  a simple FM radio,  and tune it to a spot where there are no stations, I mean right between 2 stations,   you can listen and hear a  noise of  about  6000 Hz !!!    Some other time  I will send (or post) more info so you can all see  why that is.

Now,  S.M said  his device is like  a receiver, also,  S.M  said  if you  tune  too close to the right frequency  then you run the risk of getting burned.
 
I say  it's like this:  if you have noise of 6000 Hz,  that noise  is a small  voltage but  constant,  with no variable  voltage.  If  you put in the right frequency,  with this variable  Rf noise,  then this is what will hapend:  in 1 second  the voltage will be big  then in another  second  it will be  small.

That is the reason way there is instability in his devices.    It's because  if S.M catches, or tunes to the right station,  his voltage will be variable.    A NOISE  OF 6000 CYCLES  <<or FREQUENCY.>>  IS PERFECT  FOR THESE    DEVICES,  NO VARIATION  !!!

Why a DC voltage?     

The answer  is  so simple,  if you have  high frequency  with  audio  modulation,  instead  of the high frequency alone,   you can put (or insert)  only  a simple  diode to separated  the high frequency from the  audio frequency.     The simple diode  will be  to  provide (or separte)  the DC  voltage  from the high frequency, but  with  the 6000  hz  instead.
 
Imagine if you have an osciloscope.  If you put DC in to scale, it will go up,  but if you put in this DC voltage  noise of 6000 hz,  the  osciloscope will be like this:  the DC will be up of  (+)   with the sinusoidal noise.   It's obvious !!   It's so simple !!

 S.M  said:

THE WIRE IS  IMPORTANT  AND COIL OPERATIONS        <<WHY (did he say that)??>> 
Man, S.M said a golden  thing !!!  
If you think  and think about it,  there is the answer !!!


In the  end, I say this:

 1)   DC VOLTAGE  WITH 6000 CYCLES
 2)   WIRE IS IMPORTANT,   COIL OPERATION 
 3)   EARTH ELECTROMAGNETIC FIELD
 4)   SM IS TELLING  THE TRUTH
     
MY LITTLE HELP IS  THIS:

IF YOU MOVE  A SMALL  MAGNET,  WITH HIGH SPEED,  PAST  A SIMPLE WIRE,  YOU GET  MORE POWER FROM THE SIMPLE WIRE (then if moved slowly) 

<<<< IF YOU CHANGE  THE MAGNET  INTO A HIGH SPEED SMALL AMPLITUDE  ELECTROMAGNETIC WAVE,  THEN YOU GET LOTS OF POWER  (due to the speed of light the waves are traveling at) >>>>

A VERY SMALL ELECTROMAGNETIC WAVE,   WITH HIGH SPEED,  IS LIKE A BOMB !!  YOU THEN  WILL MOVE ELECTRONS WITH  VERY HIGH SPEED !! 

IMAGINE THIS: 
THERE IS NO NEED FOR A BATTERY, FOR  THESE DEVICES.   HE ONLY  NEEDS AN ELECTROMAGNETIC  WAVE  WITH A VERY VERY SMALL, OR MICRO VOLTAGE AMPLITUDE,  BUT IT MUST BE WITH A HIGH FREQUENCY.   THEN YOU GET THE CURRENT YOU NEED !!   THE 1000s OF AMPS!!!  

THAT IS THE ANSWER   TO ALL  THE SECRETS  OF HIS DEVICES !! 

S.M  is teling the truth,  but with  secrets in his words !

The key is this:

1)   EARTH ELECTROMAGNETIC WAVE  
2)   WIRES  ARE IMPORTANT,  COIL OPERATION 
3)   AND 6000 HZ  WITH DC VOLTAGE 

I  WILL SEND TO ALL TO SEE  THIS IN A VIDEO CLIP, TO PROVE  HIS DEVICES  ARE  POSSIBLE  AND SO  SIMPLE,  SO YOU CAN  SEE  AND THINK IF YOU UNDERSTAND SOME OF THIS.  

I HAVE TO TELL YOU,  NO BATERY, NO CIRCUITS WITH TRANSISTORS,  ONLY WIRES  AND COILS  WITH A DIODE. 

THAT IS THE ANSWER !!  


BYE from MACEDONIA  
« Last Edit: September 13, 2007, 01:01:39 AM by EMdevices »

BEP

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2007, 05:14:18 AM »
@MACEDONIA

I agree with your thoughts. I believe no control circuits are needed to produce this energy.

I also believe control is needed to prevent the 'bomb' effect you mentioned. It is not difficult to wind coils that produce voltage. The difficulty is when you finally understand how you then realize what happens when it runs away!

Any controls I make are for two purposes.

1. Get it started.
2. Keep it from blowing up  :)

I can't wait for your video or any other thoughts!


otto

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #8 on: September 13, 2007, 07:55:16 AM »
Hello all,

yes, and with a Mobius....

Otto

mkt3920

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #9 on: September 13, 2007, 03:37:39 PM »
Hello all,

yes, and with a Mobius....

Otto

Interesting mobius page and speaks of interacting with earth's magnetic field.  Pic looks like mobius wind for the control coils rather than the collector coil.  What if both type coils were mobius wound?  Mobius coils creating mag fields on a mobius strip?
   http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/tripole.htm
Kent

EMdevices

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #10 on: September 13, 2007, 05:24:57 PM »
Guys, there is nothing mysterious about the JNaudin moebius coil.

Of course there is a center pole, look how he winds it!!

Notice the wire changes direction at the center.    He basicaly has two bucking solenoids, No mystery there. 

EM
« Last Edit: September 13, 2007, 06:56:41 PM by EMdevices »

turbo

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #11 on: September 13, 2007, 07:04:13 PM »
well i have studied the inside control coils in the big device, and my conclusion is that it is utilized out of a total of 4 what i call "half moon"coils.

in the cut to pieces tpu is a big speaker magnet placed on a foam piece, so this could be to let the magnet vibrate, if this is the case i assume there is a coil right under the magnet in the controller box.
also in the open tpu we can see a coil like thing under the magnets.
the open tpu's are verry similair to a classical yoke which has a balanced magnetic field on top due to some magnets placed on the upper ring.

based on that we have a vibrating magnet, four half moon coils, acoustics etc...

then it surely starts to look like this,


BEP

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2007, 03:31:26 AM »
Hmmm...

Let the magnet vibrate? If 7.8 (or whatever it is today) is where it vibrates best it stands to reason - There is where the most magnet movement will happen so also best induction. I'm sure it isn't that easy.

If we hit that magnet with two freeks that result in a strong 7.8 then same result ???

@Otto

Have you tried flipping your top collector so any current travels the same direction as the bottom collector? If so then current in the top  would complete the circle in less time - since the top one is smaller. Might save another scope and still give you a difference between top and bottom. Just my opinion  :)


Thedane

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2007, 05:20:37 PM »
Another reason why the controls are placed in the middle might be because of distance.
If he's pulsing 3-4 coils the phases have to be right, otherwise the accelerating field will get out of sync.


wattsup

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Re: Control Inside?
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2007, 11:49:21 PM »
Here's an angle.

If you had a TPU with four coils, and you put a compass in the middle and pulse on the two leads, I have found the compas will not turn, It will lock. See A.

But if you put the TPU on its side, and place the compass in the center, it turns like crazy. See B.

So if you put the TPU back to the horizontal position, the field is not turning in a circular rotation, but from outwards to inwards rotation.
See C.

So if you have a pair of inductors in the center, these will pick up the field strength and transduce this to current. That's why he would start it with a magnet and once the TPU coils started to produce a field, these would continue to feed the inductors. Also the inductors could be on a zener diode at a set maximum to maintain a maximum production loop, or keep it from getting out of control.

Caps are used to store the recuperated energy.

Magent to inductor.
Inductor produces current.
Current is pulsed on/off 120,000 cycles into the cap. (Macedonian)
At every 12,000 cycles, the cap discharges into the TPU coils, thus refeeding the inductors.

Everything in OU works in a loop. There are rarely any OU systems that work in a linear scheme such as the ECD, which is more linear, or which has not yet discovered its looping method.

THINK LOOP.