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Author Topic: Tubes?  (Read 203154 times)

duff

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #60 on: July 30, 2007, 03:56:17 AM »
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 05:35:22 PM by duff »

duff

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #61 on: July 30, 2007, 04:19:58 AM »
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 05:35:16 PM by duff »

innovation_station

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #62 on: July 30, 2007, 04:29:18 AM »
ok duff this is what i think about the quote you posted from sm

where he says this

I am using 6BQ7-A tubes for the input and phase inverter because they are VHF amplifier triodes designed to operate in Color TV at very high frequencies and so you can imagine how crystal clear my high frequencies are in my stereo amplifier."

what i see in this phrase is this  ok he is using those tubes so eather 1 tube triode or 1 dubble triode to do do this send out signal in to the magnetic amp or the ring (in my opinion it is the same thing) the phase invertor does exacaly what it says flips the phase so the flux is cancled with the other pluse that has been sent  a crystal will do the same thing at the other end of the coil like bordarland seiences did in there vid but they used a volt meter it fliped the signal and sent it back through the coil and then the osolator at that end sends the first signal and the next 1 back through the coil agin  and this repeats and repeats until the voltage reaches its peak or i guess if u let it go you would have a runaway effect
well the last part of the phrase means in my opinion this

he is using 2 high freqs with a diffrence of close to 7.8 hz between the 2 freqs also he tells us that he only uses 2 of the 3 rings for the plused freq his amp is his tpu!!!

well earlyer on today i was expairmenting with 2 freqs and my scope and a tuned primary and secondary mass to mass and well i set 1 generator to 1hz and the other to 7.8 hz and what happined when i plused the coil this is all just out of the freq gen no hi power nothing like that right from the gen

well why dont you just try it and you will see what i saw

it looks like small lightning on my scope between the pluses but not verry fast sooooo

speed  it up!!!! to verry high freq and what you got is tones of hi voltage kicks or bursts of engery the faster the beat is plused it seams right now to me that the more output power you will have

i will post a small vid of what i have seen on my scope to show everyone

is
« Last Edit: July 30, 2007, 04:59:48 AM by innovation_station »

Mannix

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #63 on: July 30, 2007, 04:58:16 AM »
Ok . I will have a go here ,to all who want to get their hands dirty and think this is a bit more important than a weekendpasstime

The 6bq7 is a med mu triode  12ax7 12au7 are more common and are pin compatible.there are many,many others and just about any piece of tube equipment will have something like them...so ..it aint that hard

they are phase inverters...ALL TUBES ARE PHASE INVERTERS!

His mention of response time was in relation to feedback..because it sure is not in pulse time ...right?

all transistors are phase inverters....he was not being cryptic or general here..it may well have a lot to do with making an air core,  blocking oscillator perhaps but with harmonic perfection...this would mean that the tank side would have to be resonant at a particular frequency just a guess by me here.

this would also suggest that pulses are not what we want...I know the conflict here..but who has got any where with pulses?...the closest thing so far was when sine was created from them..re ecd.

 Here is a question for the Pc Heros(  Otto's term ) offense not intended

What part of "harmonic perfection" would use pulses?

I notice a mild waver in my 15" tpu at specific frequencies...ones mentioned...no massive power surge and my tpu is still on the table...but it is interesting ....


Now, how dare anybody who has not used tubes themselves ask for more info....on the other hand..those who do use them just might get the respect that they may be entitled to...I donk know ..just using past history to go by here.

It means using Ottos aproach but wih tubes...at least they wont blow up..


Of course many of you have neither the capacity or the will to do that...you could just watch and wait untill while somebody else does it for you.

AS FAR AS I CAN SEE TUBES ARE JUST TALK HERE

A race to the bottom....does any body remember my story about the bottom feeders....it was just about the time Steven mentioined many times that tubes were easier.
Any body inspired to use tubes...yet?

ready for a hard challenge?

ya'll know better ay? them lights are real






Lindsay

sorry i just remembered somebody asked for a circuit


EDIT...There is absolutely no point in supplying a circuit at this point because if you do not have the knowledge or experience to follow the basics of what has been said then you should NOT be mucking around with lethal  voltages and currents in the first place...let alone what might result.





Super God

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #64 on: July 30, 2007, 05:14:27 AM »
Ack, so many condradicting ideas going through my damn head. 

"Three phase? Ok!  Pulses or sine waves?  Sine waves would make the most sense wouldn't they?  Wait, you can't get any "interesting" results with sine waves, you need kicks don't you?  Use square waves!  A three phase square wave!?  I've never done anything like that"

Aggg.  I'm really in a confused state of mind, so many questions that I need to answer, I wanna build build build.  Can't wait.  At least I'll have plenty of experiements to take up my time.  Im using some VHF tube, the 12AT7 or something like that, I can't remember the exact name.

Mannix

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #65 on: July 30, 2007, 05:27:01 AM »
Ack, so many condradicting ideas going through my damn head. 

"Three phase? Ok!  Pulses or sine waves?  Sine waves would make the most sense wouldn't they?  Wait, you can't get any "interesting" results with sine waves, you need kicks don't you?  Use square waves!  A three phase square wave!?  I've never done anything like that"

Aggg.  I'm really in a confused state of mind, so many questions that I need to answer, I wanna build build build.  Can't wait.  At least I'll have plenty of experiements to take up my time.  Im using some VHF tube, the 12AT7 or something like that, I can't remember the exact name.

What do you mean....you cant get anything interesting??

You have tried?

That tube is the same family of triodes.

No matter how hard mosfets are ...tubes are easier...Unless you know something that i dont.
if so let me have it!

Lindsay


Super God

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #66 on: July 30, 2007, 05:47:04 AM »
Not yet, but I'm planning to very very soon.  But here's what's got me.  With sine waves you have a smooth transition from peak to peak, so where do you get the kick from?  I think I'm misunderstanding the kick.  But enough questions from me :D  Looks like I'll need about 9 function generators (or 12 if I wanna pulse the collectors) to fully experiement with my coil.  But then again the function generators can't fit in the middle of a 6 inch coil like I have here.  Wow, getting ahead of myself again.  Oh well, one collector at a time I suppose.

P.S. Mannix - have you noticed that Steven talks more about the collectors than anything else in those letters?  I think at one time or another he said something about pulsing them with one or two frequencies, but then again that might just be from the control coils and not directly like I was thinking.  I don't know.

Yup, have a good day.

innovation_station

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #67 on: July 30, 2007, 05:58:24 AM »
well all what is happinng with my pluses in my vid 1 pluse is at 1hx and the second is at 8.8 hz and that is a diff of 7.8 hz the second pluse jumps and i seam to only get negitive spikes but that is ok because of the phase invertor right it will turn them around then they will be posotive but it is werry weird i can only get thease types of waves at low freqs but i think that is the beat freq but there is 3 freqs so what is the 3rd for well how about to set the coil at resosnance then add the beat what happins well i can show you in another vid but i cleand up my scope shoot so i could have a better look at what is happining and they are irruglar spikes kind of i will post 1 more vid of the cleaned up scope shoot 

and then i will add the resonance freq to the mix and well shoot a vid i guess i know what happins

here is the cleaned up shoot of the above vid

duff

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #68 on: July 30, 2007, 06:17:28 AM »
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« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 05:34:29 PM by duff »

turbo

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #69 on: July 30, 2007, 09:02:32 AM »

but who has got any where with pulses?...the closest thing so far was when sine was created from them..re ecd.


as a matter of fact i did get somewhere using DC pulses.
However i did also see intresting things when combining sine.
so i guess this question remains unawnserd for now but hey we can try both, it ain't that difficult.

Marco.

innovation_station

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #70 on: July 30, 2007, 01:25:13 PM »
when 3 squares come togather at 3 diffrent freqs will we not get a nice shine with many harmonics? and kicks or spiks
that is what i see

with the beat you see above vid with a 7.8 hz gap between the 2 freq and when i add the 3rd it adds the harmonice when i add the harmonic resonance freq that is what it does it harmonizes  exploding the waves i set my harmonis freq at a high level in the 100k setting and the wave goes crazy spikes and irrulaguar static or lighting type discharges

that is how it looks on my scope i have hooked no external power to it yet to see what will happin just the freq gens

i would have shoot a vid last night but the batteries died

is

Bruce_TPU

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #71 on: July 30, 2007, 05:05:38 PM »
Hey IS,

I always said all along, in my thread, that SM tuned his coil to 7.23 Hz.  Roberto and many others believe as you have been experimenting with, that this was the beat frequency.  We know that the three frequencies were VHF range.  So if he deliberately made the beat frequency between 7 to 8 Hz, one tunes into that "huge magnetic wave" as shown in Marco's dancing magnets that I spoke about so very often, also in my thread.  So, by tuning the beat frequency to the huge magnetic wave, caused by the magnetic field of the earch, would this cause the "phenomenon of magnetic collection"?  Perhaps.  Make sure your coils you are experimenting with are wound CCW and the the direction of the VHF are probably the same.  I would also suggest, since you seem serious about this, that you read Jason's latest post about what he has discovered about the different harmonics.  It will help you in your experiments, I do believe.

Cheers,
Bruce

Thaelin

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #72 on: July 30, 2007, 05:23:36 PM »
@ Mannix:
   You are so right on the high voltage in tube systems. I used to have a Galaxy 550 and it had a plate v of 750v! I felt its wrath once and was very careful after that. Death is a careless touch away.

@ All
   I have over the years found myself looking back for the simple knoledge spoken in simple terms. If you have a desire to really understand tubes, I would suggest you look back into the old Ham Radio manuals. ARRL is most likely one of the best as it is geared to the amature, hence amature radio. You can find PDF's of some of the old manuals on www.pmillett.com for down load. They hold a wealth of info and are for the beginners. The 1959 manual would be a great start. It is geared towards transmitters and receivers but the very thing you are discussing here will be in the circuits use if you weed them out.

Hope that is of some help to you all.  "Tubes Live"!

thaelin

turbo

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #73 on: July 30, 2007, 09:16:53 PM »
okay so today i blew up my headphones  >:( >:( >:( >:(

So i decided to build a new amp to start with  :)

Super God

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Re: Tubes?
« Reply #74 on: July 30, 2007, 10:00:04 PM »
Where's a good place to learn about designing tube amplifiers or amplifiers in general?