Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding

User Menu

Custom Search

Author Topic: Tubes?  (Read 203666 times)

Mannix

  • elite_member
  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 564
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #135 on: August 08, 2007, 12:23:47 AM »
@All,

So in his first successful trials, we know Steven used 3 old tube type generators run through a tube amplifier.

Were these generators commercial units? Probably yes. If so, were they square wave  or sine wave generators? Perhaps they were Pulse Generators, as I believe there were a couple made in the tube days.

What kind of tube amplifier did he use? Was it a lab type, or consumer home units? Surely regardless of which, chances are pretty good they had an output transformer, which would limit the frequency response and "shape" of the pulses or square waves if that's what he was applying to the coils. There would likely be tons of overshooting and ringing.

It's quite possible Steven modified whatever amplifier he used to bypass the output transformer. This would eliminate the transformer induced problems.

These generators were also not likely synchronized, unless he specially designed something to accomplish this, but I highly doubt that.

What does that indicate to you about making catalyst?

Darren

old tube type generators means sine or smooth pulse...sine is the only way to achive harmonic perfection.

it might be interesting to search for old square wave generators...as far as i can tell they arent around.and the reference to them is vital.

I am really pleased that a few are going down  this path which at first seems backward.

I am optimistic that help may arrive as tube inertia is created here..feel welcome with your hot bottles here.

Darren, does orcad have 6as7g and 6bq7,5ar4

i have only a few tubes in the  multisim that i use ..perhaps i need to change my tool?



well done Marco

z_p_e

  • elite_member
  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 651
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #136 on: August 08, 2007, 01:58:26 AM »
old tube type generators means sine or smooth pulse...sine is the only way to achive harmonic perfection.

it might be interesting to search for old square wave generators...as far as i can tell they arent around.and the reference to them is vital.

I am really pleased that a few are going down  this path which at first seems backward.

I am optimistic that help may arrive as tube inertia is created here..feel welcome with your hot bottles here.

Darren, does orcad have 6as7g and 6bq7,5ar4

i have only a few tubes in the  multisim that i use ..perhaps i need to change my tool?



well done Marco

Lindsay, you should know by now that I usually do my homework before I post something....well this time was no exception. I am already looking at designing my own tube gens, and have done quite a lot of digging.

"Old tube" does not mean sine only ...not at all!

Harmonic perfection can be achieved in at least two ways, depending on your perspective. Mine is different perhaps.

There are several tube generators doing more than just sine....here are the ones I've been researching:

HP202A
Sine / Square.
Uses tube Schmitt for oscillator.
.008 ~ 1.2 kHz

HP209A
Sine / Square.
Up to 2 MHz

HP211A
Square only.
Up to 1 MHz

HP212A
70ns Pulse Generator.
Uses Thyratron.
PRR up to 5 kHz only.

So you see, they were and are out there. And this is only Hewlette Packard!

I have models for all those tubes you listed. You can get many tube models on the web as well. PM or email me with your wishlist, and I'll see what I have.

I am however at the moment, checking the integrity of the 6BQ7A model I have. I want to make sure negative grid bias is modeled properly.

Cheers,
Darren

Super God

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #137 on: August 08, 2007, 02:18:06 AM »
If we are going to make some test equipment, would it be possible to make it round?  Like the box all the compnents are in?  That way we can put it in the middle of the ring and tune it from there, less distance for the wires to travel, too.  My tube test circuit designs are all round in design so they fit right in the middle.  I was using the first device Steve made that was in the black tool box in one of the videos as a reference.

z_p_e

  • elite_member
  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 651
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #138 on: August 08, 2007, 03:47:01 AM »
SG.

I think you missed the point.

One of the reasons for testing with tubes is so the controller doesn't have to be placed in the center of the toroid!.

Therefore, I see no need to design a tube generator that is round for this purpose.

Darren

Super God

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #139 on: August 08, 2007, 04:03:03 AM »
Well, just because it's made of tubes does not mean it is unsuceptible to interference from the coils!

innovation_station

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5134
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #140 on: August 08, 2007, 06:39:18 AM »
sg

fets are inside of the tpu why? why are they called fets? do fets not stand for feild effect? transistors 

tubes are outside the ring all of them

what is the reason for tubes?  what  will be diffrent in the ss units then the tube 1? hummmmm a spark gap??

does a tube not do both switch and have a spark type gap in a vacume  a spark gap in a vacume with ss would be required to act the same as a tube 

another thing if we intend to discharge a cap into a ring using freqs how many freqs do we have in a tpu?

well the sm 17 sedjusts that there 2 freqs cuz ther 2 caps being discharged  into the center or the outter or both so if there 2 freqs then there 2 beat freqs for each freq wich might just be first fundamintal freq and second harmnic for the first beat freq then the second might be 3 harmonic and 4th haromonic or the ring is tuned just a bit more than the first fundumental freq say 7.3 hz then the first freq of the second beat freq would be 7.3 more than the first fundumntal freq of the first combo and for the second beat it would be second haromonic of the second fundumental freq  so what would happin will there would be massicve ringing at 7.3 hz on the fundumental freqs and all harmonics

now if we add a 3 freq of high speed  what happins not a beat freq just a stright freq at say 100k then that make manny haromonics i have seen 7th plus harominc with high speed  or the speed is made on its own with the racing mags

i have an old square and sine wave generator tube powered but i dont think the generator is important  ;)

i got  verry intresting waves on my scope using my laptop and a verry simple proggie for osolations  so i dont think a tube freq generator is required  our freq generator must do more than 1 job   ;)

it must osc and it must switch at the same time and maybe even more than that well yes more than that how about it is the "processor" of the tpu so it must control dc voltage to the controls it must supply ac to the collectors it must be the spark gap ans must be the timming control so the tube sounds like a verry busy part of the tpu    ;)


steven makes a remark about the tpu  goes somthing like this

you can have many currents in 1 wire only pertaing to there own source what might that mean?

that to me means ac and dc in the same wire maybe the collectors then keep the ac in them and only take the dc to the controls then back to there source or the end of the controls are open and it will now transmitt wirelessly as long as it is stoped b4 the end of the controls plus it would be transmittinf from the perpendicular controls if you look at the sm 17 it has in its center 2 coils of 2 controls each  also what if this we sent power through collector outside ring then to the center to transmitt back to the collector kinda of makes me wonder because all of the wires running back to the center of the coil  the sm 17 it must be ss because of the spark gaps on the back  it is almost like it is 4 segments all the way through

is
is
« Last Edit: August 08, 2007, 07:55:59 AM by innovation_station »

turbo

  • Guest
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #141 on: August 08, 2007, 02:12:36 PM »
well, Steven was using three tube based signal generators when he first strike those magical tones.
and that means i will use tube based eqipment too :)

here's a pic of the ancient triple varicaps i will use to build them :)

M.

Thaelin

  • TPU-Elite
  • Hero Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1093
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #142 on: August 08, 2007, 03:53:47 PM »
   I remember thoes for sure. Old radios. On a good note, I just got a pair of 1X2B 1/2 wave rectifiers. Rated at 22,000v peak. Sounds as if they were used for the HV on a crt or such. 1.25 v 200ma filament. Time to play!

thaelin

Super God

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #143 on: August 08, 2007, 05:31:09 PM »
well, Steven was using three tube based signal generators when he first strike those magical tones.
and that means i will use tube based eqipment too :)

here's a pic of the ancient triple varicaps i will use to build them :)

M.

Dude I am so jealous of your tube equipment.  Good luck on your experiments though!  I will soon be joing you!  By the way are those homemade or are they old models or...something else?  Is there anyway I can get ahold of the same equipment you've got? (Signal generators and so forth)

pese

  • TPU-Elite
  • Hero Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 1597
    • Freie Energie und mehr ... Free energy and more ...
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #144 on: August 08, 2007, 06:02:38 PM »
ilin

no this 1X2  europe DY80 to 86  are jes for 22KV  but was not Eadio , it was vor Television (Blach/White) . also an smalone only 6mmx6cm tube  - Dy60 or 51  , US number vant remember jet ..
most build (in splug)  in the horizomtal Line Transformer. to make the High Voltage for CRT Tube (Picture Screen)

After tgis it comes same als selenn rectiviers 16KV (abozt 6mm x 12cm ceramic within hunders of seleen diode wafers.

For stromger TV - Colot  it guve som kind of GY 500 series. tube (See philips mullard telefungen
als in US  in the 5 Volt range  (# begins with 5)

In Radio  only (usually)6x4  (ez41 m 89 81 90  enz)
for strong eqipments 5U4 5R4  and so on (all in the 500 Volt working range)
All Numer take from head , but i think all must be right so.
its are 50 jears gone , since i worked  any day with this parts
G.Pese

turbo

  • Guest
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #145 on: August 08, 2007, 06:17:16 PM »
well, Steven was using three tube based signal generators when he first strike those magical tones.
and that means i will use tube based eqipment too :)

here's a pic of the ancient triple varicaps i will use to build them :)

M.

Dude I am so jealous of your tube equipment.  Good luck on your experiments though!  I will soon be joing you!  By the way are those homemade or are they old models or...something else?  Is there anyway I can get ahold of the same equipment you've got? (Signal generators and so forth)

Hi God :)
Those are real old parts and i found them in "the barn".
There were boxes full of them..
i paid 5euro for the three of them.
and the plate transformers i paid 25 euro each, i took two.
so that was about 30 euro total.

i will build the tube generators myself it is not that hard...
if you need anything i supose i could ship it but some are really heavy parts and i do not know where you live, i guess it's best for you to find "the old tube guy" in your area....
i know there are more around, and you will find them if you have to. :)

Marco.

Super God

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #146 on: August 08, 2007, 09:41:40 PM »
The quest to find the old tube guy is on!  I'll have to get my friend up here and put our Blues Brother's outfits on, we'll hop in the shag wagon and cruise aroud blaring the Peter Gunn theme song until we find out if there's anybody around here that has tubes.  Haha!

turbo

  • Guest
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #147 on: August 08, 2007, 10:12:27 PM »
i found him searching for a tube transformer on site's like ebay and such....
most of the times they will have some pieces for sale so you can call them and ask what they have.

M.

joe dirt

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #148 on: August 08, 2007, 11:58:14 PM »
The quest to find the old tube guy is on!  I'll have to get my friend up here and put our Blues Brother's outfits on, we'll hop in the shag wagon and cruise aroud blaring the Peter Gunn theme song until we find out if there's anybody around here that has tubes.  Haha!

Hi God :)

You can try talking to some of these folks, I,ll bet somebody knows where you can
 find wharehouse full of old parts, that,s pretty much what they do there,  restore
 old televisions to working condition, audio to:

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=24349649b4cc93d2254096026e70e9fa&f=36

dirt

Super God

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 419
Re: Tubes?
« Reply #149 on: August 09, 2007, 12:25:28 AM »
:)

Thanks for the link!  I'll check into that sometime! :D