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Author Topic: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?  (Read 349152 times)

Offline wattsup

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #180 on: July 03, 2007, 07:53:03 AM »
@btenzer

That's one hell of a post #1 you put together. And soooooo quick. Geez.
If only my secretary could do that. lol
Honestly great work, thanks.
By the way, if any of the ECD guys ever offered you a circuit, ask for two.

@Brnbrade

Great work. Go have a bear. Don't worry about the noise here. This is only an internal form of communication between alot of smart people scratching their heads. Just do what you know how. Keep cool. We have alot of info for now to make a good replica, so life is good. Be happy. You are doing good.

Now where can I find two big nails..........

Offline Bruce_TPU

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #181 on: July 03, 2007, 08:17:37 AM »
@Darren

It is because he was a student of Erfinder, as Otto was. And he believes that is what Erfinder would want.  If you need to hear it in Portugese, that is fine!  ;)


@Wattsup
Thank you for the compliment!  Those come hard around here!  LOL

I still need help in figuring a guess for the fine wire.  If some human being out there can look at the first pictures, and you have experience with wire, and pm me the aproximates size, that would be awesome!  Thanks.

Cheers,
Bruce

Offline Bruce_TPU

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #182 on: July 03, 2007, 08:32:59 AM »
@ Darren
AND also Darren, to answer your question of how it is significant for the ECD, is an incredible question to begin with.

We/I want to incorporate as much of SM's clueology (new word! :) ) into the ECD.  If SM says that it will make a difference for the "tpu" and since no one is going to "draw a schematic" for us of how that works, we must "experiment".  And I suggest experimenting by doing Whatever is needed, to the circuit, to mimic a tube amp

Now, besides the look of the wave itself, here are a few other considerations.  (I am going to this trouble for all of you reading this, in the hopes someone can hear.)
Solid state switches tend to have a damped oscillation or spike on the leading edge of the wave. This spike is generally the creator of noise and harmonics.

Vacuum tubes - the leading edge would only rise to the plate voltage and chop off there. As long as the power supply was clean tube switches had very clean outputs. Those that used the heater element as the cathode would also impress the power for the heater element on the output waveform.

Study please more differences.  There ARE many.

Happy Days!  And good night...
Bruce   ;D

Offline Earl

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The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #183 on: July 03, 2007, 11:32:06 AM »
Hi All,

here is a revised drawing 2007-07-03.

Enjoy.

Earl

Offline MeggerMan

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #184 on: July 03, 2007, 11:49:23 AM »
@Bruce,
Thin wire looks like 0.4 to 0.5mm diameter.
Thick wire looks like single core from 13 Amp twin and earth ring main cable (2.5 sq. mm?)
I think the reason the meter shows zero volts when the bulb is lit is because the meter is on DC and with a pure AC signal this will balance out to zero.

@Earl,
I think you may be right about the starter. From the patent you can start by moving the magnet into position, unless I read it wrong.

Has anyone seen Fig.2 on the patent?
I will be buying some hardware (steel rod, ali tube - rest I have) after work to try this idea out.
[Edit] Have bought some 10mm steel rod and 12mm OD ali tube - may need to file the rod down to get it in. Almost fits - first few mm.

This has so much in common with the TPU and from a patent thats 136 years old, wow!  :)

Regards
Rob
« Last Edit: July 03, 2007, 02:23:52 PM by MeggerMan »

Offline Thaelin

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #185 on: July 03, 2007, 12:52:08 PM »
Hi All:
   Did a small test tonite of a bifilar wound coil. Reason I feel it belongs here as well is that the internal core is, you guessed it, aluminum solid 1/4". Was mainly seeing what would be the difference with an AL core as opposed to a CU core. Well output around 80v. Signals input from opposite ends.
   Now this is the part that is weird. Rod is 24" long with 4 layers of twin #20 stranded. Scope is on each end of the rod. This AL thing is starting to push my imagination around a bit. Anyhow, Bruce... so here is two ocurances of the opposite signal injection showing great results.

The other coil was the same idea but bifilar wound on a pitsfield coil with a whole lot of turns of wire wound around the center hole at 90 degrees to the bifilar pair.

sugra

Offline duff

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #186 on: July 03, 2007, 02:05:04 PM »
.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2007, 05:39:32 PM by duff »

Offline jacob

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #187 on: July 03, 2007, 02:41:08 PM »

I am testing all of the types possible of configurations.
Attempts and mistakes. And in this it goes and it comes I saw strange things.
The capacitors seem to hold the load for 12v to 16v. This dissipating energy.


The reason voltage seems to stay constant at 12 to 16 volts for a longer time is caracteristic of the normal discharge curve of a capacitor. But it probably dies out eventually. Much faster if a load is applied. My guesss is that brnbrade is currently trying to feed back some of the output voltage toward the input to keep the device operating, and until he succeeds, he's unwilling to post a definitive configuration, because it keeps changing.

Still, we know that the basic principle is solid since it rest on a 140 years old patent. There is much experimenting do be done here...

Jacob

Offline z_p_e

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #188 on: July 03, 2007, 02:39:40 PM »
@ Bruce.

I was hoping to here from our friend on my question, but in the mean time, thank you for the mind-meld response.

Regarding the FET's, so you are saying that SM's use of tubes was key because they suppress the leading-edge spikes and damped oscillations?

Yes, that is possible, and thanks for bringing that up. Sometimes you DO surprise me.  :P

However, keep in mind that the response on the tube Plate or FET Drain is largely dependant on what they are driving, i.e. an inductor, resistive load, a tank load etc. For example, you will be hard pressed to find spikes or damped oscillations with a FET driving a pure resistive load....same with a tube. Insert an inductor with a finite self-capcitance though, and watch the wave-show! As you say though, perhaps a tube is less susceptable to these due to rounding of the corners at the top.

If this is the case, I have some experience in achieving this effect. Perhaps I'll play with it and see if I can do it.

Cheers,
Darren

Offline jacob

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #189 on: July 03, 2007, 03:50:56 PM »

Starting up may be a problem if the two signals with just the right phase relationship are not known. Better to hit it with some random signal and see what happens?



BEP,

You have to think differently about this. There is no need to inject signals into this device. This is a self multi-oscillating circuit which develops its own frequencies. All that is needed according to the inventor is to apply a magnetic field. That's why it can theorically be started with just a permanent magnet. Therefore it's important to fully understand and control this process because it is closely related to the startup mechanism of the TPU.

I can't believe that this thread was moved out of the TPU forum section.

@ Stefan

Could you please reinsert this thread  where it rightfully belongs. The McFarland patent was brought to the attention of everyone in the Steven Mark, master of magnetics thread last year. Here is the original post. It has always be a fundamental part of an integral replication of the TPU and still is.

Guys,

You have to look at this attached pdf file about US patent 119825 issued in... 1871. I found this thanks to a link posted by lynx2000. It is extremely interesting. Here are a few quotes from it:

"My invention relates to the combination of two or more simple or compound helices (coils - i.e.: control coils) and iron cores  (collectors) or magnets in such a manner as to produce a constant electric current without the aid of a galvanic battery."

About the collector equivalent:

"The iron core may be a solid bar or a bundle of iron wire  (i.e.: multi-strand wire), the latter giving higher tension..."

And guess how we start the power generation process with this setup...

"The mode of producing or starting the action in the helices consist in the use of a steel  (i.e.: permanent) or electro-magnet..."

This thing can be started with a magnet!!!! And it is physically identical to the TPU : an outer coil, an inner coil, and a collector. Plus, it is easy to build, so easy to test.

Enjoy!

Jacob


Jacob

Offline gn0stik

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #190 on: July 03, 2007, 04:10:36 PM »
So now he has it running on caps?

Well, I have my plate in front of me. All of my words are piled on it.

If someone can replicate these results and explain it, I'll eat every last one.

Anxiously waiting.

The "taking a break for two weeks" thing is familiar, though. The diagram, shouldn't be that hard to scribble out in notepad. How frustrating.

Earl, in your diagram, should power be input via the primary and output via the secondary, to the next device's primary? (which may or may not be inverted)

Basically what you have done is a couple conductors with chokes in them..

brnbrade, please post a cct before you leave for your break. if you have no ammeter, that's fine someone else can replicate and test if you post your cct.

Offline jacob

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #191 on: July 03, 2007, 04:12:44 PM »

Unless I missed something, it is rather difficult to do this without a drawing or schematic of what you have connected there. Why not post a drawing instead of a photo?

May I suggest for your own sake, and for the sake of others here trying to replicate and help you develop this (you did ask for people to replicate), that you STOP what you're doing at this point and draw out what you have done. Call this v1.0 if you like, but at least have one documented starting point.

It would take you no more than 5 minutes to scratch this out on a piece of paper, take a photo of it, and post it here.

OR, you can keep the frenzie going here by holding back as you mentioned. The choice is yours.

By the way, are you using any transistors or MOSFET's in this device?

Darren

Darren,

I agree with you that brnbade hasn't published much details about his setup. But fortunately, we have pictures and the original patent. Together, they tell the whole story. So if you read through the patent, carefully examine the pictures and factor in the additional information that was provided (i.e.: use of alufoil), you'll be able to reproduce this setup very easily.

I, just like you, like to fully analyse any idea that comes up to make sure that it is a sound concept. But where there is smoke, there is also fire. There is something real happening here. Sure, we can find faults in the way this is being done. But there will always be. Let's rather try to find and isolate what works. If we want to move forward, we must all push in the same direction. Uniting our efforts will benefit all of us.

Regards,

Jacob
« Last Edit: July 03, 2007, 04:47:09 PM by jacob »

Offline jacob

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #192 on: July 03, 2007, 04:20:06 PM »

It would not be too difficult to power a 12V, 50W bulb for a few minutes from 2 AA batteries with the right circuit. Keep that in mind folks.

Darren

Darren,

I need your help here. I have no idea how this would be possible. Because it would imply pulling upward of 10-15 amps from those small batteries and maintaining that draw for a few minutes. Plus, let's keep in mind that there is no high speed switching component being used here. Can you please explain how it can be done. Thanks!

Jacob

Offline jacob

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #193 on: July 03, 2007, 04:31:00 PM »
What Brnbrade is showing here is very very important indeed.

Four variations have been shown thus far.

1) Coils + 3v Battery, DC-DC 58 vdc out.
2) Coils + 3v Battery + Sound (two channel positive only) DC-AC 250V out.
3) Coils + Cap (330 uf 200v) + Cap (62 pf or uf(hard to see) 400v about 4-7v ac out
4) Coils + 4 Caps (hard to see values) about 20v ac out


Wattsup,

If you go back at the beginning of this thread, you'll see that the output with the 3v battery pack is 52 V AC. In fact, the output will never be DC or at least pure DC under any circumstances unless of course it is rectified and/or filtered.

Thanks for the multimeter picture. I was (unactively) looking for it.

Jacob

Offline BEP

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Re: The Brnbrade Coil/Overunity?
« Reply #194 on: July 03, 2007, 04:54:42 PM »
BEP,
You have to think differently about this. There is no need to inject signals into this device.

Agreed. As BrnBrade has shown us there are different modes. Passing a magnet one way or the other is a kick. One direction may yeild + while the other -. Hitting it with sine should create sine. And the DC should be like DC from a bridge rectifier, like in the Tesla magnetic rectifier.
For the aluminum usage I refer to 'radioactive batteries'. Radioactive batteries should have been called 'radiant energy batteries'. Also aluminum is interesting enough in magnetic fields because of the Lorentz forces involved.
All just speculation, of course. That is all I do, right?  ;D