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Author Topic: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters  (Read 108227 times)

Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #60 on: April 26, 2010, 02:38:07 PM »
It's ok then do it as you like but the diode was there.
Ok bye

I am definitely going to try your setup and learn from it guruji.  Thank you for the diagram
In my current setup with 2 coils, my 2nd transistor is getting warm while the first is not, I am thinking that your setup may solve this

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Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #61 on: May 02, 2010, 01:23:12 AM »
Ok so I've been messing with various configurations for this and have had to revise some earlier observations.
For example:  Throwing out the battery fluid and refilling with water actually made it worse after all, so no magic there like I was reading somewhere else.  (Tried this for 2 different batteries, same result)  However.  It looks like when you get your battery charged to a certain point and it looks like its really slowing down, shaking it up a bit seems to help it move on quicker.  The voltage will dip a bit, but then it'll run past its previous point pretty quick.

Using multiple coils is tricky.  Each variation I tried always uses about twice as much power from your input source, but doesn't seem to have the same effect on charging rate, possibly because I'm wasn't using the shaking method mentioned above.  Kinda hard to do that while you're asleep >.>

If I was still using a rotor, it might actually charge better if I put the battery on the same surface with it so the vibrations keep the fluid shaken up.

From what I understand of how batteries work, when you put a load on it, or try to charge it, the plate will become charged one way.  Then when you stop, it has a "relaxation time".  So my theory is, you could kind of force the relaxation while charging by shaking up the solution.

If I'm am spouting a load of rubbish someone please rescue me from my noobdom!  All I know is self-taught so any and all corrections are welcome!

Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #62 on: May 03, 2010, 03:39:44 PM »
-= Coil Configuration Observations =-

So currently I am not using the 20k resistor, or the 10k resistor, or a diode to bridge any parts of the MJL21194 transistor
I'm using 1 coil, 1/2 as large as the coils in my 2 coil setup.  It seems to charge alot better than the larger single coil.
So I thought hey, leme make a really small coil.  I pulled my largest coil that failed horrible (charged very poorly) and took about 20 winds off it.  The geometry is the same as my current coil.  When I tried this much smaller coil setup the amp draw was much higher, the charging seems to be increased as well (couldn't do long-term testing) but the transistor got hot real fast.  The coil itself didn't get hot at all.  Not sure if its because I didn't leave it long enough or what but ... yea.  I figure I'll have to try parallel multiple transistors to really test that out.  As soon as I learn how to hook that up I'll give it a go.

-= Battery Charging Observations =-

Ok so I'm seeing just as I have read around the internet, that as you charge batteries with this system they reach a certain point where the voltage doesn't increase anymore.  I have observed this, and in addition, I've seen the voltage go back down a bit if its left longer (I usually switch the charger off at this point)
The last post I made was on forced relaxation by shaking.  Now while this had a short-term effect I'm observing a bit better effect if you leave the battery to relax by itself with the charger disconnected (actually I switch to charging another battery).  Just a 30 minute rest got the voltage maximum up another .04 rather than .01 ~ .02 from the shaking method.  So I'm going to keep alternating batteries and see how high I can get them without discharging then at all

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #62 on: May 03, 2010, 03:39:44 PM »
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Offline guruji

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #63 on: May 03, 2010, 08:06:56 PM »
Hi Niofox you should read Bedini C20 file about charging. Bedini says that one should charge and make it rest then continue until it reaches 15v. This should keep the batteries charged for long again as new.
Try to find that file it's very interesting it's somewhere in this forum.
Bye bye.

Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #64 on: May 03, 2010, 08:27:19 PM »
Hi Niofox you should read Bedini C20 file about charging. Bedini says that one should charge and make it rest then continue until it reaches 15v. This should keep the batteries charged for long again as new.
Try to find that file it's very interesting it's somewhere in this forum.
Bye bye.

Thank you so much for this information.  I have found an article when I ran a search based on your comment: http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Bedini%20Monopole%203%20Group%20Experiment.pdf
As well as a number of other links that I will investigate

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #64 on: May 03, 2010, 08:27:19 PM »
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Offline crowclaw

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #65 on: May 03, 2010, 09:50:31 PM »
Thank you so much for this information.  I have found an article when I ran a search based on your comment: http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Bedini%20Monopole%203%20Group%20Experiment.pdf
As well as a number of other links that I will investigate
Hi Niofox,

Have been watching this thread for some time with interest. I thought I'd nip in here just to explain my present experiment. I'm using 4x BSP452 mosfet high side switch devices with the option to parallel up. My supply source is a variable regulated bench supply set at 12 volts. The outputs are all commoned and connect to one side of a reclaimed power supply choke (2R2 DC impedance_ laminated core) inductance not known. The remaining leg of the choke goes to common -ve or ground of supply. The mosfet is pulsed via a common 555 astable circuit running at 1.7KHz @ 51% mark_space ratio. The positive of the charge battery is connected to the common -ve line, while the negative of the charge battery is connected via the anode of a UF5408  to the switched side of the choke. This arrangement works extremely well on Nicad's and 12volt Lead Acid. Now... I have broken all the rules for charging these while experimenting on various circuits so I recon I have probably damaged my present 12 volt cell! However the results can vary somewhat, I had to discharge several times over until a decent recharge voltage could be held... although the present one keeps dropping to rest at 10.5v
Nicad cells (9volt PP3 type) I have found seem to be critical to both frequency and mark/space to find the best/quickest charging rate. Again for me... 1.7KHz seems to give the best results. Experiments on going

Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #66 on: May 04, 2010, 04:14:36 AM »
Here's the setup I now use (simplest is best I always say) tweaked at 330ohms (only cuz I don't have a large selection to find tune more - I need it around 366 or something).
Currently I only have 1 bifilar coil (core doesn't make any difference as far as I can tell) unlike that image which shows a scaled up design.

Not sure if I need to scale much further for the small number of batteries I'm charging though.  I switched the charging battery for a 400v/220uf cap and gave it a go to get an idea of the kind of potentials I am getting here.  The cap got up to ~250v then dipped to 220 sharply (like almost instantly to the point where I'm not even sure 250 is the real peak) and started bleeding off before I turned off the charger.  This happened in about 2 to 3 seconds.  The neon light came on after 1 second or less.

Discharging the cap was fun ^.^ big big snap and spark.  I suspect I may be getting a higher potential than just 250v, alot higher.  The cap is swollen and I'm thinking it can't get to its original peak anymore.  I will try to get a larger/less damaged cap from an old crt and try this again.

-= More battery observations =-
So far I have been charging batteries in singles.  Getting to the cut off point is happening a lot faster than they relax now.  I will have to throw a 3rd battery into rotation or alternatively charge them in parallel again.  In light of the high potentials I found with the cap, I think parallel charging would be best.  Charging should be slow enough that the heavier ions have time to move within chemical solution and take longer to get to the cut off

Another thing is ... batteries have their own personalities man.  I have 4 car batteries and each one is different in its own way.
#1  Rests at 12.10, charges to 14.5, slowly coming back to rest at a higher 12
#2 Rests at 10.1, charges to 15.x (it jumps around up there) then comes quickly back to rest around 10.x (I changed the water on this)
#3 Rests at 10.5, charges to 12.x then comes back to 10.5 (also changed the water on this one.  I think they are ruined for good)
#4 Rests at 12.12, charges to 12.5, slowly coming back to rest at 12.12 (This is the most normal one out of the bunch, I call him bob ... j/k)

I am rotating #1 and #4 currently
I had a 5th but I gave it to a friend to test in his car after I restored it from ~6.75v or so to a resting ~12.12v over the weekend

More to come later!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #66 on: May 04, 2010, 04:14:36 AM »
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Offline SkyWatcher123

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #67 on: May 04, 2010, 06:25:32 AM »
Hi folks, Hi niofox, it looks like in the circuit you posted that its missing a resistor between the collector and base, my circuit has a 15kohm though usually a 20k is used. Though if your getting this circuit to oscillate without it, i sure wonder how.
peace love light
Tyson

Offline Thaelin

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #68 on: May 04, 2010, 07:54:33 PM »
@ niofox:
   On the part where you "replaced the water" in two of your batteries, did you use just water or 10% sulfuric acid mix?  When you buy a new battery, it has a 10% mix in it. And where ever you put the old mix at, you had better flush it good and maybe even add a bit of baking soda to neutralize  it.

thay

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #68 on: May 04, 2010, 07:54:33 PM »
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Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #69 on: May 04, 2010, 08:04:49 PM »
@ niofox:
   On the part where you "replaced the " in two of your batteries, did you use just water or 10% sulfuric  mix?  When you buy a new battery, it has a 10% mix in it. And where ever you put the old mix at, you had better flush it good and maybe even add a bit of baking soda to neutralize  it.

thay

No I just put it some filtered drinking water.  The first battery I only dumped out about 1/2 of what was in there, the 2nd I dumped it all.  In both cases it doesn't seem to have helped, but actually made matters worse.

The only reason I tried it was
1: I read on the forum somewhere that someone did this and claimed it made it better
2: The 1st battery I tried it with rested at 10v so it had problems and that was just a last resort before I declared it useless.  The 2nd battery rested around 11.25 or so no matter how many times I ran it through the charger so I tried it with that one too

About the baking soda thing ... I didn't know about that until a friend told me the other day >.>
Not even weeds grow in the patch I threw the stuff onto anymore.  They seem to be creeping back in slowly ... but its kinda like if you used some REALLY strong weed killer.  I wonder if they use acid in those things?

Offline guruji

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #70 on: May 04, 2010, 08:49:12 PM »
Hi Niofox how do you drain the batteries cause it's a bit risky to health? You have a type of pipet or something to be safe?
Thanks

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #70 on: May 04, 2010, 08:49:12 PM »
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Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #71 on: May 04, 2010, 08:59:19 PM »
Quote from: guruji link=topic=2586.msg240289#msg240289 =1272998952
Hi Niofox how do you drain the batteries cause it's a bit risky to ? You have a type of pipet or something to be safe?
Thanks

Nah I had no idea the dangers involved and just emptied it onto a spot on my lawn.  Don't worry though, I will not be throwing anything out of a battery again in that manner.  I've since learned to use a dish with baking soda.  I think if I ever actually do try it again (doubt I will) I'd probably keep the resulting mess in a bottle somewhere as a souvenir or something.

Offline niofox

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #72 on: May 07, 2010, 03:23:17 AM »
Hi folks, Hi niofox, it looks like in the circuit you posted that its missing a resistor between the collector and base, my circuit has a 15kohm though usually a 20k is used. Though if your getting this circuit to oscillate without it, i sure wonder how.
peace love light
Tyson

Unless my project board has something shorted, yes I am running solid-state without the resistor between the collector and base
There's only one difference I've noticed with this configuration:  If you somehow stop the self-oscillation without disconnecting anything ... like using a pot and putting it too high or low, the self oscillation doesn't restart simply but putting back the pot to its working value.  You have to disconnect the input power, than reconnect it.  In my setup I have the -primary running through a simple switch.  So I have to flick it off, then back on to restart oscillation
The thing never stops under any other circumstance I've come across however.  So I just leave it tweaked at 320 ohms now (no pot) and in the whole week I have been testing this it has never stopped without my intervention

Also as you can see on the diagram, I have dispensed with the diode/resistor from the base to -primary.  I found that with the diode the charging process is reduced a tad, and with the 10k resistor there is no difference that I can see with my cheap multi-meters.  I found this particularly interesting and was thinking of see what the effect is in the original SSG setup with the rotor

Offline guruji

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #73 on: May 07, 2010, 08:14:53 PM »
Hi Niofox interesting about your modification. It would be good to try if you said it works too.
Thanks for sharing.

Offline mscoffman

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Re: Solid state Bedini charger from John Peters
« Reply #74 on: May 07, 2010, 08:57:40 PM »

Unless the battery has been abused somehow, emptying the cells
contents make no sense. The sulfur comes out of solution in the
battery during discharge so you really should try to allign the ratio of
electrolyte to water concentration with the level of charge the battery
was at, at the time you emptied the contents. The law of conservation
of matter says you would only ever need to replace water which
evaporates or gets electrolysed out of the cells. Adding commericial
battery additives is the exception. I've heard of cleaning the battery,
off with, but not putting baking soda into a a/l battery.

:S:MarkSCoffman
 

 

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