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Author Topic: Successful TPU-ECD replication !  (Read 1139036 times)

Bruce_TPU

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #570 on: June 25, 2007, 07:12:46 PM »
@Btenzer:
   That is correct, that was two seperate gens running using only the positive lead from each. No grounds were hooked up. I have been trying to figure out how to achive some sort of terminating point for each signal with out using the grounds. Not sure how I would do it.
   If and when I get my fet drives in the mail, I will be trying that again with really short pulse durations. Then I will see if that output has any power asociated to it. Laterz

@ Sugra
I would bet the farm that it will! 

@ Everyone working on the ECD
If you want to see power, TAP into the bottom big coil of the ECD from a control coil, with Roberto's Mosfet, driver setup, and signal generator.  Next TAP into the smaller loop, from a control coil with IDENTICAL signal, but different source, ie..signal gen, Mosfet, Driver.  Tap into the smaller loop so that those signals will be sent in direct opposition of the others.  BE SAFE!  ;)

The next experiment would be identical with two frequencies, and then three!!

Happy Days!
Bruce

ronotte

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #571 on: June 25, 2007, 08:02:46 PM »
@Darren,

hi, here are the measures done on my 6" ECD equipped with CC as per my TPU=ECD doc:

- Primary - R=0.5Ohm, L= 15nH

- Secondary - R=3Ohm, L=0.23mH

-Primary/Secondary intercapacitance = 485pf

-Mobius interwire capacitance = 74pf

It would be interesting to insert them on your model and compare the results!

Roberto

MeggerMan

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #572 on: June 26, 2007, 12:56:17 AM »
Hi,
The DDS 20 kits (x 2) arrived today.
Easier to build than I first thought, they have already added all the surface mouted components, not much of a challenge is it.
http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m25/kingrs/dds20_kit.jpg
(http://i100.photobucket.com/albums/m25/kingrs/dds20_kit.jpg)

Rob

chrisC

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #573 on: June 26, 2007, 01:35:53 AM »
@meggerman

Thank you for posting the DDS-20 kit. I sure would love to see your kit running. Please let us know if the output driver will drive the Control Coils directly or do you still need special fast switching output drivers?

Also, are you in Europe or the UK where you can buy these parts. Apparently there is no distributor in the US.

chrisC

z_p_e

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #574 on: June 26, 2007, 03:10:21 AM »
@Darren,

hi, here are the measures done on my 6" ECD equipped with CC as per my TPU=ECD doc:

- Primary - R=0.5Ohm, L= 15nH

- Secondary - R=3Ohm, L=0.23mH

-Primary/Secondary intercapacitance = 485pf

-Mobius interwire capacitance = 74pf

It would be interesting to insert them on your model and compare the results!

Roberto

WOW, Roberto!

Something doesn't look right.

Your document shows:
- 10.5 meters of 0.35mm wire for SECONDARY
- 4.2 meters of 0.5mm wire for PRIMARY

The closest I was able to match with AWG is:

#24 = 0.5106mm compared to 0.5mm and
#27 = 0.3606mm compared to 0.35mm

(So worst case match here is 3% error.)


Because the secondary length of wire is only about 2x the length of the primary, the secondary inductance should only be about 4x the inductance of the primary.

With the numbers you gave above for inductance, the secondary inductance is over 15,000 x higher than the primary !!  :o Perhaps the 15nH is supposed to be 15uH ??

Could you please double check your measurements ?

Thank you.

Regards,
Darren

z_p_e

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #575 on: June 26, 2007, 03:34:17 AM »
Roberto,

Perhaps if you'd like to and have time, could you measure the inductance and resistance of your warm or hot bulb as well?

This way we will have a better model.  :)

Cheers,
Darren

Jdo300

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #576 on: June 26, 2007, 04:39:52 AM »
Hello All,

Here's another update for you. I took some time today to verify that my MOSFET box and harmonic circuit are working well together. After removing the capacitors in parallel with the MOSFET driver output.

With a 100 MHz scope digital scope from school, I clearly measured a rise time of 20 ns! when my driver circuit was powering a small 1:1 transformer as a load. Also, the BEMF spikes that resulted were extremely tall! I measured peak to peak voltages of 550V+! This was with  the primary pulsed with 6V @ 2A (the resistance of the transformer primary is only 0.6 Ohms). I always use the same little transformer to test all of my circuits but this time something different happened. I was actually able to cause High voltage hash to ring from the computer speakers of a PC nearby in the room, and when I connected the scope probe and ground to the secondary coil, the transmitted RF hash from the transformer shut of the computer's USB connections! Previously I had only witnessed this effect when testing my TPU so I can testify that the rise time was the significant difference in this instance!

Now that my harmonic circuit is all ready to go, I focused on preparing my ECD and TPU V7.0 which I have yet to test. My TPU (also pictured here http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1872.msg31804.html#msg31804).

I am still a fan of the Tesla RE effects in the TPU. Each of my control coils are wound with 200ft of 30 gauge magnet wire with a total resistance of 22.7 Ohms. The coils are wound in bobbins intentionally to greatly increase the coil inductance. When I measured the L of one, it came out to be a whopping 2 mH! There are more details of this TPU that I will share but I'll keep it minimal here since this thread is devoted to the ECD. If I get positive results with it, I will start a new thread with details.

I will be testing it along with my ECD.

Attached is a screenshot of the open circuit pulse output of my circuit across the secondary of the test transformer. Also attached is a photo of my completed test setup. All I need to do now Is make the BNC cables to connect my control board to the MOSFET box and I'll be ready to begin testing.

God Bless,
Jason O

ronotte

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #577 on: June 26, 2007, 07:16:37 AM »
Hi Jason,

at the end you now have my same BEMF results!...so take care of your Mosfets as they are rated only 500V!....often, on PHASE side I measured about 900V  (there will be special...conditions).  So now you understand how easy will be puncturing effect from Drain to Gate.  When this happen you will loose the fet driver also. The funny thing is that the MOSFET itself does appear apparently to work  (this is because the puncturing is microscopic and has for itself a cospicuos resistance)...but it does not  (so no Seed- no way i LOST THERE LOT OF TIME TO UNDERSTAND WHY THE DEVICE WERER NOT OPERATING!). So if you put your probe on power MOSFET's Gate you will see in correspondence of the BEMF a 50-70V spike  that in turn will led to mosfet's driver failure.

I did a movie on my test (87 MB) but I've been unable to upload it either here or trough standard e-mail. May be Stefan will suggest a way?.

Roberto


ronotte

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #578 on: June 26, 2007, 07:21:28 AM »
@Darren,

yes it's probably a typo...sorry. For sure I'll double check it today and let you know. Of course I'll measure the bulb hot & warm resistance, please specify how you want me to measure it's capacitance: do you mean against ground?

For the Mobius I could also measure its capacitance between the two wires and against the ground...what do you suggest?

Roberto

ronotte

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #579 on: June 26, 2007, 07:54:18 AM »
@Darren,

here are the correct values:

Prymary: 0.023 mH
Secundary: 0.22mH

Cold bulb Resistance = 59.6 Ohm
Hot bulb Resistance = 420 Ohm  (similar light emission)

regards

Roberto

otto

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #580 on: June 26, 2007, 08:57:51 AM »
Hello all,

the last 4 days I didnt work at my workplace so I had a lot of time for my new tests.

I was always talking about my not soooo good controls. I did hundreds of tests.

I will be extreme short.

My control coils:

primary: 3.17m lenght, 0,5mm wire diameter
secondary: 16m lenght, 0,35mm wire diameter.

Control coil design:

1 primary coil
2 (TWO) secondary coils

All 3 coils wound at the same time (TOGETHER) NOT TWISTED!!!!

Controls 1" in lenght as in the pdf. Everything connected like in the pdf. I mean, Im using in this case only 1 control coil but pulsed with 3 frequencies.
In such a setup I have 1 16m long secondary doing nothing. With my indicator I saw a veeery strong "phase" on 1 end of my "free" coil and a "zero" on the other end of my coil. It was logic to connect my bulb to this free secondary coil.
Result: a nice shining 100W bulb.
In this way I have separated my load from the rest of the TPU.
 In this way I have a veeery strong "phase" WITH A LOAD connected.
In this way I have almost a clear sinus wave measured on my bulb.

With my super scope ( Thanks Roberto and Gustav22, again) I measured the frequency mix: 170kHz - 190kHz.
When I tune veeeery slowly I can clearly hear a huuuummmm. Frequency mix: 178kHz!!!

Again in short:

Control coil with 1 primary and TWO secondaries.
Everything connected like in the pdf but the bulb connected to the "free" secondary, or to say it better, to the 2. secondary of the control coil.

I have to mention that this coil lenghts are made for a 6" TPU but Im using this control coil in a 15" TPU because there is a lot of heat, sometimes it happens I toch a wire...

Otto

chrisC

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #581 on: June 26, 2007, 09:07:10 AM »
Hi Otto:

Great! Are you saying the 100W is decoupled from the input and is just connected across the floating secondary with no DC path to zero? If this is the case, is it possible to measure the current with a series ammeter through the floating secondary?

Regards

chrisC

otto

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #582 on: June 26, 2007, 09:19:31 AM »
Hello all,

@chrisC

exactly. But to measure the current would be a problem. The frequency is too high and my analog meter would not be a good idea. Anyway I will try it.

Otto

Hoppy

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #583 on: June 26, 2007, 10:14:56 AM »
Hello all,

@chrisC

exactly. But to measure the current would be a problem. The frequency is too high and my analog meter would not be a good idea. Anyway I will try it.

Otto


@ Otto

You need to measure the current on the input side with proper filtering. Measuring high frequency complex waveforms with either a digital or analogue meter is a no no!

This issue has been raised over and over again on this forum. I asked earlier if you intended to carry out proper measurements on the input side of your system using a battery as the power source. Can you confirm that you intend to do this and report the results?

Regards
Clive

otto

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #584 on: June 26, 2007, 10:20:54 AM »
Hello all,

@Clive,

I can only say that I cant exact measure the amps because I havent the needed equipment.
Of course, its totally clear that with my analog meter I cant measure the input and output power.

I will ask Roberto if he can make this job. I hope he has such meters and a battery.

Otto