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Author Topic: Successful TPU-ECD replication !  (Read 1138928 times)

poynt99

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1590 on: November 26, 2009, 08:09:35 PM »
I know what you're getting at tsl ;)

In the new year I expect to be doing some testing along these lines.

.99

turbo

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1591 on: November 26, 2009, 08:18:03 PM »
Now that's funny i am also testing along (Power) Lines  :D

Gobaga

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1592 on: November 26, 2009, 10:54:37 PM »
You've missed John Ambrose Fleming, Robert von Lieben and others.
Anyway, what's your point? Are we discussing here some sort of paternity?
It was not my intent to bring up something like this.My only point was this:
look at the tpu as it were a pulse forming line by itself- and there comes Blumlein, with his nested arrangement... nothing more.

PFL's don't run with gain, so how is a PFN part of a tpu?  Are you implying that there is some effect casued by a PFN that has gone unnoticed?

Triodes have another mode of operation that offers much lower rise time at much reduced amplification.

tsl

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1593 on: November 26, 2009, 11:47:26 PM »
PFL's don't run with gain, so how is a PFN part of a tpu?  Are you implying that there is some effect casued by a PFN that has gone unnoticed?

Triodes have another mode of operation that offers much lower rise time at much reduced amplification.
from otto:
Quote
Let us think about how to pulse a TPU with a high frequency without MOSFETs.
the way i proposed is just another way of pulsing
edit
i'm not implying that a pfn is part of the tpu but the tpu is a multiple pulse "former". sm stated the tpu work by creating multiple frequencies around the collector.actually it was
Quote
"In the case of my power unit, you create several frequencies within a space of the collectors coils circumference.
Frequencies are directly related to the circumference of the collector coil."
so that's for me another way to do just that.creating several freqs around a collector.if this the right way i don't know. but i do know it's different and that was otto asking for, new ways  ;)

Gobaga

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1594 on: November 27, 2009, 12:18:40 AM »

i'm not implying that a pfn is part of the tpu but the tpu is a multiple pulse "former". sm stated the tpu work by creating multiple frequencies around the collector.actually it was

and 12AU7's were used for multivibrators

What's next?  Square pulses?

Did you see the bifilar stuff in another thread?  There's your pulse forming in action.

turbo

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1595 on: November 27, 2009, 12:38:42 AM »
and 12AU7's were used for multivibrators

What's next?  Square pulses?

Did you see the bifilar stuff in another thread?  There's your pulse forming in action.

No no no Gobaga  :) not 12AU7's it was 12BY7's
At least that is what he used in the amp.
We do not know which frequency generators he used but i think any tube based generator with a good range and clean signal will do.

Here:

Quote
I originally got the idea from electron circuits which use vacuum rectifiers like the 5U4 GB or 5AR4 etc.

As my memory tells me, I originally used three old tube type frequency generators coupled to tube amplifiers composed of a 12BY7- input tube and a driver coupled to a 6AS7G output tube. It was using this apparatus that enabled me to first strike those magical tones.


For the record:

12BY-7

Penthode for tv videoamplifier applications.
Heater 12,6 Volt
Plate dissipation 6.5 Watts, where 12au7= 2.75 Watts
Amplfication Factor 28.5, where 12au7= 19.5

6AS7G

High Power twin Triode

Heater 6,3 Volt
And Plate dissipation per plate 14 Watts

Gobaga

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1596 on: November 27, 2009, 02:56:22 AM »
No no no Gobaga  :) not 12AU7's it was 12BY7's
At least that is what he used in the amp.
We do not know which frequency generators he used but i think any tube based generator with a good range and clean signal will do.

Here:

For the record:

12BY-7

Penthode for tv videoamplifier applications.
Heater 12,6 Volt
Plate dissipation 6.5 Watts, where 12au7= 2.75 Watts
Amplfication Factor 28.5, where 12au7= 19.5

6AS7G

High Power twin Triode

Heater 6,3 Volt
And Plate dissipation per plate 14 Watts

12BY7's

Thanks. That's what I get for relying on memory.  Pentodes can be "triode strapped" to give triode audio qualities.   

Hard to say what he was doing or trying to do.  Take the bifilar coil stuff - why do you even use a bifilar speaker coil to start with?  I can only guess that he was trying to mix signals for his spatial effects.






BEP

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1597 on: November 27, 2009, 04:10:48 AM »
<RANTON>
For those thinking along the lines of transmission lines:

Lamp cord, also known as 'zip cord', is a basic balanced transmission line. Impedance varies with dimensions but most will be on the order of 72 ohms. This type of cord was used between radio transmitters and antenna up until the 50's. It is very lossy above the 160 meter band. It has very low loss at frequencies into the ultrasonic.

Lamp cord was mentioned in the relayed texts.

IMHO... The open TPU clearly has common indoor 300 ohm twin-lead on two of the coil segments (probably all four). The collector is the wire wrapped between the two conductors of the twin-lead (one half of the same type of twin-lead inserted between the conductors of an un-split pair of twin-lead.
There are, at least, two diodes connected to the above coil arrangement (one each segment).

What does all this 'opinion' mean?

1. All three major type of TPUs are clearly PASSIVE frequency multipliers that are also regenerative simply because they are circular.
2. There are no high powered circuits involved.
3. There are no external signal generators.
4. The term 'gain' as used in the claimed SM texts is not the same as 'gain' used in common electronics. In common lingo the gain happens in the switch or control. Gain in a TPU is in the interaction of fields.
5. Two separate transmission lines (or the separate sides of one) is the easiest way to have current running both directions at the same time from two separate sources.
6. There are no micro or reed-switches or the most basic logic circuits. There is no need for them.
7. Harmonics of the fundamental are not integer multiples. The wave fronts are traveling in a circle. Just like calculating circumference, pi must be considered. 

<RANTOFF>

Sorry folks. Like most of us I am growing tired of the SS/Tube/Core/No Core/etc arguments. This thing is not simple enough for a person unfamiliar with wave propagation, transmission lines, resonant transformer theory, the value of dielectrics and more.

My experiments stopped with a passive frequency multiplying transmission line within a very high voltage static electric pulsed field. Timed correctly, that static pulse created a 'child' pulse from the reflected wave. This child had no source and did not have measurable drain on the static field or injected wave pulse.

It is likely I must perform better measurements and will do so when I move out of my suitcase.

Until then, and when Grumpy has returned, I'll just check in once in a while to review the same repeated arguments and attempts at reinventing motors.

BEP

innovation_station

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1598 on: November 27, 2009, 04:22:32 AM »
wattsup

lol

just harlous!  lol  fet death ...

this i have overcome after as otto says 50 or so... 

fets work great ..  if you know how to use them ... 

marco   nice work as usual!

or could i call u lee ;)  lol

but you GOT THE WRONG TUBES ...

PLUS   take a better look at this picture i can start this from swipping a magnet ...  i know i can  8)

ist!  0 input    TRUE SM TPU ...    i think so ...  its an eather pump ...  push and eather pull amp ..  ;) :D

and i know you comprehend this... 

ist!

this i built yesterday .. BE CARFULL IF YOU BUILD THE DAMM THING ...  OUT PUT WILL BE LARGE ....

IT IS AC PULSED DC 120V ON INPUT ...  POWERED FROM A 12V SOURCE ...  IT WILL LITE MANY BULBS .. IT HAS 2 OUTPUTS ... SIMPLE AS CRAP...   STUPID SIMPLE ... 
ITS JUST THE KNOWALAGE OF THE COILS AND HOW THEY INTERACT ..

BTW I CAN EASLY RUN 30 OF THEASE RINGS AS SHOWEN FROM MY CAP PAC MOTOR ...  FROM A AAJT POWER CAN STARTER FROM 5 1000TH OF A VOLT ...  :o

GETTING CRAZY  WONDERLAND ABOUNDS...  8)

otto

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1599 on: November 27, 2009, 07:13:55 AM »
Hello all,

I see a lot of ideas here.

@stprue

I used a sparc gap. A long or a short one. Not good.

@Marco

your picture of the setup is fantastic!!! For heating I would prefer 12,6V AC.

No, Im not using tubes because.....hmmmm......its impossible.

Otto


innovation_station

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1600 on: November 27, 2009, 08:34:56 AM »
i reccomend the 1 volt heater tube list i posted some time ago ...

this is all i ment marco bro ..

so you can lower inputted engery and get it to run from a magnet!

 :)

ist!

peace!   you all know i only want ballance restored .. and advance ment to take place ..

im trying to do this in a more mature safe way that people can understand ..

im not the best suited for the job .. however its now done ...


dankie

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1601 on: November 27, 2009, 05:13:32 PM »
Congrats IST , you can make the fets work !

outstanding .

kacor

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1602 on: December 04, 2009, 08:43:06 PM »
@ all
If I remember well SM mentioned he used some kind of piezo.

Maybe transformator?

" Piezoelectric Transformer is one of applications of Piezoelectric Effect that ceramic devices vibrate mechanically when low AC voltage of high-frequency, from several 10 kHz to 1Mhz, is applied on them and induce high voltage in consequence of their vibration. "


forest

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1603 on: December 04, 2009, 08:58:47 PM »
innovation_station

can you scale down your device or it must run on 120v input ?

EMdevices

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Re: Successful TPU-ECD replication !
« Reply #1604 on: December 05, 2009, 05:48:50 PM »
IST,  whatever your building there, it looks nice,  I like it!    Looks like you'll use 12 Volts from the cigarette lighter in your car.  Interesting.
EM