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Author Topic: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field  (Read 52699 times)

Offline bob.rennips

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Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« on: May 30, 2007, 06:57:25 PM »
I'm starting a new thread dedicated to experimenting with perturbing a static magnetic field. The static magnetic field generated from either a permanent magnet or a steady DC current into a coil.

This was all started off by a posting by kames. Thanks kames. I've reproduced the posting below as I don't know how to link off to a post on another thread. I've also re-uploaded the two relevant patents as found by kames.
___________________________________________________

@All
A few pages back (page 168) I have posted a simple and stupid experiment. Doesn?t look like anybody picked it up but sorry. Anyone can reproduce it with ease. There was a purpose to post it as a prelude to something else. I was thinking about opening a separate thread but as long as most of the people are in this thread I decided to post it here. It can be moved to a separate thread at any moment. There were several events that struck me when I performed that experiment. First, nobody could give a reasonable explanation. Second, I have found two patents in my unsorted files. Those two patents were backed up just in case a long time ago, before I even started looking for SM?s tpu. When I first time read those patents I decided ?old news?. When I recently read them again having all the stuff of the tpu in mind there were a lot of things to look over again. There were a lot of things to try to understand what SM was trying to tell from his every single message through Mannix.
I am in the process of testing those two patents. That is not a manual to how to do the things. Those are basic ideas and results.
The first patent (file name) I changed to ?power unit?. The second (file name) I changed to ?control unit?.
In the power unit the text is much more important than the drawings. Read it all. Don?t miss a single line. Drawings are not the same as what text is saying.
In the control unit, the drawing might remind you what you saw in the videos. It is just a nice technical solution.
I have scanned all the attachments from this forum and didn?t find anybody ever posted it before. Maybe I missed something. In this case, just disregard this post.
If you read these patents for the first time, come back and see what I posted on page 168. Any criticism or opinion is okay except for teaching me how to use a scope or probes or asking if I forgot to check my battery charge.

Again, I haven?t tested everything from these two patents. I am in the process. If anybody can get ahead, it is only better.

Regards,

Kames.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2007, 05:08:05 PM by bob.rennips »

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Offline chrisC

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2007, 07:25:33 PM »
@bob.rennips

Thanks for your post. Yes I would agree this new thread should just concentrate on the Kames patent findings which shouldbe interesting to verify, after all the theory and setup seemed like it's long the correct path? Thanks also to Kames for his excellent search.

Interesting that a search on the USPTO Public Pair Info. database yielded nothing on the inventors nor was there any data found for the International PCT numbers. Starnge...

chrisC

Offline bob.rennips

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2007, 07:39:34 PM »
Looking at the following configuration for the first coil.

Note this is a proof of concept. As such it will have multiple battery power sources. The point of the experiment is to observe anomalous voltage AND current being generated, which substantially differ from the expected. IT IS NOT A REPLICATION OF THE SM TPU.

I believe the SM TPU manipulates the magnetic fields in the way this device is doing. Once I understand what is happening regarding the magnetic fields I hope to translate this to a possible toroidal arrangement of coils.

The experiment is based on an air core solenoid NOT a TOROID.

1. 1st coil using heavy gauge enamelled copper wire of say 2 layers is wrapped first. This is where I hope to meaure some anomalous output voltage and current.
2. This is followed by a couple of rounds of pvc tape for extra insulation between different coil layers.
3. Next is wrapped a bifilar coil of lighter gauge enamelled copper wire. It is into these coils will be pulsed the low voltage followed by the high voltage. (see later for parameters for these pulses).
4. This is followed by a couple of rounds of pvc tape.
5. The next coil is the coil that will generate the static magnetic field. As such it will have a 5-6 layers of enamelled copper wire. This coil will be connected via a manual switch to a 12v battery. Resisters will be added to set the current to approx. 1amp.


To start with I'm going to have have the first pulse set to 12volts and the second pulse set to 24 volts. I'll be using IRF840s to trigger the pulse and a simple logic counter to time the period between the pulses. The pulse width will be approx. 10% of the period between the pulses.

I'm starting off with very low voltages so that I can obtain a baseline of expected waveform shapes on my oscilloscope and voltage ratios for a particular frequency period. I'd be surprised to see anything anomalous with these low voltages but these observations will act as a control for later.

I'll then up the voltages to see at what voltage levels things start to happen.


DIMENSIONS OF SOLENOID

Based on the work of Bruce Cathie I'm going for the following coil dimensions.

Solenoid Inside diameter: 0.5065 inches
Solenoid Length: 3.03906 inches (3 1/32 inches)

This is worked out as follows and will only make sense to those who have read Cathie's books. It's based on geometric harmonics of the earth.

Speed of light harmonic: 144000 which is the harmonic reciprocal of 694.4444444  - the earth magnetic field harmonic. The calcs look like I'm making it up, but it follows a complex line of thought by Cathie which he's simplified into a set of rules for determining lengths that are intune - a harmonic - of key earth harmonics.

So starting with 144000:

/ 10 = 14400
x2 = 28800
Square root = 169.7056274 geofeet harmonic.
x12 = 2036.4675 geoinches harmonic.

x 6076/6000 = 2062.2627 english inches
/6 /6 /6 /6 = 1.59125214 inches circumference (base geometric harmonic for the solenoid)
/ pi = 0.5065 inches diameter for the solenoid

Assuming whole turns this ensures that the length of wire is a harmonic of the speed of light and the earth magnetic field harmonic.

The length should be a multiple of the base geometric harmonic.

Solenoid length = 1.5912 x 2 = 3.0396 inches.


In other word I'm going to get 0.5 inch diameter round piece of wood to wind the coils on with a coil length of 3 1/32 inches. I'll obviously be removing the wood once the coils have been wound so that it's an air coil.

Not sure how long this will take, family commitments etc. but will post further updates as I have them.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2007, 07:39:34 PM »
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Offline dutchy1966

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2007, 07:40:53 PM »
Hi Bob


Good idea to start this new thread! As a matter of fact I was thinking about it too.

Also I'm playing with the following idea in my head:

How can we have a simple proof of concept?

My idea is to have,say, 1 meter long pvc pipe that will nicely hold some disc neos. Image the pipe upright and a stack of neos at the bottom end inside the pipe. Our two windings go around there as shown in the patent.
Now to test the strength of the field we drop another few disc neos (so they cant turn) in the top op the pipe. While the two sets of magnets will be opposing the top set will be floating in the pipe depending on the strength of the opposing magnetic fields.

when we now start pulsing our coils the top set of magnets will be pushed upwards in the pipe depending on the increasing magnetic field created at the bottom end.
If the field really increases like the patent states the top neos will probably be shooting out of the top end of the pipe.....lol   (maybe better take an even longer pipe  :D  

What do you all think, might this work well?

Regards

Robert

Offline bob.rennips

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2007, 07:55:22 PM »
Hi Bob


Good idea to start this new thread! As a matter of fact I was thinking about it too.

Also I'm playing with the following idea in my head:

How can we have a simple proof of concept?

My idea is to have,say, 1 meter long pvc pipe that will nicely hold some disc neos. Image the pipe upright and a stack of neos at the bottom end inside the pipe. Our two windings go around there as shown in the patent.
Now to test the strength of the field we drop another few disc neos (so they cant turn) in the top op the pipe. While the two sets of magnets will be opposing the top set will be floating in the pipe depending on the strength of the opposing magnetic fields.

when we now start pulsing our coils the top set of magnets will be pushed upwards in the pipe depending on the increasing magnetic field created at the bottom end.
If the field really increases like the patent states the top neos will probably be shooting out of the top end of the pipe.....lol   (maybe better take an even longer pipe  :D 

What do you all think, might this work well?

Regards

Robert

Well worth a go. You could perhaps also add another coil layer to your coil for the output and have this going to a 24v car bulb. Ideally the output should be the first coil to be wrapped but for experimental purposes I'm not sure it'll matter that much.

The unknown I have at the moment is what direction the anomalous magnetic field appears. Given SM has coils at right angles to each other, this is one aspect I'll be experimenting with. If the magnetic field is at right angles you won't necessarily see a change in how much your magnets jump.

However you could hang a magnet on a piece of string on the outside of the pipe which will jump what ever direction the magnetic field moves in.

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2007, 07:55:22 PM »
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Offline dutchy1966

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2007, 08:09:58 PM »
Bob,

I think the field will still pretty much fluctuate in the same direction as the static field.

Why?

Because the patent tells us to put another solenoid inside the magnet to pick up the field. I t is arranged in a way normal induction takes place.....

Robert

Offline starcruiser

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2007, 08:38:00 PM »
Robert,

I was thinking along the same lines for the coils form. I just had an idea you could take that PVC pipe and wrap (3) 30 ~34ga coils on it, one for an electromagnet, and the other 2 for the pulse coils, then a 14ga lamp cord over them for the output. With the PVC pipe we can then insert wire at 90 degrees to the coils and test that at the same time.

How about using a neo magnet along the outside of the core? Like I said prior several things to test/try.

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2007, 08:38:00 PM »
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Offline starcruiser

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2007, 08:40:27 PM »
Robert but the motor portion of the patent talks about using a coil at a 90 to the stator magnet which is not used in the generator version. So, supposedly either way may work???

Offline dutchy1966

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2007, 08:47:44 PM »
Carl,

Well first of all I think the generator version is less work to build and personally I'm more after generating electric than mechanical power. so I more or less didn't pay to much attention to the motor bit.

Anyway, as you say there are still several things we want to test. But at the end of the day it all comes down to a way to proof the principle. That has to be done as the first thing and it doesn't matter who does it or with what configuration. Everyone can use whatever ever they get their hands on and complies with the principle outlined.

I mean once the principle is proven we can start thinking about what is the best way to utilize it.

As i can see now the mechanical bit is the easy part in the patent.

Have you given the control circuit some thought already?

Robert

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2007, 08:47:44 PM »
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Offline bob.rennips

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2007, 09:31:44 PM »
...

Have you given the control circuit some thought already?

Robert

I'm going to be using IRF840 for the mosfets because these go up to 500v.
To drive these will be IRS2117PBF (edited from IRS2217 that doesn't exist!). These are high side high voltage mosfet drivers that allow 10v input to switch a mosfet with 600volts. In other words the input is floated up to the nominal output voltage. I particularly like these drivers as they don't use opto isolators and therefore can support very high pulse rate (frequency). The down side is they need 10v for logic 1.

To control the timing I'll use two CD4017 decade counters, which usefully have logic 1 at the voltage supply level. So 12volt supply to the chip gives an output pulse of 12v, which is more than sufficient for the logic pulse voltage required by the IRS2117 (edited from IRS2217 that doesn't exist!) chip.

The counter work by providing a logic one in sequence on one of 10 output pins. Each time you clock the counter the output logic one moves to the next pin. You can choose which pin resets the counter back to 0.

The first counter will determine the period between pulses. If I count from 1 to 8 and have output pins for 1 and 4 in the sequence connected to the above mosfet drivers then I can generate pulses with a certain period depending on the clocking freq. to the counter.

The second counter will determine the pulse width. If set to 10 pulses and I control the on period from only output pin 1 then this is 10% duty cycle of the on period of the first counter.

To be honest there are better ways of controlling pulses but I have a stack of CD4017s, so this is what I'm using.

Another thought I had from way back was to have both ends of the coil connected low. I'd then turn on, at the same time, both ends of the coil using two IRF840 to say 400volts. Although both mosfets would receive the turn on signal at the same time, the difference in turn on time (nanosecond level) would give a very short duration pulse. Similarly when both mosfets are turned off you'd also get a very short pulse. I know this will work as shoot through current when using high and low side mosfet drivers have to be specifically guarded against. Shoot through current being caused by different turn-on times even though the devices are the same spec.

Cheap and nasty - most certain to give you spikes of voltage!

« Last Edit: June 06, 2007, 03:38:55 PM by bob.rennips »

Offline dutchy1966

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2007, 09:39:24 PM »
Hi Bob,

That sounds good to me. maybe you can post a schematic at some point.
I'm thinking about using a laptop to control switching through lines from the parallel port.
I'm just not sure if it will be fast enough....

Have you got any ideas on that?

Robert

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2007, 09:39:24 PM »
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Offline gyulasun

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2007, 11:58:40 PM »
....  I'm thinking about using a laptop to control switching through lines from the parallel port.  I'm just not sure if it will be fast enough....

Hi Robert,

You could use ready made power MOSFET driver ICs between your parallel port output and the MOSFETs gates, to make fast rise/fall times from the laptop's output.

Gyula

Offline bob.rennips

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2007, 12:25:09 AM »
....  I'm thinking about using a laptop to control switching through lines from the parallel port.  I'm just not sure if it will be fast enough....

Hi Robert,

You could use ready made power MOSFET driver ICs between your parallel port output and the MOSFETs gates, to make fast rise/fall times from the laptop's output.

Gyula


The IRF2117 are power mostfet drivers but require 10v for logic 1, so these wont work as I believe parallel ports work on 5v ? There are others that work on 3.3v+ for logic 1, so these would be ok. An ir2106 looks like a candidate for a closer look:

http://www.irf.com/product-info/datasheets/data/ir2106.pdf

But word of warning. I've had a well designed, commercial, stepper motor driver board with optoisolators, fuses etc complete fry-up, when messing around with TPU style coils.
I would almost guarantee that at some point your laptop will become a doorstop if you go this route!

This has also been mentioned on this board before. The Bob Boyce pwm3e circuit is very nicely designed and tested. I think he'll even sell you a pcb board. Buy the components and solder in! He even has step by step picture on how to do this!

http://www.oupower.com/index.php?dir=_Other_Peoples_Projects/Bob%20Boyce/Hydroxy%20Gas%20Projects/Control%20Electronics/PWM3E


Offline starcruiser

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2007, 01:03:50 AM »
Sorry Robert I was at work and .. well you know how it goes.

I am thinking of using a simple blocking oscillator for the signal source. I know this will not allow sync'ing the pulses but I am thinking this might do the trick, I may even try and use the generator coils as part of the circuit to really keep it simple (KISS is my motto). Besides using this Oscillator will allow me to keep the parts count down and I can use higher voltage transistors to allow for the higher voltages down the road.

I also have a few circuits laying around from my TPU experiments and was thinking about using them as well. I want to try a few easy experiments using what I have on hand and already built first then move it up to the next level as I go on.

I am with Bob on this, starting with 12vdc (batteries) and move on from there. This potentially keeps the output in check, but who knows, 12v maybe all we need?

Offline chrisC

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Re: Proof of concept - perturbing a static magnetic field
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2007, 01:40:48 AM »
@all

See electricity through a magnetic field in video. Watch 4:57 and 5:07 into the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ltnlviCqu70

chrisC

 

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