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Author Topic: The storage thread  (Read 13157 times)

joe dirt

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The storage thread
« on: May 03, 2007, 03:02:19 AM »
Edit: this thread will be used primarily as a dropbox of ideas and 3d models of those ideas  :)
        will be cleaning it up to make it easier to follow and as more info comes about.

   I,m not sure if this has been done yet, so I,m putting it up on the board.
   The prime mover (in the middle) is the P.F.T. from jln labs,  here,s the link

http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/pftm2.htm

Attached to the ends are Faraday disks (homopolar generators) I thought the concept
   is worth investigating 8)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homopolar_generator

Dirt

P.S. you need the program "openfx" to view the 3d model,  the zip was archived with
      7zip.

« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 08:05:18 PM by joe dirt »

joe dirt

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2007, 07:10:28 AM »
Hello all

The reason why I thought this could work, is that a Faraday disk has little or no
   back torque from what I understand,  could be wrong though,  and the P.F.T. has
   little current draw (according to the tests at J.L.N.)

Dirt

Low-Q

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #2 on: May 10, 2007, 10:26:29 PM »
Hello all

The reason why I thought this could work, is that a Faraday disk has little or no
   back torque from what I understand,  could be wrong though,  and the P.F.T. has
   little current draw (according to the tests at J.L.N.)

Dirt
The back torque on a Faraday disc is in fact quite high. Just try to move a strong magnet close to a aluminum plate, and you'll feel the back torque. Try to make a magnet glide down a 45 degree or 90 degree aluminum plate. The magnet will sag quite slowly until it leaves the plate.

Br.

Vidar

joe dirt

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2007, 02:56:44 AM »
Quote
The back torque on a Faraday disc is in fact quite high. Just try to move a strong magnet close to a aluminum plate, and you'll feel the back torque. Try to make a magnet glide down a 45 degree or 90 degree aluminum plate. The magnet will sag quite slowly until it leaves the plate.

Br.

Vidar

Hello Low-Q

Thanks for the info, but are you certain the faraday disk operates using the same   
principle mechanics?    This taken from the Wiki:

Quote
Like all dynamos, the Faraday disc converts kinetic energy to electrical energy. However, unlike all other dynamos, this machine cannot be analysed using Faraday's own law of electromagnetic induction. This law (in its modern form) states that an electric current is induced in a closed electrical circuit when the magnetic flux enclosed by the circuit changes (in either magnitude or direction). However, the circuit in the Faraday disc is parallel to the magnetic flux vector and therefore encloses no magnetic flux. Therefore, Faraday's law does not apply to this machine.

Appreciated
Dirt

Gearhead

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2007, 04:39:46 AM »
Faraday disk generators are well known.  They power rail guns, atom smashers, and various welders etc.  If they had no back torque someone would have noticed.  There was a lot of discussion and misinformation about homo polar generators in the past.  Some of the atom smasher type generators put out in the neighborhood of  700,000 amps at 8-12 volts.

Low-Q

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2007, 09:58:13 PM »
Maybe you are right Joe. A small magnet crossing a big area of metal will because of the magnetic loop from north to south have a relative different direction and generation of current in the metal plate in the center of the magnet compared to the edges where the magnetic field is going the opposite way. This two currents works against each other, and that might be the reason why small magnets are partly prevented to move close to a metal surface. The Faraday disc, however, is rotating in a magnetic field where the magnetic lines are going the same way in the whole direction of the rotation.
I'll take a moment to think on it :)

Br.

Vidar

joe dirt

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2007, 04:47:25 AM »
Low-Q your input is appreciated

Gearhead 700,000 amps @12 volts! and they run this in a circular pattern! I,m
  surprised it doesn,t create a minature black hole and then all of us would have
  to live on a singularity (talk about close neighbors)

Well........I guess we won,t really know until this device is actually built
  and tested and since I,m the one who put up the idea.... I guess that
  should be me........................ WooHoo  who needs sleep anyway ;)

Any idea where I can find suitable copper pieces?  I have a lathe & milling machine
  so working it won,t be a problem,  I can create the long magnets out of old
  chipper blades from the local sawmill....  (man, R&D is getting expensive)

Updates in que
Dirt

« Last Edit: May 12, 2007, 05:39:09 AM by joe dirt »

Motorcoach1

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2007, 09:26:59 PM »
fun idiea Joe go to a repair center where they repair korsene power heaters  like ready hots , these use a HV coil to ru the spark assembily I have a few that i use and there 120 volt output is 30Kv ....... samsung copyers have a stand aloe board i the printer thats is 19 KV

joe dirt

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2007, 02:29:28 AM »
Hey M.C.

Yes...old copy machines have all types of nifty parts, I,ll start looking
  around for a few, kerosene heaters, I,ll look into that also.

Thanks
Dirt 

innovation_station

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #9 on: May 13, 2007, 03:17:54 AM »
hello joe

seams a lot like my machine but i use my turbine and water to turn the generators the configuration you have showen will produce back torque because of the statarny magnets put them all as 1 and they will not produce back torque because all is spinning fariday said that this was the only acception to his rule i am just finishing my unit it will be compleat verry soon and ready for testing after testing is compleat it is on to production and some one contacted me and wants to produce it after i have proof of concept this same person gave me 85 neo mags to do my proof of concept generators they are being milled this comming week each mag disc will have 16 -22 1" x .25 "  neos in it there 4 discs of neos and 2 copper discs  and if you put the magnets oppsing each other north to north it will produce 2 x the voltage as north  south the only diffrence is my unit will spinn at about 15 000 rpm and up from there the faster it spinns the more power it will make my entire unit spinning will weigh about 65 + lbs so for it to slow down it will have to produce a hole lot of back torque but since this produces such a little amount it will not slow down and will be overunity as the n machine is too the whole thing hings on the speed of operation as does the tpu except with the tpu it is electricty we are raceing around at almost the speed of light!

is

joe dirt

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #10 on: May 13, 2007, 03:28:45 AM »
Hey I.S.

Sounds like your ahead of me on this one, i hope it works out for ya! Congrats ;)

Quote
this same person gave me 85 neo mags

Man i wish i had friends like that, that,s pretty cool of them.

Appreciated
Dirt

innovation_station

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #11 on: May 13, 2007, 03:57:27 AM »
hey joe this good guy is from your country met him last week in my country we are 98 percent sure it will work but right now proof of concept first! then we go huge  ;)

and i do mean big magnets 6 " od neo rings and 14 of them 500 us each! total on mags 7000 us plus all the other stuff

is

allcanadian

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #12 on: May 13, 2007, 05:17:20 AM »
Have you seen Teslas patents concerning the homopolar generator, he solved most of the problems involved. There are basically two, eddy currents generating heat(heat is not electricity) and the brush problem(putting 100+ amps through high speed brushes).

innovation_station

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Re: PFT-FD
« Reply #13 on: May 13, 2007, 05:25:29 AM »
what if your high speed brushes was a spark gap? and did not phsicaly touch the disc?
or you used some non toxic super condictuve liquid in place of mecuary? those are some of my latest thoughts on the topic also tesla said that if you section the disc it will force current to flow to the outside of the disc also what if the heat was not such a big problem and you found a use for it like to heat your house then the unit could provide heat and electricty for your house!

is

joe dirt

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YATPMM
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2007, 03:41:35 AM »
No need to start a new thread, so here is "Yet Another Theoretical permanent magnet motor" idea.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2007, 08:02:49 PM by joe dirt »