Language:
To browser these website, it's necessary to store cookies on your computer.
The cookies contain no personal information, they are required for program control.
the storage of cookies while browsing this website, on Login and Register.
 Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here: https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding

Custom Search

### Author Topic: Donut sealed pontoon system  (Read 993 times)

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Donut sealed pontoon system
« on: May 05, 2023, 06:14:50 PM »
https://overunity.com/19459/buoyancy-calculations-making-use-of-an-exception-to-archimedes-principle/

I studied and discussed buoyancy and sealing issues.
And from that, I thought about the structure of change.
Because is no longer a 'use of an exception to Archimedes'

About calculating buoyancy, here it is simpler and more clear .
Fixing sealing problems may also be easier.

Figure 1 is an overall block diagram.

Among them, a string of pontoons to the left of the sprocket,
immersed in water, gets buoyancy and will rise.

A string of pontoons on the right, in a tube.
The upper mouth of this pipe is above the surface of the water.
The lower mouth of the tube is sealed.
Ideally, there is no water inside the tube, it is air.
A string of pontoons on the right did not get buoyancy .

So, the key is how the pontoon passes through the sealing mechanism
at the lower mouth of the tube,
keeping only air in the tube.

Figure 2 is a pontoon.
The middle part of the pontoon is a sealed air tank.
The parts of the pontoon that extend beyond the air tank
at both ends are made into a crown tooth shape.
There are chains connected to pontoon strings.

Figure 3 is a possible seal drive mechanism.

If it is assumed that the pontoon is a continuous tube
that goes down from the lower mouth of the air tube,
it may be easier to achieve.
But the tubular pontoon does not get much buoyancy
on the left side of the sprocket.

So the pontoons have to be made section by section.
Such a pontoon passes through the donut sealing mechanism
and there will be a large diameter change that makes sealing difficult.

Figure 2 Such a pontoon with Group edge teeth
Two pontoons up and down can form the shape of a tube.

Two continuous pontoons go through the donut sealing mechanism,
there is no diameter change, and the sealing is much simpler.

Donuts are made of suitable elastic materials.
When the pontoon passes through the doughnut,
the donut flattens a length outside the pontoon wall.
This section is press to the extent that it exceeds the length
of the crown teeth at the pontoon junction and will not leak.

The buoyancy of a string of pontoons to the left of the sprocket,
enough to pull the pontoons out of the doughnut .
But then the two pontoons that are going to pass through
the donut cannot be connected into a tube.

Therefore, by asking the donut to actively rotate itself,
it is possible to make two pontoons pass continuously
at the donut without separating.

After the pontoon passes through the doughnut,
it separates and reaches the state of chain straightening.

This requires the donut to rotate and phase in sync with the large sprocket.
It is easy to achieve using electronic control technology.

The doughnut and the red shell are also closely matched and do not leak.
Many blue drive wheels drive the donut to spin.

The deeper the left pontoon string is underwater, the more power it gets.
This depth is determined by the sealing performance of the doughnut.

Donut sealing mechanism may seem complicated, but it is more than use of an exception to Archimedes'
It is much easier to seal in a long strip.

Thank you
panyuming

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #1 on: May 06, 2023, 12:13:26 AM »
I changed the sketch again.

The donut does not turn anymore, it is fixed instead.
The pontoon has no teeth and is changed to the sleeve method.
The pontoons in the air tubes are stacked as continuously as possible.
The drive wheels directly drive the pontoon downward.
Some water is stored at the bottom of the air tube to act as lubricant for the doughnuts.
The pontoons that move down will carry some water out between them.
Add a water level control valve to maintain the water level at the bottom of the air pipe.
Add a small water pump for start-up to drain the water from the initial air pipe.

Donuts can be selected as finished sealing rings, for marine propeller shafts. You don't have to make your own.

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #2 on: May 06, 2023, 02:45:21 AM »
I improved it again.

The connection of the pontoon was changed to the hinged method.
A small magnet is added to the pontoon to compensate for the eccentric moment.
The blue drive wheel was removed, and the buoyancy
on the left side of the sprocket pulled the pontoon down through the doughnut.
Removed the starting water pump. The upper sprocket is actively
rotated at start-up to drain water from the lower part of the air pipe.

Many layers of rubber rings spacer gaskets make up a sealed doughnut.
It does not require high precision.
Unlike the application of boat shafts, some water leakage is allowed here.
The amount of water leaking is less than the amount brought out between the pontoons,
and the water in the air pipe will remain at the level controlled by the valve.
Design the shape of the pontoon, you can adjust the amount of water carried out from the pontoon gap.

Therefore, the processing is much simpler.

This system can be used on ships that do not need fuel to sail forever.

#### Tarsier_79

• Full Member
• Posts: 118
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #3 on: May 06, 2023, 08:16:24 AM »

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2023, 05:50:43 AM »

* Simple pontoon structure.doc
« Last Edit: May 09, 2023, 02:37:08 PM by panyuming »

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2023, 02:25:35 AM »

« Last Edit: May 11, 2023, 04:26:24 AM by panyuming »

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2023, 04:00:40 PM »
The pontoon structure was improved.

In order to speed up the pontoon running line speed,
the two ends of the pontoon should be made into a conical shape to reduce the resistance of the pontoon in the water.
In this way, the hinge is placed on the axis line of the pontoon,
so that the pulling pontoon has no eccentric moment, eliminating the hook for balancing the torque,
The pontoon structure was also simplified.

The pontoon in Figure 7 is made of PVC finished pipe, the size is mm,
and the air volume in the pontoon is slightly greater than 5 liters.
« Last Edit: May 13, 2023, 12:53:17 AM by panyuming »

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2023, 10:11:53 AM »
Figure 8 is a possible system schematic.
The total height of the entire system is about 8 meters.
The effective height for generating buoyancy is about 4 meters, with 10 pontoons containing more than 50 liters of air, perhaps 50kg buoyancy.
If the pontoon string runs at a speed of 1 m/s, there is about 490W of power.
Excluding various losses, about 300W of effective power may be output.
Even if there is no fuel and no input, such a large-sized machine, only 300W of power, is too small.

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #8 on: May 14, 2023, 11:00:25 AM »

Stay in the future Waterworld

#### Willy

• Full Member
• Posts: 219
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #9 on: May 14, 2023, 01:36:33 PM »
A very nice study in buoyancy, I think.
Its nice to see some variations in approach.

In simplifying the design down to a few points.

What is ?

The energy as force against water pressure upon a pontoon at depth required in
order to pass it through the seal, multiplied times the length of pontoon that will
pass through the seal.

The force as weight of the pontoons on the right while in air

The force as buoyancy of the pontoons on the left while submerged.

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #10 on: May 15, 2023, 01:45:15 PM »
A very nice study in buoyancy, I think.

Thank you Willy for joining the discussion.

The mass (weight) of each pontoon's own structure is the same.
There are as many pontoon skewers on the left as there are pontoon skewers on the right.
They are balanced to the sprocket center.
So just calculate the difference in the number of pontoons on the left and right sides in the water,
and then calculate the volume of air in the pontoon of the difference,
and the buoyancy value is obtained.

So buoyancy has nothing to do with the mass of the pontoon.

The force required to pull the pontoon down from the sealing ring is divided into two parts.
one Part is the upward buoyancy of the water on the bottom surface of the pontoon.
This force is roughly balanced by subtracting the buoyancy of one pontoon on the left.
The fatal mistake I designed could be here.

The other part is the friction of the pontoon with the sealing ring.
This friction force is mainly related to the difference between
the hole diameter of the sealing ring and the interference fit of the pontoon diameter,
the material elasticity of the sealing ring,
the lubrication between the sealing ring and the pontoon,
The number of layers of the seal，
and the pressure of the water depth.

Minimize the interference fit between the sealing ring and the pontoon,
minimize the number of layers of the sealing ring,
and try to use materials with good elasticity, which minimizes these frictions.

The total effect: the rate at which water leaks from the bottom of the seal
into the air pipe is lower than the speed at which the pontoon
carries water out of the air pipe at the rated operating speed.
It works well.

I won't calculate any of that.
I just feel that it can be done, the friction is less than the buoyancy of one pontoon.
So I put the total loss at 37%, which should have margin.

I used to think that buoyancy machines would get a lot of buoyancy.
After roughly calculating this machine, I don't think it's worth actually making.
Because the output/size ratio is too small.
Probably because the speed that can be achieved is not high.
The higher the operating speed of the pontoon, the greater the output, and the smaller the effective buoyancy.

Although this buoyancy machine may be a free energy device.
But it is not as practical as using solar panels or wind turbines plus battery systems.

Thank you!

#### panyuming

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 61
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #11 on: May 15, 2023, 02:59:11 PM »
According to
https://overunity.com/19459/buoyancy-calculations-making-use-of-an-exception-to-archimedes-principle/21/
Site case Fb

The buoyancy of each pontoon is caused by the difference in water pressure between the bottom and top surfaces.
The pressure difference between the bottom and top surfaces of the pontoon
coming out of the sealing ring on the right may be equal to the sum of the pontoons on the left.

So, my design was wrong and impossible to achieve.
Sorry to delay everyone's time.

#### Tarsier_79

• Full Member
• Posts: 118
##### Re: Donut sealed pontoon system
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2023, 07:38:48 AM »
Quote
he force required to pull the pontoon down from the sealing ring is divided into two parts.
one Part is the upward buoyancy of the water on the bottom surface of the pontoon.
This force is roughly balanced by subtracting the buoyancy of one pontoon on the left.
The fatal mistake I designed could be here.

Correct. The force is the pressure at the depth. It is not countered by the pressure on the top surface of the pontoon, so it will be significantly more. Sorry, but here is no advantage to your design.