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Author Topic: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)  (Read 88857 times)

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #120 on: March 22, 2007, 03:30:44 PM »
Dr. Spark,
as long as you don?t use any transformer and don?t use mechanical switching
with the right contact materials, I guess we will never see any additional energy
coming into this circuit.

It is just a capacitive current transformer type circuit and we need
external energy input via electron clustering at the mechanical switching contact points
or something simular to generate additional energy from the outside of the circuit
to get additional energy input.

I am looking forward to your new tests with the transformer.

Regards, Stefan.

Offline drspark

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #121 on: March 22, 2007, 09:50:16 PM »
Hi Stephan,

Just to complete the record I performed the 1 to 100 ohm measurements you sugjested.
freq 307hz

The parts arrived today, transformer is not an audio freq transformer. is standard mains 50/60hz unit.

That yellow torroid any idea how many feet of #24 i should wrap on it?

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #122 on: March 22, 2007, 11:41:47 PM »
Okay, this is also not overunity.

Now if we fold and integrate again the waveform,
we get about 25milliVolts atthe R1= 1Ohm shunt.
This means 25 milliAmps flow into the circuit, which means
an input of 10 Volts x 0.025A= 0.25 Watts.

The R2=100 Ohm resistor gets a power of about
(3.6Volts) ^2 / 100 Ohm = 0.13 Watts, so the output at this resistor is
still lower than the input of 0.25 Watts.

This way, it just will always work only in underunity mode.

Regards, Stefan.
P.S. If you wind a transformer,
try to go first with so many windings, so that you have around
10 Ohms DC resistance of the coils.

Offline kcarrigan

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #123 on: March 25, 2007, 12:24:34 AM »
Hi guys,
New caps on order. Thought you'd want a diagram of the 50:50 duty cycle timer circuit I use. Instead of using transistors and components, use this circuit.  The output of course will need something like a MOSFET or biploar transistor to keep the 'Ra' resistor isolated from any output loading affects.
v/r
Ken

Offline gezgin

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #124 on: March 25, 2007, 11:32:41 AM »
Yes, this site about 555 osc. circuits:
http://www.doctronics.co.uk/555.htm

Offline wizkycho

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #125 on: March 26, 2007, 04:01:28 PM »
Hi all !
maybe we can switch things this way.

at first only C1 is charged, C2 is empty.

At this point (if K1 is closed at O1,O2) current through s1(trafo or coil)
starts to flow and induces voltage which in return rises C1+ potential and lowers C2+ potential making it possible for C1 to additionaly discharge to C2.

can you please answer:
1. I expect that voltages will end up (obseving right and left branch) at level simmilar or same as when using four caps ? will they ? or only discharge current is much stronger but making it imposible to reroute C2 charging to C1 ?

2. Is there already any place to place load in this schematic ?

None the less I asume that if trafo is replaced with two coils (on one core) will have I think very strong magnetic pulse which can be utilised to push some magnets on rotor... not putting to much to input.

just a specualtion, but should be tried.

Igor
 

Offline drspark

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #126 on: March 27, 2007, 08:15:37 AM »
Hi People,

New Caps and board.
finer frequency and duty control.
Plenty of room for Gyula's diodes&resisters,
and adding the other 3fets to ballance the circuit.

I am ready for a transformer now...
anyone have a hifrequency transformer pt# Mouser.com I should try

Motor application, interesting, gray(ish)

Stephan, check out new scope shot, reintegrate...

drSpark


Offline wizkycho

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #127 on: March 27, 2007, 10:35:48 AM »
Hi all !

Please reconsider using schematic in my previous post:
advantages:
- much simpler (only two switches)
- no loss in charge potential(U) (unlike previous paralell conection where charges split, and capacity(charge number) splits when in serial - in return demanding current refill)

This is exactly what I have tried to achieve. Two Cups (one full, other empty). The thing is how
to lift one cup over another without losses (or small ones)...Here full Cup lifts itself (with trafo) and lowers Cup that is refiling. Full charge and even its potential is flowing from one cup to another over and over again...is it cheap ? is it maybe free?

Please brainstorm this schematic...haven't tried it (many things can happen here that are not obvious) but must soon.

Offline drspark

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #128 on: March 27, 2007, 08:02:22 PM »
Hi Igor,

Nice!
Sim OU first try!
Need to think about this one....
I think I have all parts but the board.

drSpark

Offline drspark

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #129 on: March 28, 2007, 12:19:23 AM »
Hi People,

Here is my best simulation of Igors latest.
Lets call it *bouncer*?

HELP! I have that small torroid core from pc powersuply and #24 magnet wire
HOW CAN I MAKE A SUITABLE TRANSFORMER FROM THOSE THINGS?

NOT GOING TO PUT 10-OHMS OF IT ON HERE >300 FEET OF WIRE  ;D

DRsPARK
« Last Edit: March 28, 2007, 10:14:18 AM by drspark »

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #130 on: March 28, 2007, 11:23:00 AM »
Hi People,

New Caps and board.
finer frequency and duty control.
Plenty of room for Gyula's diodes&resisters,
and adding the other 3fets to ballance the circuit.

I am ready for a transformer now...
anyone have a hifrequency transformer pt# Mouser.com I should try

Motor application, interesting, gray(ish)

Stephan, check out new scope shot, reintegrate...

drSpark



Hi Dr. Spark,
after folding the waveforms and integrating,
it does not show overunity.
Input average voltage at 10 Ohm resistor about 1.2 Volts,
means 0.12 amps in and 10 Volts means 1.2 Watts input.

Average voltage at Loadresistor R2= 10 Ohm = about 3 Volts.

Power at this resistor thus:
Voltage ^2 / R = 0.9 Watts.
So you have now to try with the transformer.

Just try to wind first with low turn numbers and thick diameter wire,
maybe just 10 turns, so the ohmic resistance is low and you can switch with
faster frequencies !

Good luck !

P.S: Nice new circuit from Igor too.

Regards, Stefan.

Offline wizkycho

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #131 on: March 28, 2007, 04:40:12 PM »
Hi all !

Made sim.
For pits sake look at this wonderfull 120Wpeaks at Rload.

input is allmost zeroed.
battery is really not needed, and if needed it is recharging itself !!!
No need for sparks.

situation stays same after 100 seconds of sim (capacitors doesn't deplete a bit)
simmulation is stable(tried with different values) and gives correct wave forms unlike in parametric parallel/serial switching.
so I think that this really works

This is so simple it can be made motionless. Have we finally found a holly Grail ?

Harti please make aditional link to this Igors switcher topic at www.overunity.com

hope this works. It can be made light, small, and powerfull...works in space

Igor

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #132 on: March 28, 2007, 06:13:05 PM »

...I am ready for a transformer now...
anyone have a hifrequency transformer pt# Mouser.com I should try
Motor application, interesting, gray(ish)


Hi DrSpark,

Unfortunately, there are not much choice  to choose from.

Perhaps these two types will be worth trying, but they would need a switcher frequency of higher than 15-20kHz.

mouser part # 673-PE-63385 1:1 pulse transformer $6.14 one qty
                 # 673-PE-63387 1:1:1 pulse transformer $10.62 one qty

These are the prices for someone not willing to trouble/wind many feets of enameled wire onto a toroid core...  :D

To get as high as 15-20kHz from your multivibrator, you have to change the feedback C values for a lower value, or you may like to use a CMOS version of 555 timer IC like TS555CN (part #511-TS555CN, $0.39 one qty) and in this case you can easily tune the switching frequency by a single potenciometer (and duty cycle with another one, independently). If you wish schematics on this circuit later I can upload.

Gyula

Offline wizkycho

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #133 on: March 29, 2007, 09:53:40 AM »

Hi Dr. Spark,
after folding the waveforms and integrating,
it does not show overunity.
Input average voltage at 10 Ohm resistor about 1.2 Volts,
means 0.12 amps in and 10 Volts means 1.2 Watts input.

Average voltage at Loadresistor R2= 10 Ohm = about 3 Volts.

Power at this resistor thus:
Voltage ^2 / R = 0.9 Watts.
So you have now to try with the transformer.

Just try to wind first with low turn numbers and thick diameter wire,
maybe just 10 turns, so the ohmic resistance is low and you can switch with
faster frequencies !

Good luck !

P.S: Nice new circuit from Igor too.

Regards, Stefan.

@ DrSpark, Gyulasun, Harti

After conducting many tests, changing parameters of components, etc. I can confirm
that first measurements of EMF Recycler (http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=133.0;attach=6634;image) is not showing FE.
Gyulasun pointed out in his previous posting that resistor (84.3mA) for measuring current at the output is missplaced before C5 and that is exact cause of this false mesurement.
Nevertheless when I put resistor in series with only output lamp (means after C5) I get much better results (O/I Watt ratio) than DrSpark and it is most times near unity 90 - 98 % . The
real difference in my setup is that two currents are flowing through trafo (which is actually Rload). One is from preserved charge in caps and the other additional from input.
I suggest to DrSpark to make small adjustment and use two Rloads, and put input inbetween.
this way O/I ratio will increase.

What do you think of this last Only two caps schematic and theory behind it. I think it's amazing
and would like some speculative confirmation or denial, scince I have no time to make it today, but weekend is near...
It is easyer (allmost free) to "lift" (potential) allmost massless bunch of electrons, than lift full cup of watter for purpose of filling the other empty cup.
Think that massless electrons (a lot of them) can do work of say 10KWs and compare how much mass of water we have to lift and at what height (spend work) to observe same ammount of work. "Cup" filled with electrons is easily lifted, it is massless...
Hi Hopes this works.

best regards

Igor Knitel
Perihelion Labs

Offline drspark

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Re: Igors switcher (EMF recycler2)
« Reply #134 on: March 31, 2007, 09:44:17 AM »
Hi Igor, Members,

The battle of the sims...

All in fun, you never know, till you build em...

drspark