The paradox is the energy loss during the transfer of charge. You start with 1 capacitor that has lets say 1 joule of energy. After the charges equalize between two capacitors the calculated energy is half of what you started with. Instead of 1/2 joule on each cap you are left with .25 joules on each one. This adds up to a total of 1/2 joule of energy. Where did the other half go???

V8larko

I said that I can only speculate and try to find reason other than losses.
It seems that you know answer and everything about it,
and I am confused why you opened thread if all of that is known to you?
Did you want to hear others opinions, or to find some victim so you can preach to that person how wrong he is?
Neither you or I are right.
Why?
Because it is still cap conundrum and is not solved.

I offered a solution of where and why the energy dissipates for debate in the beginning of the thread, you did read it didn't you?. So why are you confused?.
So yes, I did solve it and now I'm looking for opinions on my solutions.

Is it pressure?
We all use that term pressure or voltage, but is it really that?
Electricity is not water or gas, and electrons are too slow.
I thought about it many times, and pressure just does not fit exactly.
But without better explanation, I am stuck.
Short answer: I really dont know.

I know you don't know but I can help. The electrical pressure relates to the electric field around each electron and while they move slow there are billions and billions of them which produce a very powerful "electron cloud" with a combined field. I remember something from a good book on the subject by A.D.Moore on electrostatics. Moore said if we had a 1 cm cube of aluminum and separated all the positive and negative charges 1 meter apart. The electric field would produce a force of something like 32 million million million pounds. This force is equivalent to the weight of a steel cube 76 miles square.

So you are very much wrong and those tiny electrons in something as simple as a 1cm cube of aluminum can produce unimaginable forces in the right context. The atomic bomb is based on liberating some electrons from a small amount of material which produces a massive amount of energy which can incinerate an entire city... just from moving some little electrons.

So it's probably a good idea to understand what is actually going on because our civilization and every technology we know is based on moving some electrons. Electricity, chemistry, biology, everything revolves around atoms and the electric forces which dictate there action. Kind of important stuff.

Regards

https://youtu.be/4v0YlultV0w

Not sure what this guys credentials are so you might take it with a grain of salt. I can’t envision how this would be possible without some amount of inductance. As far as I know and ideal capacitor has zero resistance and inductance.

Real question is

Can cap of 10V perform 4 times of work than cap of 5V,
as energy equation states?
Or is it false?

Lunkster, another paradox is the energy gain when separating a parallel plate capacitor. You have a capacitor whose plates are separated by a certain distance. Let’s say it’s capacitance is 50 uf and it’s charged to 200 volts. The energy stored would be 1 joule. As you start to separate the plates the voltage will increase and capacitance will decrease. At twice the distance the voltage doubles and capacitance halves. You now have 2 joules of stored energy on the capacitor. Where did the extra energy come from? The explanation you will find is that it required work to separate the plates. In doing so you add energy into the system.

Nice kajumbee.
What about removing the dielectric which is far lighter than the plate itself...
What about changing the properties of the dielectric material instead of moving anything...
For everything there is a solution. There just need an effort but everything is possible.

Regards

Kajunbee

Your explanation in first post is the conclusion that I came to also. That it is simply the redistribution of charges over a larger area. I had given this quite a bit of thought over the years and was fairly comfortable with this explanation until recently. There are several videos on YouTube now concerning the paradox. In one it was said that if there was not a loss of energy the stored charge would slosh back and forth till the end of time. I’ll see if I can find it again and provide you the link.

https://youtu.be/4v0YlultV0w
Not sure what this guys credentials are so you might take it with a grain of salt. I can’t envision how this would be possible without some amount of inductance. As far as I know and ideal capacitor has zero resistance and inductance.

That was an interesting video, thanks.

We could do some thought experiments...
1) We have the two capacitor setup made of superconducting materials with zero resistance, connect them and the electron current sloshes back and forth for an untold amount of time.
2) We have the two capacitor setup with a very high resistance, connect them and it takes and untold amount of time for the voltages to balance.

It would be easy to assume the resistance is the cause of the dissipation of energy however in case 1 it is the inductance which causes the electrons to slosh back and forth not so much a lack of resistance.

In my experiments I added a coil with inductance in between the two capacitors and I measured a dampened alternating current between them. When I removed the inductance there was no alternating current and they balanced immediately. The problem here is that whenever an electron which carries an electric field with it moves it produces a magnetic field. The magnetic field on the conductor gives the electron current a property similar to inertia which then causes it to over run and alternate.

So we could suppose that if we used superconductors in the two capacitor setup and if all the resistance and inductance were removed the electrons would not slosh back and forth for an untold amount of time leaving us back at square one, as you implied. Most are not considering all the factors in my opinion which becomes problematic.

In my opinion the physics dictates that when the initial charge density balances over twice the surface area this is the first cause which dissipates the majority of the energy regardless of what happens in between the capacitors. It also helps that I have seen FE first hand and it was not based on a mysterious energy gain as many suppose but understanding and removing an inherent loss in the system many took for granted. So it is very important to understand exactly what is happening where and why in my opinion.

Regards

Lunkster,


In each cap should be 5V, and energy 1/4 , I think.


What do you think, is it real?
By doubling voltage energy grow very rapidly?


All we need to do is raise voltage in cap, and soon energy will be huge.