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Author Topic: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board  (Read 24902 times)

Offline r2fpl

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #30 on: September 28, 2019, 11:14:44 AM »
I did the DC test but the situation is the same for AC.

https://youtu.be/6t-WbWIqwhY

Of course, all devices correctly measure the 4ohm resistor

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline r2fpl

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #31 on: September 28, 2019, 01:17:08 PM »
https://youtu.be/1vDRcrw41OI?t=37

Tesla and Kapanadze talked about the impulse. Each of us understands this. The focus should be on how to receive this energy by moving the coil into resonance with this impulse to slow down the response and thus extend the duration of action.

Is this a good explanation. Does anyone contradict Tesla's words when he says the impulse is MW or GigaW of energy ?! Probably not.

However, there are switching power supplies and they do not give more than they get what they do wrong or why it is not so obvious.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #32 on: September 28, 2019, 01:23:13 PM »
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Offline d3x0r

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #33 on: September 28, 2019, 03:07:54 PM »
@gotoluc
you could maybe just spray down the ground with a hose ... 2k Ohm, that's really high.  Thanks for measuring.

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #34 on: September 28, 2019, 04:26:10 PM »
Would you check the TX coil operating frequency by a frequency meter (if possible) to see if it changes when you ground its bottom
to the buried copper pipe versus the frequency when its bottom is connected to the 15' wire?

I have retested the setups using a scope and the self tuning resonance circuit stays at 1.1Mhz (TC resonant frequency) connected to wire or grounding rods.

Video demo: https://youtu.be/ISaLhHcMkVQ

Regards
Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #34 on: September 28, 2019, 04:26:10 PM »
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Offline gotoluc

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #35 on: September 28, 2019, 05:26:09 PM »
I did the DC test but the situation is the same for AC.

https://youtu.be/6t-WbWIqwhY

Of course, all devices correctly measure the 4ohm resistor

Hi r2fpl,

Using a multimeter is not the ideal way to measure actual resistance between grounding rods. It only give an estimate of the grounds conductivity. There are more specialized instrument for doing this which transmits and receives a signal, then computes the resistance.

@gotoluc
you could maybe just spray down the ground with a hose ... 2k Ohm, that's really high.  Thanks for measuring.

Yes d3x0r, I agree but the point of the test was to demonstrate how bad of a conductor the ground is in my area.
This was a reply to poynt99 post, suggesting the currents return path is completed through the ground by coupling of Tesla coils top capacitance.

Electronic engineering states that, to deliver current there must be a return path (example: 2 wires)
So as far as an EE is concerned, it is not possible to transfer power using only one wire, there must be a return path somewhere.
I personally don't agree the ground can be considered as the return path in my area anyways and why I made this demonstration.
I have already demonstrated it's not done through the air by enclosing the receiver in a Faraday cage. So it's still unclear how this simple circuit can transfer power using only one wire at distances of 15 meters or more as demonstrated by this video r2fpl has found. 

Link to 15 meter single wire power transfer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtG5nU34WQ0

So an EE is unable to explain how this can possibly work because the teachings have remained limited till today.
Tesla knew of this misunderstanding over 100 years ago and tried to educate by demonstrating but was cut off by the influences of the time.

Regards
Luc
« Last Edit: September 28, 2019, 11:07:09 PM by gotoluc »

Offline znel

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #36 on: September 28, 2019, 05:46:47 PM »
I have retested the setups using a scope and the self tuning resonance circuit stays at 1.1Mhz (TC resonant frequency) connected to wire or grounding rods.

Video demo: https://youtu.be/ISaLhHcMkVQ

Regards
Luc
I believe gyula was referring to the receiver coil changing frequency when connected to earth, in which case you may need more or less capacitance in the top load.   The sandy ground, as you mentioned, doesn't provide the mineral content between the ground pair needed for a lower resistance.   If you watered the ground around the rods, this would expand the area in which the current can flow ( instead of the small area of just the rod ) and lower resistance.    A "good" ground would be a deep ground, one that penetrated the water table where minerals and moisture is abundant.   
« Last Edit: September 28, 2019, 07:49:49 PM by znel »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #36 on: September 28, 2019, 05:46:47 PM »
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Offline gyulasun

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #37 on: September 28, 2019, 09:27:14 PM »
Hi Luc,

Thanks for checking the operating frequency for the two cases.

Let me notice the followings:

-- you pay attention to the frequency of 1.1 MHz and not to the decimals and I think that the loaded Q of the two secondary coils may remain relatively high. From your scope display the frequency is 1.147 MHz for the direct wire connection and is 1.137 MHz for the grounded pipe connection. This roughly 10 kHz change at the TX coil frequency could mean a significant detuning when we are dealing with high Q RX and TX circuits.

However, the RX coil frequency would change roughly in the same amount and direction the TX coil's frequency does when their bottom wires are grounded to the pipes so the 10 kHz change can safely be neglected indeed.
So here I assume the pipes may detune both coils in the same amount so both coils may remain closely tuned to each other as you carefully tuned them with the singly wire connection. I answer this also to member znel's comment above, it was easier to check the TX coil frequency change than that of the RX coil. The tuning on the RX coil would be the best as he has mentioned by changing the top load capacitance, and I add to use a low power LED as an indicator instead of the incandescent bulb.  But there is no real need to do this, it is sure there is a certain amount of energy transfer towards the RX coil but ground losses certainly limit it. 

-- you measure the ground's DC resistance between the pipes as 2 kOhm. Unfortunately, ground resistance (or rather) impedance is frequency dependent too.  I agree what you wrote to member r2fpl on measuring ground conductivity, it is a complex issue and conductivity may change due to change in the moisture content of the soil etc as znel mentioned.
Regarding Tesla, I think he ultimately wished to resonate the entire Earth by the magnifying transmitter for the high efficiency (over 95-96%) energy transfer and this would not involve the Earth's  conductivity in the sense his earlier coil transmitters (by single wire or via air) or your present tests would.

Gyula

I have retested the setups using a scope and the self tuning resonance circuit stays at 1.1Mhz (TC resonant frequency) connected to wire or grounding rods.

Video demo: https://youtu.be/ISaLhHcMkVQ

Regards
Luc

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #38 on: September 28, 2019, 09:40:11 PM »
Hi r2fpl,

Using a multimeter is not the ideal way to measure actual resistance between grounding rods it only give an estimate of the grounds conductivity. There are more specialized instrument for doing this which transmits and receives a signal, then computes the resistance.

Yes d3x0r, I agree but the point of the test was to demonstrate how bad of a conductor the ground is in my area.
This was a reply to poynt99 post, suggesting the currents return path is completed through the ground by coupling of Tesla coils top capacitance.

STATEMENT :

Electronic engineering states that, to deliver current there must be a return path (example: 2 wires)
So as far as an EE is concerned, it is not possible to transfer power using only one wire, there must be a return path somewhere.

RELATED NON CONVENTIONAL EE-DEVICE :
https://www.google.com/search?q=avramenko+1-+wire+plug&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-m





I personally don't agree the ground can be considered as the return path in my area anyways and as demonstrated.
I have already demonstrated it's not done through the air by enclosing the receiver in a Faraday cage. So it's still unclear how this simple circuit can transfer power using only one wire at distances of 15 meters or more as demonstrated by this video r2fpl has found. 

Link to 15 meter single wire power transfer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtG5nU34WQ0

So an EE is unable to explain how this can possibly work because the teachings have remained limited till today.
Tesla knew of this misunderstanding over 100 years ago and tried to educate by demonstrating but was cut off by the influences of the time.

Regards
Luc

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #38 on: September 28, 2019, 09:40:11 PM »
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Offline gotoluc

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #39 on: September 29, 2019, 12:28:33 AM »
you pay attention to the frequency of 1.1 MHz and not to the decimals and I think that the loaded Q of the two secondary coils may remain relatively high. From your scope display the frequency is 1.147 MHz for the direct wire connection and is 1.137 MHz for the grounded pipe connection. This roughly 10 kHz change at the TX coil frequency could mean a significant detuning when we are dealing with high Q RX and TX circuits.

Since we are not dealing with a clean sine wave in both cases the scope averages the frequency based on the wave form shape. The very small difference in frequency the scope displays may not at all be a real change in frequency from the circuit but from a small change in the sine wave shape. Look closely at each wave shape and I'm quite sure you will see a small difference and hence the change.
I'm use to seeing these small digital artifacts affect the frequency data on a digital scope and why I ignored the digits below 1.1Mhz
I'm very confident the transmitter coil is locked at the same resonating frequency in both cases.

However, the RX coil frequency would change roughly in the same amount and direction the TX coil's frequency does when their bottom wires are grounded to the pipes so the 10 kHz change can safely be neglected indeed.

Yes, I agree.

So here I assume the pipes may detune both coils in the same amount so both coils may remain closely tuned to each other as you carefully tuned them with the singly wire connection. I answer this also to member znel's comment above, it was easier to check the TX coil frequency change than that of the RX coil. The tuning on the RX coil would be the best as he has mentioned by changing the top load capacitance, and I add to use a low power LED as an indicator instead of the incandescent bulb.  But there is no real need to do this, it is sure there is a certain amount of energy transfer towards the RX coil but ground losses certainly limit it. 

The point of the experiment was to consider the ground (in my area) as a possible current return path. So to reduce load and retune should not be necessary but I do understand why it's mentioned.

you measure the ground's DC resistance between the pipes as 2 kOhm. Unfortunately, ground resistance (or rather) impedance is frequency dependent too.  I agree what you wrote to member r2fpl on measuring ground conductivity, it is a complex issue and conductivity may change due to change in the moisture content of the soil etc as znel mentioned.

Yes, I agree, ground impedance needs a special instrument to measure.

I made a video demo of such an Instrument I have access to: https://youtu.be/kCwCf20l6FM

Regarding Tesla, I think he ultimately wished to resonate the entire Earth by the magnifying transmitter for the high efficiency (over 95-96%) energy transfer and this would not involve the Earth's  conductivity in the sense his earlier coil transmitters (by single wire or via air) or your present tests would.

Yes, again, totally agree. Tesla wanted to offer mankind much more then just the AC Grid.
I also agree that ground conductivity was not how Tesla's ultimate technology worked.
I'm only playing with this as a starting point but interestingly enough, just this one wire power transmission is enough to rattle the present EE beliefs.
The magnifying transmitter is beyond belief.

Regards
Luc

Offline Jimboot

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2019, 01:22:59 AM »
http://Https://vizivtechnologies.com commercial transmission co FYI  Using Zenneck waves

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2019, 01:22:59 AM »
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Offline gotoluc

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2019, 02:08:49 AM »
http://Https://vizivtechnologies.com commercial transmission co FYI  Using Zenneck waves

Yes Jimboot, we are well aware of them. However, fact is still 99% of the electrical engineering establishment do not believe what they claim is possible.
It will remain a pipe dream until the day they publicly provide the service they claim.
Even then they'll have to deal with maybe years of 3rd party verification's before "The Establishment" is ready to rewrite the possibility of efficient high power wireless transmission.


Understand that even one wire power transmission is not possible according to "The Establishment"
Any educated engineer will tell you current must have a return path.
So just proving efficient one wire power transmission alone will be quite a feat!!!

Regards
Luc

Offline gotoluc

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2019, 02:26:44 AM »
Two different tests to verify ground rod impedance and ground resistance between the two 10 feet deep copper grounding rods.


Video demo: https://youtu.be/yAzWwAbDpFk


Regards
Luc



 

Offline stivep

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2019, 05:32:48 AM »
It looks  like    you guys didn't read what I  wrote in  here and in
Wesley's  Kapanadze and other FE discussion forum
I'm not so  much  available now to respond as I have  major Jewish holiday,  and that's  few  days.
short note:
1.  you don't much  care what is the resistance of the ground   however it may  help
2.  you  are   not much interested  what is the current in  the ground, however it may  help .
3.  The Goubau line is made  not by use  of single wire  ,but by use of  single wire coated  with  dielectric that creates interface.
     and the line between  two  Tesla coils will work  only if you have  interface.
3a.depends from  frequency it may need   the TAPER as  explained here:
http://jpier.org/PIERM/pierm54/04.16120207.pdf
Capturing Surface Electromagnetic Energy into a DC through Single-Conductor Transmission Line at Microwave Frequencies

3b.  non coated  copper  wire will work as well , but if  it is  not coated  than  role  of  dielectric is taken by air.
And  space between air  and  wire  is called interface   however nobody  tends  to recognize it  this way.
If you  use  air as  dielectric  than   you  have  a lot of losses

4. So how it is that for Goubau  line  you need to  have   wire  that is  coated   with dielectric?
 
Answer: first we  need to  understand  what is interface.:
it is space  or  rather   plane or area  between  two media  with different  dielectric  or conductive properties.
that includes  earth  that now  is  named: LOSSY  CONDUCTIVE MEDIUM.( google it)

examples of   interface:
1-  dielectric and another  dielectric   with different dielectric properties
such as teflon  and  polyamide one on the top of another. The space between  them is your  interface.
for your  eye there is no space but  for EM wave it is.

2-  dielectric and  conductive  medium
such as copper foil( conductive  medium)  and air (dielectric)
Because the surface  of 1ft wide aluminum foil   is  better than  surface  of wire    used in Goubau  line than we have  much less losses if  condition needed for   energy transmission is met.
example of  this interface is here:
https://youtu.be/XOTLfnMOSqQ?t=369

3- lossy conductive  medium and dielectric     
such as  earth  and air.

there are more  types of   interface   and  these interfaces works  little different at different  frequencies.
That means   interface will  always be    the same  interface but  means of  feeding   EM wave  into the interface and out  may be characteristic   to given  frequency range.

Failures:
The failure   of your experiments  can be caused also by:
1. lack of impedance  match.
2. lack of proper  polarization AND BREWSTER  ANGLE - that is done (at its easiest)  by  changing elevation of top capacitor . HV Tesla coil  must be vertical to the  ground 
3. lack of resonance in both  the Tx  and Rx  Tesla coils
4. standing wave is:
Quote
stationary wave, is a wave which oscillates in time but whose peak amplitude profile does not move in space.
so you need to free some   of its energy   and  feed it into interface at right Brewster angle.
5. your two  coil   the  Tx  and Rx system, between two points  A  and B is  reactive   system. 
that means   its capacitive and inductive - (reactive components  )  reactances  will be  the  most    important despite  the   distance between the  points.  (e.g 30m or  30 000 meters  it is always going  to be the same dependency present)

6 .wood is  not  the dielectric for us.
https://youtu.be/XOTLfnMOSqQ?t=412
That  video  shows also the  difference between  dielectric suitable for  us  and  wood  table)
the interface is made by surface of dielectric and air
even  if  there  is  not receiving Tesla coil it is capacitive  coupling
of lightbulb  and my hand -that is my body  as part of resonance circuit

7. improper mode of  your EM wave
That  means that EM wave in its  regular  form  is TEM ( google it)
Your TEM wave in the interface is  now at TM mode-transverse magnetic mode. ( google it)

Note:
 behavior of TEM in Near Field is different  that in Far Field
typically  the  Brewster Angle from Top Capacitor down to Earth  is reaching  Earth at end of Near Field 
However  if   Top  Capacitor  is elevated low above the ground  than distance from  the bottom of  the Tesla Coil to the
point   of line  drown  from Top Capacitor  to the Earth surface   at 65  to 67 degrees  may be shorter than
the end  of Near Field  or it can   "land"  on  Earth( - the lossy conductive medium) at Fresnel Zone
 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fresnel_zone

so the recommended distance between two Tesla Coils the Tx and  Rx at 1.1MHz  is more than  21m
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_and_far_field

Note:
Please understand that  TEM in TM mode is NON-RADIATIVE !!!!!
that means as you are  in  Far Field  you cant  receive  it  in air.
It is not radiating.
Wesley 
 
« Last Edit: September 29, 2019, 04:22:00 PM by stivep »

Offline r2fpl

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Re: Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board
« Reply #44 on: September 29, 2019, 11:54:25 AM »
« Last Edit: September 29, 2019, 04:00:18 PM by r2fpl »

 

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