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Author Topic: Power from repelling magnets  (Read 13936 times)

Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2019, 02:52:31 PM »
I have recovered enough to continue my construction in short spurts. I got the rotors mounted and a stator and find it very tricky to match the attract and repel forces so that movement
is balanced and requires very little effort. I will continue to tweak fine tune it.
I have made about 10 of these Lafonte things and one of the scissors devices I could never
get balanced.

I know magnets vary even in the same batch.
I may have to develop a threaded adjuster to get it right.
Remember I first saw the possibility in Lafonte's ideas 12 years ago and
have made much progress in a month and a half with a very busy schedule
and a heart attack in the middle too. 

The sadist part is no one sees the potential in this enough to even assemble a simple
20 minute Lafonte device. As you might guess I have no place in my life for professional
sports squandered time and money.

Norman


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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2019, 02:52:31 PM »

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2019, 05:49:02 PM »
Ok, i don't understand this Lafonte very well but i think think that neither do others. So what i figure so far. Two magnets are attracted, it needs a greater force to separate them. Then we approach one pole of a bigger magnet to these two magnets from the side. Then sure more interaction goes to interacting with the bigger magnet, and the force to separate two magnets is less. I tried it and my fingers are quite sensitive, i can say the force was 2 times less maybe, not 5 times less as Lafonte says, but i don't exclude that in some configuration it may be 5 times less.

That the bigger magnet approaching and moving away needs no force, i doubt it, the magnetic fields are not ideal and all is never exactly how it theoretically should be. This effect then is also due to magnetic fields being asymmetric, that is having two poles. Show that there is overunity, measure it, this is important, even if it doesn't overcome all the possible friction there, which i think will most likely be the case, nevertheless it's important. Don't try to make continuously moving device, measure whether there is overunity in that effect or not.

So how is it, this?


    N ->              <- S

NNNNNNNNNNNNNN


           <- N S ->
NNNNNNNNNNNNNN


The matter is, very few people here are really capable of research. if you make some thing fully working, then they replicate yes, but it needs research to get there, so there is no use of it. And these few who are, mostly don't do any research, because they cannot afford the time. And there are a large number of possible things to do, so the possibility that two people do the same thing, is almost zero. Thus, in spite a lot of interest, this forum cannot much help the overunity research.

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2019, 04:36:42 PM »
I would just say about that one, maybe it works, maybe it works better, but it is much more difficult to measure, than my design. What concerns mine, one should just add a pressure sensitive resistor and a simple trigger, and that's all that is necessary. If one likes that design, fine but, much more work. To make it such that it can be measured and not dependent on the movement of hand. I don't know of course all the possible variations of Lafonte, maybe some are easier to measure, but overall the design seems to be more complicated, three magnets interacting instead of two, and movements in two directions instead of all on one line. But ok, do it if you prefer, measure it, though more complicated and needs some calculation.

Did you already get pressure sensitive resistors, or anything such? What a thing, changing the distance between magnets in an adjustable way? Quite a bit to do, but if you work with nuts and bolts, different from pieces of mounting tape as i did, then it may be possible, pressure and force can be measured at different distances, and work calculated as one may figure.

One good thing to know though, there may be more than one possibilities for overunity with permanent magnets, maybe. Before i knew only my solution, i don't know anything else that has any measured overunity either, even when done by hand. Would be great if this would be the second of course.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2019, 04:36:42 PM »
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Offline Floor

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2019, 08:34:35 PM »
@ Norman6538

Glad your all right  and back at it.

 floor

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2019, 03:47:30 PM »
This experiment can be done without anything at all, one just needs magnets and force sensing resistors (pressure sensitive resistors), something like these  https://www.ebay.com/itm/Resistive-Film-Pressure-Sensor-Flexible-Force-Sensitive-Resistor-for-Robot/362699404305?hash=item547291b411:m:mwYkv3D5OqYdTTZXeo6MeeQ . Energy is force multiplied by a distance. A sum of small distances and forces at these distances, is a good enough approximation. Force sensitive resistors should be calibrated, like using a known weight with an area equal to the area of the magnet, see what resistance corresponds to that

I tried to find a video of measuring magnets with force sensing resistors, i couldn't find any, many videos about how to use force sensing resistors. So when doing only that, that's something not talked about, and easy to make a video about something there are no other videos about. Something new to go into, and at that it's rather simple.

This is a video about force sensing resistors  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTO3U-0Njtw . One really needs only a multimeter, but it's not linear. I don't really know, never tried these things, which ones to use, how accurate they are, etc, Just telling all i know. It were a joy to work with these things, if i could afford the time, i see with regret the wonderful things that i'm missing.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2019, 03:47:30 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #20 on: August 24, 2019, 02:33:55 PM »
My recovery has had some setbacks but I expect to make progress during the next week.
I have to move up to a small bicycle wheel to get the precision needed to get an accurate measurement.

My full health diagnosis is not complete yet but I expect that to come this week after
more tests.

Norman

Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2019, 10:04:07 PM »
I'm quasi functioning again in less than low gear but I have all the parts made and ready to mount and adjust/weak. I have a break all day tomorrow so expect to have a report tomorrow if my health does not fall apart. I have better adjustability but the repel is very tricky to get right on.

Norman

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2019, 10:04:07 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2019, 04:36:30 PM »
I made a very interesting discovery today. I could not physically align and zero balance the magnets and I suspected that the repel spin had something to do with it. When the attracting magnets on the left would pull the rotor but not align physically then when I pushed the left past the alignment point it found a magnetic balance spot where it took little to move in either direction. Then when I pushed it past that sweet spot the repel took over and kicked the rotor on clockwise.  That spin is why my pendulum only works when the magnetic polarity is correct.

That will affect all of my research - back to the drawing board.

Norman

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2019, 05:52:19 PM »
I think you are trying to go too complex. Trying to make it continuously rotating, you just cannot chop it through. I also made my experiment with a full circle of magnets later. In theory it was supposed to continuously have overunity, but really, the poles tilted in unknown ways, all became very complex and impossible to control, and all was against the wanted effect. And complex, the difference was only having a whole circle of magnets, very simple configuration, but very complex things happening.

This is why i say, trying to make it to continuously rotate is not an easy solution to the problem, and thus not the right thing to do. I said, try to do measurements instead, in the simplest configuration, measure whether there is overunity. Measure the simplest Lafonte effect. Very important, as much as i know, no one has done it yet. Get the force sensitive resistors as i referred to, measure the force at every distance, at two different distances from the bigger magnet. Then do the calculations, calculating the energy for both is very easy, high school physics, once you have these measurements. Mostly try how to measure force with force sensitive resistors, they are really pressure sensitive resistors. I think they would be precise enough, they are cheap so should be tried first, or more advanced pressure sensors should be used.

It is a problem, too many want an easy solution, showing it constantly rotating is great of course, and no need for measurements and calculations. But this always ends with, trying one way, then another way, then another, no result, and a lot of work, may be not for each case separately, but all together a lot of work. Instead of doing the research, methodically, starting from the simplest, measure, calculate. In spite that it sounds a nuisance and too much work, it is really much less work, that certainly has a result, positive or negative, but at least one can see for certain how the things are.

Get a multimeter, costs $4 something, ways to get it free, it measures resistance. Get a few alligator wires, cheap also. Get pressure sensors like resistors.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2019, 05:52:19 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2019, 06:59:35 PM »
Thanks ayeaye, If you look at my work in the past it is always crude and basic and simple. I am not trying rotation - Yes it is a rotor but I am only trying to measure the power in and out using the rotor with weights lifted and dropped.

I am thinking through this. One way is to go 3D in a way similar to Floor.
Leedskalnin said that either the N or S pole pushes more iron fileings up than the other.

And remember we still do know really know what magnetic fields are. We use them and know their characteristics but do not really know what they are.

Norman

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2019, 07:18:56 PM »
Just start from measuring the simplest thing, the simplest Lafonte effect. But measure the energies completely, in joules.

What magnets are. Likely they are just dipoles, that is atoms. Electrons rotating the same direction, they attract, opposite directions, they repulse, like the Ampere law. Read my other threads here, even about how induction works. That all that really exist, are the electrostatic forces, magnetism is a dynamic effect.

Why they have overunity, well why don't the electrons fall to the nucleus, in spite they do work?

Go a bit ahead, get a multimeter, i say multimeter is fun.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2019, 07:18:56 PM »
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Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #26 on: September 04, 2019, 03:35:25 PM »
I'm still running in 1st gear but I finished another version than has an axle off center so it self attracts and it measures 400%. But I think the best will be the linear version and I started it today and expect to finish in 2 days if I have enough strength.

Norman

Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2019, 03:10:42 AM »
In the past few days I have made major discoveries and now get 600% out.. with 2 vertical aproaching - not rotor/stator Lafonte's  but the repel is stronger than the attract so the repel mag sare not aligned to make them weaker....and its very sensitive to adjust and even then the forces  are not symmetrical because approaching and leaving switch between attract and repel.
Who - da - ever thunk it?

Now I need to scale it up and feed output back to the input.

Norman
 
 
 

Offline ayeaye

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #28 on: September 09, 2019, 11:52:06 AM »
Who - da - ever thunk it?

Can you anyhow show that it is 600%, or how much it is? This is the only thing that matters now.

Offline norman6538

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Re: Power from repelling magnets
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2019, 01:50:31 PM »
ayeaye - I can but I'm more interested in scaling up. Remember I use weight down vs weight up x distance so that measurement cannot be disputed.

Norman

 

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