Problem is when you have a f.e machine and you do not patent it. Sombody will come around and claim the idea as theirs and do patent it and stop all progress on the thing. You can't do a thing because they have the patent, and are sitting on it.This is true but expensive. It should be enough simply to disclose your work. It will then become "prior art", and will cause the next person's patent to fail.
What you can do is:
Invent a f.e device. Patent it. BUT be fully transparant in the patent. Discribe everything. So people can fully and without hidden stuff replicate it completely. In that way a patent can become a worldwide available and free instuction manual for all.
open source? only usefull for peer review and getting the technology to those that will use it. other than that it's a failure as a way of getting rich. no one will buy the product if you give the technology away. IMHO! ::)
open source? only usefull for peer review and getting the technology to those that will use it. other than that it's a failure as a way of getting rich. no one will buy the product if you give the technology away. IMHO! ::)
open source? only usefull for peer review and getting the technology to those that will use it. other than that it's a failure as a way of getting rich. no one will buy the product if you give the technology away. IMHO! ::)
actually a lot of people buy open source tech and depend on it. how do you think the internet got here? http://catb.org/~esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
open source? only usefull for peer review and getting the technology to those that will use it. other than that it's a failure as a way of getting rich. no one will buy the product if you give the technology away. IMHO! ::)
Given the choice, I think that most folks would rather shell out a few bucks and be done with it instead of attempt to build something themselves. Not many of these folks would even care to know how it works as long as they knew they were saving money in the long run. 12:00 ;)
well I'm going to test this theory. i'm going directly into manufacturing and selling my generators. gotta love ebay.That sounds like a very good possibility. I would rather ebay a 'working' item rather than mess around trying to decipher a patent (or online babblings) only to have it fail after weeks of work.. Been there.. Done that.. No fun.. Case in point is the numerous replications of Steven Mark's TPU without an apparent working replication. A lot of interesting results but I see no light bulbs being lighted (for more than a few seconds) after more than a year of various tries by various people. Sure it may work but chances are it is missing that one little key that no one is going to find. If Steven Mark's (or anyone else for that matter) had workings TPU's on ebay I think a lot of people (including myself) would be buying one. Yes I may eventually be able to build one but if I can buy one for a reasonable amount of money then why bother. Open sourcing can make a person money if they want to work for it. Looking forward to your ebay listing to see what you have. Later, Tom :)
are you referring to the guy that hacked NASA? http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1124.0.html
Maybe the best reason of open source Vs. Patenting can be read here
http://www.web-space.tv/free-energy/D7.pdf
scroll down about half way down (page 19) where it starts talking about Patents and the patent secrecy act and what happens if you have a very useful patent. Very interesting reading.
http://www.web-space.tv/free-energy/D7.pdfIt is some sort of German site. First time each day you will have to go down to the bottom highlited link and click on it.
Quotehttp://www.web-space.tv/free-energy/D7.pdfIt is some sort of German site. First time each day you will have to go down to the bottom highlited link and click on it.
The main page is
http://www.web-space.tv/free-energy
and the first time each day you will have to go to the bottom of that advertising page and click the link. There are a lot of interesting pages from the main page. Someone else on this form pointed this link out to me. It has been very interesting reading all the different PDF's. Later...
Hi FreeEnergy
I came up with an idea the other day that I'm willing to share with you and/or Stefan that could be worth 0 to millions of $$$ I have no plans of promoting this. If you are interested or know someone who is, I'll PM you the info. and you can do whatever you want with it.
The reason I'm doing this is that If any money is made from it, it could be used to help people who run into a little trouble like Jack H. or other members who need a helping hand. Just need a trusted member to handle this and I think you or Stefan can do it.
Regards
Dave
PS This is 100% free. Nothing in it for me
is there a license out there that is qualified as "free and open source" for patenting a machine?
I Will,
Open source, won't come under patent fires,, where as Patenting it is like hey you ill take that off you,you did not patent it, now read about the hypocrites talking about saveing the planet.
watch useing technology to destory the planet = http://youtube.com/watch?v=NrERPOBMO04 ,
also watch, deprave the world of food and useing gm to poision it even more to make people even more sick > http://youtube.com/watch?v=JdvhNnM850w
One problem my friend, if I see what you design, and I have money, then I get my lawyers to patent it, that I sue you into the stone age(and everyone you sold plans to).
One problem my friend, if I see what you design, and I have money, then I get my lawyers to patent it, that I sue you into the stone age(and everyone you sold plans to). Then I change it a bit so it doesn't quite work show that product, no one has faith in it and it disappears. 7 years of slander and mystique put it out of the main stream, and that is about it. If you the original inventor decide to build it after the 7 years, I just threaten you and your family, heck I might even do something more than scare you. Or just buy you off, cough(Steven mark(s)). Its a game of chess and one doesn't win chess by making one winning move its a series of moves that leads up to that one move and keeping your opponent from seeing your end goal.
One problem my friend, if I see what you design, and I have money, then I get my lawyers to patent it, that I sue you into the stone age(and everyone you sold plans to). Then I change it a bit so it doesn't quite work show that product, no one has faith in it and it disappears. 7 years of slander and mystique put it out of the main stream, and that is about it. If you the original inventor decide to build it after the 7 years, I just threaten you and your family, heck I might even do something more than scare you. Or just buy you off, cough(Steven mark(s)). Its a game of chess and one doesn't win chess by making one winning move its a series of moves that leads up to that one move and keeping your opponent from seeing your end goal.
documentation can be manipulated, and the inventor will, has always, lost and exhausted his monetary supply to fight. Look at all of the examples in the last hundred years, Tesla, the inventor of so much (including radio) had his patent taken until it suited the government to give it back after he was dead. Just go through and read about anyone who comes up with an idea that might actually work, there is a short list of what happens to them, whether they patent it or not. But what can be said is that none of them are around to discuss a darn thing, are they? And if they are even said to be alive, good luck finding them. If you guys want to discuss the possible outcomes of patenting or opening it up, lets do it sighting examples.
Heres example #1 for patenting, Stan Meyer. Need I say more? O.K. I will Tom Ogle. I can go on.
An example of no patents, oh wait some major company patented it, and the inventor is gone and broke. So that leads to #3
Patents owned by large companies/government that bury the info. Steven Mark(s),Tesla etc.
Just look at the history of the moves and the pattern will arise. Once you see the pattern, then you will see that 99.9% of the moves are covered.
People generally have two motives for building O/u or even efficient new power sources, MONEY, or for the general good of mankind. From there the choices of the individuals are easy to predict, and therefore easy to defeat.
Pardon, but was not,several months before, an announcement about a chinese
inventor(P.R.C) of a motor/generator concept ?
Who also wish to donate the concept to the U.N. ?
Such kind of public "attack" can, under "worlwide press watch" security ,save the concept and the inventor !
S
dL
p.s.: "sacrifice", sacer/sacerdote/sacrificium
ring_theory,do you know that Jesus Christus,human,had been positioned to be
GOD-same by (now) "holy" Imperator and "helios"(SUN-GOD) Konstantin !?
One Imperator with two religions ! And also known as murder !
And so If I were to share with this forum, could say a company or corp. use it as it would now be out in the open?
It wont happen, and its no where NOW.
The argument is over my friends, ALL would be patent holders are worried about the open source money loss side of it. Well empirical cases prove that thats NOT the case. Open source can get renumeration, and its the only way to get safety and ENSURE (read that again) dissemination. I don't want to hear that others are different with patenting as they have no technology out there, where is it? be out next week?.Sorry. Its no where. Steron is no where, Steven Ryan is no where, EBM is no where(these are modern cases with technology already ready to market and patented) Why are you the patent holders different? you will do some thing different then they did? LOL Sorry you can do nothing they didn't do.
The argument is over about not being able to make money from open source.Ossie Freedom did that with a very crappy booster (water4gas) he open sourced it and now makes 3-4 million per year in book sales.If i need to explain WHY a patent limits the inventor then i am afraid the patent holder is not of sound mental mind.
For what ever reason the patent holder with free energy technology may feel
Open source can get you money
Open source IS THE ONLY SECURITY (given the nature of free energy technology politically)
Open source gets out in REAL TIME
So whats the excuse? there is none.
Ash
I am confused. You are citing examples of Steorn and EBM, which have produced nothing because they have nothing. It is not a patent issue, it is an inablitiy-to-produce issue.
Interestingly, there is an equal amount of open-source working free energy devices - zero.
Problem is when you have a f.e machine and you do not patent it. Sombody will come around and claim the idea as theirs and do patent it and stop all progress on the thing. You can't do a thing because they have the patent, and are sitting on it.
What you can do is:
Invent a f.e device. Patent it. BUT be fully transparant in the patent. Discribe everything. So people can fully and without hidden stuff replicate it completely. In that way a patent can become a worldwide available and free instuction manual for all.
Right on!
Unfortunately I have to agree with you.
But what is the recourse?
Having as many devices as you can afford build in China or in countries not dictated to by you know who?
then have them flood the Market.
Only problem is you will not be able to import these devices.
Get rid of the "You know who" is the only solution that I can see,besides keeping your invention to yourself .
Professor
quote author=d3adp00l link=topic=1821.msg32727#msg32727 date=1180326419]
One problem my friend, if I see what you design, and I have money, then I get my lawyers to patent it, that I sue you into the stone age(and everyone you sold plans to). Then I change it a bit so it doesn't quite work show that product, no one has faith in it and it disappears. 7 years of slander and mystique put it out of the main stream, and that is about it. If you the original inventor decide to build it after the 7 years, I just threaten you and your family, heck I might even do something more than scare you. Or just buy you off, cough(Steven mark(s)). Its a game of chess and one doesn't win chess by making one winning move its a series of moves that leads up to that one move and keeping your opponent from seeing your end goal.
@utilitarian
Would U please give us some more solid examples of working FE devices getting to --- zero?
Are those technical issues or personal issues?
I assume open source always give immediate positive educational effects for general public on tech ideas and info.
Would that be considered overall as a better human achievement !?
Hang on i remember you, i remember you usually make allot of incredulous assumptions and have no real contribution's, i remember you now
They have a physical device, go and see it and read the reports. its more then you have
Way more then you have.
i have no need or desire to discuss particulars with you, as now i remember you, my time is far more precious
You like that one?
I do
Regards
Ash
Howdy Y'all,
The patent system is a very clever deception. On the surface it is a way for inventors to protect their inventions and deliver the profits to the people who deserve them. But the underlying mechanism is to control technologies entering the market. When the powers that be see technologies moving through the patent office that they do not want in the public domain they can stop the technologies there before they enter the public domain. The patent system is really an insidious way of controlling technology and keeping beneficial technology out of the hands of the people that could benefit from it. It is a very evil deception...
Blessed Be...
No, Wrong, You haven't been to the EBM lab and seen the 10 tone device and or tested it and or understand how much they charge for their device. I do.I can see AGAIN that you have no idea of the situation. First you should of gone there your self to find out how much they are charging to use their device and license it.Think people give away a ten tone device to use for normal money?, LOL, your allot dumber then i thought. You think you can just purchase one for a few 1000 dollars? The point is, your incredulous assumptions are not based on any experience, and your avid skeptic guesses are in now way a contribution much like your R and D attitude i see. I hope you learn and better your self soon and contribute.
I noticed how you conveniently do not know of a single company licensing the EBM technology or using an EBM device to power anything. I guess their price is so high no one can afford it? Maybe they ought to come down, what do you think?
>conventiently
Its spelled conveniently
I noticed how you dont know a single thing about the Patent office,REAL case files, EBM and i cant find your R and D any where.
> I guess
Yes these guessing of yours need not be, there is enough HARD facts to show you the benefits of OPEN source against Patenting.
That is self evident what you asked me
One question. When is the last time you have heard of a company, any company, file a patent lawsuit to prevent someone else from manufacturing a free energy device?
Compare that to the normal amount of patent lawsuits out there. Keep in mind how a patent lawsuit comes about:
1. Someone is using a technology, usually to make money.
2. Someone else says, "Aha, that technology is close to my technology"
3. That someone else sues.
Notice how that is not happening here.
Howdy Utilitarian,
As far as I can tell free energy patents never make it through the patent office, so there is nothing to sue over...
pity...
Blessed be...
You missed the boat.
The Patent doesn't get that far, and if it does, its still vulnerable to other weaknesses, not only this , its the method of DISCLOSING IT, which is what the metaphor for the patent is, where as open sourcing allows security and ensures dissemination, and also as we prove again this is stated to remind every one, can still make money. The point he was making, is the FREE ENERGY patent doesn't get that far, in marketing, in manufacture, and at OTHER levels, look at the document i posted.Plus it opens up un necessary interference from other factions, not only this, but many other things.
Therefore, with FREE ENERGY technology, the scales still favor open source
.....
Things are slightly different TODAY, but ask Jack Hildenbrand and read this NEW page on the subject.
http://panacea-bocaf.org/howtheywentwrong.htm
ask what would of happened if JACK at least licensed/open sourced it like Ossie Freedom.
He could of made money, he thought other wise
Now Jack Hildenbrand.is a victim to the patent office
Ash
LMAO
I don't care if it was too serious, It still turned out funny.
A smile is the only unregulated freedom we have. ;D
The return on humour is inversely proportional to the supply of misunderstanding among free energy researchers... I think. :)
If a person creates something that increases the productive power produced by our species the inventor will be paid in the long run because more power produced lowers the price of power while purchasing power increases because power reduces the costs of producing everything.
Someone withholding the knowledge by which more power can be produced so as to profit from that scarcity of knowledge is no different than the oil company and monetary currency company profiteers who withhold the free flow of power so as to profit by that scarce supply of power. How about knowing something before spouting off your mouth concerning what you think someone is saying when in fact you miss the point entirely?
In today?s business world inventors can work the open source business model and in so doing the inventor gains positive feedback as an inventor. To suggest that a powerless inventor can somehow gain enough power to enforce a patent by which the inventor can fend off all criminal powers that are exerted in the effort to take credit, take patent ?rights?, and falsify any sense of reasonable justice is to ignore current reality.
@ Joe Kelley
You defiantly speak like a southern lawyer. And as usual no one out side the courts and those in collage can understand it.
Thanks z.monkey for some clarification.
PS my wife is studying for para legal. And we have allot of fun with the way things have to be written for legal purposes. It is almost like two languages. So as a party of the second part, I render the floor. LOL
I have an open source experiment for y'all
I invented a political/economic LAW and I call this law Joe's Law. I tried to get Wikipedia to publish it; however that effort failed.
The political/economic LAW is my discovery; the words describing the political/economic Law are my invention.
The reason why this open source experiment is being offered in this thread could become obvious to the reader as the reader works on the open source experiment.
Someone, or many people, suggest that open source won?t make someone rich and the alternative is to patent an invention so as to get rich as the patent enforces the elimination of competitors who re-produce the item that is under the patent enforcement mechanism.
Once the reader becomes familiar with the political/economic LAW (as it exists in reality) their notions of patent enforcement may change.
utilitarian,
I have already specifically agreed with the perception that patent enforcement has its place and use. Who wants to do away with patent protection? Who do you not agree with concerning that someone who thinks that ?we should do away with patent protection?
unilitarian,
Your impression may be accurate. I am hard-headed concerning accurate data being better than ambiguous data. Do you desire ambiguity? I do not.
My personal experience includes inventions. In my line of work (when I was working in my line of work) many situations demanded invention, it was a daily thing. I could do what a lot of other workers did and stop working when faced with a demand for invention. In that way I could get paid for sitting, until a boss showed up to invent a way out of the situation that demanded invention.
I can be much more specific concerning my specific inspirations concerning invention.
If you have a specific example concerning your viewpoint on patent enforcement as being a means of increasing invention, then please consider discussing that specific example; otherwise the discussion isn?t specific ? rather, it is ambiguous.
Should I do the common thing and simply ?believe? that your viewpoint is true despite my own personal experience that suggests that your viewpoint is unsupported?
AB Hammer,
I am not a mind reader. When you ask for that which protects I am unable to know what it is that you suggest is attacking or injuring Open Source or anything.
What is the protection or defense aimed at?
What is threatening?
What is it that is being protected against?
What is it that is the cause, need, or demand for protection?
Example:
A rubber is a protection device employed to protect the egg from the sperm.
What is the sperm in this case where a rubber is needed for protection against it?
Is the rubber used to protect against aids?
Is it aids or sperm?
What exactly is it that concerns you to a point whereby you see the need for protection?
++++++++
Bear in mind as a proponent of a new "law", the burden is on you to support it, not on anyone else to disprove it.
++++++++
utilitarian,
You obviously misunderstand my viewpoint. Joe?s Law is merely a way of describing physical and psychological reality. The relationship is what it is, I merely describe it.
If you, I, or anyone thinks that my description is inaccurate the fact that the relationship exists doesn?t change. I see no need to support or disprove the relationship described by Joe?s Law. It exists even if I don?t see it; conversely it won?t vanish if I ignore it.
I have chosen to use cheap materials only, in this demonstration, because the need to bring down production costs, and make it possible to build this type of wave generation device, any where in the world, and with local materials, as car parts etc, which doesn't needs to be imported. Other materials could of course be used, and the schematics for its design of course, be different. Simple is better, it is said, and fewer parts, and bearings, will bring lower cost of building, and also repair.
We can here see energy content in waves, The numbers means kW per hour, and meters of wave. South America, 97 kW per meter of wave, for example, that means, a Wavereaper? device, which is 100 meters broad, would generate 9.7 mw, cost would be around 1200 000 Dollar, for that device. However, the revenue would be over 400 000 dollars monthly with current energy price.
You protect your inventions that do not work but I should tell you a story long in the running...
The story of the poor mans patent...
This is what you do sir you first send your idea in a tamper proof envelope to yourself in the mail be sure it is post marked... And also sign for it.
Do not I repeat do not open this as you will need it sealed tamper proof and sent to you....
If you take this evidence to court I say you have an 80% chance that you will win your lawsuit and claim the rights to the patent.
This is what I like to consider a poor mans patent but I was told this worked for a few people through the years.
Take extra steps as well if you feel nessacary have it notorized on the back of the envolope that it was sealed on a certain date.
Surley you will win without a doubt then get you an attorney that does not get payed unless they win.
Yes it is stacked against the poor thats when you get out your trick deck...
Pay 75bux and copywright a book with the full details in it including possible spin offs ...
Deny the proof of the library of congress I highly doubt that will happen.
Yes it was song writers that did the envolope thing that is correct.
But lets see a fraud with the library of congress then show me one.
A patent will be circumvented just as easily... With a modification.
-infringer-
Yes it is stacked against the poor thats when you get out your trick deck...
Pay 75bux and copywright a book with the full details in it including possible spin offs ...
Deny the proof of the library of congress I highly doubt that will happen.
Yes it was song writers that did the envolope thing that is correct.
But lets see a fraud with the library of congress then show me one.
A patent will be circumvented just as easily... With a modification.
-infringer-
You confuse copyright with patent. A sealed envelope may offer some protection in a copyright case, but not with a patent. With inventions, the only thing that will protect you is a patent. And a patent is more than just you coming up with the idea and writing it down. A patent examiner has to review it for originality, non-obviousness, and other things. Whether or not you agree with the patent process, it is all you have to protect you. If you do not bother to go through with it and pay the price of a patent as far as time and money, then you pass up all protection for your invention.
And yes, many patents can be circumvented, but many cannot. Many patents are worthless, but some are worth quite a bit.
>So, there is no way to prevent patenting of our workYou can't do the same in countries like Spain or Argentine. In this last case, the law protects the inventor if has made public his work, for at least one year before. No more... In other words: you have maximum one year for start the process of registration; if you don't started, any other has right over that work, no matter who invented, but is just matter that it is an invention, that is all.
GO and try and get a patent on LINUX. Go watch them laugh at you. The same is for the case of free energy technology when released in the public domain.
This is LAW also
Ash
a lawyer would be a good idea here. But I doubt if there is any who would ever be interested in helping out people with no real regard for themselves first.
So in spain it would seem that the best thing to do would be to do this. Post all data and info of the device, put on there a notice that you are pursuing a patent, but if anyone would like to build the device for their own use they are more than welcome. If anyone is interested in building the device for business they must contact you and get permission. From there you have 1 year to get the patent, and then you can continue an outsource type license setup, with people who ask for permission and agree to the idealogy of the agreement. Don't take money in exchange for the use, as that would entitle the person giving you money a vested interest in the device. Stipulate that if they are in the business of making the device and selling it for a profit then they must pay you royalties, and they are restricted on the profit and markup percentages they can use. You can determine what is fair and reasonable profit and markup. but if they are not in a business model, then they are exept from royalities.
Since no corporation will agree with the spirit of such terms then you can reject their license application.
This would keep the prices from getting out of control, would prefer smaller businesses over huge corporations (who see a limit on profitablity as evil), and allows for the device to proliferate in such a way that only peoples ability to make the device will limit.
Read about this link,
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheCallToArms/message/1066 (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TheCallToArms/message/1066)
below if you do not want to click link,
listmembers, look at the rotor-verter
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=- (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-)
6905677911913482159&q=rotoverter
http://panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm (http://panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm)
Roto -Verter
This page is intended to support panaceas open sourced RV communities
and
HECTOR the inventor of the RV whom is also open sourced and working
together
with panacea's
public research and development team.
*This page is intended to further substantiate the available OPEN
SOURCED
FREE ENERGY research and development potential we the public have to
develop
towards de centralized energy systems when our community acts
collectively.*
Note- members of the public not poised in this advanced field, *might
find
the following subject matter a bit hard to comprehend*. This will
change
when the the research and development centre is granted. I Ashtweth
have
done my best to present the organization's findings in as much
LAYMEN'S
context as possible.
I (Ashtweth) started out as a laymen and was not poised in this field
or
even educated in the trade of consensus realities 'electricity'. Thus
I
am the same as the majority of the public reading this, I had to
learn the
hard way by years of study, i have attempted to convey this
information into
as much of a laymen's comprehensible presentation as possible.
The Replicated proof of principle in the RV was done by panacea to
provide
the public with energy saving awareness/applications in* a non profit
role.*And for an evaluation towards submission of the device for ZPE
education and
testing research and development in panaceas R and D centre.
As a result of panacea's replications, the non profit organization
have also
complied technical thesis on the Roto Verter donated by the engineers
working on the RV. For complete detailed education, facts and
verification
and construction please consult the following compilations.
1)RV energy saving research and
development<http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RV%20energy%20saving%
20applications%20and%20R%20and%20D.pdf>
(2MB, PDF)
2)Advanced RV research and development
3) RE-OU -v6 <http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/RE-OU-v6.pdf> (1.9MB,
PDF)
The RV is currently an alternative energy device being utilized by
open
sourced engineers around the world as an energy saver and to
transform and
understand ZPE when configured in looped mode via a resonance
extraction.
*The RV principle is a far superior energy saving device which can
serve the
public immediately in various efficient energy saving applications.
Please*
*consult the RV energy saving document and support the inventor or
help
panacea support the inventor and the open sourced engineers who made
it
possible for this awareness to reach the public*.
Panacea has just launched replicated results of the RV's energy
savings.
Baldors motors and drives Australia have just sponsored panacea and
generously donated two motors towards helping promote the RV as the
most
efficient 1-2 HP electric motor in the world. The RV's energy savings
applications will save the public energy and money. Please consult
this
panacea promotional press release for further details.
Baldors Launches energy
savings!<http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/Baldors%20launches%20energy%
20saving.pdf>
The following information and replications involving the RV will be
divided
into two separate sections explaining and demonstrating the RV in the
role
of ZPE research and in an energy savings role.
Background
The inventor Hector is an *open sourced* *energy* engineer and
explains that
For ZPE and LOOPING, the process involved in the RV's energy saving
power
management is vital to further demonstrate over-unity (explanation
below).
With current electric motors wasting energy by their Inefficient
design,
engineering ZPE transformation is out of reach. The RV is an R&D tool
designed to work with those issues in power management to find
solutions and
applications for ZPE engineering design.
ZPE technology once perfected and developed is of the highest
efficiency as
it employs a condition of *over unity*. Technically OU is defined by
Hector
the inventor as:
Over unity is a *high efficiency* condition via *energy transformation
principles* which enables a system to *transform energy* from *ZPE*
and out
put *more* energy than is required to maintain the whole process. One
way to
create over unity is demonstrated in the replicated proof of
principle in
the RV.
Technically the RV is explained by the: Roto-conversion RV effect: A
Way to
operate a motor at HI impedances with a lower reflective power loss
at idle
mode. Working similar to a POWER transformer but on Electrical to
mechanical
conversion.
Resulting in a HI EFF performance and under some conditions (*OU-over
unity)
due to the resonance-magnetic amplification and other quantifiable
phenomena
related to ENERGY TRANSFORMATION from the ambient*. Radiant Energy: =
(AC in
RF [radio frequency] mode)
Below is an example from the inventor showing the out put in the
generators
side exceeding the input in the motors input side using vectoring
capacitors
and electrical resonance principles.
Pictured above is two three phase motors configured to run in RV
mode.-
Photo courtesy of Hector.
On the *right side* of the picture is the generator with its meter
figure
showing an out put of *203 volts with 5.1 amps of current*. This
figure
exceeds the input current (left hand side) of *119.8 volts and 8
amps* of
current needed to sustain the resonant action. This is possible via
the
electrical to mechanical transformation.
From this picture one can see what is regarded as *reactive power*
operating
in the RV.* It is possible to extract this power into a condition
that is
non reflective to the source, or input side*. To date Hector has done
this
in a looped configuration which he has since disclosed on the
internet.
Hector Describes Looped systems are real using non reflective
fractional
resonant power Extraction or ballun compensated direct tensor loading.
Hector has also offered laymen's methods and solutions using his split
capacitors diode resonant systems (plug) to split power dividers to
EXTRACT
non reflective power. Additionally the open sourced engineers working
with
panacea have upgraded circuits and design concepts which incorporate
certain
power switching circuits to make this *EXCESS Energy* usable.
Several versions of these configurations are on the R and D' design
board'.
*Resources and R and D equipment which panacea will to provide from a
public
granted situation in the commissioned research and development centre
will
play a major role in enabling this technology to be developed and
owned/used
by the public*.
*The RV is public knowledge (open sourced) and cannot be patented or
regulated. Thus once perfected and developed is public free energy*.
The RV is Statutory Public copyright (Other Rights Apply) local and
international (Publication) of a Scientific discovery called Roto
conversion
Effect.
Through independent replication The RV has showed potential for
various
energy transformation principles towards over unity research and
development
which Include, magnetic amplification, radiant energy and stochastic
resonance (ZPE).
Norman Wooten an open sourced energy engineer was the first to report
the
RV's potential of magnetic amplification with a coupled generator to
demonstrating an *over unity capacity *in his 2001 test.
Norman Wooten- courtesy of keelynet.com
In his test Norman coupled this PMI Kollmorgen U12M4/9AF4T Servo Disc
DC
Motor to a three phase motor wired to run in RV mode. The RV was used
as the
'prime mover' motor to drive the the PMI disk as a generator
The PMI Kollmorgen U12M4/9AF4T Servo Disc DC Motor which was used as
the
generator to extract OU.
Here is a summery of Norms results quoted from his internet
disclosure on Mon,
25 Feb 2002 ? on the Keel net forum.
Quote:
*I loaded the DC generator with 160-watt incandescent lamp load.
Since I
have two independent systems here, one being driven with 120VAC line
input
and the other system a belt driven DC generator being loaded with pure
resistive load. Here are the numbers: Motor was retuned for minimum
current
draw which required 45 mfd, 370V oil filled cap with a resulting
current
draw of .15 amps @ 120VAC input. *
*The independent generator put out .75 amps @ 74 VDC into a resistive
load.
The only thing that needs to be looked at on the input side of the
equation
is the power factor of the AC input. I need to look at the current/
voltage
phase relationship. I'm satisfied with the figures that I calculate
which
shows roughly
18 watts AC input
with a DC output of 55.5 watts.
What I find most interesting is the fact that the more load you put
on the
3-phase motor the lower the input current draw and the motor gets
colder.
The belt driven DC generator gets quite hot after about 30 minutes of
running time. Go figure it out. I believe there is a lot to be
learned about
revolving magnetic fields in 3 phase motors and tuning the output via
capacitors. This experiment is so easy to do everyone should
seriously look
at this phenomenon.*
-End quote
*As you can conceive* *this shows premise for further investigation
into
running motors and generators in RV mode.*
One engineer's interpretation is that the resonance and magnetic
amplification is transforming ZPE. Another's is that the factors
contributing to the input dropping when the load is being increased
is due
to the electrical resonance effects impedance of the
AC line AC input.
Hectors has also extracted *over unity* from the RV and made a video
showing
his results. Here is a screen shot of the video which he used to
light up a
1000 watt light bulb. Below is the input figure shown needed to
transform
energy from the RV's electrical to mechanical transformation to light
up a
1000 watt light bulb.
Taken from the video showing a 60 hertz Aluminium motor 7.5HP 3PH
230/460
184TCH(frame) US MOTOR coupled to an identical motor acting as a
generator
in RV mode lighting up a 1000watt bulb
Taken from the video showing the input from the motors draw.
Taken form the video, the purpose of the close up is to observe the
bulb *lit
to full brightness.
*
The RV also shows proof in the potential to develop and understand
*zero
point energy* when used in the configuration of *looped or self
running mode
*. Below is a picture of the first confirmed test from the inventor
Hector
looping the RV and disclosing the principles involving *ZPE*.
Pictured above is Hector operating two three phase motors used to
illustrate
the Disclosed internet Schematic of the RV in a loop mode (self
running). In
loop mode the RV is charging the battery that's powering the prime
mover
motor and still out putting more energy than is required to run the
motor.
The RV looped schematic has been given by hector to the public open
sourced
for public knowledge and to thwart cartels from patenting and
suppressing
it.
This looped sequence involves transformers (unseen in picture) which
represent the down grading of voltage from the generators resonating
circulating output current. The transformer primary , secondary , plus
battery with one transistor and a few extra parts of Capacitors,
Diode ridge
,resistors , mica caps , & more diodes (blocking) where all it took
hector
to close the loop on the battery.
The closed loop is described by Hector as being achieved from the
Impedance
matching (Amplitude) of the resonant generators output elements
relative to
the batteries input amperage. This can also be further understood by
RF
(radio frequency) engineering practice. Hector parallels the RV's OU
to RF
practice where he is creating (current) nodes from standing waves
present in
the resonant media of the alternator which involve interface behavior
of
stochastic resonance from the thermal ambient back round noise (ZPE).
Quote: *System gain comes from stochastic resonance and ZPE** as the
magnetic latching occurs within the core-wire LCR components of the
motor
and its capacitor driven rotary 3PH fields, in resonance, the time-
energy
decay is the only energy you require to replenish at to maintain it.
The
energy from stochastic resonance within the LC tank components drains
energy
from the "thermal" signature of the ZPE and K thermodynamic-
thermoelectric
ambient heat (electron spin).
This is a full disclosure of an operational and tested device, system
is
made of standard off shelve items, tuning is made by changing
capacitor
values and the proper selection of standard items for its
construction, 3PH
motors, 10:1 12V or 5:1 24V transformers with the proper core and
winding
values (standard) off shelve, diode bridges capacitor (all standard).
It
requires extreme knowledge in RF systems and electromagnetic resonance
engineering*. -hector end Quote.
The inventor and open sourced engineers descried are like Tesla and
Schauberger,
great humanitarians who have offered this open source technology and
education *for humanity to advance*. Hector has published the looped
schematic and made the plans available to any body wishing to
replicate over
the internet.
The issue of replication of the looped design however is
*complicated* and
so far to achieve this advanced level, Hector is needed to be
recruited into
an R and D environment to offer his education and to follow through
with the
public disclosure. For those wishing to evaluate the schematic, the
looped
ZPE plans are available at http://www.theverylastpageoftheinternet.com (http://www.theverylastpageoftheinternet.com)
Hectors original disclosure which since has been improved with a dual
battery switching system and many other modifications.
*It is Advanced energy R and D, brand new and very difficult for the
first
timer to grasp and replicate, hence why we need to recruit Hector and
all
the open sourced engineers working on the RV into the centre where we
the
public can provide grant support and SAFTY for this research**.*
*Only through this open source technology disclosures can it reach the
public and allow green energy technology to operate and stay UN
suppressed,
and free our self's from petroleum subjugation and pollution*.
*Hector is a very underrated* *and talented* open sourced energy
engineer
whom has contributed the RV for public education to show far advanced
energy
saving applications and the potential the RV has to operate in an
over unity
condition. Hector has also has developed far advanced *Zero point
energy
user systems* (Z.E.U.S).
Photos provided by hector
Hectors internet disclosure of the z.e.u.s System is pictured
in the centre in a triangle formation.
Side view
Another device replicated independently and given open sourced by
Hector
to demonstrate a lab testable existence of ZPE and over unity is the
Trans-verter device (below) comprising capacitors and a three phase
transformer.
*Credits to jinis* for this Submission and Disclosure of
Hectors replication. Pictured on the right the Trans-Verter, One phase
(Ferro resonant ) transformer modified with vectoring capacitors.
This is
another device like the RV which has *demonstrated over unity
efficiency and
is needing further study to extract the power in a condition which is
non
reflective to the source.*
The Research and Development of the RV has been extended and
perfected by
open sourced engineers known to panacea, many improvements and
potential is
shown in the technical compilations mentioned on this page. To reach
the
capacity this research and development has, the RV and these
engineers known
to panacea *needs to make it into a resourced and consolidated
resourced
backed granted environment*, *where it can be secured into public
knowledge
and circulation*.
The RV can also be applied into cogeneration roles involving certain
expired
energy patents which the public can also benefit from. To date certain
expired patents are able be fused with the RV. *Many generators can be
adopted to the RV prime mover* and run in RV mode for high eff use as
Norman
Wootan proved.
Hector has already experimented with the *Ekhlin brown* patent as a
generator attached to the RV. This patent has expired and Hector has a
working OU design. At the time hector first built this he was not open
sourced and experienced the greedy out come that results in this
citation.
This resulted in his prototype being suppressed according to Hector.
Another
one of the expired patents which can be used in cogeneration with the
RV
technology is the expired L *ee **Rogers**'s air car patent.*
Further technical detail is contained in the compilations mentioned.
The concept disclosed by hector is to run Solar + RV + air compressor
+ lee
Rogers patent. The expired patent can be built and tested with the RV
and
publicly disclosed and owned. To date an open sourced team member of
panacea
is working to perfect this RV-Rogers co-generation, but is under
resourced
and lacks the time needed and money to complete the project. In the
centre
this will be resolved.
Above is the lee Rogers air car drawing from the expired patent.
The RV can act as a power source to drive the air compressor with the
aid of
solar cogeneration making a more efficient and faster solar car. This
design
is needs proper granted resources to be built and tested. Also
*Hector has
designed RV vortex co-generation energy technology based on victor
schaubergers ideas which also requiring testing. Hector has also
described a
water injected diesel conversion concept but needs resources to
perfect.*
*Hector and many other engineers experienced in this alternative
energy
field are ready and willing to contribute in the public granted
research and
development centre*. There are many talented humanitarians whom have
technology awaiting public disclosure.
Their energy technology is for *vehicle transportation and home power
systems* which need public grants to start production and to spread
further
education.
*The referenced communities are the individuals who taught me all
that I
know and contributed to the advancement of the RV FREE and open
sourced*.
This group is run by Doug cozen who has made a variety of energy
recovery
systems over the years and continues to advance at an alarming rate.
For the
past 5+ years, Doug has been experimenting with a low-voltage
colliding-coil
EDGRAY motor, but also with a permanent magnet version as a hybrid
Gray/Adams motor.
Panaceas Replication of the RV
Although I am not working and or experienced by trade in electricity,
power
engineering or this advanced field of Energy Transformation, I
Ashtweth
along with another helping engineer took the time to replicate the
Roto
verter myself and learn its theory and operation.
*This was with the help of my new found, technically brilliant,
altruistic
friends from around the world. These warriors of truth, are members
of Doug
Konzen's free-energy Yahoo Group 'EVGRAY' on the internet. *
My replication of the RV is further proof of two principles, the
first is
related to *the capacity the RV has in relation to energy saving R
and D
which is available to be applied by the public right now.* The other
is in
relation to over unity R an D which proves the* EXCESS ENERGY IS
PRESENT* in
the RV and is there to be extracted.
*The RV is needing further testing and study in panaceas non profit
research
and development centre for this to advance further at this stage.* The
following will be a basic summery of the results , for complete
technical
detail please refer to the technical E-books listed in the
introduction.
Energy savings
Using the RV in a separate motor application is a superior energy
saver
device *which can be applied* *right now to run more efficiently a
Lathe, a
milling machine, an industrial bench drill or any other variable load
machine which the RV can operate from a speed of one to two HP and
save up
to 90% energy!*.
Panaceas replication showing a 1 HP BALDORS RV motor
modified for energy saving applications.
*The RV is the only method of power management which allows also
allows practical solar cogeneration use of the above mentioned
applications*.
Other energy saving roles are possible, please read the technical
compilation Panacea completed to for further detail.
Here is an open letter that can be forwarded to ANY university who
must up
grade their faculty and advance their power engineering via this
scientific
discovery. Panacea-bocaf have RV representatives around the world, a
representative in Brisbane Australia can provide a tangible energy
saving
demo to Brisbane universities.
Panacea-bocaf can also provide university and or send this
documentation of
RV tests to any international university. *PLEASE FORWARD THIS LETTER
TO
YOUR UNIVERSITY, and / or contact Panacea for more info.*
<http://panacea-bocaf.org/RotoVerter.htm>Download the university
letter
here! <http://panacea-bocaf.org/files/university%20letter.pdf>
The energy savings that the RV proves is unique and also is a pioneer
of
future solar shop cogeneration which will enable the practical
application
of solar shop equipment where previously it would be financially
impossible
and impractical. The non RV equivalent is estimated to need 10 times
the
solar panels to function.
All machinery which employs variable loads by 1-2 HP electric motors
can be
run *SIGNIFICANTLY* more efficient in RV Mode, not to mention now
able to be
solar driven to recharge the batteries *where previously it would be
impossible*.
*It is time the public mandate law to upgrade and enforce electric
motor
standards to match the RV's energy saving efficiency to do critically
needy
environmental benefit*. For complete detail and construction details
please
consult the technical thesis panacea completed, and sign up in the
relative
section for public lobby support of the mandates!.
This data needs to upgrade efficiency standards in industry, the
energy
savings the RV proves is premise to mandate law to make electric
motors more
environmentally sound. Green politicians and the public need to
enforce this
and support panaceas efforts to serve you for a sustainable future.
If you
are an industry worker which use machinery, a member of the public or
a
Green politician Please sign up and or contact panacea in the relative
section.
PLEASE SIGN THE PETITION
<http://panacea-bocaf.org/forms/rvpetition.html>FOR NO ENERGY WASTAGE
AND SUPPORT THE RV HERE!
These concepts and technology is public knowledge, and I encourage all
people that use machinery with rotary punch or solar cogeneration to
now
save money and energy b*y using the RV open sourced technology. *And
to
further commit towards the engineers goals of free energy and focus
helping
the youth to live free from subjugation and greener. Donate for
panacea.
Here is a technical video showing and proving these facts via the
replication results.
*Over unity/ZPE replication*
Panacea's replication choose to input the RV with a battery and
inverter and
show a DC current and voltage input for more accuracy.
Above is the RV full in view, showing the prime mover
,
alternator
with capacitor bank [centre]
With the RV running, the input is 11.7 volts on the inverter
from
the battery, and by the meter is reading a draw of 30.6 amps of
current,
which equals around 385 watts (Times the voltage by the current to
get the
watts)
The alternator out put shown by the meters reads *165 volts with 9.7
amps AC
of circulating current*. 165 volts times 9.7 amps of current equates
to
about *1600 watts.*
In summery the input current is 385 watts, The output current is
*1600 watts
*. Take 1600 watts, subtract 385 watts and it will equal *1215 watts
of over
unity from the input needed to create it*.
*Where is this excess energy coming from?*
*This is what needs to be studied and understood through further
testing in
the R and D centre*. Panaceas tests are conclusive and prove *it is
possible
to Loop the RV with the excess energy produced.* *And it is further
feasible
that Hectors R and D is valid and is to be submitted into the
research and
development centre.*
my tests-my replication inserted here (Normans replication and a
looping
attempt with phils OU and resonance collection and inverter)
The only way to make free green energy a reality is through open
source
technology and through the engineers committed and experienced to do
it.
Your input is the medium needed with grants. PUBLIC funded, publicly
disclosed, and free to the public. With out your public input, it
will only
stagnate.
*This device proves many things, The most important for now is that
we have
the capacity to develop higher efficient green energy systems and
keep them
in open sourced public disclosure or public knowledge.*
The RV, Trans-verter and related co-generation RV technology all will
be
perfected in panaceas centre. *please contribute to public free
energy,
support you none profit org and dontate and or sign up!!.*
Next is the Joe cell suppressed energy technology.
On 11/21/06, Mark Eldridge <updigme@...> wrote:
>
> I know that some in the group are interested in being able to
provide
> for themselves without the "help" of the local utilities. I show
you this
> because it is very close to the system that myself and my partners
are close
> to finishing. Some differences and some sketchy claims, but it is
refreshing
> to know that I'm not alone in my quest.
>
> As always, if I find out more, that is of actual use, I will pass
it along
> to the group.
>
>
> 11/20/06 - Self-Running Generator powered by Static
Electricity<http://www.andalusiastarnews.com/articles/2006/11/18/news/
372news.txt>
> [image: KeelyNet](I could not find the patent that the article
claims is
> pending. Inverter input can be from as low as 6VDC up to 120VDC
which would
> be used to produce 120VAC or so which would determine if the 10
volt coils
> are in parallel or series. Don't rag on me for the diagram, I have
no idea
> of the true schematic, this is just a rough idea of the layout with
the
> coils incorrectly wired. Will know more in future. - JWD) Walter
Owens
> thinks he has invented the machine that will "change the nation."
Known
> about town as a "tinker," the Florala resident has spent the last
18 years
> working on the concept of creating a device that would solve the
nation's,
> if not the world's, dependency on crude oil. His idea: a patent-
pending
> prototype for a generator fueled by static electricity. "It works
this way,"
> he said. "Static electricity is all around us, everyday. If you
stick your
> hand in Styrofoam peanuts and pull it out, they stick. That's static
> electricity. My machine draws the static electricity from the air,
as well
> as producing more. That charge then goes into a coil system that
magnifies
> the charge and converts it into D/C power. "That power then comes
out of 12
> different wires with enough amps to make electricity flow," he
said. A power
> converter is used to change the electricity converted from D/C
power to A/C
> power for use in everyday needs, he said. Operating on four car
batteries,
> the machine works by using start-up energy from the batteries to
drive a D/C
> motor that turns a flywheel. That magnetic flywheel runs through a
system
> where 300 feet of 10-gauge copper wires, enclosed in sheepskin,
pushes the
> electricity into 12 coils, with each coil producing somewhere
around 10
> volts of electricity. "This thing will build enough electrical
power to
> operate an automobile," he said. "It needs no gas, no oil. This one
unit is
> more than enough to run a house." He demonstrated his concept, by
showing
> how his invention puts out enough power to run an outboard motor
and corded
> work light. Owens, an accomplished inventor, holds 27 patents for
items such
> as farm equipment, a boat, a commode system and a newspaper rack.
"Look at
> all of our men and women who have lost their lives over the battle
for oil,"
> he said. "What if we could stop our dependency on gas, oil? We
could bring
> our guys home and go a long way in stopping pollution. I knew it
would be
> difficult, but I had to try. This could be the turning point for
our world."
> Currently, Owens has completed a prototype and is looking for
someone to
> take his invention into the marketplace. "This thing is much bigger
than
> me," he said. "It's going to take someone much younger than me to
get this
> thing out in the forefront where it needs to be. I'm looking for
someone to
> do that."
I agree RedEangle..
I vote for patent and open source,
patent apply only for mass production, inventor get reward,
individual should can duplicate it freely,
everybody can and legitimate duplicating in home scale..
but is in this way patent works ?,
To add to your and RedEangle post
If you want free energy? learn how to build and I'll patent so I can control who builds for profit and get paid from those who build to make profit from others. But those who want to build for themselves? Go for it.
Alan
Patent-ing
means
to
give as
"open source"
technical findings
under
comercial
right and obligation
laws and orders
There are two kinds of patent application :
patente for technical innovation :
needs physical-technical examination
claims right monopole validation -if awarded(=accepted as new innovation) 17+3=20years (under WIPO/INPI-fee paying condition)
relatively expensive if PCT/WO-wide rights demand cause lingual translations
patente for utlity model/process(i-material) :
no examination
claims riight monopole validation 10 years.
If somebody applicate in 1/one country (f.e. Belize) worldwide an 100US$ costs utility model ,
(without the intention to speculate to worldwide WO-utility claims rights monopole),
explaining a "free energy" device this application as "open source"-source is then
worlwide comercial free available
cause you - as applicant - want this !
There is no need for "unusefull" exagerations about "open source" or patenting
it it the same medaille/medail( A-and-B-side)
In my 3/4. school class [(Roßmarktschule/Speyer(Spyra)] was beside the wall-tabula/Tafel/table a script :
a Matthaeus-Psalm(~Sure/Law-Order) :
Erst denken ,dann sprechen
meaning First thinking about the facts(also pros and cons)
then critizising ~judging
First reading your and the common rights and obrigations/obligations :
this information you get from your national patent office free/gratis off-or on-line
and 100US$ is less than the "overunity-prize-jackpot" offer
Or......if it actually works well, use it to power your own personal quad copter and buzz around doing good deeds and solving crime. No immediate threat to the "power cartels"....
Slowly building street cred and ground support until it's time to lead the masses against the asses and their gasses.
That you guys still sit around even speaking of "patents" and "open sourcing" disgusts me and shows how little you see of the 'matrix'.
I'm out of here.....
BUZZZZZZZ ZZZZZ ZZZZ zzz z z
Oh crap....
Can anybody give me a lift back to my mom's basement?
thank for you explanation,Think easy like patenting=open sourcing and nobody ( hopefully for good peacefull intnetions) can stop somebody to applicate and replicate the descripted patent object !
but i did not go deep into kind of patent or how to patent yet.
i read moray book,
http://kristofferhell.net/doc/sea-of-energy_henry-t-moray.pdf (http://kristofferhell.net/doc/sea-of-energy_henry-t-moray.pdf)
is that situation same with current situation?,
the main problem is situation.
if not go and get patent,
every being from bowels of the earth to the moon to the mars till pluto will
come to the earth surface patenting device.
don't worry, human will be serviced first .
Then there is the second step : UAL/TUEV and similar security org approval to get assurance
security and to know the own/family/neighbour object function risks !
Think about your responsibility ! Without assurance security you will have to pay 100% and
need to approve that not you are guilty and judged by law with up to several years prison !
As DIYer you will need for each constructed object several kinds of aval/approvements:
to save your life/health/patrimony and the life/health and patrimony from all others around you ! This costs time and money
Hi!
Fortunately, there is no such invention.
I'm sure that's prevailing energy system why they have not killed anyone.
It is easier to imagine cheating killed.
who is lured by money.
Personal Opinion.
sorry ;)
This question made me think of this video https://youtu.be/Ks8WH3xUo_E
After thinking about it for a bit, Open Sourcing is like helping your brother while Patenting is like taking money from your brother. Which I ask myself WHO is PATENTING STUFF? AN expert of knowledge or just a person who does not know what he/she is patenting?
It dose not matter which way you go,your screw'd either way,and some one else always ends up making the money of your idea's.Not always, half the stuff doesn't work, and what's the point spending thousands on stuff that almost impossible to get or have made without spending loads of money ? if you have an idea just sell someone a stake in it and how long do you think you will last once the big boys find out what your up to, one way or another they will put you out of buseness, just share it with your mates and people you can trust !