GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Plug Heater

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics


  • *Total Posts: 501913
  • *Total Topics: 14983
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 3
  • *Guests: 12
  • *Total: 15

Author Topic: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment  (Read 9158 times)

Offline evostars

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 153
    • my youtube channel with bifilar pancake coil info
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2018, 06:59:31 PM »
Radiant energy experiment with 3 bifilar coils:
Why is the disruptive discharge, BEFORE the pulse turns on?

https://youtu.be/lByUMEg0OHs
https://youtu.be/lByUMEg0OHs


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2018, 06:59:31 PM »

Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2018, 07:19:55 PM »
I don't know, a bug in the Rigol's software maybe, he should try again with an analog scope.

How to get waveform data out of Rigol, it's a series of bytes for every channel, each byte is a sample, right? This Python script can be easily modified to calculate from that data, instead of vector graphics, in fact it's even simpler to do. But, a bless or curse, but i don't have Rigol.


Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13820
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2018, 09:10:15 PM »
It's no bug in the Rigol.
Put the circuit into LTSpice and run the simulation, paying attention to the startup transients. There is no need for fancy bifilar coils to see this behaviour.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #17 on: September 14, 2018, 09:10:15 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #18 on: September 14, 2018, 09:54:07 PM »
Bifilar coils have capacity. These waveforms are all hairy because bifilar coils self-oscillate on their resonant frequency.

Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13820
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2018, 12:45:27 AM »
Bifilar coils have capacity. These waveforms are all hairy because bifilar coils self-oscillate on their resonant frequency.
All coils have capacity. All coils can self-oscillate on their resonant frequency. I don't see "all hairy" waveforms above; they look quite regular and repetitive to me.


Tesla Bifilar coils wound according to patent # 512,340 have _more_ capacity than single wound solenoidal or pancake coils of the same geometry. Nowadays with the availability of cheap high voltage capacitors in virtually any capacitance, it is easy to increase the "self capacity" of any coil by adding a series or parallel capacitor.

Quoting from the Tesla patent:
Quote
I have found that in every coil there exists a certain relation between its self-induction and capacity that permits a current of given frequency and potential to pass through it with no other opposition than that of ohmic resistance, or, in other words, as though it possessed no self-induction. This is due to the mutual relations existing between the special character of the current and the self-induction and capacity of the coil, the latter quantity being just capable of neutralizing the self-induction for that frequency. It is well-known that the higher the frequency or potential difference of the current the smaller the capacity required to counteract the self-induction; hence, in any coil, however small the capacity, it may be sufficient for the purpose stated if the proper conditions in other respects be secured. In the ordinary coils the difference of potential between adjacent turns or spires is very small, so that while they are in a sense condensers, they possess but very small capacity and the relations between the two quantities, self-induction and capacity, are not such as under any ordinary conditions satisfy the requirements herein contemplated, because the capacity relatively to the self-induction is very small.
(emphasis mine)
If someone wants to claim that there is something special about using a bifilar coil, as opposed to an ordinary single-wound coil of the same dimensions with appropriate added capacitance, in some particular application ... they should do comparison tests to demonstrate the difference.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2018, 12:45:27 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2018, 01:11:15 AM »
Nowadays with the availability of cheap high voltage capacitors in virtually any capacitance, it is easy to increase the "self capacity" of any coil by adding a series or parallel capacitor.

So you assume that these two are the same thing, i don't make such assumptions.

(Rationale -- why are my oscilloscope traces not well aligned to the grid lines. It is because i have an old oscilloscope where the phosphor is worn out in some places on the screen. So i cannot always perfectly align them to the grid lines, but perhaps i lost hope and didn't try. I calibrated the scope thoroughly though, and it is otherwise a good an precise instrument.)

« Last Edit: September 15, 2018, 01:12:56 PM by ayeaye »

Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13820
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2018, 03:33:22 AM »
So you assume that these two are the same thing, i don't make such assumptions.
Actually what I "assume" is that people who make claims should be able to prove them, or at least test them in a reasonable manner and report success or failure with real repeatable data.


If you think the two are different, or you wish to find out whether they are or not... please feel free to post your demonstrations for discussion.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2018, 03:33:22 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #22 on: September 15, 2018, 11:32:19 AM »
If you think the two are different, or you wish to find out whether they are or not... please feel free to post your demonstrations for discussion.

I did an experiment, which weirdly this time you are not willing to replicate. Experiments are done to find out how nature works. If we make assumptions, we omit doing experiments, because we pretend that we already know, and then may well be that there are things in nature that we will never find out. Such assumptions are just another example of omissive logic which may lead to conclusions opposite to the truth or not seeing some things that are real.

The previous time i did an experiment, i didn't consider mosfet leaking. But i went further to find out how it leaks and the way to calculate how much it leaks, so that this can be added to the calculations. I think my work has been useful for many who face a similar problem.

There is this story that the spanish who came to america told. They came to shore with small boats, the indians asked, how could you go over the sea with such small boats. The spanish said, they didn't, they came with that big boat that is on the sea over there. But the indians were not able to see the boat.


Offline forest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3766
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2018, 05:53:41 PM »
The egg of Columbus

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #23 on: September 15, 2018, 05:53:41 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #24 on: September 15, 2018, 11:54:23 PM »
This is my most careful copying of the oscilloscope traces (see the figures below), i cannot do it better. The precision is now twice greater than before, twice the squares of the oscilloscope grid, it seems that single precision is not enough. The content of the sch file is now the following.

Quote
v 20130925 2
L 48000 49000 48300 48500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 48300 48500 48700 47900 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 48700 47900 49100 47500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 49100 47500 49400 47300 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 49400 47300 50000 47000 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 50000 44200 50500 45000 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 50500 45000 50900 45500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 50900 45500 51500 45900 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 51500 45900 52400 46200 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 52400 46200 53200 46300 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 53200 46300 54400 46400 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 54400 46400 55800 46500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 55800 46500 56500 46500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 48000 42900 49000 43100 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 49000 43100 50000 43200 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 50000 43200 50000 40500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 47800 46500 56700 46500 3 0 0 0 -1 -1
L 47800 40500 56700 40600 3 0 0 0 -1 -1

With this

Quote
#Time for gschem unit in ns
XU = 5.0
#Voltage for unit for ch 1 and 2 in mV
YU1 = 0.5
YU2 = 5.0

the output of the Python script is now this

Quote
Input power was 9.952 uW
Output power was 12.026 uW

The output is still greater than the input.


Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #25 on: September 16, 2018, 05:35:52 PM »
Circuit board with Ne555 timer (figure below).

What is the sch file mentioned above? it is a netlist, created by gschem and used by the spice circuit simulator geda. Almost all the spice circuit simulators have such netlist and some vector graphics editor, with which such line graphs can also be drawn. Like LTspice has asc files which are very similar to sch files, you may try to draw such graphs with LTspice and maybe the asc file it saves to can be used with the Python script above right away. I cannot try this as i use linux and there is no LTspice for linux, so i have to use other spice circuit simulators.

Another way is to use some vector graphics editor, there are simpler ones, but one can even use inkscape. What it produces is an svg file, there the coordinates of the lines can be clearly found, but they should be either be extracted from there manually, converted somehow, or then change the Python script so that it can read them. Yet another way may be to use some simple bitmap graphics editor, and change the Python script so that it can read bitmap data. When using a digital oscilloscope, the Python script should be changed so that it can read the waveform data taken from the oscilloscope, which is easy to do, there just have to be 3 lists and the gety() should then simply return y.

The lines have to be drawn in the right order for the Python script to work. Both graphs have to start from the same x coordinate, the one for R3 has to be above and the one for R2 below. Both x axis have to be drawn last after drawing both graphs. The graph for R2 has to end with y on the x axis. See how the Python script works or change it when you want it to work differently, it is very simple.

« Last Edit: September 16, 2018, 08:06:49 PM by ayeaye »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #25 on: September 16, 2018, 05:35:52 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13820
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #26 on: September 16, 2018, 11:08:56 PM »
Quote
I cannot try this as i use linux and there is no LTspice for linux, so i have to use other spice circuit simulators.
LTSpice will run fine using WINE on linux. Also most distros will have a version of QUCS spice in the repositories, which also works well.

Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #27 on: September 16, 2018, 11:29:28 PM »
I use geda, it's the original spice and it is very good, if one doesn't mind the command line interface. Wine, i don't much like to use it, i see it rather as a joke, an implementation of another operating system where only a few things run.

I said the netlist files of geda and LTspice should not be very different, they should also be a kind of standard i think.


Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13820
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #28 on: September 17, 2018, 02:49:22 AM »
OK, whatever, just trying to help.

 :o

Offline ayeaye

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 449
Re: Bifilar pancake coil overunity experiment
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2018, 03:36:47 AM »
What is that?

Ok, i tried LTspice, but its asc file has a different format than the gschem (geda) sch file. I wrote the following Python script to convert LTspice asc file to gschem sch file the way that the Python script above and the one in ideone can read it. It converts asc file in the standard input to sch file in the standard output. Redirect files to get one file from the other.

Quote
import sys
 
for s in sys.stdin:
    l = []
    i1 = -1
    if (s[0] != "L"): continue
    for j in range(6):
        i0 = i1 + 1
        i1 = i0 + s[i0:].find(" ")
        if (s[i0:i1].isdigit()): l.append(int(int(s[i0:i1]) * 6.25))
    print("L %d %d %d %d 0" % (l[2], 50000 - l[3], l[0], 50000 - l[1]))

So it's possible to draw the graphs above with LTspice. I noticed though that the grid pattern in LTspice is not as good as in gschem, it lacks the big squares, so it's not convenient to use it for drawing graphs. I don't know though, maybe there is a way to change the grid style somehow.


 

OneLink