Wesley's Kapanadze and other FE discussion forum

[stivep]

At 11:23 in part 1 it can be seen that the water pipe is the only ground, as the end of the radiator cable can be seen laying on the ground. Despite this Kapanadze has claimed that the devices self-run with just one ground connection. The Aqua 2 device clearly demonstrates this.
Take a look at this shot: -

At first video show  (prior to  link at 10:04)  car radiator    being buried. https://youtu.be/Goq76CQapyI?t=257
 
please look here . 
https://youtu.be/Goq76CQapyI?t=604     link at 10:04
then video shows  water pipe  connection  at 10:58 instead of radiator connection
https://youtu.be/Goq76CQapyI?t=658

Wesley

[Hoppy]

Yes, thats right, light coloured radiator cable and thick black cable are not connected together onto the water pipe at any point in the video.

[stivep]

Yes, thats right, light coloured radiator cable and thick black cable are not connected together onto the water pipe at any point in the video.

that I do understand
here you have on ground wire 6.4V and should be zero right?
https://youtu.be/Goq76CQapyI?t=474

So  because of large size of this post I need to end it  in this form
but  6.4V at water pipe was measured  with clamp volt meter  as in video above.
that is clear indication of existence   of reference point   on wire connected to the water  pipe.
and it proves two ground structure  in Tariel device.
Attachments:
1. http://www.searchanddiscovery.com/pdfz/documents/2014/41332nelson/ndx_nelson.pdf.html  NOTE: you need to place mark I'm not robot
2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_battery
 

_{To use the natural electricity, earth batteries fed electromagnets, the load, that were part of a motor mechanism.}

3.https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433023210184;view=1up;seq=80     this is simply  a jewel.  1885 book talking about earth battery construction start from page 72
 it is related to  third picture below 


Wesley

[stivep]

http://www.searchanddiscovery.com/pdfz/documents/2014/41332nelson/ndx_nelson.pdf.html
 NOTE: you need to place mark I'm not robot
to gain access to this document

1. here you have  the same book from 1885 about  "resistance"
of earth. - that is in  very primitive form of understanding of science in this period of time . but it is  quite shocking.
length of DC circuit using earth  loop 

2.look at picture : -

Earth and DC current.. picture referring to point 2 in my post.jpg

from the same  book we know that 1 mile of copper wire  coated with zink   -the resistance is 6 ohm.
- and it says that if you use  earth instead of return wire you can save 50% of battery life. look at picture #2
 That translated to other statement in this book says that it is due to telluric current presence.
 So if battery was 34V that "17V" was adding into battery life. However such ridiculous   claim  can not be accepted
 We should say( state it )  in terms of current flow at  given potential not   the voltage.
We see here that current flow is additive.

2a. for us is important to understand the   Battery was establishing voltage potential  and current flow was conserved due to Telluric current.
By that  if we can  establish any voltage potential  for example 5000V than we influence _{"free electrons"} - flow  according to understanding o physics in 1885
But than current flow will obey the same phenomena as stated above - for battery.

2b. We need to understand also  nature of telegraph impulse that was unknown in 1885 that is :
- every impulse of DC has its  front edge AC and  falling edge AC.
that is nothing more  and nothing less but stimulation similar to our  rectangular impulses used in Tariel Kapanadze  devices.

2c.
- And now we are at  electrostatic pump , where we include diode to pump  current flow in one direction , from the earth to  the device  as nature wants to be in balance.
 We may do it as I mentioned in my articles  above in few different forms.  ( first  I mentioned electrical motor as early Kapanadze device  concept) evolving to electrostatic without use of electrical motor but using  electrostatic pump .

2d.
- use of the diode is not critical but  it is the easiest solution.
We may replace diode with  resonance circuitry forcing or forbidding  energy flow but here we already at  losing energy  in such process - not in conserving  every bit of energy.
so using of chokes is not  very fortunate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choke_%28electronics%29
- for some of you who do not understand how it works pleaqse  go to  series and parallel resonant circuits:https://www.allaboutcircuits.com/textbook/alternating-current/chpt-6/resonance-series-parallel-circuits/
 - in series circuit  all frequencies are stopped  and only frequency of resonance is allowed to pass.
 - in parallel circuit all frequencies are allowed to  pass but  resonance frequency is stopped.
 there is NO  ENERGY LOSE !!!!! in such  arrangement


2e.  Schematic from above showing Tariel electrostatic  circuit ( hand drown contains 2 diodes)
that is exactly what was explained at the very first posts here.

2f. Look below  there is statement standing that

earth   does not oppose   to current flow that is why  we have 50%  less battery   use.

It is in theoretical analysis completely incorrect statement . - what they did not understand there in 1885 , is that
Telluric current  makes it happened .
However  for all practical application it is correct!!!!

summary : 
-We have evidence of close circuit using  two grounds where one of the wires  is our ground path  where  Telluric current is present .
-That could be compared to  telegraph circuit of 1885 where  earth was used as returning path.
===========================================================
So we have active close circuit as long as we have difference of potentials.
- that difference can be by using big  low resistance copper wire  ,  and ground as second wire.
- that could be if we measure difference of potentials between two grounds using that  big gauge wire
- that could be if  we use additional  voltage potential for example 34V battery from 1885
- that could be if we use  for example 5000V  of DC to increase voltage potential
- that could be if we use pulse signal DC that has two  AC components ( look above in text)
And magic happens if we use this kind of impulses  as they  already  have seen this phenomena using telegraph Morse code impulses in 1885
(these impulses are the same in nature as our rectangular impulses.)
 I hope this is understood!!?




Wesley
 PS : for these who still can not accept two grounds   think of it as
-one  physical ground
and
- one  capacitivley  reactive ground due to HV difference ( that ground has also reference point to earth ground - called also physical ground.)
for example device that was presented to me in Tbilisi have had only one physical ground.
 Every ground must have reference point to the ground but in dipole antenna that is mass to mass relation  ( at e.g  22floor of apartment building, that is why we  call it - counterpoise.)

[Hoppy]

that I do understand
here you have on ground wire 6.4V and should be zero right?
https://youtu.be/Goq76CQapyI?t=474

So  because of large size of this post I need to end it  in this form
but  6.4V at water pipe was measured  with clamp volt meter  as in video above.
that is clear indication of existence   of reference point   on wire connected to the water  pipe.
and it proves two ground structure  in Tariel device.

Wesley

I would expect just mV reading. The guy is using a high impedance voltmeter and even when the other guy holds the one of the probes, the meter still reads 6V!. As the subtitle suggest, 6V reading means nothing.

The point I'm trying to make, is that Kapanadze has only one ground connection at any point in time, so the reliance on a tapped potential difference between two ground points for Arunas's theory does not apply in the case of this Kapanadze green box demo. The mass of the earth ground appears to be important, which strongly suggests to me that there is a hidden energy source feeding the device, whereby the lamp array is being powered by the energy processed by the device and is relying on a good ground connection for a return path, thus why he was experimeting with the ground leads.
Thanks for references on telluric currents.

[T-1000]

really? I always fought that green box worked on two ground wires, one for water pipe and other for buried radiator. I also dont like the Arunas diagram too, tesla coil secondary does not have such sharp  waveforms?

Hi guys,
You could just drop PM to me while getting confused with that pic which Wesley added.
First at all, the one ground rod or two ground rods it does not matter.
Second, the Tesla coil and middle plate of capacitor(top load) are separated by spark gap in that pic. Which is giving spikes we all need.
Third, you have to utilize electrostatic laws in order to gain more particles on the wire from the ambient. This is where current gain is without using power source.

Cheers!

[Hoppy]

Hi guys,
You could just drop PM to me while getting confused with that pic which Wesley added.
First at all, the one ground rod or two ground rods it does not matter.
Second, the Tesla coil and middle plate of capacitor(top load) are separated by spark gap in that pic. Which is giving spikes we all need.
Third, you have to utilize electrostatic laws in order to gain more particles on the wire from the ambient. This is where current gain is without using power source.

Cheers!

T1000,
It would be more helpful to all on this thread if you could post a corrected sketch to show how you think the Kapanadze green box is configured.

Thanks Hoppy.

[stivep]

I would expect just mV reading. The guy is using a high impedance voltmeter and even when the other guy holds the one of the probes, the meter still reads 6V!. As the subtitle suggest, 6V reading means nothing.

The point I'm trying to make, is that Kapanadze has only one ground connection at any point in time, so the reliance on a tapped potential difference between two ground points for Arunas's theory does not apply in the case of this Kapanadze green box demo. The mass of the earth ground appears to be important, which strongly suggests to me that there is a hidden energy source feeding the device, whereby the lamp array is being powered by the energy processed by the device and is relying on a good ground connection for a return path, thus why he was experimeting with the ground leads.
Thanks for references on telluric currents.

 and :

Hi guys,
You could just drop PM to me while getting confused with that pic which Wesley added.
First at all, the one ground rod or two ground rods it does not matter.
Second, the Tesla coil and middle plate of capacitor(top load) are separated by spark gap in that pic. Which is giving spikes we all need.
Third, you have to utilize electrostatic laws in order to gain more particles on the wire from the ambient. This is where current gain is without using power source.

Cheers!

For both of you Arunas and Hoppy 
Philosophy:
confusion  does not exist- confusion is first  created _{and than it exists}

I did not create any confusion - you created your o own confusion  by not reading carefully that what I said
and I said  two  ground structure EVEN IF IT LOOKS   FOR YOU LIKE  ONE

This is my quote from previous post :
 

PS : for these who still can not accept two grounds   think of it as
-one  physical ground
and
- one  capacitivley  reactive ground due to HV difference ( that ground has also reference point to earth ground - called also physical ground.)
for example device that was presented to me in Tbilisi have had only one physical ground.
 Every ground must have reference point to the ground but in dipole antenna that is mass to mass relation  ( at e.g  22floor of apartment building, that is why we  call it - counterpoise.)

Hoppy:
 I would expect just mV reading. The guy is using a high impedance voltmeter and even when the other guy holds the one of the probes, the meter still reads 6V!. As the subtitle suggest, 6V reading means nothing.

It sounds for me more or less like:

There is a hooker under the neon lamp in red district of Hamburg, but for Hoppy she does not mean anything, and Wesley comes by and ask Hoppy.
-did you mean she does not exists? 
-and if she exists  than  tell me Hoppy why something that does not mean anything over sudden has got  meaning ? Just because I ask  you a question ,or just because she has a reason  to exist in this particular  place at that given point  in time?
So by  use of just words you  have created and converted  meaningless to meaningful 

By that Once you said 6V - it has got a meaning! That means it exists.


1. Unfortunate is that your suggestion reminds said but not stated and supported.
2. We where talking about Green box where we physically see  two grounds in that  green box  show. -  and the questions would be to you Hoppy to answer the questions:
a- why do you think video shows  radiator ground and over sudden  cold water pipe with 6V reading?
b- why Tariel show two grounds?
c. - you Hoppy suggest  hidden source , but at the same time you also say that  at no time both grounds have been connected to  green box.
so  if we fallow your suggestion  than Tariel must of  create two different hidden sources of hidden energy...
And this is NONSENSE to me.
As far as 6V reading- That what for you means "nothing"  is your rights to say it ,.........  but  that sounds  like universal law of Hoppy in physics. <grin>
You need to understand that  in High Power  installations such as glass Table and  Tent Tariel could not make it work without two _grounds  when he used motors as generators .


Any Ground   physical and  reactive must obey  requirement  of having direct reference point.  !!
As far as distance between the groundsI have explained it  above  look at picture #2 ( gauge 4 wire =6 Ohms at  1 mile length )
but at the same time  book from 1885 says:  look below picture _{Telluric current practical observations}
Wesley

[Hoppy]

 and :

For both of you Arunas and Hoppy 
Philosophy:
confusion  does not exist- confusion is created

I did not create any confusion - you created your o own confusion  by not reading carefully that what I said
and I said  two  ground structure EVEN IF IT LOOKS   FOR YOU LIKE  ONE

This is my quote from previous post :
 1. Unfortunate is that your suggestion reminds said but not stated and supported.
2. We where talking about Green box where we physically see  two grounds in that  green box  show. -  and the questions would be to you Hoppy to answer the questions:
a- why do you think video shows  radiator ground and over sudden  cold water pipe with 6V reading?
b- why Tariel show two grounds?
c. - you Hoppy suggest  hidden source , but at the same time you also say that  at no time both grounds have been connected to  green box.
so  if we fallow your suggestion  than Tariel must of  create two different hidden sources of hidden energy...
And this is NONSENSE to me.
As far as 6V reading- what for you means nothing  is your rights to say it ,  but  that sounds  like universal law of Hoppy in physics. <grin>
You need to understand that  in High Power  installations such as glass Table and  Tent Tariel could not make it work without two _grounds  when he used motors as generators .
Any Ground   physical and  reactive must obey  requirement  of having direct reference point.  !!
Wesley

Answer: -
a) The 6V reading cannot be relied upon as accurate or significant unless you are really telling me that there is a genuine 6V differential between two earth points in Kapanadze's garden. 
b) He shows two grounds because he is seen to be testing both of them for effectiveness.
c) The presence of two grounds does not logically assume that there must be two sources of hidden energy.
If Arunas felt that he needed to address the confusion, then he must of felt that the sketches you posted were causing confusion because the sketches were showing the configuration being discussed and questioned.

[stivep]

Answer: -
a) The 6V reading cannot be relied upon as accurate or significant unless you are really telling me that there is a genuine 6V differential between two earth points in Kapanadze's garden. 
b) He shows two grounds because he is seen to be testing both of them for effectiveness.
c) The presence of two grounds does not logically assume that there must be two sources of hidden energy.
If Arunas felt that he needed to address the confusion, then he must of felt that the sketches you posted were causing confusion because the sketches were showing the configuration being discussed and questioned.

Hoppy How about c)?

c. - you Hoppy suggest  hidden source , but at the same time you also say that  at no time both grounds have been connected to  green box.
so  if we fallow your suggestion  than Tariel must of  create two different hidden sources of hidden energy...
And this is NONSENSE to me.

Statement :
"if one part of structure is proven  not valid, the whole body stops to be valid."
The only condition  for its  existence for now is by accepting human error - but you Hoppy do not want to admit it?

_{Please read  my previous post one more time as I was correcting it  while you responded .}

Wesley
 

[Hoppy]

Hoppy How about c)?Statement :
Wesley

Wesley, I've answered it. See my previous post.

[forest]

First we must be sure about the energy source and the mechanism of extracting it.
I have a theory but it is far from complete, because the issue is complicated. There is possibility we have the situation when two or more energy sources are colliding and depending of the actual device one or other prevails. That cause confusion.
The resonance is definitely used because Tariel said so.

[T-1000]

First we must be sure about the energy source and the mechanism of extracting it.

Good you mentioned that part.
In situation we have with Kapanadze style devices - we are dealing with what is the current on the wires and what happens when more particles with charges are injected into wire.
As soon that is realized there is current amplification in result. Which is your Volts x Amps = Power on output.

[stivep]

Wesley, I've answered it. See my previous post.

No   you did not  answer specifically accurate :
My point c.)

c. - you Hoppy suggest  hidden source , but at the same time you also say that  at no time both grounds have been connected to  green box.
so  if we fallow your suggestion  than Tariel must of  create two different hidden sources of hidden energy...
And this is NONSENSE to me.
As far as 6V reading- That what for you means "nothing"  is your rights to say it ,.........  but  that sounds  like universal law of Hoppy in physics. (http://overunity.com/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) <grin>
You need to understand that  in High Power  installations such as glass Table and  Tent Tariel could not make it work without two _grounds  when he used motors as generators .

Any Ground   physical and  reactive must obey  requirement  of having direct reference point.  !!
As far as distance between the grounds I have explained it  above  look at picture #2 ( gauge 4 wire =6 Ohms at  1 mile length )
but at the same time  book from 1885 says:  look at above picture _{"Telluric current practical observations"}

Hoppy  answered :

_{c) The presence of two grounds does not logically assume that there must be two sources of hidden energy.}

<sub>Wesly says about inconsistency  of Hoppy thinking pattern - that turns sense into NONSENSE:

You suggested :</sub>          hidden source of energy.
_{and you said that :} c) "The presence of two grounds does not logically assume that there must be two sources of hidden energy."

Problem               :both statements exclude each other (x=> + x=<) = NONSENSE just because sign"> "is not specified. And you already excluded that  both grunds must have hidden source of     
                          energy and you already excluded that both grounds are connected at the same time
conclusion:           For all practical  applications - "if one ground  had hidden source of energy and another one did not ( _{according to your c)} ) than  only one of two grounds _{( having hidden source )} 
                           can be used at  all time."
 So according to your c)  that what _{you suggested} and that what _{you said} are in conflict !!.

We are dealing with two grounds and if both of them have been used  at the same time or one at the time  than hidden source of energy does not make any sense.!!!
(as  you already excluded that both grounds are connected at the same time)

_{resulting outcome if fallowed  Hoppy's analysis:} If one ground had hidden source of energy  and the other  didn't  - than Tariel device could  work only with  that particular one ground.
By that all of  work  and effort  made to  create another ground would be worthless and  automatically assigned to category of NONSENSE

I hope you  understand it.
by  that 

Statement :
"if one part of structure is proven  not valid, the whole body stops to be valid."
The only condition  for its  existence for now is by accepting human error - but you Hoppy do not want to admit it?

Of course you do not want to admit it.


This is physics not  home kitchen and we use logic to  understand physics.
I was scrutinized the same way  during  past 30 years my friend.

Wesley

[forest]

T-1000
I agree about particles injected, but first how they are injected and second : how they are created or maybe they are already here but dormant till excited (Don Smith).
In fact this could be as simple as photoelectric effect caused by concentrated "cosmic rays" - that is explanation of Henry Moray and Nikola Tesla. Cosmic radiation may be involved also indirectly, that's my hypothesis. Somebody with  knowledge and radio tools can easily prove Tesla radiant energy patent by using directed radio antenna, HV capacitor , HV diode or Avramenko plug and of course ground connection. Such experiments should already be in books. EM wave directed to polished and insulated metal plate connected to diode and one side of capacitor when other end is grounded should charge that cap (or AV plug used).