GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics

  • *Total Members: 82789
  • *Latest: mgh0466

  • *Total Posts: 500715
  • *Total Topics: 14850
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 0
  • *Guests: 41
  • *Total: 41

Author Topic: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant  (Read 11043 times)

Offline seychelles

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 423
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #75 on: May 20, 2018, 06:20:00 PM »
NOTHING MYSTERIOUS TO REPORT, BUT COPPER ENAMEL WIRE ARE
KNOWN NOT TO TERMINATE WELL. UNLESS YOU HAVE REMOVE AND
POLISH THE ENAMEL COATING OFF .THEN SOLDER TIN EACH ONE INDIVIDUALLY THEN SOLDERED
ALL TOGETHER..

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #76 on: May 20, 2018, 06:29:21 PM »
Hi seychelles, thanks for the helpful reply.
I did remove the enamel off each wire end, though i did not solder each one and then solder them all together, I just twisted them all together, then soldered.
Ok, i will desolder them and make sure each one is soldered, then solder them all together and then check ohms.
peace love light

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #77 on: May 20, 2018, 07:58:47 PM »
Hi all, just finished making sure each wire strand end was soldered well and then resoldered them all together and the total parallel resistance is still 1.1 ohms.
I also verified my meter is accurate by checking known resistor values.
Unless there is a short in the strands somewhere and when wired together in parallel, is causing this higher than normal ohm rating.
Still though, one would think that a short to another wire, would make it have even less ohm reading.
Otherwise, the coil has been working fine it seems, not sure what is going on.
peace love light :)

Edit: Ok, had the thought to check my meter, if i place the meter leads together, i can only read down to .9 ohms, so it is probably a meter limitation or issue.
 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #77 on: May 20, 2018, 07:58:47 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #78 on: May 20, 2018, 09:38:51 PM »
....
Edit: Ok, had the thought to check my meter, if i place the meter leads together, i can only read down to .9 ohms, so it is probably a meter limitation or issue.
Hi SkyWatcher,

Yes, the meter leads often trick the unsuspecting user: the banana plugs should be pulled out and then plug in again a few times and also they need some rotation left and right a few times when they are plugged in. Not every day but say in a few months time if not moved for long.
Also, I often find if I do not press the tips together strongly enough, then the meter does not show total zero. In this case you need to substract this non-zero value from the measured value.  Sometimes the rotary range switch is which needs cleaning, to do this, you have to dismantle the meter and clean the contacting surfaces with non invasive spay.
Once I also found a banana socket that was normally soldered into the printed circuit board of the meter got loose during the years and it needed careful resoldering. 

Returning to your earlier post where your averaged result yielded the 108 % charging efficiency, I wonder whether you have some explanation for it since then? 
The procedure with which you arrived at this number sounds correct.  It is interesting that in this 'splititng the negative'  RenĂ© circuit variant the Li type batteries seems to be more suited for the pulsing charge current than the lead acid types.  On more 'suited' I mean they have less internal impedance versus lead acid types hence less loss., if this is one of the explanations.

Question is whether the Li type batteries love pulse charging on the long run or their lifetime will be affected. I do not have info on this.

Do you think this circuit would still work with such high efficiency if the oscillator frequency would be low say in the range of 30 -70 Hz only? If yes, then the pulsing magnetic field of the oscillator coil core could be utilized in a pulse motor, by pushing rotor magnets in repel, maybe...  I am wondering of course.    8)   

Anyway, thanks for all your efforts.
Gyula

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #79 on: May 21, 2018, 08:21:36 AM »
Hi gyulasun, thanks for the very helpful reply.
I didn't think of that, subtracting the shorted probe value.
So it was actually flipping a little between .8-.9 ohms with the probes pressed hard together, that makes it fairlly close to the predicted parallel ohms of .29 ohms.

I think the load test efficiency went over COP 1, yes because of the low loss, low internal resistance lithium ion cells.
And that is with 3 in series, which means more loss, if they were in parallel, or a series parallel arrangment, it would be higher efficiency.

I did not notice any short term issues with the pulse charging, not sure about long term.
This circuit switches itself, so not sure how this particular circuit would work with a pulse motor, timing wise.


peace love light
« Last Edit: May 21, 2018, 06:42:41 PM by SkyWatcher123 »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #79 on: May 21, 2018, 08:21:36 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #80 on: May 21, 2018, 06:57:16 PM »
Hi SkyWatcher,

You wrote:  "This circuit switches itself, so not sure how this particular circuit would work with a pulse motor, timing wise."
Yes that is ok, it is an oscillator and I did not express myself fully correctly: I thought of a pulse motor which normally would be controlled by with say a reed switch and this reed switch would be inserted in series with the 1 MOhm base resistor in the oscillator.  So the oscillator would work at its own, high efficiency frequency and not at a low frequency as I said but only during the ON times of the reed switch. This way the coils magnetic field would be chopped up whenever repulson is needed between the rotor magnets and the core while the multiple flyback pulses during the reed ON times could be used for either charging or driving other stator coils etc.  Was just a thought, (Callahan and others have shown such circuits,) I not yet thought it over, the charging efficiency may prove to be less than with a normal continuously oscillating operation.   Let's forget I mentioned,  8)

Your transformator idea is good, and probably there is a limit in the number of LEDs how many of them could be driven in the same way without 'paying' for them.  The higher voltage side of such transformer normally has some ten Ohms of resistance, maybe less if you are lucky, this depends mainly on the power rating it was designed for originally. But if you have a few such transformers then you could drive their paralleled 12V coils together from the oscillator and their higher voltage outputs could drive further independent groups of LEDs.
Gyula

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #81 on: May 23, 2018, 05:35:53 PM »
Hi gyulasun, thanks for the reply.
That is a good idea, to use the rene/aum circuit with a reed or even a hall effect in a pulse motor.

The tranformer test was showing interesting results, until the charge battery passed a certain voltage, the led bulbs increased in brightness and then it started to affect the charging output.
Seems like when less energy is absorbed into the charge battery at closer to peak charging voltages, the flyback energy is then diverted to the led bulbs from the secondary coil to a greater degree.
Though it still did not affect the actual input to the circuit, most likely because the leds were not tapping energy from the primary input pulse.
I think the led bulbs were just using a small amount of the flyback power, then were using more toward end of charging, so it's an impedance matching thing happening.
peace love light

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #81 on: May 23, 2018, 05:35:53 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #82 on: May 24, 2018, 12:26:44 AM »
Hi SkyWatcher,

Yes, the output transistor with its open collector in most Hall sensors is npn and can be adopted simply by replacing  the 1 MOhm base resistor with it, to drive the pnp base in the oscillator.  A 10 kOhm resistor directly between the collector of the Hall and the base of the pnp transistor would be needed to limit the Hall transistor current.

I think you nicely described what you found with the step up transformator test in the oscillator, and I agree with your all deductions. How much part of the flyback pulse energy can go to the LEDs or to the charge battery surely depends on which of them has lower or higher impedance, just like in case of a voltage source that is loaded by two paralleled loads of differing values: more current would flow into the load having a lower impedance than the other load.

Gyula

Offline seychelles

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 423
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #83 on: May 24, 2018, 05:49:55 AM »
TO INCREASE THE EFFICIENCY FURTHER , JUST PUT A GLASS JAR WITH A
BALL NIB MAGNET ON TOP OF YOUR COIL..IF IT DOES NOT SPIN, JUST GIVE A SPIN START.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #83 on: May 24, 2018, 05:49:55 AM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #84 on: May 24, 2018, 07:13:58 AM »
Hi gyulasun,  thanks for the positive reply.
Yes, the pulse motor idea would be an interesting project..

Also, i weighed the 12 strand coil, it read 1 lb. 6 ounces, minus maybe an ounce for plastic end pieces.
Looking at the awg. wire chart, then the 12 strand in parallel, comes closer to .200 ohms,

I also tested a couple other coils.
Quickly built an 18awg. magnet wire air coil with at least 3" inner diamter and just taped 20 or so turns together,
measured similar .200 ohms.
That coil ran at fairly high frequency and caused the NPN transistor to heat up and it did not perform as well at similar input as the 12 strand coil.
Then tried a 24awg. single strand air coil, from a previous small newman motor project.
That coil is 14.5 ohms and did not perform as well as 12 strand and was low frequency, the coil also showed heating.

Am aware the multiple strand litz type coil has less losses at higher frequency direct current,
Seems this 12 strand coil works very well, what I've been thinking is, how would a larger coil perform in comparison.
Like maybe a 5-10 lb. coil made from insulated wire used for wiring houses, something with fairly thin insulation and large enough gauge and length to keep the coil below .5 ohms.
peace love light

Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #85 on: May 24, 2018, 11:04:27 AM »
Hello Seychelles,

Would you tell if you have already tested the ball magnet suggestion?
I ask because at first the spinning ball magnet idea sounds good: the friction of the ball is quasi negligibly
small on the hard glass surface and the air resistance is quasi ideally small.  On eddy current loss in the magnet:
well I am not fully sure on that but let's neglect it too.

Now to have an increase in efficiency of the oscillator setup, the spinning magnet should produce
more induced energy in the oscillator coil than the energy it takes from the coil for maintaining the
fast spinning.  Hmmm, this sounds interesting...So you may have found something interesting with
such tests,  I wonder?  I am open... and not nit-picking of course  :)
Thanks
Gyula

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #85 on: May 24, 2018, 11:04:27 AM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #86 on: May 24, 2018, 02:58:44 PM »
Hi SkyWatcher,

If you wish to check further on your 12 strand coil DC resistance, here is a good link on how to estimate less than 1 Ohm resistances in a simple way and with relatively good precision:
http://www.robotroom.com/Measuring-Low-Resistances.html 
It has a set of data at the bottom what resistance was calculated from the voltage drop measurements for instance for a 59 feet length of #14 gauge wire (0.153 Ohm) with respect to the expected range (0.136 to 0.159 Ohm).

Would like to show you an online air core coil calculator (you may be aware of it though). It is good because let you learn about several choices on wire gauge etc for just a chosen L inductance and includes the total wire lengths and DC resistances with differing coil radiuses which all give the same L inductance you entered. See here: http://www.colomar.com/Shavano/inductor_info.html
The program was made for air cored audio crossover coil calculations so the mechanical sizes for the coils are relatively big, though you may prefer such now.
It can give a good and quick overall view what can be expected 'size-wise'.

Here is another, similar calculator which (also for a given L inductance) let you choose bobbin's inner diameter and coil length for a wire gauge you choose. This calculator (or similar other multilayer ones online) can extend the size range limitations of the above crossover coil calculator if needed, that is all. There is an acceptable difference (5-6%) between the results of the two calculators.

Regarding on your pondering the use of insulated wire for coils, do you mean stranded copper wire?   like this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wire#/media/File:Stranded_lamp_wire.jpg or an insulated single wire? Unfortunately, it is hard to find a fairly thin insulation for making coils, maybe the use of the several strands of enameled copper wire is the good choice. Other insulation types may take up too much space when making multilayer coils, this may or may not cause further problems in coil performance.

Gyula

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #87 on: May 24, 2018, 07:23:06 PM »
Hi all, Hi gyulasun, than you for the very helpful web links, i will be using that resistor circuit to measure this 12 strand coil.
And the air coil calculator may come in handy.

I was thinking, maybe some 14awg. stranded copper house wire, might have a thin enough insulation to be useful in a large air coil and might give better charging performance.
Otherwise, i did find a spool in the closet with about 3 more pounds of 24awg. magnet wire.
The thing is, i was thinking about others that may find my ideas useful and I was wanting to make it easier to find the materials and make it easier to build.
Because building a 12 strand coil or greater is not very easy, if a large gauge off the shelf coil material could be used and maybe even give better performance, then it would be good.
It doesn't necessarily have to be some monstrous coil, maybe only a 2 pound coil would work well, testing would be needed.
Your thoughts appreciated as always.
peace love light :)

Offline SkyWatcher123

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 787
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #88 on: May 24, 2018, 10:27:41 PM »
Hi all, so was just looking at some house wire at menards.
Looks like for $20, can get 100 feet of 12awg., which works out to .17 ohms at 1.98 pounds.
And $25 for 100 feet of 10awg., for .1 ohms at 3.14 pounds.
Not too much cost to try this experiment.
Then i will use the air coil calculator, to get the best geometry.
Does anyone think one of these coils would work well enough to try.
peace love light

Offline gyulasun

  • without_ads
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
Re: Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant
« Reply #89 on: May 25, 2018, 12:31:09 AM »
Hi SkyWatcher,

I think a test coil from 12 AWG 100 feet wire could be risked.  Unfortunately I cannot comment this, have not made coils from such house wire.  I assume you choose the stranded wire instead of the solid type? 
Speaking of coils, there are crossover coils both with air and so called solid cores and maybe it is worth seeing such to get a feel on DC resistances and sizes and L inductances: https://www.parts-express.com/cat/crossover-inductors/296   

How do you mean to get the best coil geometry with the calculators?  Can you see such feature in them?  In the first link the program itself creates the sizes for the different wire gauges to achive the entered L inductance and in the 2nd link the user can enter certain sizes beside the L inductance.   Just curious, I do not know what geometry would be optimum here...

Gyula


 

OneLink