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Author Topic: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !  (Read 1595448 times)

Offline Fingal

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #285 on: February 07, 2007, 07:50:55 PM »
Well, it is not my position that is expressed on that website. If it was I would probably not be interested in visiting Overunity!

I scanned the forum once again and found that this exact method already has been proposed
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,1763.msg18947.html#msg18947.

(very good description). Sorry for not seeing that earlier.

I think the only relevance of the measurement is to test the original claim ( 12 times more output than input, and I think we agree he means energy), when for example do a simple task of pumping (lifting) water.

If however the OU is very small or would not manifest itself as output from the lever, I agree the test would not be valid to do. So one could argue that the the test is only valid of it shows OU of great magnitude!

Also the test may not be relevant for your ongoing discussion. I didn't mean to interfere or interrupt you actions!

Last, why does the author of the website do these rather complicated calculations  instead of just building it and do the test. Of course, he doesn't believe it is OU, in the first place!

Myself, I am just a bit lazy and enjoy surfing the web for interesting ideas.

regards.
Fingal






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Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #286 on: February 07, 2007, 09:50:02 PM »
I don't believe this is 1200% efficient. Its just not... I don't even claim this mechanical device is even overunity at all, but I do believe this device violates the laws of thermodynamics. Excess energy is being created by the lever and is transfered to the pendulum. When the device comes to a rest the lever reassumes its starting position. Therefore no additional energy is given to either the pendulum or lever to achieve this potential to kinetic transfer. I'm sorry for assuming you were nay saying, but many people have come and posted things claiming it proves this system doesn't work, but no one has posted anything substantial thus far. Overunity is a long ways off for this device, I just want to understand the energy transfer that allows the pendulum to collect excess energy from the lever.

~Dingus

p.s. Get a copy WM2D!

Offline Charlie_V

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #287 on: February 08, 2007, 04:45:49 AM »
Hey guys, I found this form while wasting some time and I like it.  Its fun to imagine ideas and have people to talk to about them without being laughed at. 

I looked at the video and I found it very interesting.  I don't think this device is over-unity, but it appears to be a very clever use of harmonic coupling and leverage (of sorts).  The pendulum is shifting the beam 's center of mass in and out of the central axial.  You'll notice the pendulum traverses a large distance (compared to the beam).  The beam takes that large distance and converts the kinetic energy to force.  You'll notice the beam only moves about an inch or so but has great force behind it.  So the energy is roughly the same (neglecting losses) but in a different form.  The pendulum has a small force, but large distance to travel (comparatively of course), the beam has a small travel distance but large force. 

The harmonic coupling of the two objects is interesting too.  You'll notice in the intro of the video (where the Serbian guy is demonstrating with a toy), that he sets the toy up in his pendulum/beam configuration and says that the load has no effect.  However, you'll also notice he has to re-adjust the configuration because the pendulum was slowing down fast.  This just shows that the pendulum is coupled to the beam.  If you could put a force on the beam at the right time you could cause the pendulum to stop moving.  By re-adjusting where the pendulum sits, you can reduce the coupling (making the vibration of the beam not effect the pendulum as much) but you will restrict the distance the beam can travel.  All in all, this seems to me to be a very efficient way of gearing without the worry of slips or tears! 

Personally, I feel an over-unity device is going to come from something that stores energy yet does not give that energy when used - like a magnet does when you induce a voltage.  The magnet has stored energy yet the field does not decrease when you induce a current in a coil.... I've always found this phenomenon very very interesting. 

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #287 on: February 08, 2007, 04:45:49 AM »
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Offline FreeEnergy

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #288 on: February 08, 2007, 12:10:31 PM »
not much of a new approach but the results look good.

Offline exnihiloest

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #289 on: February 09, 2007, 11:29:40 AM »
Hi All,

I have modeled Milkovic pendulum using WM2D.

All the stuff is here:
- model
http://exvacuo.free.fr/Sciences/Experiences/Pendule/PenduleMilkovic.wm2d
- picture
http://exvacuo.free.fr/Sciences/Experiences/Pendule/PenduleMilkovic.jpg
- low motion video simulation
http://exvacuo.free.fr/Sciences/Experiences/Pendule/PenduleMilkovic.avi

In this model, the pendulum is used to pull up a weight (pay load), attached to the lever with a string. Thus the potential energy of the pay load will give us the energy gain.

Each time the pay load climbs, a platform is positionned upper and upper in order to prevent the load to fall back. The platform is playing no role in the energy balance.

The energy (kinetic+potential) of the pendulum and of the lever is monitored and the potential energy of the pay load is substracted from it to give the total energy gain.

It is fund that the energy gain is null. It is even a bit negative because I neglected the very weak kinetic energy of the pay load.

The weight of the lever can be 0 (actual simulation) or any value, it doesn't change the null result.

As Milkovic doesn't claim new physics to explain its machine and as its machine modeled according the current physics laws doesn't work, we can conclude there is no OU in Milkovic pendulum. It is just a usefull device to transform a form of work into another.

Fran?ois






Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #289 on: February 09, 2007, 11:29:40 AM »
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Offline FreeEnergy

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #290 on: February 09, 2007, 12:20:42 PM »
hey guys take a look at the acceleration of rectangle 19.

.sorry if this is of no help.

Offline theratboy

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #291 on: February 15, 2007, 09:26:28 AM »
this is not overunity,
its a gravity motor...it makes use of earths attract force
this means this particular generator will only work in places where gravity exists,
for space applications a flywheel made of magnets and inductors providing current will do the trick(flywheels dont slow down in space because there isnt any gravity force that slows down)

i cant believe we had this in front of our noses all this time...

btw..its not such a good idea to recolect energy from the moving piston in order to store it and impulse it again w/ a magnet or w/e

its a better idea to keep spinning a flywheel with the up-down movement and moving and pushing the pendulum once every 3-12 cycles, depends of how efficient you build the model

and im not even merging this w/ bendini's (imagine a working concep with a flywheel made of magnets =]

i dont think NASA will certainly pay much attention to this,

i haven't read all these post, if this was already discussed, just ignore me...im just trying to post tips :)

lol had months wanting to post something but was afraid
« Last Edit: February 15, 2007, 09:49:36 AM by theratboy »

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #291 on: February 15, 2007, 09:26:28 AM »
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Offline hartiberlin

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #292 on: February 16, 2007, 02:27:15 PM »
Has somebody done lately any rebuilding work on this machine ?

I mean real try to replicate it , not just in WM2D software ?

I always see the oscillations slowing down in theWM2D screenshots,
but did not have the time to have a closer look...
SO should theoscillations not rise, if it is an overunity machine ?

Please post real pics of real rebuild machines.
Many thanks in advance.

Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #293 on: February 17, 2007, 12:43:18 AM »
No physical replications so far, but from the collective wm2d sims, I've determined this isn't even close overunity. It does appear to run more efficiently than a standard pendulum, so my theory is its a small 2nd law violation, but thats heavily debated.

There are far too many promising projects to invest anymore time in this.

~Dingus

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #293 on: February 17, 2007, 12:43:18 AM »
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Offline i_ron

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #294 on: February 17, 2007, 05:47:32 AM »
Has somebody done lately any rebuilding work on this machine ?

I mean real try to replicate it , not just in WM2D software ?

I always see the oscillations slowing down in theWM2D screenshots,
but did not have the time to have a closer look...
SO should the oscillations not rise, if it is an overunity machine ?

Please post real pics of real rebuild machines.
Many thanks in advance.

I have not previously posted to this forum because of the inane level of the posts.

But here is my effort to date. I have taken a different approach and felt compelled
to power the pendulum as a first step. The picture shows an 18 Kg pendulum being
powered with an 11 watt motor.

Best regards,

Ron

 


Offline i_ron

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #295 on: February 17, 2007, 06:14:26 AM »


I have not previously posted to this forum because of the inane level of the posts.

But here is my effort to date. I have taken a different approach and felt compelled
to power the pendulum as a first step. The picture shows an 18 Kg pendulum being
powered with an 11 watt motor.

Best regards,

Ron

 All the simulations to date seem to have missed the point. This is a two stage
mechanical oscillator.

Here is a picture from the back before the weight was doubled and before the
counter weight was installed. It was a motor test and incidentally the 9 Kg weight
was kept in motion (120? plus) with only 5? watts.

R






[/quote]

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #295 on: February 17, 2007, 06:14:26 AM »
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Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #296 on: February 17, 2007, 06:22:20 AM »
A very nice prototype...

So the motor will only turn untill the pendulum trips the pressure switch, then gravity takes over again. I also like that your counter weight is adjustable, as well as the levers pivet point. So I assume the pannel box is you speed controler. How has your system harmonics hunt going? Congrats again on the really dynamic design job.

Glad to see someone is really putting a propper effort in to exploring this technology.

Best design and prototype I've seen in a while,
~Dingus

Offline i_ron

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #297 on: February 17, 2007, 06:41:24 AM »
A very nice prototype...

So the motor will only turn untill the pendulum trips the pressure switch, then gravity takes over again. I also like that your counter weight is adjustable, as well as the levers pivet point. So I assume the pannel box is you speed controler. How has your system harmonics hunt going? Congrats again on the really dynamic design job.

Glad to see someone is really putting a propper effort in to exploring this technology.

Best design and prototype I've seen in a while,
~Dingus

Thanks for th kind words, Dingus,

The blue box holds the logic and the Fet to pulse the motor.

The motor has one coil and three magnets on each rotor. To fire the coil only on the down swing I chose to use a quadrature encoder, as seen in this picture on the front.

The opto's for the coil are just ahead of the motor. When the secondary beam is
allowed to oscillate also, it requires more input to the motor, no surprise here.
To accommodate this I added two more windows to the opto's and two more magnets
to the motor from my original four magnet two window 5 watt model... and a doubling of the weight. This is just enough power to allow a limited vertical displacement of the pendulum pivot point. The counter weight is two 25 pound bar bell weights.

At this time I have not attempted to extract power from the secondary arm, rather
I have been side tracked back to a couple of previous generator projects. I will not
post more on this until such time as I have "caught up".

R

Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #298 on: February 17, 2007, 07:31:18 AM »
Well if you ever have a digital video to post please be sure to bring it here. I'm quite curious to see the phases of the pendulum and lever. Good luck on your current experiments.

~Dingus

Offline helmut

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #299 on: February 17, 2007, 12:48:03 PM »
Hello
I guess.that we search the unknown truth.
The Computer is raltity and the Programs to do the calkulations as well.
But we should remember,that we search for the unknown,which is not Reality (yet)
Not the Computer sets the Level,but our Minds.
So please do not devote the Developers ans Searchers.

Helmut

 

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