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Author Topic: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !  (Read 1659192 times)

Offline Merg

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2175 on: July 31, 2014, 12:39:49 PM »
Pendulum Water Pump (Philippines)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONgcf1a9PfE

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Offline Merg

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2176 on: August 16, 2014, 08:02:26 PM »
New videos from R.Head:

escapement improvments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1RbpflZ8RU

TSO problems to avoid
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuFXvJbkviA

Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2177 on: September 12, 2014, 02:45:32 PM »
 http://www.overunity.com/7443/closing-the-loop-on-milkovics-two-stage-mechanical-oscillator/
Start from reply 21…
 
In analyzing the Milkovic 2 stage pendulum as shown on youtube:
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC6Qlj1Mbo8
 
 We noted that after 2.30 minutes, a single push by the hand will lift the weight twice. On close examination, the lifting of the Weight appeared to be when the pendulum bob is swinging with the maximum velocity at the vertical position.

In Physics, work is done (energy is spent) only when there is displacement.  In this case, the output is the lifting of the weight.

 
 It should now be clear to all experimenters that any overunity measurement or loopback mechanism MUST be done at large angles when the weight is actually lifted.

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2177 on: September 12, 2014, 02:45:32 PM »
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Offline iacob alex

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2178 on: September 12, 2014, 04:10:32 PM »
 Hi 888 !
Why not to play the largest possible angle ? ( inverted pendulum ).
 Al_ex

Offline iacob alex

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2179 on: September 12, 2014, 07:20:20 PM »

 Hi 888 !
Why not to play the largest possible angle ? ( starting as a free inverted pendulum ).
 Al_ex

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2179 on: September 12, 2014, 07:20:20 PM »
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Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2180 on: September 13, 2014, 12:33:08 AM »
 
Hi 888 !
 Why not to play the largest possible angle ? ( starting as a free inverted pendulum ).
 Al_ex
 
@Al_ex,
The largest possible angle will be the next stage.  In the next stage, the pendulum will be replaced by an unbalanced wheel.
 
At this stage, it is only necessary to show that the Input Energy by the fingers is less than the Output Energy as shown by the lifting of the Weight (twice).  Success at this stage will indicate overunity.  Note that the electromagnet can be placed in a fixed position to repel the magnetic pendulum bob when it rises to the exact position.  The Weight to be lifted and/or the lever arm can be adjusted so that the system is in balance (or in resonance).  This means that the process can be repeated exactly with the pulsing of the electromagnet to provide Input Energy.  That Input Energy plus the Lead-out Energy will provide the Output Energy in lifting the Weight and overcome friction and air resistance.
The large setup in the video or similar is a good candidate for the experiment.
 
I attached the figure showing the large angle to do such an experiment.  Has any experimenter used such large angles?

 
The tension of the pendulum string does the magic twice – leads-out gravitational energy during the push and lifts the Weight with centripetal force when the velocity is highest.

Offline markdansie

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2181 on: September 13, 2014, 04:48:28 AM »
Hi 888
I admire you tenacity and good nature in your pursuit of free energy or overunity. I also find your posts entertaining. However is in not time to do some reflection on your claims, theories and assumptions made over the years that have always never panned out? Perhaps with a review you may see some common areas with miscalculations, misleading assumptions and incorrect conclusions. This may prove to be very valuable by learning from past mistakes in order to assist you in your endeavors in the future. Otherwise we are just faced with the usual garbage in garbage out.
Never stop, I encourage you and everyone else, but sit back and learn from past mistakes.
Kind Regards
Mark Dansie

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2181 on: September 13, 2014, 04:48:28 AM »
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Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2182 on: September 13, 2014, 06:40:05 AM »
Hi 888
I admire you tenacity and good nature in your pursuit of free energy or overunity. I also find your posts entertaining. However is in not time to do some reflection on your claims, theories and assumptions made over the years that have always never panned out? Perhaps with a review you may see some common areas with miscalculations, misleading assumptions and incorrect conclusions. This may prove to be very valuable by learning from past mistakes in order to assist you in your endeavors in the future. Otherwise we are just faced with the usual garbage in garbage out.
Never stop, I encourage you and everyone else, but sit back and learn from past mistakes.
Kind Regards
Mark Dansie
http://www.alternate-energy.net/Dvid/view.php?video=ArX7BDY1XRM&title=The+225+HP+Pulse+Motor
 
I posted that video in 2006.  That pulse motor was from USA and I explained its operation at Tsinghua University.  I also explained the Energy Multiplier from Tsinghua using the Lead-out energy theory.  I was investigated as a US spy when I returned to Hong Kong.
 
Now I have grounds to believe that Pulse Motor was real and used in Army Tanks in China!  I shall review my theory and calculations.  Since I already have a work bench at Overunityresearch.com, I shall put the updates there.  Those who want to see the reviews and check the calulations can visit that site.  No comments are allowed at that site but those who want to comment can post here or in a new thread.
 
The large Milkovic 2 stage pendulum video convinced me that if we treat the finger push as Input and the twice lifting of the Weight as Output, we should have Output > Input.  My old mathematical treatment of this pendulum was wrong as it did not consider the moments correctly.  I shall revise that.
 
God Bless.

Offline Paul-R

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2183 on: September 13, 2014, 01:44:18 PM »

if we treat the finger push as Input

and the twice lifting of the Weight as Output



"the finger push as Input" = force x distance moved

"the twice lifting of the Weight as Output" = m x g x h   (twice)

The fact that the weight's potential energy is not saved, but reverts to some noise and heat when it descends makes no difference. I am sure this is right.

The weight's PE needs to be saved and made to do useful work by some means.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2183 on: September 13, 2014, 01:44:18 PM »
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Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2184 on: September 13, 2014, 02:28:32 PM »

"the finger push as Input" = force x distance moved

"the twice lifting of the Weight as Output" = m x g x h   (twice)

The fact that the weight's potential energy is not saved, but reverts to some noise and heat when it descends makes no difference. I am sure this is right.

The weight's PE needs to be saved and made to do useful work by some means.
@Paul-R,
 
For the first stage experiment, we just compare the Input Energy with the Output energy.  The Output energy dissipated as noise is acceptable.  The video makes it very convincing that Input Energy is less than Output Energy.  We just need to confirm it with more scientific measurements.
 
The best point from the video is that overunity can only be demonstrated at large angles with such setup....

Offline iacob alex

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2185 on: September 13, 2014, 03:11:14 PM »
     Hi. 888 !
Let's make the simplest test.
We can take out an inverted pendulum , from :
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_pendulum#/image/File:Cart-pendulum.svg
...and replace the hanging pendulum ( red mass ) with this one ( as a starting position ) , at :
http://u2.lege.net/John_Keely/keelytech.com/news/oscillations/secondary.gif
I suppose that , we can  play in this manner , a different kind of motion...maybe erratic swinging ( see swinging sticks model...) , maybe a surprising one.
      Al_ex

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2185 on: September 13, 2014, 03:11:14 PM »
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Offline Paul-R

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2186 on: September 13, 2014, 05:27:22 PM »
The video makes it very convincing that Input Energy is less than Output Energy.
I don't think it is safe to conclude this. It takes very little energy to  make a very loud bang. I think  work  needs to be done to  quantify the output rigorously.

Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2187 on: September 13, 2014, 06:21:26 PM »
     Hi. 888 !
Let's make the simplest test.
We can take out an inverted pendulum , from :
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverted_pendulum#/image/File:Cart-pendulum.svg
...and replace the hanging pendulum ( red mass ) with this one ( as a starting position ) , at :
http://u2.lege.net/John_Keely/keelytech.com/news/oscillations/secondary.gif
I suppose that , we can  play in this manner , a different kind of motion...maybe erratic swinging ( see swinging sticks model...) , maybe a surprising one.
      Al_ex
The mathematical analysis and the experiments will be based on the attached diagram with reference to the video in:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gC6Qlj1Mbo8
 
The first simplification will use P as horizontal.  The final will use P as tangential.  The tension in the string will be the sum of the static force and the centripetal force due to circular motion.  Expect overunity only at large angles from both analysis and experiment.

Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2188 on: September 14, 2014, 12:00:10 AM »
One question raised by a Chinese Experimenter:
 
Must I build a large 2-stage Milkovic Oscillator to detect or confirm overunity?  Can I build a small model in the laboratory?
 
Answer: When we first pulse the pendulum, the Weight W1 will not rise at all.  The Input Energy and Lead-out Energy are all used to increase the amplitude of the Swing.  After sufficient build-up, the Weight W1 can be lifted (twice).  Output can then be easily measured.  The pulsing energy (Pd) is very small.  Thus a large 2-stage Milkovic Oscillator is needed to provide a large enough (Pd) for experiment.
 
Even after the Weight W1 is lifted, there is likely to be some tuning to achieve best results.  The adjustment can be via changing the mass of W1 or the Lever Arm L1.  Too small a model will not permit such tuning.
 
This answer is likely to apply to the Pulse Motor later on.  The wheel should be large or multiple coupled wheels like the 225 HP motor needs to be used.

Offline ltseung888

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Re: 12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !
« Reply #2189 on: September 14, 2014, 11:56:55 PM »
One comment:
The OUTPUT Energy of the Milkovic 2-stage pendulum is NOT the W1 times g times the total height.  The swinging lever is an oscillating system (seesaw).  That oscillating system also converts potential energy into kinetic energy and vice versa. 
 
What should be the correct OUTPUT Energy?

 

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