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DR,The excess energy your sim indicates is being supplied by the energy contained in C1. If you check the initial condition of C1 prior to running the sim, it will indicate C1 has 10v dc applied. If you plot this voltage over time, you will see that it decreases as C1 supplies energy to the circuit. If you then calculate this energy loss, add it to you input energy consumed from V1 and then compare to the output energy across R1, you will find the COP<1.Regards,Pm
Ok that was interesting and so I had to check that although the software uses AC analysis on this capacitor and shows that it starts off at 0V and charges up over time. Furthermore the output of the circuit is AC and any DC in the capacitor would have nothing to do with the AC output through a transformer into R1. Here is the analysis of C1 note I am using an updated model I have been working on where the capacitors are renamed in a logical order so C1 is now C2 and this is the charge up plot of the circuit.At the moment that this capacitor fully charges about 6.4 seconds into the simulation a 7.6 Hz oscillation begins that places a charge on C1 in this circuit (connected to D1 and L1) that increases the charge on C1 to 22V and then the requirement for power from V1 is diminished down to 380 micro-watt, since the circuit now has 22V DC as the power input, that is in the simulation I have for download here:http://overunity.com/17603/a-half-baked-idea-re-envisioned/
DR,All your previous sims on this thread prior to my post #6 were run in the transient mode not AC. The difference being that initial dc conditions are taken into account prior to simulation in the transient mode but not taken into account in the ac mode. In regards to your apparent OU it really doesn't matter as energy is still required to charge C1 and must be taken into account.For example I've attached two sims of your circuit with both taken in the transient mode. BTW, let me explain that V3 is a zero voltage source which is used as a lossless current sensor.In the first pix, C1 has an initial voltage of 10v dc due to being coupled to V1 thru L1,L2, and L3. The plot cursor for V(vc1) shows that C1 has dropped to 9.9997311v at the end of the simulation which equates to a loss of (10^2 - 9.9997311^2) *1 *.5 = 2.689mJ. The plot math shows an input energy consumed of 3.024mJ and an output energy of 5.397mJ. Therefore the COP = 5.397/(2.689 + 3.024) = .944 .The second pix has an initial condition command which set the starting voltage across C1 and the starting current thru L1 to zero which now allows the circuit to start with zero dc voltage or current conditions which would be equivalent to the start in an AC mode simulation. C2 is disconnected to clean up the plot as it has no effect on these energy measurements. Now we can see C1 or V(vc1) starting to charge from V1 and we see an ending voltage of ~4.362v which equates to an energy level of ~9.51J. The plot math shows an input consumption of 43.75J with the output energy produced being only 77.51mJ. As I previously stated, you must account for the energy in C1 to arrive at an accurate conclusion as to whether the device is OU or not. Regards,Pm
I like the simulation but its still not the same circuit, you need to add D1 and C1 as I have it in the last circuit diagram I post before yours here, I would like to see that simulation and have a copy to run if that is ok. But this information so far is helpful, please not that D1 and C1 in the last circuit model are a part of what I have been doing with this circuit.
OK, here is your latest circuit with several changes to the sim. R2 was added to help the sim converge thus speeding it up plus, I removed the "skip initial operating point" (uic) in the simulation command as it produced a large current transient at startup due to the charging of C5 from V1 which then reduced the plot viewing amplitude of any subsequent current traces. I have also added the initial command statement (.ic) however so C1 starts with no charge. Also, V(tp1) is offset 10v to separate it from V(vc1) for ease of viewing. These changes in no way affect the overall energy measurements of the simulation.The sim plot has both cursors on V(vc1) which indicates the voltage change on C1. Cursor1 is placed at the point when the voltage on C1 is at it's peak and cursor2 is placed at the end of the sim. The energy lost In C1 between these cursors is (22.712025^2-21.424129^2) *1 * .5 = 28.42J.The plot math shows the input energy over the 60s period to be 273.5J and the output energy produced in R1 is 27.955J. So, the COP = 27.995/(28.42+273.5) = .093.For observation, the large amount of energy consumed from start to 6.46s is mostly to charge C1. From that point on, C1 supplies nearly all the energy to the circuit and is depleted over time. We have also neglected the energy to initially charge C5 to 12v which would amount to 7.2mJ.I have attached the .asc file for you to play with.Regards,Pm
The plot math shows the input energy over the 60s period to be 273.5J and the output energy produced in R1 is 27.955J. So, the COP = 27.995/(28.42+273.5) = .093.
Beautiful work as usual pm. Where does the excess input energy go, then? Is it dissipated in the internal resistances of components such as the transistor and R2? Can we be sure that these resistances aren't dissipating more than they "should"? I haven't looked at the sim files myself so I don't know where all the power-dissipating components are.
Ok I will look at the simulation and thank you I appreciate the file.