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Author Topic: The secret to Overunity  (Read 33430 times)

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #45 on: December 19, 2017, 04:56:23 AM »
I have to take a step outside of conventional electricity when it comes to static induction machines


Science tries their best to relate the two technologies.
They even go so far as to mimick the other, with step-up transformers
And capacitor cascades


But it is still not the same. We still cannot tame the static, anymore than we can bring our
Electricity to life.


Period.


The old form of energy directly affects physical matter.
It comes explicitly in two phases.
I know these to be electrons, and positrons.


Our electricity only uses one half.


It's about that simple.


We don't have the technology to prove it, or I should I say our technology is not capable.
Because it only uses half.


But I can prove it atomically, and I can prove it by the effects it has on physical matter.
Our form of electricity cannot.


We can make a positron now, with our particle accelerators and high powered lasers
Mathematically they are the same thing that is in our "positive" Leyden jar.


Vitreous
And
Resinous


Electrons
And
Positrons


The two together are E=mc^2
Electron = 1/2mc^2 or 1.602 x 10^-19 J


I'm not sure if opening one end of two capacitors (+/-) would be the same thing....
One to ground, one to +
But you would have to run a secondary identical circuit off the two open leads.
And allow the induced voltages to oscillate 180-degrees out of phase.





Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #45 on: December 19, 2017, 04:56:23 AM »

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #46 on: December 19, 2017, 05:38:52 AM »
I have tamed the static.

Some of it anyway.   8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-aP7sk48jw

Offline blueplanet

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #47 on: December 19, 2017, 08:01:55 AM »
You are right if you are talking about a closed circuit. The total energy should be from the source if the environment factor remains normal.










“Subject To losses”?
That’s your explanation?


Power is power. V*I


Whatever is lost after that is subtracted from the total.
It doesn’t change the total energy involved.


At what size does a static-electric generator
Equal to the power of a conventional steam-electric generator?


And how much “energy” has to be put into each to achieve this power?


“Static” is only static until you allow it to move.
In the same manner that the potential energy of a battery is “static”.
The same can be said of any capacitor.


The condenser can dump 100% of its energy at one time.
The ‘actual current’ is a large spike. The ‘average current over time’
Is the value commonly used, this is why it is often micro amps in quantity.
Instantaneous current is all induction cares about.
This is an important distinction when dealing with high frequencies.


You can melt steel with a ‘static’ discharge.
To do this with a conventional generator connected to an arc welder
Requires exponentially greater quantities of energy.


The math is available for both of these situations.


If we take an absolute value for the energy required, it becomes apparent that
Our conventional generator and arc welder are less than 1% efficient.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #47 on: December 19, 2017, 08:01:55 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline blueplanet

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #48 on: December 19, 2017, 08:09:15 AM »

I am not sure what you are talking about.
From what i can see there is no secret here if your circuit is a simple closed circuit. No secret means that there is no OU.  [size=78%]There is nothing abnormal unless R<=0.[/size]
[size=78%]
[/size]





Formula 2) The Charge on capacitor Q = C* V_source*[1-Exponential(-t/RC)]

This is again great secret for those who can see. Notice how the charge (ie. the energy) overtime is defined in relation only the voltage of the source , R , and C . No mention of current here because it doesn't affect the charge on the cap. Only voltage does. You don't believe it ? look again at the formula. The overunity secret is right there.



Offline forest

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #49 on: December 19, 2017, 08:47:43 AM »
The overunity secret is magnetic field

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #49 on: December 19, 2017, 08:47:43 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline sm0ky2

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #50 on: December 19, 2017, 01:12:07 PM »
I have tamed the static.

Some of it anyway.   8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-aP7sk48jw




Nice
So the ball rides the cone of the cup like a belt-transmission?
Larger radius = higher up the cup it goes?

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #51 on: December 19, 2017, 01:39:09 PM »
You are right if you are talking about a closed circuit. The total energy should be from the source if the environment factor remains normal.




The environmental factor (in most conditions) is relatively infinite.
We live in a sea of electrons and positrons
Even the parts of the machines themselves become entangled in the process.


If you wanted to get technical, the ‘source’ is the environment
The static machine simply provides a mechanism for transfer.
99% of the energy we use to initiate the charge differential
Can be attributed to friction. And has nothing to do with the process.
If a good insulator is used, there is no “cling”, and the action of separation
Has no opposing force.


In a rotary machine, rotational momentum dominates.
The faster the rotation, the higher the voltage
But the flywheels are easier to turn in this condition.


Our modern generators become harder to turn at full production
This is because our brute force methodology holds one half still while
forcing the other like a pump.


I think in order to reduce the greater part of our energy losses
(the portion of energy that is lost to heat and magnetism in our devices)
We need to create technology that uses both electrical forces.


The field equations are exactly the same, you simply change the sign of the charges.


Consider the dual-plate condenser, and notice how the secondary plates were connected
they form an independent circuit, each side has the opposite charge of each jar
And a transitional current develops to keep the charges balanced to a ‘middle voltage’
if we think of this now as our “ground”, we can begin to think about the type of technology
we should be designing. (butterfly/leaf/mirror image?)








Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #51 on: December 19, 2017, 01:39:09 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline Tajerek

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #52 on: December 19, 2017, 09:31:17 PM »
Would be nice if it so easy, but u are wrong.

Formula 4) The time taken to fully charge a cap from a voltage source is 5*R*C

Yes, formula is true but in your schematics R is very low like a short circuit. So I=U/R, that means a huge amount of current.....
That's Ok it means it charges faster. Then once the Cap is charged it acts like an open circuit to DC. You HV module shouldn't have a short circuit breaker.

Offline Tajerek

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #53 on: December 19, 2017, 10:29:55 PM »

The charge TIME is to be consider for the power transfer..  Look at scopes shot of a disruptive high voltage trough a spark gap and the RAISING TIME occupy most of the screen..  The relation between the L1 and L2 is directly related to raise and surge of L1 because L2 has it`s capacitance and is acting 180 degree trough the curent cycle... This will give the L2 a more sinusoidal wave given a full amplitude.

You lower the charge time by increasing the voltage (even way beyond the rating of the cap) and reducing the R. this means you have to pick low ESR cap. I won't go into the formulas and calculations to prove it but you can test and see.

You will probably ask how come I raise voltage way beyond the rating of my cap ? won't that bend the plates of the cap and it fries and becomes a deadshort ?! well No as long as you are discharging it as soon as it fills up. That's what the spark gap does.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #53 on: December 19, 2017, 10:29:55 PM »
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Offline Void

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #54 on: December 20, 2017, 12:10:06 AM »
You lower the charge time by increasing the voltage (even way beyond the rating of the cap) and reducing the R. this means you have to pick low ESR cap. I won't go into the formulas and calculations to prove it but you can test and see.

Hi Tejerek. Again, lowering the charge time will not in any way bypass the energy consumption
from the input power source required to charge up a given capacitor to a given voltage. This has
already been pointed out to you. ;)

Rather than suggesting other people test your false assumptions for you, why not do some
basic testing with capacitors yourself and you should quickly see where you are going wrong in your assumptions.
It will not work as you say. This thread should more appropriately be called 'The secret to self-deception'.
Sorry, but for someone to claim to know how to achieve OU when they obviously haven't even done the most basic
testing of their assumptions is silly.

All the best...
« Last Edit: December 20, 2017, 02:55:26 AM by Void »

Offline citfta

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #55 on: December 20, 2017, 12:31:41 AM »
You lower the charge time by increasing the voltage (even way beyond the rating of the cap) and reducing the R. this means you have to pick low ESR cap. I won't go into the formulas and calculations to prove it but you can test and see.

You will probably ask how come I raise voltage way beyond the rating of my cap ? won't that bend the plates of the cap and it fries and becomes a deadshort ?! well No as long as you are discharging it as soon as it fills up. That's what the spark gap does.

Applying too high of a voltage to a cap will NOT bend the plates.  What is does is punch a hole in the dielectric and short out the cap.  If the current is high enough it can cause the dielectric to burst into flames and make the cap explode with a very loud bang.  And the voltage applied can damage the cap before it fills up.   As has already been pointed out to you at least a couple of times you really need to do some basic research before you start expounding theories about OU.  Then you would realize that you don't really understand the formulas.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #55 on: December 20, 2017, 12:31:41 AM »
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Online AlienGrey

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #56 on: December 20, 2017, 01:58:16 AM »
Applying too high of a voltage to a cap will NOT bend the plates.  What is does is punch a hole in the dielectric and short out the cap.  If the current is high enough it can cause the dielectric to burst into flames and make the cap explode with a very loud bang.  And the voltage applied can damage the cap before it fills up.   As has already been pointed out to you at least a couple of times you really need to do some basic research before you start expounding theories about OU.  Then you would realize that you don't really understand the formulas.
  Ok your a skeptic  who only belies what an expert official tells you right! (that's what you have just told me above well what if i charge up a 100uf  450v valve amp smoothing cap and throw it to you to catch, (shock horror) ever get some one do just that when you were a kid (apprentice) , ? no well what if i dump the energy across a Tesla coil primary ? what would it do if i put your phone in the middle of the coil ? perhaps you could explain whats just happened to the phone ?               

Offline sm0ky2

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #57 on: December 20, 2017, 02:47:55 AM »
Applying too high of a voltage to a cap will NOT bend the plates.  What is does is punch a hole in the dielectric and short out the cap.  If the current is high enough it can cause the dielectric to burst into flames and make the cap explode with a very loud bang.  And the voltage applied can damage the cap before it fills up.   As has already been pointed out to you at least a couple of times you really need to do some basic research before you start expounding theories about OU.  Then you would realize that you don't really understand the formulas.


A spark gap is a voltage controller
It doesn’t matter what your source voltage is


Once the cap reaches the break-down voltage of the gap
It will dump


I can connect a 1Mv machine to a 100v cap
With a small spark gap, the cap will never over voltage


There is no measurable current from a 1Mv static machine
It discharges instantaneously through any insulator or conductor
(well, almost any)
But it will fill a large condenser almost fast as the discharge


It happens way too fast to measure the current,
And if you did manage to get a numerical value
The time-reference divides it back to 0
Because it all took place in a tiny fraction of a second.


I’ve tried making stupid 5-gallon buckets, and 50-gallon
plastic water drums
You’re more likely to kill yourself with stuff like that
Than you are to actually hold over 1Mv in its place.
It’s better just to use it straight off the machine like
Tesla did, to make 10-15 foot lightning
Or excite atoms, like a gas lamp tube, or an ionic reaction.


If you want to convert the energy into our modern electricity
(you are throwing half of it away, but for the humor)
You should use a cap with a much smaller voltage than
your hv generator puts out.
Control it with the frequency




Offline Void

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #58 on: December 20, 2017, 02:53:44 AM »
Ok your a skeptic  who only belies what an expert official tells you right!     

From what I have seen Citfta is not at all that kind of 'skeptic' (a debunker). :) He does his own
OU experimenting from what I understand. I think his view is probably similar to mine. Open minded
about OU research, but understands well that you have to put things to proper testing before you can
attempt to draw any meaningful conclusions.

There is a huge difference between debunkers who dismiss everything related to OU out of hand,
and healthy skepticism where one neither dismisses nor believes unless something can be proven
by proper bench testing. IMO, the OU research area needs much more healthy skepticism and a lot less people
just making claims without being able to demonstrate anything to support what they are saying. ;)
There is just way too much silliness going around in these forums and on Youtube, etc. :)
No wonder many people assume that only gullible or deluded people or frauds are involved in the search for COP > 1.  ;D

All the best...


Offline citfta

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Re: The secret to Overunity
« Reply #59 on: December 20, 2017, 03:13:36 AM »
AG,

My post was based on over 50 years of experience with caps.  I retired from a career of working in electronics.  There are no "plates" in a normal capacitor.  There are layers of foil wrapped around each other with the dielectric material in between.  When I was a kid my dad had a TV repair shop.  He would let us have the bad condensers as they were called then.  They were coated in wax.  We peeled that wax off and unrolled the foil across the yard.  So I know first hand what they are.  And the rest of your post doesn't appear to have anything to do with what I posted.

Smokey2,

You can't have it both ways.  You're claiming the spark gap will limit the voltage and I agree.  But Tajarek is claiming he can go over voltage to charge the cap faster.  You can't go over voltage if the spark gap is limiting the voltage.  So I still maintain that you will blow some caps and possibly be injured if you insist on trying to charge them with over voltage.  I have seen what they do when they explode.

And the comments about me from Void are entirely correct.  I am actively searching for OU because I have seen enough to convince me it may very well be possible.  But I also try to correct mistaken ideas when I see them.  I don't want people wasting their time on false ideas.  Now if a person is doing research and experimenting to try and learn that is a great thing to do.  But when a person claims to have solved OU and they haven't even built anything yet to demonstrate their claims then I am very skeptical.

Thank you Void for your kind comments.

Respectfully,
Carroll

 

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