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Author Topic: Confirmation of OU devices and claims  (Read 255800 times)

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1905 on: August 06, 2019, 05:06:46 AM »
I've just received mail from Mr. Gear.
His team tested Rick's two and three battery system and measurement showed underunity in both test.
However, they also purchased through third person Rick's kit and will analyze it and make transient power measurement within next few days, along with some more complicated tests involved looped reactive power.
For the tests been precise, team has been split into two.
Every group will conduct its own methods with state of the art equipement.
Result of each group will be evaluated by Mr. Gear and his consultants.

The goal of test is determine does motor/load kit is COP>1, or OU, and if not, how efficient they are.
I dont have information what kit they purchase and Mr. Gear explaimed that he will reveal only test results, but not data and videos made during test.
Data and videos will remain in company possesions and can be viewed only through bussines agreement, after Rick will be contacted if test will be positive.
At least he will release final conclusion in public, which can not hurt company interest.

I think this is fair from his side. At the end he represents company interests and even final conclusion is much.

If test show positive results, Rick will be contacted and he will be presented with bussines proposal.

From his words test will be conducted very professional and with top gear which exists.
He mentioned possible complex measurements involved reactive power loop, but lots of what he spoke is out of my league.

So, stefan, you asked me to build it. I cant.
But found person who can and it is not problem for him.
Actually, I will be glad if results turns positive, and this whole story ends well.
Finally, Mr. Gear has possibility to do.it and I believe he will.

He said that every investigation of his which turns out even partially success was good for company and bussines deal has been made.
Until now he did not find true self runner but he found few very clever solutions which company paid well and inventors were satisfied.
True results were published through real patents which can actually be build and work.

I hope this will help,

Cheers!
So what sense makes it, if they just said, they did the test and will not show any evidence of it ??? lol...
My friend did also build the same setup as in RickĀ“s latest video with the 2 brushless motors and he also got it to work.
I hope I can convince him to show a bit of it...
Regards, Stefan.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1905 on: August 06, 2019, 05:06:46 AM »

Offline poynt99

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1906 on: August 06, 2019, 05:14:52 AM »
(snip...)But notice I wrote the other day that you all need to understand what the real efficiency of a motor is before you go into this. I wrote that days before that comment was put on my youtube comments today. So then when you have determined that the input energy is causing mechanical work to be done with very small percentage of losses--say motor is 98% efficient at 30W--and you modify the circuit so that it runs the same but additionally puts out (in an independent loving path loop) 10% or 50% or 90% of the input energy, then you know you have free energy Darren. But that is why I also wrote that you guys will probably never agree upon the efficiency of a motor so that no matter how much electrical output is generated in addition to the motor drive it will always be considered as a fraction of the input energy.(snip...)
I'm totally fine with any efficiency motor you choose. If it is a 98% efficient motor to start with, then fine. It has no bearing on the final outcome as far as I am concerned.


Now concerning the highlighted portion of the quote, I ask the following:


How does one determine the percentage of input energy being put out in the flyback loop?

Offline rickfriedrich

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1907 on: August 06, 2019, 05:57:38 AM »
Darren,
That is the point of the debate here. You are claiming that any output in the negative loop is a faction of the input or that the primary loop/forward phase is one part and the negative loop the remaining. So if the motor is 98% efficient with a 100W input and if the negative loop produces 10W of work, or 50 or 100W then obviously the loop is not a fraction of the input. Or if the batteries can be rotated around, etc. The flyback loop is not part of the input energy. Read the posts I wrote tonight.

I'm totally fine with any efficiency motor you choose. If it is a 98% efficient motor to start with, then fine. It has no bearing on the final outcome as far as I am concerned.
Now concerning the highlighted portion of the quote, I ask the following:
How does one determine the percentage of input energy being put out in the flyback loop?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1907 on: August 06, 2019, 05:57:38 AM »
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Offline poynt99

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1908 on: August 06, 2019, 06:10:58 AM »
Quote
...and you modify the circuit so that it runs the same but additionally puts out (in an independent loving path loop) 10% or 50% or 90% of the input energy, then you know you have free energy...
The above quote is from your post (your phrasology and use of the "percentage of input energy" reference, not mine).

How does one determine the percentage part of your quote?

The "independent loving path loop" is the flyback loop consisting of the flyback diode, the charge battery, and the coil winding, is it not?

Offline rickfriedrich

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1909 on: August 06, 2019, 07:11:34 AM »
Darren,
Context is important. To be more clear let's say "percentage of" what the "input energy" took to power the motor and the losses. Percentage comparison only, not percentage of it. I've been saying in several different ways that the input energy is separate from what is charging the battery. It is a different phase and direction (and type). Again, percentage as in if it takes 100W to run the motor that is 98% efficient, and 10W (which is merely 10%) or 50W or 100W is produced in the load or charging battery then obviously the 10W or 50 or 100W is not part of the input energy. "Percentage" of the electrical output in the battery is not important. I am merely talking about the hypothetical that if it takes so much W to run the motor then there is nothing left to produce an electrical output. Bottom line.

Yes the coil is part of that loop if I am understanding where you are going with that question. But it is out of phase and the negative energy is, if resulting in more work done than what can be accounted for from the input energy (100W minus the work of the motor and losses), shows that it is truly independent and above unity.

The above quote is from your post (your phrasology and use of the "percentage of input energy" reference, not mine).

How does one determine the percentage part of your quote?

The "independent loving path loop" is the flyback loop consisting of the flyback diode, the charge battery, and the coil winding, is it not?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1909 on: August 06, 2019, 07:11:34 AM »
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Offline forest

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1910 on: August 06, 2019, 07:50:28 AM »
IMHO The flyback ouput is the same as input minus loses , because motor do not consume current and energy is only consumed when magnetic dipoles are broken as a heat and EMF inside the motor. In other factors motor is just a coil and this is boost converter.

Or maybe in other words : motor is COP = 2 (well almost , because some resistive loses), but in "normal way operation" the duplicate of input energy is lost (like the transfer of energy between two capacitors, remember ?) and it become COP < 1.
I'm not sure however if the duplicate is intrinsic nature of magnetic fields or just interaction with Earth's field.

P.S. Above is just a theory of course , unless confirmed

Offline tinman

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1911 on: August 06, 2019, 01:41:35 PM »
Hi Jeg, They are related in that they are both voltages generated by a coil, but there is a major difference.
If I apply a voltage Vi to a coil, the coil then generates a voltage that is in opposition
to the applied voltage Vi. Since this generated voltage is in opposition to the applied
voltage Vi, it is referred to as 'counter EMF' or 'back EMF'.

Now, if I then disconnect my voltage source Vi from the coil, the coil no longer has a voltage
applied to it, The magnetic field around the coil collapses and creates a voltage spike which
is the same polarity as Vi was (in other words this generated voltage spike is not in opposition)
and which acts to try to keep the current that was flowing in the coil going. This inductive switching voltage
spike is an assisting or aiding voltage. It is not acting counter to the original applied voltage Vi, so it shouldn't
be referred to as 'counter EMF' or 'back EMF'.

All the best...

That's actually incorrect Void.
When the source is disconnected from an inductor,and the magnetic field collapses around the inductor,the voltage across the inductor invert's,and is of opposite polarity to that of the source,as the inductor is no longer the sink,it is the source.

When a voltage is dropped across an inductor,current will start to flow,and a magnetic field builds.
When the voltage source is disconnected,the magnetic field now starts to collapse and cut through the windings in the opposite direction. This causes a voltage inversion across the coil,but the current will continue to flow in the same direction through the coil. 


Brad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1911 on: August 06, 2019, 01:41:35 PM »
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Offline lancaIV

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1912 on: August 06, 2019, 02:02:14 PM »
In AC-circuit : positive half period ( to load) + negative half period( back to source: battery or energy provider ) :                                              for circuit frequenzy 50/60 Hz stability !
Net-grid controled fixed sinus Voltage / current !
The invention against "fix/-ed 3000/3600 RPM normated " electric devices :         
       
              variable speed/frequency drive/ controler !
    Up to 75% power savings. ! Or up to  400% use from the before electricity consume !
+ no-/load electric device controle

forest : the industry could double the output from each motor or generator device , electricity-to-torque and torque-to-electricity , but the the total global industry would become changed !
Reference : Fred Miekka publications,Akio Hara generator,geminielectricmotors,Catalan Hallbach array motoret cet.
Not  cw or ccw : both ! using in the same time !Negative permanent magnet field and positive permanent magnet field

Offline gyulasun

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1913 on: August 06, 2019, 02:21:42 PM »
So what sense makes it, if they just said, they did the test and will not show any evidence of it ??? lol... 
... 
Regards, Stefan.
 

Hi Stefan,
   
Exactly!  This has been the point in all the posts written by those members you have put under moderation (now Void and TinselKoala included!): they all asked for evidence. And all they have got was psywar and then moderation, instead of evidence. 

Stefan, I would suggest you visit Mr Gear's team, you are both in Germany so travel cost should be at a minimum, and make sure in person on the test results they get from the measurements (remember they split into two teams to perform the tests).

Afterall, this is an overunity forum, you run it and there are ou claims. If this is not a reason to make sure about it, then what is?

Regards, Gyula

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1913 on: August 06, 2019, 02:21:42 PM »
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Offline tinman

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1914 on: August 06, 2019, 02:22:17 PM »


Yes the coil is part of that loop if I am understanding where you are going with that question. But it is out of phase and the negative energy is, if resulting in more work done than what can be accounted for from the input energy (100W minus the work of the motor and losses), shows that it is truly independent and above unity.

And that was my point of my comment on your video Rick.

In your video,your input energy was jumping all over the place,so how did you calculate your input energy?
Second-you do not know how efficient your fan motor is,so once again,how are you making your energy calculations?.How much energy dose it take to move X amount of CFM's of air?,and how much energy was your fan using to achieve this?. Your motor may have been using(i believe in the video,the best i could make out was 24v @ 1.2 amp's) 28.8 watts,but how much energy is required to have an air flow of(i think it was) 1600 CFM at atmospheric pressure.
Third-You had no output measurements at all as far as your inductive kickback output go's,so once again,how are you making your power measurements to claim OU?.

So lets say your fan is 80% efficient(highly unlikely),and your inductive kickback output is 10%. You still have a loss of 10% to heat,and this is a best case scenario. In actuality,your fan would be 50-60% efficient at best,and we(including yourself)have no idea as to what your electrical output was,nor do we have an accurate P/in for your fan either.

So, we have no P/in measurement--
We have no fan efficiency value--
We have no output measurements--
But you claim OU  :o
You also claim the EE guys have no idea what there talking about.
You say we live in a sci-fi make believe world  ::)

I think you have it all backward Rick,as it seems that it is you making claims of the (know so far) impossible,and you do this without any data at all to back up your claim's.

No Rick,it is not us living in the land of make believe  ::)


Brad

Offline Jeg

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1915 on: August 06, 2019, 02:40:16 PM »
When the voltage source is disconnected,the magnetic field now starts to collapse and cut through the windings in the opposite direction. This causes a voltage inversion across the coil,but the current will continue to flow in the same direction through the coil. 
Hi Void, Brad
Thanks for the answers guys.
I wouldn't describe it better than Tinman. Just to mention again that inductive kickback is calculated by the same equation of cemf as it is also a result of opposition to current.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1915 on: August 06, 2019, 02:40:16 PM »
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Offline tinman

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1916 on: August 06, 2019, 02:46:54 PM »
Oh,i see the open source Koala is behind OU.com bars

 ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

Anyway,im currently looking for one of those fans Rick is using,so as i can replicate Ricks device setup,and crunch some numbers.

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1917 on: August 06, 2019, 02:51:42 PM »
A" delicate"  relationship is also between electricity endconsumer and e-provider to remark :
                       linear Watt versus sinus "Watt"- Volt-Ampere-Frequency power

220 Volts x 45 Ampere ~ 1000 VA but Vp to Vlinear ~ 700 average Watt( ~ DC)  power content

So who is paying 25 Eurocents per 1000 VA -AC is paying 35 Eurocents per KWh. for AC electricity !
Actually "expensive" solar cells/battery-sets systems are belong this net-grid price !

https://www.pordata.pt/en/Europe/Electricity+prices+for+households+and+industrial+users+(PPS)-1479
Wrong calculation and payment : criminal fake or fraud ?
Radiation heat output : per linear Watt or per " sinus"Watt/VA" ?
Now the E.U.-market endconsumer knows why he does not have  to pay for " displacement current compensation" like
the industrial client, because he pays it intra ( internal price calculation) !


Offline lancaIV

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1918 on: August 06, 2019, 03:38:31 PM »
Oh,i see the open source Koala is behind OU.com bars

 ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

Anyway,im currently looking for one of those fans Rick is using,so as i can replicate Ricks device setup,and crunch some numbers.
"extraordinary technology"- devices challenge :
A. Rick Friedrich
B. http://www.keppemotor.com/institucional/keppe-motor-universe-ceiling-fan/?lang=en
C. https://m.phys.org/news/2015-10-inventor-motor-aims-millions-energy.html


Offline Void

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Re: Confirmation of OU devices and claims
« Reply #1919 on: August 06, 2019, 04:24:43 PM »
I have done this yesterday and it works exactly as Rick shown. I never tried this setup before with the complete conventional fan ciruit in it (only self triggering setups).
I have identical results: Air Flow is the same, my power consuption is slightly lower, but I have also another output to load secondary batteries for free! Why you are waiting for someone. DO IT FOR YOURSELF, START AND MOVING ONE DIODE!!!

Hi baudirenergie. The issue is whether these type of setups might be 'OU' or not, however. 
Energy in inductive switching spikes which normally may be dissipated in windings in the fan
or in other components in the fan such as diodes, can be redirected to pulse a secondary battery, but this still
in no way in itself necessarily indicates anything about OU. I have experimented quite a bit with using inductive
switching spikes in pulse circuits to pulse secondary batteries and unfortunately, no OU. In all my experiments
I have found that the energy is coming from the source battery driving the pulse circuit. Even if you are swapping
the batteries back and forth, the batteries start to run down if you leave it all running long enough.
If there are special exceptions to this where such an arrangement shows possible indications of actually being OU, I have
not ever seen a convincing demonstration of it anyway.

This is the point which some people here have been trying to get across here.
It is an incorrect assumption to think that because you can direct energy from inductive switching spikes,
or similar, to charge a secondary battery or batteries, that this somehow indicates 'OU'.
Such an arrangement actually in no way necessarily at all indicates OU.

Only by doing a proper comparison of average output power to average input power, or by self-looping such
a setup in some way and leaving the self-looped setup running for a suitably long enough time, can you understand
what the real performance of a given setup is in regards to efficiency. If using a battery to power a self-looped setup,
then the suitable run time needed to determine if the circuit might be OU or not depends on the current draw from the battery
in comparison to the battery's Amp-hour rating.
 
If some people are not understanding and acknowledging the above points, which should all be givens at overunity.com,
then they are only demonstrating that they don't really understand what they are doing.  Sorry, but there is no nicer way to
say it. That is just the plain reality of the situation.


 

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