Author Topic: Confirmation of OU devices and claims (Read 541639 times)

lancaIV · « **Reply #420 on:** May 09, 2019, 01:44:22 PM »

benfr, you are right, there is often misinterpretation !

pressure, force, work, power : the final is : work x time = power in Wh

Volt : tension Ampere : current. DC: Volt x Ampere = work

Volt-source + Ampere charge x time = power source
Ampere -source + Volt-charge x time = power source

So you mean you have a " power amplification concept":
based by a tension-source or current-source ?

How is the" factor : time" calculated if not 100% flow per second but in pulsation ( time on/ off) ?

Sincerely
OCWL

p.s.: does the ambient makes part from your conversion concept device ?

do you analyze humidity, temperature, ambient/room pressure/ static during tests ?

benfr · « **Reply #421 on:** May 09, 2019, 02:56:13 PM »

Quote from: lancaIV on May 09, 2019, 01:44:22 PM

So you mean you have a " power amplification concept":
based by a tension-source or current-source ?

Sincerely
OCWL

Thanks...I have both. But I have only shown the VOLTAGE amplification , for free.
The AMPERAGE amplification, as described and exertable in Rick Friedrich's RICK, is the following :
one resonant tank LC in parallel.
to position energy watts consuming at the entry of the tank (1 W resistor before the tank, and following the frequency gen). Place also a capacitor in series between that resistor and the tank.
Placing such similar resistor inside the tank, between the capacitor and coil, will demonstrate AMPERAGE multiplication at the resonance point(s) with the following calculation.
This is done by using the measurement Power or Amperage in closed circuit = Voltage squared / resistance in OHM.
To measure, place two probes across each resistor.
Some resonant frequencies will demonstrate higher amplification than others. In the same circuit, several frequencies are resonant, and the Q is not the same for each of them.

AlienGrey · « **Reply #422 on:** May 09, 2019, 03:00:04 PM »

Quote from: itsu on May 08, 2019, 11:23:49 AM

AG,

Gyula pointed (linked) in his above post to the specific post on page 20 you refer to.

All info on those 2 screenshots (1st one from the sim, 2th one from my real circuit/scope) are in that post.

Just picture the circuit drawn (see below), then for MY REAL CIRCUIT, picture the purple trace probe (CH3)
across V1 (FG and whole LRC), ground lead left (-), probe tip right (+).
I seem to have INVERTED the purple signal, so in real it should be flipped over (180°).

Then picture the blue trace probe (CH2) across C1 (series Cap), ground lead also left, probe tip right.

The reason for the voltages across the RLC (purple) and the C (blue) being 90° off is explained in a link i
presented a few post later to benfr (post # 295) where i wrote:

There it reads:

So (in resonance) compared to the "view" from across the whole RLC (purple), the signal across L and C are
resp. +90° and -90° (remember my purple trace is inverted) out of phase.

Hope this clears it up.

Concerning this question:

I guess you mean my post #271 on page 19.

There i refer to Benfr his setup, see sim circuit (cap, coil, cap, coil, cap, coil in series) with parallel
across it a load (R1) and the FG (V1).

The square wave signal in both the SIM (green) and in my screenshot (blue and white) are from across the FG (V1).
The green (sim) and blue signals are when NOT in resonance (nice squares), the white one is what happens when
IN resonance (the resonance signal loads the FG in such a way that it forms these troughs.

Regards Itsu

Hi Itsu thanks for confirming that for me (i don't work well if too many choices) I tried something like that when
Wesley mentioned adding a C to an inductive coil transformer to obtain a 90 deg phase shift but got nowhere, I will retry to see if I can set the experiment
up for my self again and report back later, many thanks again.

gyulasun · « **Reply #423 on:** May 09, 2019, 04:24:30 PM »

Hi benfr,

You wrote:

Quote

However, coil matching at resonance is a matter that is not explored in the video, in an explicit way, for it has several dimensions : wavelength, capacitance, inductance, rate of change, disruptive discharge, and others.

You mention "disruptive discharge". I do not think there is "disruptive discharge" happening and I wrote this to a.king in my post #339, Page 23 of this thread. However, he has not returned with an answer yet.

Would you mind explaining how you think it happens in Rick's setup when the series LC (i.e. the TX) circuit is driven by the output of the gate driver IC?

Gyula

lancaIV · « **Reply #424 on:** May 09, 2019, 04:44:42 PM »

benfr, thank you for the trial to make it clear ( me not !

)
Probably it will be a need to invest two hours of life for his view and description :
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ke4aqkrkh1o
So only after that I will ask you again for details. !

Happy disclosure wishing
OCWL

benfr · « **Reply #425 on:** May 09, 2019, 05:03:41 PM »

Quote from: lancaIV on May 09, 2019, 04:44:42 PM

benfr, thank you for the trial to make it clear ( me not ! )
Probably it will be a need to invest two hours of life for his view and description :
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ke4aqkrkh1o
So only after that I will ask you again for details. !

Happy disclosure wishing
OCWL

not sure to understand you...

benfr · « **Reply #426 on:** May 09, 2019, 05:06:43 PM »

Quote from: gyulasun on May 09, 2019, 04:24:30 PM

Hi benfr,

You wrote:

You mention "disruptive discharge". I do not think there is "disruptive discharge" happening and I wrote this to a.king in my post #339, Page 23 of this thread. However, he has not returned with an answer yet.

Would you mind explaining how you think it happens in Rick's setup when the series LC (i.e. the TX) circuit is driven by the output of the gate driver IC?

Gyula

Gyula, simply put - a SQUARE wave IS a disruptive discharge. YES you need this to trigger the resonance we are looking at. BUT you could not have it and still do useful observations - beyond my area of play, here, so I won't tell you to start this. The Gate driver is, merely, a disruptive discharge amplifier.

a.king21 · « **Reply #427 on:** May 09, 2019, 05:19:42 PM »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQqYs6O2MPw

partzman · « **Reply #428 on:** May 09, 2019, 05:30:00 PM »

Quote from: benfr on May 09, 2019, 05:06:43 PM

Gyula, simply put - a SQUARE wave IS a disruptive discharge. YES you need this to trigger the resonance we are looking at. BUT you could not have it and still do useful observations - beyond my area of play, here, so I won't tell you to start this. The Gate driver is, merely, a disruptive discharge amplifier.

Hi Benfr,

Perhaps you could explain what a square wave is a discharging? Obviously something is being disruptively discharged but it is unclear as to exactly what this "something" is?

Regards,
Pm

benfr · « **Reply #429 on:** May 09, 2019, 05:52:22 PM »

Quote from: partzman on May 09, 2019, 05:30:00 PM

Hi Benfr,

Perhaps you could explain what a square wave is a discharging? Obviously something is being disruptively discharged but it is unclear as to exactly what this "something" is?

Regards,
Pm

Hi, a square wave is disruptive ie suppose I'm "shouting loud at you" for some bad reason

suddenly when there was silence.
_|
that is the waveform that would be recorded.
the louder I shouted, the strongest the dB discharge, and the longest the vertical bar.
Now, superpose a square wave and match the above wave.
You have now the place where the disruptive discharge takes place.

tomd · « **Reply #430 on:** May 09, 2019, 09:57:50 PM »

Ringing a LCR circuit with a square wave. Its important the frequency of the source is sufficiently less than the resonant frequency.
"Why is ringing occurring here for square-wave inputs at only low frequencies?

Because it's not low frequency - the edge of the voltage (if infinitely steep) has contained inside it infinite harmonics and, one of those harmonics will be coincident with the LC resonant frequency and trigger a damped oscillation as seen in the 2nd waveform picture. Of course, the edge of the voltage only has to contain a harmonic coincident with the LC resonance for this to happen - it doesn't need to be infinitely fast." https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/259593/a-question-about-ringing-phenomena-and-resonance

AlienGrey · « **Reply #431 on:** May 09, 2019, 11:22:54 PM »

Quote from: a.king21 on May 09, 2019, 05:19:42 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AQqYs6O2MPw

Walter Lewin a real 'fun guy' he must get it from the mushrooms he eats.

Also Itsu yes made up your circuit as I have used resonance many times but never tried to test for 90 deg till now! as many of will already know I will repeat the obvious fact 'to get a phase shift of 90 deg both a capacitor and the inductor to have to be in resonance' with your selected 'resonant throughput frequency'!

Well, that solves one problem and explains a great deal!

Many thanks all! AG

itsu · « **Reply #432 on:** May 14, 2019, 07:22:43 PM »

It seems bigger is better in this case.

So i build a big coil with what i have:

former 16cm diameter
1mm diam wire (AWG #18)
145 turns spanning 15.5cm, so coil is almost square.

Measured:
Inductance 2.3mH and Q 98 @ 100Khz
DC resistance 1.7 Ohm

Series capacitor is 2x 35-345pF air variable paralleled.
Measured:
51-684pF.

Resonance tuned to 180Khz (caps slightly below half way).

Using my FG only in square wave DC 50% duty cycle 10Vpp:
picture shows this setup.
screenshot shows first results:

Yellow: voltage across C
Green: current through LC (inverted so it shows the voltage leading the current as in an inductive circuit)
Blue : input voltage from FG
Red: math trace yellow x green = real power in the LC circuit.

So allthough we have a high p2p voltage across both L and C, the 90° shift between voltage and current accounts for the low power.

Itsu

itsu · « **Reply #433 on:** May 14, 2019, 10:30:44 PM »

I added the gate driver running at 9V (60ma), see screenshot.

Yellow: voltage across the air caps
green: the current through the LC circuit
blue: voltage from the gate driver out.

I tried to modify my satellite LC coils (163uh @ 100pF) by paralleling a 4.7nF cap to the 100pF trimmer so
they would resonate also around 180Khz, but that won't work.

They strongly try to resonate around 2.8Mhz which seems to be their natural selfresonance frequency, so all
i see is a ringdown on 2.8Mhz repeated every 180Khz.
I guess the LC relationship is way off to be able to resonate that low.

Also my hall sensor probe seems unable to correctly pick up the signal, its always is showing a one direction
magnetic field (@ 180Khz) no matter how i keep the probe toward the coil (front, rear or side).
It does show stronger amplitude at the top of the coil (same as my field strength meter).

Itsu

benfr · « **Reply #434 on:** May 15, 2019, 10:37:03 AM »

Quote from: itsu on May 14, 2019, 07:22:43 PM

It seems bigger is better in this case.

So i build a big coil with what i have:

That's an awesome setup itsu. Congratulations. I can see you went for the big coil as presented by Rick on his video. It is looking like it.
1. Do you have voltage loads like bulbs/LEDs to light at resonance with the small input ?
2. Did you buy the gate driver somewhere or you built it ? I am interested to know about the schematics if you please.

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Author Topic: Confirmation of OU devices and claims (Read 541639 times)

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