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Author Topic: SeeSaw smot ramp  (Read 15195 times)

CLaNZeR

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SeeSaw smot ramp
« on: November 23, 2006, 04:04:09 PM »
Has anyone tried a seesaw Smot Ramp?

Excuse the rubbish picture, but easier to try draw than explain.

Basically a balanced SeeSaw with a smot ramp, as the ball gets to the end of the ramp, the ramp tilts with the weight and the cogs move the smot magnets so the ball once again goes back up.

I await you skillfull chaps to blow it out of the water again, but hey I gotta keep trying LOL!!

Regards

Sean.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2006, 06:23:59 PM by CLaNZeR »
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Paul-R

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #1 on: November 27, 2006, 04:13:35 PM »
Very interesting. Have you come across the "Hamster cage" wheel idea? Try this variant on your idea:
http://www.keelynet.com/energy/callomag.htm
Paul.
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peter_schmalenbach

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #2 on: November 27, 2006, 08:08:55 PM »
Hello CLaNZeR,

the idea is good. I was thinking about it last year, too.

But working is not possible because the attraction of the magnets at the end of the SMOT is too big. The cogs cannot move (break off) the ends of the magnets by help of the ball's low weight only.

Best regards
Peter Schmalenbach
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CLaNZeR

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #3 on: November 27, 2006, 08:54:11 PM »
@Paul
Funny enough I was looking at that hamster cage over the weekend, still trying to get my head around the concept. I think in the design shown that the magnet in the cage would slip on the bearings and maybe coating the rolling bearings with rubber would help.
Interesting one though and good idea.

@Peter

Can see what you mean about pulling the magnets apart at the end.

So what about!!! using a turn table to move a number of metal balls around.
The ramp would be weighted at one end and the Steel ball would be heavier than the weight.
The ball rolls up the ramp, the SeeSaw tilts and turns the turn table.
The ball falls of the end of the ramp and the weight takes the ramp back down.

There would need to be a release latch that only turns the turn table when the SeeSaw is tilted forward but not on the reverse.

Again sorry about the rubbish graphics attached!

Regards

Sean.
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FreeEnergy

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #4 on: November 27, 2006, 10:25:23 PM »
cool!
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2010, 01:29:37 PM »
Interesting to see how the last post in this thread was in 2006.

The combination of a seesaw with magnets is very promissing. There are many possible designs...

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FreeEnergy

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2010, 02:41:10 PM »
i think this will work better and the balls wont get stock to the magnet. just remove the bottom magnet.
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FreeEnergy

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2010, 03:23:02 PM »
EDIT - forgot to add a spring to hold the lever horizontally.

actually the magnet wont be strong enough to pick up the ball to make it roll the ramp/track horizontally.

so i think some kind of light weight lever mechanism would totally help pick up the ball. something like this:
« Last Edit: April 05, 2010, 07:04:45 PM by FreeEnergy »
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FreeEnergy

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2010, 06:58:48 PM »
Quote from: Rapadura on April 05, 2010, 01:29:37 PM
Interesting to see how the last post in this thread was in 2006.

just a little trick of mine  ;)

just kidding, i dont know why this happened either.
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2010, 02:21:05 AM »
I was doing some simulations with Phun (the free version of Algodoo) to see what is the behavior of a steel ball on a seesaw with a attracting "magnet". I liked the results.

The problem with Phun is that this software don't have magnetism, so we need to put a gravitational field in our pseudo "magnets" (that will work more or less like magnetic attraction).

And the other big problem with Phun is that it is a 2D software, and I think that any solution to make a perpetual motion machine with seesaw and magnets have to be a "3D solution". The idea of CLaNZeR is a 3D solution, and I think it have a chance to work... In any design, something will have to move "sideways" at the end of the cycle, the ball or the magnet.
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2010, 03:14:58 AM »
The design I was thinking about is that in the drawing bellow.

The steel ball is inside a closed tube, that is the seesaw itself, so the ball can't move sideways, only can go up and down in the seesaw.  The magnet is suspended, with a wooden counterweight, and can move sideways.

In the design bellow, the magnetic attraction force of the magnet has to be calibrated in order to make it attract the steel ball only with the help of the inclined plane.

Remember all that thing about the interaction of gravity and the "normal force" in the "inclined plane"? Yeah, I remember that in the high school. I did some simulation using Phun software, I achieved to calibrate the attraction force to pull the ball only until it passes the fulcrum, and after that, when the seesaw goes down, the "magnet" can not attract the ball, because it no longer has the help of a inclined plane.

Well, so we can do the first half of the cycle. But we need to do the second half, that is make the ball go up in the inverse direction, back to its initial position.

I think the only way to do that is move the magnet to the opposite side. And I think this movement have to be sideways, a horizontal rotation. I just don't know if the power of the "fall" of the seesaw is enough to, somehow, start a movement of the magnet that will only end when it reaches the opposite side.

I'm thinking of a system that somehow gives a "slap" on the magnet, making it rotate horizontally. The fall of the seesaw have to be used to give the "slap" in the magnet.  Maybe the weight of the seesaw should be important to determine whether the force of the "slap" will be enough to make the magnet rotate to the other side. I don't know...
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2010, 01:34:23 PM »
Using the fall of the seesaw to give a "slap" in the magnet is not a big problem. It's relatively easy, with a "L" shaped piece of plastic.

The questions is: will the strength of the "slap" be enough to make the magnet rotate 180 degrees horizontaly, and reach the opposite side, where it will be able to attract the steel ball back to its initial position?

What factors can determine if the 180 degree rotation of the magnet will be sucessfull? The mass of the seesaw? The perfection  of the bearings in the axis where the magnet and the wooden counterweight are suspended?
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2010, 03:10:20 AM »
Come on people! Use your imagination! There are lots of possible designs of perpetual motion machines using the combination of seesaw and magnets! Just invent yours!
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Paul-R

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2010, 12:44:00 PM »
Quote from: Rapadura on April 06, 2010, 01:34:23 PM
The questions is: will the strength of the "slap" be enough to make the magnet rotate 180 degrees horizontaly, and reach the opposite side, where it will be able to attract the steel ball back to its initial position?
What is interesting is that many believe "slaps" or impulses, whether they are electric pulses or hammer blows
to be a way of introducing excess energy inot the sytem. (viz: the Watson Bedini variant, Campbell gravitational
device, Adams motor, water hammer and the John Worrell Keely motor etc).
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Rapadura

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Re: SeeSaw smot ramp
« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2010, 01:28:47 PM »
Don't know if the "excess energy" is being introduced by the slap. Just know for sure that the seesaw will fall to the other side after the ball passes over the fulcrum, and the fall can be harnessed to move the magnet-counterweight system. The doubt is how far the magnet can go.

I expect other people have more ideas using seesaws or the "normal force" on a inclined plane. Maybe magnetic shielding can help somehow.
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