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Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: Steven Dufresne on April 22, 2005, 02:51:24 AM

Title: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on April 22, 2005, 02:51:24 AM
Hi All,
Everyone here probably knows already but I'm working on replicating the testatika, currently
working on one of the two small machines.  I've recently completed some changes and
done some testing.  Building it a few pieces at a time and testing whenit seems to make
sense helps direct the building and may answersome questions about what different parts
are for (that's thetheory anyway :-)).  It's all under:
  http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/smallmach1.htm
The collection of all I've done so far re testatika is at:
  http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa
Enjoy,
Steve
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Implosion on October 09, 2007, 10:54:58 PM
Hi Steve,

Is that your own website?   ( rimstar )

Greetings

Peter from Holland ( Implosion )

Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: helmut on October 10, 2007, 12:07:29 AM
Hi Steve,

Is that your own website?   ( rimstar )

Greetings

Peter from Holland ( Implosion )


@Peter
I have no sucsess to see the site.
No connection   do you know what to do?

helmut
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on October 17, 2007, 04:06:45 PM
Hi Steve,
Is that your own website?   ( rimstar )
Greetings
Peter from Holland ( Implosion )
@Peter
I have no sucsess to see the site.
No connection   do you know what to do?
helmut

Hi Peter,
Yes,
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa
is my site.

Hi Helmut,
Try the above full address.
-Steve
PS. Sorry for the delay, I don't check in here often enough these days.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on November 24, 2007, 10:27:03 PM
 Hello all and to Steve @ringstar , I have been looking over the site and giveing it a good study. I'll start building soon. would like to get only builders here so we can work and not have arm chair BS. I see someone has started to build on another thread and the work looks first class. I have accesss to plexi and a shop to fabricate , I use Emachineshop.com to get my parts made , they make anything as for the grids this may be the best source seeing that they can lazer cut them to spec. Did you study the back engineering the P Potter has done? and is there anyone else working on this besides this site. If we need to work in a private fourm for now I have one that is not open to the public , it is just for builders so we don't get misinformation or worse yet interfierence. Please let me know and we'll put together a miterials list for the build. mike 
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on November 25, 2007, 01:52:29 AM
@Steve , thank you for the nice note. been back over to the site and looking over your work on the disks. I have the stock to make the 2 disks in clear and black. I have a few bearings for the center also. will start the the mounts monday. Mike
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on November 25, 2007, 03:53:33 AM
Hi Mike,
The problem I have with building a full blown testatika is figuring out what to build since I don't know how it works. So instead I focus on experimenting with what parts might be tapping into an energy source. That's why I focus on the pots (Paul Baumann's term for the big cans) or different types of disks or the magnets as it could be any one or all of these. Currently I'm experimenting with adding an ultra high frequency to horseshoe magnets as that seems to be the goal of the Linden experiment:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/lindenexp.htm
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/lindentests1.htm

I have seen Paul Potter's ideas but I have doubts that his electron cascade idea can be the energy source as that would mean the large amount of energy that the 3kW machine is producing is coming from redirected energetic free electrons in the air. I could be wrong since it's just my gut feeling, but I don't think there's that much constantly available.

Regarding Peter's other thread here, Peter and I have talked quite a bit elsewhere. Though I don't think his use of triboelectric effect is applicable since that involves physical contact between the disks I do like the use of triboelectric material as that gives you one disk that is initially charged. This would act as an initial HV source. Directly as a result of Peter suggesting this I did a quick experiment with this in mind and it turned out quite well:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/276disksg2vinyl1.htm

You say you're ready to start on the disks. Can I ask what your plan is?
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: karl on November 25, 2007, 04:39:53 AM
Steve,
some time ago I was asking you @rimstar about your opinion to introduce the electrophorus principle as a main principle also in history.
My demonstrator is tested and there are some good results whiche gives me further insights to the electrophorus.
The electrophorus in an rotational state (es sectors) or in a slightly vibratory state (up and down without touching the dipole surface) will generate a AC current. also when loaded with low ohmic resistors as a nulb in plasmastate.
There is no need for a spark at all.
Connect a small bulb out of a voltage checker (Ne?) continiously between the upper surface of the mover and the metal foil which lies under the rubbed record and make only slight movements in each direction?s-> No sparks but nearly continuous current through the bulb.
The charge is conserved!
No connection to earth required!
Move it as long as you want, every time you are changing the capacity you are directing the current, without collecting it in masses, through the neon bulb which reacts promptly with a glow discharge.
Amazing experiment, worse to do, no starting charges or phases needed, ever constant in function.
In the next step we'll have a look at the forces which acts to the moving parts.
A fullsymmetric or a assymmetric device is possible.
I come back to hyde patent and have a look at the stator disks which should be preloaded.
You can compare this forceless (force canceling due to constructive features) generator with an pos/neg electrophorus.
You are able to make 2 disks out of different materials to get a plus and a minus influencer.
Let them work together instead of against.
Hyde proposed 10% of the output is used to drive a ac (induction motor?) or small dc motor which is coupled to the rotor(s).
No significant losses due to backdrag or airresistence (use vacuum for maximal performance).
No rotating brushes or coals only wires.
Have also a look again on the simplified decouple cuircuit (AC) and the step down DC-Version.
Verry interesting insights may occour when combining the elektrophorus principle with the hyde machine.

I attach the patent for the simplicity of the situation.

Best wishes
Karl
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hartiberlin on November 25, 2007, 06:04:37 AM
Hi Steven,
have you tested to pulse with High Voltage some lightly radiocative quartz crystals ?

I guess they just pulse HV bursts onto these quartz crystals to release exited beta decay
and this is collected in the leyden jars.
All machines have some crystals in them.
In the small machines the crystals are  at the front, where the coils are wound around them and the mesh
metals are in front of it and in the big 3KW machine they had mountain crystal stones
in the leyden jars at the backside of the machines.
I was told this by Stefan Marinov, whom I was in contact with andwho visited also Methernitha
and had a look into all the machines.

Also when I was there at Methernitha in Linden in 1989 I was told that the secret is
in the crystals,which I did not understand at this time, but today it is pretty clear,
how they do it...

As some other researchers have shown, that you can excite beta decay by RF high voltage bursts,
just try this and see, how much energy you can gain from exciting a beta decay crystal with RF high voltage bursts.

Put it in a lyden jar or simular capacitor to capture the fast high energy beta decay electrons to charge up this capacitor...

Good luck.

Best regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: TheOne on November 25, 2007, 06:27:44 AM
Hi Steven,
have you tested to pulse with High Voltage some lightly radiocative quartz crystals ?

I guess they just pulse HV bursts onto these quartz crystals to release exited beta decay
and this is collected in the leyden jars.
All machines have some crystals in them.
In the small machines the crystals are  at the front, where the coils are wound around them and the mesh
metals are in front of it and in the big 3KW machine they had mountain crystal stones
in the leyden jars at the backside of the machines.
I was told this by Stefan Marinov, whom I was in contact with andwho visited also Methernitha
and had a look into all the machines.

Also when I was there at Methernitha in Linden in 1989 I was told that the secret is
in the crystals,which I did not understand at this time, but today it is pretty clear,
how they do it...

As some other researchers have shown, that you can excite beta decay by RF high voltage bursts,
just try this and see, how much energy you can gain from exciting a beta decay crystal with RF high voltage bursts.

Put it in a lyden jar or simular capacitor to capture the fast high energy beta decay electrons to charge up this capacitor...

Good luck.

Best regards, Stefan.

hey hartiberlin,

This is not dangerous to manipulate this kind of quartz? also what quartz crystals you are talking about?
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hartiberlin on November 25, 2007, 06:39:03 AM
Mountain crystals.
As Linden, where Methernitha is located is near the Switzerland mountains
and Paul Baumann was a crystal collector, he had collected many rocks in the nearby mountains and
they had a room for display of the crystals he had collected
there, when I was there in 1989.

He was a watchmaker and had great knowledge also of crystals,
so he might have just stombled about this effect to release beta decay
electrons from lightly radioactive mountain crystals
when he experimented with electrostatics from
old audio long play discs and and acryl discs.
He might have accidently pulsed some crystals with the
spark discharges of these high voltage experiments
and then saw  an energy amplification.

Nowmally these lightly radioactive mountain crystals are not dangerous.
They have only very weak radiation.
But when you hit them with some
high voltage radio frequency bursts they will
release an excited decay of fast beta decay electrons,
which can be captured by a capacitor and charge it up.

You could put them between capacitor plates or also hit them
with a coil wound around them and capture the electrons in the capacitor
plates or mesh plates...

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hakware on November 25, 2007, 08:16:28 AM
This sounds so Henry Moray and his "Swedish" stones its crazy.. when you say slightly radioactive, can you quantify how many Counts per minute they would give off?

Thanks
Mountain crystals.
As Linden, where Methernitha is located is near the Switzerland mountains
and Paul Baumann was a crystal collector, he had collected many rocks in the nearby mountains and
they had a room for display of the crystals he had collected
there, when I was there in 1989.

He was a watchmaker and had great knowledge also of crystals,
so he might have just stombled about this effect to release beta decay
electrons from lightly radioactive mountain crystals
when he experimented with electrostatics from
old audio long play discs and and acryl discs.
He might have accidentally pulsed some crystals with the
spark discharges of these high voltage experiments
and then saw  an energy amplification.

Normally these lightly radioactive mountain crystals are not dangerous.
They have only very weak radiation.
But when you hit them with some
high voltage radio frequency bursts they will
release an excited decay of fast beta decay electrons,
which can be captured by a capacitor and charge it up.

You could put them between capacitor plates or also hit them
with a coil wound around them and capture the electrons in the capacitor
plates or mesh plates...

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on November 25, 2007, 02:49:24 PM
Steve,
some time ago I was asking you @rimstar about your opinion to introduce the electrophorus principle as a main principle also in history.

Hi Karl,
I remember our conversation. I'm happy to see you've done some experimenting.

My demonstrator is tested and there are some good results whiche gives me further insights to the electrophorus.
The electrophorus in an rotational state (es sectors) or in a slightly vibratory state (up and down without touching the dipole surface) will generate a AC current. also when loaded with low ohmic resistors as a nulb in plasmastate.
There is no need for a spark at all.
Connect a small bulb out of a voltage checker (Ne?) continiously between the upper surface of the mover and the metal foil which lies under the rubbed record and make only slight movements in each direction?s-> No sparks but nearly continuous current through the bulb.

I've been getting AC (or AV) from similar arrangements for a couple of years now, but no useful
current, for example:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/smallmach2.htm
How much current would be required to light your small bulb?

Hyde proposed 10% of the output is used to drive a ac (induction motor?) or small dc motor which is coupled to the rotor(s).
No significant losses due to backdrag or airresistence (use vacuum for maximal performance).
No rotating brushes or coals only wires.
Have also a look again on the simplified decouple cuircuit (AC) and the step down DC-Version.
Verry interesting insights may occour when combining the elektrophorus principle with the hyde machine.

I attach the patent for the simplicity of the situation.

Thanks. The Hyde motor has always exited me even more than the testatika. The similarities
are interesting.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on November 25, 2007, 03:04:40 PM
Hi Steven,
have you tested to pulse with High Voltage some lightly radiocative quartz crystals ?

Hi Stefan,
I haven't tested the testatika with any radioactive material though I do have a bunch
of Americium which I've taken from ionizing smoke detectors. They give off alpha particles.
I've been hoping the energy source is ZPE so that no non-renewable materials would
be needed. I guess I'll have to include pulsing quartz crystals on my todo list. I grew
up in a mining area in Labrador (part of the Canadian province of Newfoundland & Labrador)
where there is plenty of quartz in the mountains. I've always wanted to visit there again.

Most are probably already familiar with it, but the Harold Colman and Ronald Seddon-Gillespie
patent from Great Brittain 763,062:
 http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=EPODOC&IDX=GB763062&F=0
is also quite relevant.

Thanks for all your insight. There aren't many people around who've been to Methernitha
so your input is valuable.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on November 26, 2007, 05:56:44 AM
@ Steve - I'm looking at makeing the disks first to get the Ion flow. In the back tower off the motor using a gum rubber belt (Van De Graph type ) runnig the radious of the disk to produse ion flow to the disks. One the Quratz stone , in that area of the swizz the stone there is high in lead , much of the industry in the past was makeing glass, and later makeing optic blanks so I'm filimaure with the matreials. these are natural Electrcts, and plastics of sorts are to depending how there used. Ceramic Eletrcts can be found in old microphones that are great for expierimenting with. still studying. Did you get the Hamel drum up and running ?  thanks Mike 
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: karl on November 26, 2007, 12:11:01 PM
Steven,
have you implied the electrophorus principle in one of your machines?
Are they preloaded by rubbing the disks or stators with a cloth (basicly a kind of an electret).
Mr. Hyde's basic principle to cancle out the backdrag forces is to leave the total capacity every time in the rotation the same.
This is not  the classic work to potentional conversion while changing the capacity (basic Electrophorus) but the increasing of a partial capacity and a decreasing of an other partial capacity at the same time in a sine wave manner to get harmonic and continous electron flow.
Best wishes
Karl
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on November 26, 2007, 12:51:38 PM
@ Steve - I'm looking at makeing the disks first to get the Ion flow. In the back tower off the motor using a gum rubber belt (Van De Graph type ) runnig the radious of the disk to produse ion flow to the disks. One the Quratz stone , in that area of the swizz the stone there is high in lead , much of the industry in the past was makeing glass, and later makeing optic blanks so I'm filimaure with the matreials. these are natural Electrcts, and plastics of sorts are to depending how there used. Ceramic Eletrcts can be found in old microphones that are great for expierimenting with. still studying. Did you get the Hamel drum up and running ?  thanks Mike 

Mike,
Thanks for the response. Sounds like an interesting starting place. I won't pester you for further
details for now since I know you probably need to the time to build it.
Re the Hamel drum, it didn't work for me though from showing it to David Hamel I learned enough to
make another attempt. However, time doesn't permit. I focus on testatika instead.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: TheOne on November 27, 2007, 05:13:47 AM
Hi, I'am trying to find this book "Electrical Influence Machines" related to the Pidgeon machine that looks like a testatika, I want to understand how it work, but i cannot find the book on the net, I see one site where you can buy but you need to read it online, Since i hate staying in front of the computer to read stuff like that, I prefer to print it, So is someone know a link or have the orignal doc in PDF format?

Thanks
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: TheOne on November 27, 2007, 05:28:52 AM
lol I was able to find one but its online, at least its free here the link for the one who are interested

http://www.electrotherapymuseum.com/2007/ElectricalInfluenceMachines/index.htm

but i rather prefer to have a PDF version :)
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 05, 2008, 09:09:03 PM
My pouter was down for a while and I have made some progress on the machine. I made up some polycarbonate Lexan disks and used copper foil on the front disk and aluminum foil ( air duct foil tape on the back disk .  the drive system works great , I switcted to a leather belt drive to improve the smoothness and grip to the sheves. the motor runs @ 5 to 15 volts @ 1 to 2 amps and stays cool for long run times , at this point I'm looking for a new motor that is brushless If any on know where to get one that would be appriciated. I need to get some brass screws to make the collectors. I used aluminum screen on the collector pads an will test these to see how well they work out. I have ordered some glass for the laten jars they are the globes from large Addis and Coleman gas latrens, these ar readily avalible and are fairly inexpencive and can be stacked with lead channel from a stain glass supplyer localy, I make stain glass so I have a large stock.   the bottem pic is the front glass disk , I need to make new hubs and newer type bearings and will be building this machine for testing when my lath gets here , I made all the pullies and sheves by hand on a drill press and hole saws this is very time consuming and had to make a few sets to get the ratios right for the weight of the disks and spin RPMs .All the parts were salvaged from scraped out printers and power tools that had seen better days to keep the cost down in the expierimental machines and the plastic was donated by my boss and i thank him. 
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 07, 2008, 08:12:03 PM
Does anyone see any problems with useing steel ballbearings in the hubs ? I set the space between the disks at 11 mm and moveing to 4 mm to increase static fields. how is everyone else setting theres , I useing 60cm disks (20 inches ) All other parts (screws and fastners are brass or aluminum due to magnatisim ) I made up some gold leaf static jars to study the flows around the disks these are very handy ! I used small babyfood jars. a plastic vial will work too. the leather belt is great when useing V gruve sheves and cheep  ;D
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Peter on January 08, 2008, 12:23:40 AM
Hello,

  i have compiled the jpg's from the old book that TheOne found at http://www.electrotherapymuseum.com/2007/ElectricalInfluenceMachines/index.htm
to a word document, so you can print it out (see attachement).

Greetings
Peter

Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on January 08, 2008, 10:12:53 PM
Mike,
Nice work! Thanks for showing us. It helps keep us builders going when we see we're not alone.

Does anyone see any problems with useing steel ballbearings in the hubs ? I set the space between the disks at 11 mm and moveing to 4 mm to increase static fields. how is everyone else setting theres ,

I keep mine as close as possible to get maximum field strength, but the wobble is my limiting factor.

I useing 60cm disks (20 inches ) All other parts (screws and fastners are brass or aluminum due to magnatisim ) I made up some gold leaf static jars to study the flows around the disks these are very handy ! I used small babyfood jars. a plastic vial will work too. the leather belt is great when useing V gruve sheves and cheep  ;D

I made a set of pulleys and used a small diameter round file to make the groove. The bearing system didn't work out though. It let the disk tilt over. See:
 http://rimstar.org/equip/estatmb/mk1/estatmbmk1.htm
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 09, 2008, 12:43:32 AM
Thank you Steve , the 60cm disks are mounted on the hubs with 2- 608 bearings , I have a little wobble thats due to I made them on my drill press but can be adjusted by drlling set screws at 120degrees around at 3 points. the drive at the bottom is also bearinged at both ends and the pully on the right is an idoler for the belt to go to the back disk , this turns in the oppisit direction Like on the Jorge machine.  i origanoly made round pullys to see where they would follow and the belts kept comming off. so I switched to the V gruve and the leather belt (square ) and the problem solve with out haveing the put a lot of tension on the pullys and belt. the added tension also put more work on the motor causeing higher amp draw. now runs cool in long run tests and my power supply stays nice and cool too. My next step is to put a thrust bearring between the disks to get them very close and not worry about the hubs rubbing. my goal is to eventualy eliminate the motor if possible or incorperating it into the hubs one neg. and the other Pos. then ther would be no drive belt. this could be done useing stepper motor parts and be brushless. the mag field would then be in the vortex equaly neg. and pos. to the disk reference.  By the way thank you very much for your time converting the book to word and posting this valuble information. I'll be working on the collectors tonite , bought a nice cross vice at Harbor Freight last nite for the drill press, this will help in makeing the close adjustment of the collectors ( oval holes )
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on January 09, 2008, 02:59:52 AM
Thank you Steve , the 60cm disks are mounted on the hubs with 2- 608 bearings , I have a little wobble
...
By the way thank you very much for your time converting the book to word and posting this valuble information.
It was Peter who did the converting. See his message above.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 09, 2008, 03:33:40 AM
@ Steve - the 608 is the No# on the bearing you can get these in a double roller and then use only 1 bearing in each hub .The thrust bearing is from a Dewalt drill (battry tourq control type )  thanks for the correction I should have thanked Pete so Thanks PETE ;D  oh by the way do you have all the Albert hauser diagrams ?
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on January 09, 2008, 03:48:14 PM
oh by the way do you have all the Albert hauser diagrams ?

I think I do. Are you looking for them or one in particular? If it's just one then I can upload here. If more, then send me private email and I'll send you what I've got as an attachment. You can get my email address from my profile or at the bottom of any of my webpages.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 10, 2008, 12:43:25 AM
@ Steve D - on your web site in the links to Watson"s-  Albert Huser is discribeing the Testanika 3kw machine and it says to see diagrams - I only see the parts list of the diagram. The other thing I have been looking into is the Layten jar capisators , on the Joerge R. link I noticed something interesting ( when Baumman opend the jayten capisator he had to retune it after he put the coil back on , this took a while )  In Joerge R.  did you notice the large coil in the first photo and the rest have small flat coils under looks like PVC caps. " the coil is more like a selonoid coil- quote from the link A.H. " this might mean the spring wound wire in the center is connected to a plunger in the center of the coil , so as to ossilate when tension is given from the spark gap ( the plunger will only move when tension is present and Q is reached then it releases due to the magpulse of the coil this happens in millieseconds ), this ossilation is giveing the freq. ossilation and acts like a pump in the jar to induce ion flow at the same time. something to ponder on.  in effect the perforated aluminim and copper sleves in the jar are the primary and the coil is the secondarie but instead of ( like in a flyback tranformer the gap is used backwards to the secondaie ) . I'll look around for a flyback and induse static voltage to the secondarie and see what happens , this can be done useing a auto coil or a good HV sourse with low amprage (ma's) so I don't burn it out. 
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on January 10, 2008, 02:02:20 AM
@ Steve D - on your web site in the links to Watson"s-  Albert Huser is discribeing the Testanika 3kw machine and it says to see diagrams - I only see the parts list of the diagram.

See that attached, hauser.zip.

The other thing I have been looking into is the Layten jar capisators , on the Joerge R. link I noticed something interesting ( when Baumman opend the jayten capisator he had to retune it after he put the coil back on , this took a while )

I remember reading this a year or so ago and have been wanting to find the reference again. Where did you read about Baumann openning the pot (Baumann's term for the two big cans) and retuning it?

In Joerge R.  did you notice the large coil in the first photo and the rest have small flat coils under looks like PVC caps. " the coil is more like a selonoid coil- quote from the link A.H. " this might mean the spring wound wire in the center is connected to a plunger in the center of the coil , so as to ossilate when tension is given from the spark gap ( the plunger will only move when tension is present and Q is reached then it releases due to the magpulse of the coil this happens in millieseconds ), this ossilation is giveing the freq. ossilation and acts like a pump in the jar to induce ion flow at the same time. something to ponder on.  in effect the perforated aluminim and copper sleves in the jar are the primary and the coil is the secondarie but instead of ( like in a flyback tranformer the gap is used backwards to the secondaie ) . I'll look around for a flyback and induse static voltage to the secondarie and see what happens , this can be done useing a auto coil or a good HV sourse with low amprage (ma's) so I don't burn it out. 

I've always wondered if Hauser was speculating about the 3kW machine's pot's contents or if Baumann told or showed it to him. I wonder because Baumann said that "In the large capacitors there are 20 layers of perforated sheet". This is from the visit by 30 engineers.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 11, 2008, 01:45:01 AM
Thank you Steve that was what i was looking for. I was meeting a collige last nite and met some folks form Finland and Norway they are in the finance biz , what was interesting ,I asked them about ever going the Methernika , Swiss and they said yes and knew about the testanika machine but didn't know anything about it but had the occasion to see it run. he also said that he would inquire for me and rely the info to my collieg. It seams that he does biz with the group and was very nice in being open about the subject. I also explained my position on the machine that I was only interested in building one and was not in it to make money or give the information out , I strongly feel that this is their property and will not infrindge on thir kindness. 
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Bessler007 on January 11, 2008, 11:43:08 AM
Not exactly it but here's an interesting link:

http://www.coe.ufrj.br/~acmq/electrostatic.html

Hi, I'am trying to find this book "Electrical Influence Machines" related to the Pidgeon machine that looks like a testatika, I want to understand how it work, but i cannot find the book on the net, I see one site where you can buy but you need to read it online, Since i hate staying in front of the computer to read stuff like that, I prefer to print it, So is someone know a link or have the orignal doc in PDF format?

Thanks

http://books.google.com/books?id=inhPAAAAMAAJ&printsec=titlepage#PPP3,M1



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_electrostatic_generator_patents
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on January 11, 2008, 03:57:49 PM
Thank you Steve that was what i was looking for. I was meeting a collige last nite and met some folks form Finland and Norway they are in the finance biz , what was interesting ,I asked them about ever going the Methernika , Swiss and they said yes ...

Thanks Mike. Amazing coincedence. I guess if we want to see the machine we just need to do business with Methernitha. Keep us posted.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 12, 2008, 10:52:36 PM
Update - Ok I had the chance to get the disks moved closer together tihs morrning and it runs great !! just need to update the small drive belt I'm useing a hair scrungie , sence I cut my hair off they make neat drive belts  ;D  on to the collectors next  ...good Ion smell comeing off the disks
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Implosion on January 13, 2008, 02:55:51 AM
Update - Ok I had the chance to get the disks moved closer together tihs morrning and it runs great !! just need to update the small drive belt I'm useing a hair scrungie , sence I cut my hair off they make neat drive belts  ;D  on to the collectors next  ...good Ion smell comeing off the disks

Hi,

What kind of materials did you use for the discs? both the same, or based on the Triboelectric series?

I have build it almost on the attic, but i have a problem with the tempature, sometimes its very cold there, and another time its less cold. and then the discs crimps more then the lamels, so some lamels felt from the discs.
So i have to move it to another room on the first floor. but that room is fulled by a bath for the bathroom. lol.
And 2 januari our sun is born, so very busy at the moment. ( every 4 houres feeding )

But I have allready setup one disc ( vinyl ) and works fine with rotating. ( I use 2 bearings for one disc ). and it rotate very straight ( one meter disc's ) so I want to use a distance about 4 mm between the disc's.

I can also get the long glass tubes, but they are very expensive ( one tube 120 cm long , and 7 cm in diameter cost about 80 euro's ) LoL

Greetings Peter from Holland.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 13, 2008, 07:43:15 PM
The Disks are Polycarbonate ( Lexan ) 51cm , useing copper foil on front disk and aluminum foil tape on the back disk
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Implosion on January 13, 2008, 08:14:49 PM
The Disks are Polycarbonate ( Lexan ) 51cm , useing copper foil on front disk and aluminum foil tape on the back disk

Ah ok, and the static is generated by the brushes? like the wimhurst machine?

Peter
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on January 15, 2008, 02:09:31 AM
Oh no- No Brushes or gum belts at the moment, just running by the disks prouduceing ion , lite smell of the feild produceing ions , it is raining today and cool temps .
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Implosion on January 15, 2008, 03:43:10 AM
Ah thx for your answer.
That is good, that the discs are getting static by his own. and not by brushes.

Peter
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on February 05, 2008, 03:07:17 AM
Up date - new devlopment with the Polycarbonate  (Lexa disks) , It seens the Ion or Ozone is starting to detierate the front belt hub and the mounting screw holes. I haven't tryed to pull power off the disks so this is what may have lead to the early detieroateion of the parts. Mike
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hartiberlin on February 20, 2008, 06:36:19 AM
Hi Motorcoach1,
looks good.
Now you need to pulse via corona dischare some
granite rocks in a Leyden Jar,
cause the original Testatika runs on excited radioactive Beta
Decay probably from natural granite or mountain crystal rocks
that contain a lot of Kalium 40,which can be excited to decay much
faster via RF high Voltage pulses.

Good luck.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: EMdevices on February 21, 2008, 12:01:50 AM
Nice build Motorcoach.

I would like to offer some advice to anybody trying to replicate.

It is obvious the machine as a whole resembles a Whimhurst machine !!   As such, the principles involved should first be understood, before other exotic notions are entertained. 

Take a look at this link to see how a wimhurst machine operates.  http://www.coe.ufrj.br/~acmq/whyhow.html   

Here's a paragraph from this link that's revealing:
 
Quote
The output current of a Wimshurst machine depends essentially on the area of the ring occupied by the disks and on the rotation speed. See how. The machine acts as a current source for a load connected to its terminals, including losses by internal corona and sparking. Curiously, only one disk contributes to the output current, because if the charge of one sector is removed by a charge collector, the potential at the corresponding sector in the other disk decreases due to the relatively high capacitance between the disks, and the potential difference between this sector and the charge collector becomes too small for a discharge across the air interval separating them. It is possible to collect charge from just one disk instead of from both disks. The obtained current is a good fraction of the regular output due to the same effect. It is even possible to eliminate the neutralizer from the side where current is taken, with the output circuit serving as neutralizer, but in this case the machine is less reliable, requiring a short-circuit at the output for startup.

Note that the machine is a current source.  As we know,  a current source produces the most power when going into a high impedance load.     P = I^2 R,  where "I" is the current, and 'R' the load resistance.   So the higher the impedance of the load the more power is delivered.  Another way to think about this is to realize that with a high impedance we have a huge voltage given the same current, or V = I x R,  so it's good to build up high voltage.

The real inovations of the Testatika, over the well known Wimhurst machine,  seems to be the following:

1)  Improved charge carriers  (plates don't carry as much charge as grills, so grills are better)

2)  Use of the high voltage developed, to drive and turn the machine. Not by electrostatic means, but by electromagnetic means, using magnets and coils and comutators.

3)  Matching of the load impedance to the source impedance of the machine.  This is the most crucial.  One spark and all the built up energy goes wasting as heat.

The most important aspect seems to be #3.  If this can be acomplished then #2 can be acomplished.  #1 is a no brainer.

So the real question is how to effectively use high voltage static electricity?
Inductors come to mind. A quick contact to an inductor would build up magnetic fields and discharge the main capacitors in a controled manner.  This is just a start.   Diodes can be involved of course as we keep hearing about "rocks" from Stefan.

To me, overunity was always associated with the Wimhurst machines.  Studying their balanced design and the ingenous induction principle always conviced me that they were special.

So here is a test:

1)   Ramp up a Wimhurst machine to high voltage and connect across a voltage divider made with resistors.  Choose realy high total resistance like   100 M ohms.

2)  Then measure acurately the speed of the shaft and the torque on the input shaft to get an idea of the Power Input.

3)  Calculate the Power Output from the voltage divider.        

This should show if Pout is greater then Pin.  If it is not, increase the resistor value even more.  The voltage will only build up higher and higher up to breakdown.  A good design will have a high breakdown voltage hence a great performance !!

EM
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: mungibung on February 25, 2008, 05:36:52 AM
Hello all,
I've been looking on the net for quite a while and the best site fort info and pics I have found on the testatika machine is here, this cleared up many of my ????? on the subject. Ihope this helps someone, it did me
                             Michael


http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on April 02, 2008, 02:27:35 AM
FYI Today, I tested my single disk small machine with vinyl sheets
on the back. The output for the tests were the side antenna keys
w.r.t. ground. There's a big difference in measured voltage when
I let the vinyl sit for a while and let the charge dissipates from
when I rub the vinyl with my hand. See:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/smallmach2_test3_vinyl1.htm
This was all as expected based on my older tests with a vinyl
record for the back disk of my two disk machine but I had to
try it. I tend to think that the whole backing plate is vinyl
and that the two plates on the back are metal but what I did
today was a simple test.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hartiberlin on April 09, 2008, 02:43:39 AM
Thanks Steve for this report,
but your output is only in the 300 milliVolt range.
How much current could you draw from it ?

Regarding:
http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/testamagseries2.htm

you need to have glimmer or other K40 isotope  (Potassium40) containing material
which is excited from the capacitor plates and the magnetic fields.

The Testika is really a magnetic and electrical field excited radioactive decay accelerated
machine.
This way the accelerated radioactive decay is converted to electricity.

As you see yourself with your experiments, the electrostatic and magnetic effects
alone are just too small to get any usefull power output.

The huge power output can only be explained by exciting the mountain crystals
inside their backside Leyden jar capacitors and between their horseshoe magnets
and releasing Beta radiation= free electrons
which produce the huge power output.

This is also the only logical explanation for the huge power output
and Mr. Bosshard always said: "The secret is in the crystals".

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on April 09, 2008, 06:53:27 PM
Hi Stefan,

Thanks Steve for this report,
but your output is only in the 300 milliVolt range.
How much current could you draw from it ?

I didn't measure current and I'm sure it would be very small, probably too small for my meter. But the point was just to show that with the disk as a variable capacitor, using a triboelectrically charged backing gives significantly higher voltage at the antenna keys. It was only to test that one small piece of the puzzle. I didn't think it was the source of the testatika's high power output.

Regarding:
http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/testamagseries2.htm

you need to have glimmer or other K40 isotope  (Potassium40) containing material
which is excited from the capacitor plates and the magnetic fields.

I'm beginning to agree with you, partially. See more below.

The Testika is really a magnetic and electrical field excited radioactive decay accelerated
machine.
This way the accelerated radioactive decay is converted to electricity.

As you see yourself with your experiments, the electrostatic and magnetic effects
alone are just too small to get any usefull power output.

The huge power output can only be explained by exciting the mountain crystals
inside their backside Leyden jar capacitors and between their horseshoe magnets
and releasing Beta radiation= free electrons
which produce the huge power output.

This is also the only logical explanation for the huge power output
and Mr. Bosshard always said: "The secret is in the crystals".

From examining this photo:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/misc/test.jpg
I've begun to agree with you, but not for the ultimate high power output. My current working theory is that the high power is produced in 3 stages. The first is the variable capacitor giving alternating voltage. The second is from the three small pots in the front using stimulated radioactivity to boost the charge that is fed into the third stage, the large pots, which tap into ZPE to give their huge output. Since this may not be clear in text, I just put together this webpage with some diagrams:
 http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/th3stagepower.htm
The tall capacitors in the back may play a role in pumping up the voltage needed to get he medium voltage AC from the disks as variable capacitors, since the charge on any triboelectric material may decrease over time. The charge from the tall capacitors may also be needed in the rotation circuit.

Since I'm nervous about working with "stimulated" radioactivity, I'm working mostly on stage 3 and feeding it by other means.

By the way, Stefan, on my 3 stage power theory page (the link above), I quote you a bit. Let me know if I got it wrong and I'll fix it.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on April 19, 2008, 06:17:04 AM
Hi Guys,

I think I might be zeroing in on something.

No radioactivity at all btw Stefan.
More like Tesla?s patent 685,957


Have you guys ever heard of a polarity inverter?

Figure 4.2
http://www.physiqueindustrie.com/Publi/solid_state_pulsed_power.pdf

I believe there?s one (or two) in the Testatika.
You know,  lightning stuff and such.

- (ground), +/- (cloud), + sky above cloud.

I think this drawing below could be nested together as well.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on April 19, 2008, 07:11:36 AM
parasitic. (should be minimized).
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: hartiberlin on April 20, 2008, 04:51:21 AM
Hi Steven,
many thanks for mentioning my name.
I just read in an old paper from 1984 about Methernitha,
that they also had a workshop for
crystal-pollishing !
So they did cut and saw and pollish
also crystals over here.

Now it is really clear to me, that Baumann
must have learned about the excitation of crystals during this time
and that the Testatikas really work on excited radioactive decay in their
used Mountain crystals.

@argona369
I don?t see, what you want to proof with this pulse inverter ?
Will there come more energy out then put into it ?
Probably not..
and Tesla?s radiant energy patent is widely known,
but it needs a high power source to work.....

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on April 20, 2008, 06:48:54 AM
>@argona369
>I don?t see, what you want to proof with this pulse inverter ?

Hi Stefan,

The Testatika is an electrostatic pulsing device right?
The  "Principle Experiment? was an arm that moved back and forth,
As a segmented polarity rotating disk would do.
There?s pulsing going on in the Testatika i believe.
Another clue is the fact that the speed needs to be regulated.
Would it need to be regulated for voltage or pulses?

>Will there come more energy out then put into it ?
>Probably not..

It?s just one part that could be in the Testatika,
Maybe even nested into a plate form. Or maybe not at all.

Leydens can do interesting things.
I found fig 2 interesting in Tesla?s ?Experiments with alternate currents of high potential?,
in that the generator side of the leyden?s were connected to the ?inside coatings ?
Of the leydens, and with that configuration, with that setup, he was able to convert AC to  DC and mimic a wimshurst generator.

>and Tesla?s radiant energy patent is widely known,
>but it needs a high power source to work.....

I think it?s one of those cryptic patents.

Cliff,
Title: looking for a Tesla document
Post by: argona369 on April 21, 2008, 03:05:31 AM
Looking for the Tesla document/lecture/talk
Where Tesla talks about his device that was
?diametrically opposite to a hertzian transmitter?

(There?s a diametrically (non-resonant) opposite transformer
in figure 2 from Tesla?s ?Experiments with alternate currents of high potential?)

Anyone got a link or name of the lecture? I can?t find it.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Motorcoach1 on May 03, 2008, 07:59:15 AM
edit
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on May 04, 2008, 08:31:15 PM
alternate capacitor
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on May 05, 2008, 03:56:48 AM
Please see,


Tesla radiant energy,
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=4623.msg94061#msg94061
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: argona369 on May 09, 2008, 07:23:21 PM
Hi Guys,

It couldn?t be this simple could it?
Just an idea,

If you had a naturally charged disk with opposite polarity segments.

And two uncharged plates were nearby but not ?inline? with the disk, with an uncharged capacitor connected to the plates.
Would the disk turn and be attracted to the plates (up to a point).
And at the same time, the capacitor charged.

This would be repeated by discharging the capacitor as the next set of plates
Rotated into position.

Cliff,


Added:
Btw,
The disk would have to ?loose polarity? for the disk to move away.
Probably a little more complicated than shown.
This might naturally occur though.
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on August 23, 2008, 02:34:11 PM
Hey All,
For the middle cylinder(s) for my pots I want to use a magnetizable metal and a few months ago I found that the metal used in gallon paint cans is magnetizable. Unfortunately it wasn't solderable with my 40 watt soldering iron (or maybe I didn't use enough acid paste?) so electrically attaching wires to it is difficult to do in a way that works well for high voltage purposes. Another problem with gallon paint cans is finding one that is not coated on the inside. I've found that this coating is not electrically conductive. This past week I found a similar metal can that is magnetizable, solderable and uncoated! You can see this can at:
 http://www.bscchem.com/
It's the top right can in the top photo. It seems a chemical supply store is the place to go for this sort of thing. I've even been able to solder the two edges of the cylinders together for a flat join rather than doing my usual overlap or close meeting. I was even able to cut slits in the top and slide my wires between the edges of the metal and solder them rather than having the wires overlap, another good thing for high voltage capacitors.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
Title: Re: Testatika small machine testbed
Post by: Steven Dufresne on November 12, 2008, 09:32:51 PM
Hi all,
Back in 2005 I started work on replicating the Hyde generator, well documented in US patent 4897592:
  http://www.google.com/patents?id=HX4BAAAAEBAJ&dq=4897592
From private correspondance between William Hyde and Moray B. King (see King's book "Quest for Zero Point Energy"), a prototype that contained 2000 capacitors and diodes produced the following results:
  No. rotor segments: 240
  No. stator segments: 480
  Rotor speed: 6000 rpm
  Output voltage: 602 VDC
  Output current: 38 amps
  Output power: 22.9 kW
  Input power: 2.4 kW
  Net output power (while free running): 20.5 kW

Then I got side tracked for 3 years with the testatika (:-)), partly because of its similarity. Lately I restarted building my Hyde replication and given what I learned about the testatika over those 3 years I see the correlation even better. So I then returned to the testatika and am currently modifying it to match. I've documented the correlation, with a diagram, at:
  http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/testatika_and_hyde_generator.htm
It's off of my theories page:
  http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/testa/theories.htm
Basically, it says that the interaction between the testatika disks and the antenna keys are where the excess power is being produced in the form of anomalous high voltage spikes and that the pots turn these spikes into lower voltage DC.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org
PS. Hi F_dyne. We really do seem to be in sync today. :-)