# Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

## Mechanical free energy devices => mechanic => Topic started by: Hope on March 20, 2017, 05:16:23 AM

Title: Well soon the people in the white coats will appear BUT!
Post by: Hope on March 20, 2017, 05:16:23 AM
There must be some way to make use of nature more in storing energy so first let's just say I will come pick up huge weights on all your places and let you hang them and drain (harvest) the energy and make more as you like!

"an object weighting 1 Ton lifted 1m into the air can store approx. 533 watt hours of energy. Increasing the vertical lift distance to 100m and the weight to 200 Ton leads to a device capable of storing approx. 10.67 mWh of energy."

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Gravitational potential energy storage
Postby Kheldar on March 21st, 2010, 6:56 pm

Hi all,

I've been thinking about a way to store lots of energy. It's probably been considered already, but I just wanted to get an opinion on it's merits. I was so excited when i thought of it that i went ahead and added it to wikipedia lol

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section: Energy storage types

I know it would work (just not whether it would work well) so I went ahead with it, but my maths are not based in any engineering experience so that's what this post is for. I am pasting the exact text I put in below so that you can judge.

<begin>
Energy can be stored by lifting a heavy object vertically using a cable and winch system. Energy can be harvested again by lowering the weight against a dynamo. By using the formula Ug = mgh where 1Ug is equal to 196J, and since 1 watt hour = 3600 J we can determine that an object weighting 1 Ton lifted 1m into the air can store approx. 533 watt hours of energy. Increasing the vertical lift distance to 100m and the weight to 200 Ton leads to a device capable of storing approx. 10.67 mWh of energy. Large scale implementation of such devices have the potential to serve as a method to store excess alternatively generated energy for when sunlight and/or wind is not availabe. The costs associated with this form of energy storage are low since the weight can consist of a wide variety of materials (building rubble for example) and also due to the extemely accessible technologies used.
<end>

What do you think. Did I mess up Wikipedia even more? lol

If it will work and it can help at all and if it is an original idea then I hereby announce it royalty/licence free for the whole world. Haha

I just think that it makes a bit more sense than building infrastructure to pump water uphill.
Kheldar
Forum Neophyte

Posts: 15
Joined: 28 Jun 2009

Well that is out of the way.   I can not use some program like other to draw this but in words.   First motion is evident in energy and trees move.   Small trees in lesser ways than mid and larger trees.  They dance in the winds.   If a system of ratcheted cables we attached to the tree and an near by rock or container of debris even.   As the wind flexed the tree (or any flexing structure) that flex motion could be used to lift near by or carried rocks or debris as weights.    Talking about cheap storage!  Even if you had to stick a log under the lifted weight as a spring made the worm winch take up the slack.   Could you image 20 trees with 600 lbs each hanging 10 feet or even just tipping a long piece up a few feet could storage in kinetic energy, wow.    Back to the white coats,  maybe in the center of Stonehenge  was a huge tree doing just this.   And all the steampunk machines running off it 24/7/365.

PS   what if we put a mass of cables letting the continental drift power the force part?

Title: Re: Well soon the people in the white coats will appear BUT!
Post by: fritznien on March 20, 2017, 05:50:33 AM
"an object weighting 1 Ton lifted 1m into the air can store approx. 533 watt hours of energy."

i think you made an error somewhere along the way.
one ton, call it 1000 kg lifted a meter would be 9800 newton meters of energy or 9800 joules,
3600 seconds to the hour. 9800/3600=2.72 watt hrs.
i think the only practical app for this is with pumped storage for hydro electric sites.
Title: Re: Well soon the people in the white coats will appear BUT!
Post by: seychelles on March 20, 2017, 07:59:44 AM
GERMANY IS USING OLD COAL MINES AS SOLAR POWER STORAGE.
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/articles/2017/03/german-coal-mine-to-be-reborn-as-giant-pumped-storage-hydro-facility.html
Title: Re: Well soon the people in the white coats will appear BUT!
Post by: MileHigh on March 21, 2017, 03:16:10 AM
GERMANY IS USING OLD COAL MINES AS SOLAR POWER STORAGE.
http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/articles/2017/03/german-coal-mine-to-be-reborn-as-giant-pumped-storage-hydro-facility.html (http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/articles/2017/03/german-coal-mine-to-be-reborn-as-giant-pumped-storage-hydro-facility.html)

This is a very creative idea, congratulations on making a great posting.  There are presumably a lot of old underground mines that would be candidates for this innovative technology.  If it can be done in a cost-effective way and make the bean counters happy, I see it as a big win.  An invisible benign underground energy store that can store very large amounts of energy is what we need as part of the conversion over to renewable energy.
Title: Re: Well soon the people in the white coats will appear BUT!
Post by: sm0ky2 on March 24, 2017, 06:50:58 PM
"Innovative"........

Gravity Battery was retired on a global scale around 200 B.C.

Technically no different than a storage lake above a dam,
Except through pump inefficiencies, vs mechanical weight lifting.
Rock on a string, E=mgh
How do we measure torque and rotational force?

Mankind considered this obsolete 3 millennia ago
The invention of the water wheel and windmill, animal power
Meant we no longer had to exert energy to lift the weights.
Sure it has been used sporadically throughout human history,
But mostly as personal gravity storage or in small uncivilized
villages. Not really on a large utility scale, since the collapse of
the ancient civilizations.

It has been mostly a social issue as to why we don't use this
No one cared about "storage", we want instant gratification.
We wanted to use the power directly. Which has led to our
Overly expensive grid-system.
If this was a storage-based grid, with balanced battery banks,
Our demand requirements would drop by 75%.

We realized this, and have since been sinking ungodly amounts
money into battery storage technology. Much of which are much
more expensive than a Boulder. All emotions aside, investors
would have to take huge losses to jump on board with gravity
storage. There is very little R&D to be done with gravity based
energy storage. The equations we use today are no different in
functionality that the equations used thousands of years ago.
We have hammered out a few more decimal points, but when
considering the large masses used in such large storage systems,
the math works out pretty much the same.

We are currently gearing up towards having micro-generation
stations across the country. Renewable energy can soon be stored
on the grid itself, reducing the need for on-demand peak adjustments
within the generation network.

Which will make gravity based storage once again a viable technology.
In direct competition with expensive battery banks.
(who will win?\$?)

It is ironic that it took mankind so long to come full circle, yet we look at
those people from 3,000-7000yrs ago - like we are somehow smarter or
more advanced than they once were. Once we realize that we are not yet
to the level they were at, but in fact are quickly approaching their level of
knowledge and technology- perhaps we can learn what they tried to teach us,
carved in stone.

Using deep sink holes or old mine shafts, is a great idea.
It removes the requirement of building unsightly towers,
which will save on costs and preserve the view.

Politics and economic issues will be our only obstacle.

While not in and of itself "free energy", this is a well known
low cost form of energy storage. (By far the oldest, and cheapest.)
When coupled with a modern generator, \$ for \$,  we can upgrade
any large modern battery system 10-fold with this simple technology
that predates our current history of civilization.
Remnants of the time before time.