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Author Topic: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency  (Read 238245 times)

Offline tinman

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #915 on: April 16, 2017, 02:18:06 PM »
The single wire coil won't ring from a "Shock Charge". You may need a "Make an Instant magnet" trick.

Oh boy! Can't wait for the TK's next thriller Ohmic resistance measurement video with his mighty digital multi meter!

This more of your own made up stuff synchro ?

Do you mean,a pulse of high current ?.


Brad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #916 on: April 16, 2017, 02:21:01 PM »
This more of your own made up stuff synchro ?

Do you mean,a pulse of high current ?.


Brad

That's better. I'm restoring the insults to the comment on my "Unified Field Theory" firewall thread.

Offline Grumage

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #917 on: April 16, 2017, 03:01:40 PM »
Would I be correct in thinking that these coils/transformers were specifically designed for DC pulses?

Cheers Graham.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #917 on: April 16, 2017, 03:01:40 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #918 on: April 16, 2017, 03:06:47 PM »
Would I be correct in thinking that these coils/transformers were specifically designed for DC pulses?

Cheers Graham.

@Grummage,

Unfortunately the Tesla patent was redacted by the "War Department, and the pulse portion removed.

Offline tinman

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #919 on: April 16, 2017, 03:08:09 PM »
Would I be correct in thinking that these coils/transformers were specifically designed for DC pulses?

Cheers Graham.

Are you referring to the bifilar coil grum?


Brad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #919 on: April 16, 2017, 03:08:09 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #920 on: April 16, 2017, 03:27:28 PM »

Yes...

The scrapyard we visited to view an early Tesla Electro-magnet in 62' was guarded by an old guy who told us the magnet fired accidently once while it was on it's side, and knocked a junk car off the top of a pile into a neighbor's yard at a distance of maybe fifty yards. We were not permitted to photograph it.

Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #921 on: April 16, 2017, 03:41:25 PM »
If evostars aimed his pancake coil at at cutlery rack, instead of measuring voltage, he'd be as traumatized as I was when I first tried it. The NC EMP Sats are atomic warheads in the Ionosphere that are designed to implode a Magnetic Tsunami from the Earth's magnetic field.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #921 on: April 16, 2017, 03:41:25 PM »
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Offline tinman

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #922 on: April 16, 2017, 03:51:29 PM »
The scrapyard we visited to view an early Tesla Electro-magnet in 62' was guarded by an old guy who told us the magnet fired accidently once while it was on it's side, and knocked a junk car off the top of a pile into a neighbor's yard at a distance of maybe fifty yards. We were not permitted to photograph it.

Oh-so now we have electromagnets that repel steel cars
 ::)

Where or how do you keep coming up with this stuff synchro lol.


Brad

Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #923 on: April 16, 2017, 04:07:28 PM »

Well, MileHigh,  can a square wave be considered pulsing a bifilar coil?

Conrad nicely demonstrates in his videos, especially in Part 1 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fC84W0PIZoE
when he switches from pure sine wave to square wave at 4 MHz, the bifilar coil nicely responds to
that wave much the same way as it does for the sine wave and of course the output response is sine wave as expected.
It gives pretty good response even to subharmonic (1/3) square wave excitation as well.

Is this still a strange question? 

Gyula

Yes it's a strange question because it was a discussion about Magluvin's mistaken belief that "since a series bifilar coil can look like the wire resistance only, then I can pulse a series bifilar coil and get an instant magnetic field without having to energize the inductor."  It wasn't about the bandwidth-limited square wave excitation that you see in Conrad's clip.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #923 on: April 16, 2017, 04:07:28 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #924 on: April 16, 2017, 04:07:56 PM »
Oh-so now we have electromagnets that repel steel cars
 ::)

Where or how do you keep coming up with this stuff synchro lol.


Brad

@Tinman,

My vendetta with TK goes back to one of his earliest coil comparison videos nearly eight years ago. I had a large coffee can size solenoid bifilar professionally wound at an electric motor shop in Eureka California around the same time, and packed the core with welding rods for my first Bedini SSG. I already knew how to charge and pulse the coil from Dave Dinan, but I really didn't know exactly what to expect. I shocked twice; Once to shock charge and ring  it, then a second time. The spark from the second swipe was around ten times as large as the ring pulse. Well, everyone's already heard about the rack of carving knives that careened about twenty five feet towards the coil. The coil was unaffected by the attraction.


Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #925 on: April 16, 2017, 04:23:30 PM »
Your coming up with 10ohm on conrads coils shows your inexperience with seeing such and making even an approximate determination of the resistance and it is far from showing that you are an authority in this area. Then you say that the difference between 10ohm and .4ohm doesnt make a difference anyway.  Run the sim and see how long it takes for the ring to die down in each example. Its a large difference and your assumption of 10 ohms then posting all the formulas trying to show big issues to prove your view against others views, then yeah, it should be pointed out that you are not producing accurate info in your argument. That 10ohms wastes a lot of energy in the circuit at a very unnecessary and unrealistic rate. 

So maybe, if i have to be blunt, just shedup.

Mags

No it doesn't show my inexperience, it shows that I was simply tired and took TK's resistance measurement from his clip instead.  Stop spinning.

As far as your silly complaint about the resistance goes, and since you portrayed me as a teacher, let's imagine this scenario:  The teacher goes through the effort of analyzing a circuit and applying various concepts involving inductance. capacitance, resistance, frequency, energy and power analysis and goes through a step-by-step logical analysis and arrives at a satisfactory conclusion.  Then some student in the back of the class raises his hand and objects and says, "But sir, the resistance was 11 ohms and not two ohms!"

There is a pregnant pause in the classroom and then nearly every student turns around and glares at the problem student and makes it clear to him that he is acting like a fool and an idiot and is either being intentionally disruptive, and/or he is too dim witted to realize that the whole point of the exercise is to understand and appreciate the analysis and the values of the components are just illustrative and not critical to understanding what is really going on.

To be blunt, put your brain in gear and think properly and stop playing the hapless fool "out to get me."

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #925 on: April 16, 2017, 04:23:30 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #926 on: April 16, 2017, 04:36:37 PM »
What's the magnet wave look like? Here's a view of a "Galactic Wormhole":

Offline gyulasun

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #927 on: April 16, 2017, 04:47:33 PM »
Yes it's a strange question because it was a discussion about Magluvin's mistaken belief that "since a series bifilar coil can look like the wire resistance only, then I can pulse a series bifilar coil and get an instant magnetic field without having to energize the inductor."  It wasn't about the bandwidth-limited square wave excitation that you see in Conrad's clip.

Hi MileHigh,

Well, it is true that Conrad's function generator happened to produce a distorted square wave instead of a beefy brick wall wave form at the 4 MHz frequency involved but nevertheless it was already far from a sine wave, close to "imitate" a switching waveform, do not you think?

For me, this is not an explanation,  and I do not think what Magluvin wrote is a mistaken belief, I agree with him.

Obviously, the claims have to be proved by measurements and hopefully it is taking place in this thread.

Gyula

Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #928 on: April 16, 2017, 04:49:28 PM »
Would I be correct in thinking that these coils/transformers were specifically designed for DC pulses?

Cheers Graham.

Nope, the wording of the patent indicates that it is a device that is supposed to work with sinusoidal AC frequencies.  The patent states what amounts to an observation that at the resonance frequency the device acts like a series LC circuit and offers no AC impedance and only shows up as wire resistance.

It also states that the inherent capacitance can also be used for power factor correction.  That would imply that Tesla envisioned the series bifilar pancake coll as one half of what would presumably be a large air core transformer driving an inductive load.

Here is something that may have been a possibility from my mind's eye:   A small factory owner at the turn of the 19th century has a workshop that includes a dozen half-horsepower motors that are always on that drive some small pieces of machinery.  He complains to the electric utility that he is being overcharged for his power consumption and/or his installed electrical wiring is running too hot from resistive losses.  Tesla wanted to put a series-bifilar-based air core transformer next to each machine to do the power factor correction for each motor.  However, this never was realized because other and better methods where developed for power factor correction and the patent was never used in a working device.

I am no Tesla expert, but that is my best guess.  In old factories there were also very large electric motors that drove a long main driveshaft and belts connected to the driveshaft powered the various machines.  I am pretty sure most of us have seen these pictures.  So perhaps Tesla envisioned a giant series-bifilar transformer for this case, who knows.

The patent says nothing about pulsing the coil at all.

Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #929 on: April 16, 2017, 05:08:02 PM »
and I do not think what Magluvin wrote is a mistaken belief, I agree with him.

Really, you believe a series bifilar coil can can produce a magnetic field because when you pulse it it appears to be resistive only and you get near-instant current and a near-instant magnetic field without doing the work to energize the inductance?

I agree, we can temporarily forget about our existing knowledge and this claim and/or belief will have to be proven with measurements.

 

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