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Author Topic: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency  (Read 358302 times)

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #225 on: March 29, 2017, 11:40:06 PM »
Quote
“The Tesla bifilar winding just has more interturn capacitance and so needs less external capacitance to make the LC circuit resonate at a given frequency”

TK isn’t that a special property of pancake coil in relation to others coils ? It seems to me that is one special property isn't  ? 
 

Yes, that is a "special property" not only of "pancake coil" but of the Tesla Bifilar winding, whether flat or solenoidal, and I have never said it isn't. It is the heart of Tesla's patent 512340, after all. I have explained how this is useful, or was useful in Tesla's day. But that doesn't make the coil magic. Yet people still attribute all kinds of other special properties to it, which it does not in fact have.

"IN EVERY COIL".... that "special property" of cancellation of self-inductance at a particular voltage and frequency is a property of EVERY coil. Yet people say that the Tesla Bifilar pancake coil winding is "special" because of this property that EVERY coil has. Perhaps you are not one of those people, but some of the people commenting here certainly are.

Now, the _flat_ or "pancake" coil does have one other "special" property, no matter if it is Single wound or Tesla Bifilar: When used as the primary of an air-core resonating transformer, it allows the builder to get the outermost turns (corresponding to the upper turns of a solenoidal coil) a good distance away from the secondary, and this is advantageous for two reasons. First, it lessens the chance of high-voltage flashover between the secondary resonator and the primary, which can be dangerous to equipment and personnel. Second, it "loosens" the magnetic coupling coefficient between the two coils, which allows the resonator to "ring" more freely when it gets a pulse from the primary.

Meanwhile.... note the Tesla Bifilar primary on my little mini-sstc here:

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #226 on: March 29, 2017, 11:52:00 PM »
Where you see i say that pancake coil has no self induction MH ?

I say :

“the father of pancake coils say exactly that "it possessed no self-induction" only need find the right frequency to that happens .”
 
Are you blind you are you try manipulate  what i wrote ?

You said this:

<<< Yes Evostars , the father of pancake coils  say exactly that "it possessed no self-induction"  only need find the right frequency to that happens , and seems is that that some really don't agree  , and that is the reason to the compass not show any deflection even when  drive a load , not by the high frequency like someone say .  >>>

And I requoted it as this:

<<< (No self induction) is the reason to the compass not show any deflection even when  drive a load , not by the high frequency like someone say>>>

You are saying the pancake coil has no self-induction at resonance which results in the compass needle not deflecting.  There is no manipulation there at all.  Perhaps it is related to language for you since English is your third language?   Why are you still in confrontational mode?

MH Is you logic not mine a logic of someone very dirty  but not surprise me i already saw that same behavior in other occasions.

Did you read what I said to you before?  <<<And in this thread I have read many really nasty and ugly ad hominem attacks from you against me.>>>  If you can't stop the ad hominem attacks then you should leave this thread.

MH You write that not me . Did i wrote  that not produce magnetic field ?  show me please where i wrote that .

I used the speculative word "seems."  <<< Your logic seems to be this...>>>  I am not saying that you definitively stated that the coil does not produce a magnetic field.

If you agree that the coil produces a magnetic field, then what is your explanation for the compass needles not deflecting in your video?

real sad real sad .

One more time:  No more ad hominem attacks.  Discuss the technical points only.

MileHigh

Offline web000x

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #227 on: March 30, 2017, 12:03:16 AM »
@evostars,


What are the measured LC values and wire gauge for your bifilar coils?  I'd also be interested in the read out of a capacitance meter connected to one leg of each coil while the coils are not connected on the far end.  I am curious if the similar orientation of the dielectric field in the pancake coil produces a stronger capacitance vs a bifilar solenoid.  Dollard seemed to think the planetary alignments had a more profound impact on electrical phenomena because of the dielectric flux orientation between them so this test stands to reason... 


Dave


PS @Efinder, thanks

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #227 on: March 30, 2017, 12:03:16 AM »
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Offline Zephir

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #228 on: March 30, 2017, 12:46:15 AM »
Quote from: MileHigh
this might be the third time I will ask you:  What are the special properties of the pancake coil?
The pancake coil has the evanescent scalar wave phenomena enhanced - whereas the normal inductors have them suppressed. The tunneling of EM wave through evanescent field runs with superluminal speed, whereas EM wave in classical circuits always propagates with speed of light or lower. The overunity is extradimensional, normal causality violating effect in essence and the normal spreading of EM waves along conductors cannot achieve it.

Quote from: TinselKoala
the _flat_ or "pancake" coil does have one other "special" property, no matter if it is Single wound or Tesla Bifilar

The bifilar coil collect the A-field component of magnetic field, which isn't detectable with normal coil around torus (Aharamov-Bohm effect). Even at the case, when normal coil is used, then some magnetic field leaks from toroid, because it's coil represents one loop of winding by itself. Once the bifiliar coil doesn't induce the back-EMF voltage and magnetic flux into the circuit, then all energy collected on such a coil must be redundant and as such overunity. The conclusion therefore is, that the every bifilar coil wound around standard Joule-Thief oscillator winding should collect portion of its energy for free.

IMO the MileHigh/TinselKoala should get banned from this site, as their long-term agenda contradicts the very purpose of this forum: the research and spreading the overunity technology. In my experience just a few dedicated trolls like these two ones (note their posts count) can disrupt the constructive atmosphere of the whole forum. You cannot achieve the understanding of overunity with using of laws, principles and concepts, which are itself based on energy conservation law - to pretend otherwise would be just an oxymoron. The raising such laws, concepts and principles therefore doesn't and cannot ad nothing into discussion. You can be very educated / experienced in it, but just this education would prohibit you in understanding, why and how the overunity is working. We don't need explanations, why overunity is impossible - every textbooks and Wikipedia contains more than enough of this propaganda. We all did come to this site not because we don't know, that the overunity shouldn't work - but just because of it: we perceive it as a scientific anomaly.

Offline evostars

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #229 on: March 30, 2017, 01:31:56 AM »
@evostars,


What are the measured LC values and wire gauge for your bifilar coils?  I'd also be interested in the read out of a capacitance meter connected to one leg of each coil while the coils are not connected on the far end.  I am curious if the similar orientation of the dielectric field in the pancake coil produces a stronger capacitance vs a bifilar solenoid.  Dollard seemed to think the planetary alignments had a more profound impact on electrical phenomena because of the dielectric flux orientation between them so this test stands to reason... 


Dave


PS @Efinder, thanks
top coil (of 3 stacked coils,  center pulsed,  top bottom series connected) :  70 turns, 1.78 nF  0.51mH
bottom coil 0.47mH   1,72nF (coil tuned to topcoil, by adding 2x 50pF in parallel, so both resonate at the same frequency)
center coil (tighterwound)  2,58 nF 0.57mH

capacitance was measured by disconnecting the 2 windings (what i call "bridge")
my lcr meter is a very cheap chinese CA-4070L.

Edit: I havent done your reading yet, with 2  coils stacked, but not connected, and then one lead of each coil to measure capacitance.
The wire gauge, I dont know. the diameter including enamal coating is around 0.8mm. they are hand wound on cd sleeves with 70 turns total (2x35)

edit2: done the measurement. around 47pF between the top and bottom coil (without the center coil) not series connected,
again, a poor reading from a cheap LCR meter.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #229 on: March 30, 2017, 01:31:56 AM »
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Offline web000x

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #230 on: March 30, 2017, 01:52:11 AM »
top coil (of 3 stacked coils,  center pulsed,  top bottom series connected) :  70 turns, 1.78 nF  0.51mH
bottom coil 0.47mH   1,72nF (coil tuned to topcoil, by adding 2x 50pF in parallel, so both resonate at the same frequency)
center coil (tighterwound)  2,58 nF 0.57mH

capacitance was measured by disconnecting the 2 windings (what i call "bridge")
my lcr meter is a very cheap chinese CA-4070L.

Edit: I havent done your reading yet, with 2  coils stacked, but not connected, and then one lead of each coil to measure capacitance.
The wire gauge, I dont know. the diameter including enamal coating is around 0.8mm. they are hand wound on cd sleeves with 70 turns total (2x35)

edit2: done the measurement. around 47pF between the top and bottom coil (without the center coil) not series connected,
again, a poor reading from a cheap LCR meter.


Thanks,
 
Those numbers aren't too far from a couple of coils I've got at 100 turns 23 gauge bifilar.  One coil (standard bifilar will little concern to proximity of two wires during winding process) measured 2.9 nF.  The second coil (wires twisted together with a drill to increase bifilar winding proximity) measured 2.6 nF.  I'm not sure why the twisted pair of wires had less capacitance which was another reason for my curiosity into the capacitance of the pancake coil.  Maybe a learned person will shed light, lol..


Dave

Offline evostars

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #231 on: March 30, 2017, 01:54:41 AM »

 
 When he says:  "in other words, as though it possessed no self-induction...", he is NOT suggesting that there are no external magnetic fields or effects associated with magnetic fields!   
 
 
 Undivided attention, and careful consideration should be given to the bold text......

"mutual relations" existing between the special character of the current and the self-induction and capacity of the coil......

If and when you comprehend what he's suggesting, you discover the true  purpose of the flat spiral wound "bifilar" coil, it's got nothing to do with anything that is being debated.  It's about purpose....he gave you the purpose in the title.....  Try asking yourself...what in the hell is he referring to by this "special character of the current".

Quote:
 
"I have found that in every coil there exists a certain relation between its self-induction and capacity that permits a current of a given frequency and potential to pass through it with no other opposition  than that of ohmic resistance, or, in other words, as though it possessed no self -induction."
 
 
 So that its clear....  we are informed of what was "observed", as it applies to "every coil", we are informed of this "AFTER" we are informed of the "PURPOSE", which was.....:
 
 
 "My present invention has for its object to avoid the employment of condensers which are expensive and cumbersome and difficult to maintain in perfect condition, and to so construct the coils themselves as to accomplish the same ultimate object.
 
 That which was "observed" in every coil is to be kept in mind while becoming informed/familiarized with the latest development and or improvement.


Tesla is leading us to something profound here.....fucking recognize it!


The special character of the current.

spiraling. compressing inwards.

the compass points at the center of the coil, while the dielectric field is equaly concentrated between the windings, over the whole coil. where the "bloch wall" of a magnet would be.

what about the phase between the dielectric and magnetic fields? And its influence on the impedance.


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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #231 on: March 30, 2017, 01:54:41 AM »
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Offline evostars

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #232 on: March 30, 2017, 01:57:08 AM »

Thanks,
 
Those numbers aren't too far from a couple of coils I've got at 100 turns 23 gauge bifilar.  One coil (standard bifilar will little concern to proximity of two wires during winding process) measured 2.9 nF.  The second coil (wires twisted together with a drill to increase bifilar winding proximity) measured 2.6 nF.  I'm not sure why the twisted pair of wires had less capacitance which was another reason for my curiosity into the capacitance of the pancake coil.  Maybe a learned person will shed light, lol..


Dave

Maybe because the fields twist around the windings

Offline evostars

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #233 on: March 30, 2017, 02:12:02 AM »
Yes Evostars , the father of pancake coils  say exactly that "it possessed no self-induction"  only need find the right frequency to that happens , and seems is that that some really don't agree  , and that is the reason to the compass not show any deflection even when  drive a load , not by the high frequency like someone say .
Hmm I dont know. I will check this, with a compass next to the coil. I have noticed the magnetic field doing funny things below its resonant frequency.
As the wave shape is not sinodial anymore.

Still I do wonder what the differnce of a biffilar coil would be if the windings where on top of each other, instead of next to each other.

As is a bifilar coil made from speaker wire. one winding on top of the other winding, so you have 2 pancake coils on top of eachother. The dielectric field wil then be between the 2 windings. the inductance would also be differnt, as the 2 coils are not alligned anymore.

The dielectric field will now be at 90 degrees to the magnetic field.

I really have to build this and check it.

The resonant frequency video is thougher then I tought. Even wikipedia has no propaganda page on it. Impedance, and the phase relation between the fields is a bitch. With DC the impedance is equal to resistance, due to the phase differnce being 0. 

So, I guess, at the right frequency the phase difference between the magnetic and dielelectric must be 0.
Man I really could use some VR to visualise the fields.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #233 on: March 30, 2017, 02:12:02 AM »
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Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #234 on: March 30, 2017, 03:01:28 AM »
 
Those numbers aren't too far from a couple of coils I've got at 100 turns 23 gauge bifilar.  One coil (standard bifilar will little concern to proximity of two wires during winding process) measured 2.9 nF.  The second coil (wires twisted together with a drill to increase bifilar winding proximity) measured 2.6 nF.  I'm not sure why the twisted pair of wires had less capacitance which was another reason for my curiosity into the capacitance of the pancake coil.  Maybe a learned person will shed light, lol..

I am not sure how you guys are measuring the capacitance of your pancake coils but what I can say is that if you hook the leads of an LCR meter to the two terminals of the coil and set it to capacitance you are almost certainly getting an incorrect reading.  The basic problem is a capacitor has a DC open-circuit between the two terminals and a coil has a near DC short-circuit between the two terminals.

I am under the impression that capacitance and inductance meters excite the device under test with a series of discrete frequencies and measure the impedance and crunch the numbers back from that.  Honestly I am not sure what they actually do and I suspect different models and different brands do different things.  But it is safe to say that a capacitance meter is not expecting to see a near short-circuit in the device under test.

My suggestion is that a frequency sweep is the only way to measure the capacitance and then you have to crunch the numbers backwards to get the value.  I also suspect that as you sweep the frequency up that the pancake coil will manifest both series LC and parallel LC properties depending on the frequency and there might be multiple poles and zeros in the impedance as you do the frequency sweep. At higher frequencies just the proximity of your hand to the coil may affect the response.  This is all speculation on my part.  TK and others would know much more than me.

MileHigh

Offline web000x

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #235 on: March 30, 2017, 03:15:10 AM »
I am not sure how you guys are measuring the capacitance of your pancake coils but what I can say is that if you hook the leads of an LCR meter to the two terminals of the coil and set it to capacitance you are almost certainly getting an incorrect reading.  The basic problem is a capacitor has a DC open-circuit between the two terminals and a coil has a near DC short-circuit between the two terminals.

I am under the impression that capacitance and inductance meters excite the device under test with a series of discrete frequencies and measure the impedance and crunch the numbers back from that.  Honestly I am not sure what they actually do and I suspect different models and different brands do different things.  But it is safe to say that a capacitance meter is not expecting to see a near short-circuit in the device under test.

My suggestion is that a frequency sweep is the only way to measure the capacitance and then you have to crunch the numbers backwards to get the value.  I also suspect that as you sweep the frequency up that the pancake coil will manifest both series LC and parallel LC properties depending on the frequency and there might be multiple poles and zeros in the impedance as you do the frequency sweep. At higher frequencies just the proximity of your hand to the coil may affect the response.  This is all speculation on my part.  TK and others would know much more than me.

MileHigh


The test I referred to is one where the two coils in the bifilar windings are two capacitor plates.  In this configuration, you can indeed use a capacitance meter.  My coils are not pancake coils, rather bifilar solenoid coils.  I was interested in the relations between evostars coil capacitance vs some of the one's I had made.


Dave

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #235 on: March 30, 2017, 03:15:10 AM »
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Offline MileHigh

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #236 on: March 30, 2017, 03:46:24 AM »
The test I referred to is one where the two coils in the bifilar windings are two capacitor plates.  In this configuration, you can indeed use a capacitance meter.  My coils are not pancake coils, rather bifilar solenoid coils.  I was interested in the relations between evostars coil capacitance vs some of the one's I had made.

Yes I read your posting and I am aware of what you requested.  I was just making generic comments that of course would apply to solenoid coils also. I seem to vaguely recall someone doing a YouTube clip where two physically similar solenoid coils, one regular and one bifilar, were frequency swept and the bifilar one had a lower resonance frequency which is a satisfyingly expected result.

As another generic comment, one has to wonder about the coil self-capacitance because it can only exist as a very brief transient because the "plates" are really just a minuscule puff of charge on a conductor that "shorts out the plates" presumably very quickly.  In a true stand-alone self-resonating coil, there presumably would be such a minuscule amount of charge circulating back and forth that the AC current and corresponding magnetic field would probably be very very weak.  I have always speculated that Tesla's bifilar pancake coil was a big coil perhaps 12 feet in diameter.  I am not sure if there are any pictures of some in his lab.  Perhaps they self-resonated in the tens of kilohertz frequency range and were more "stable" for lack of a better term.  Perhaps that means that a small bifilar pancake coil that you see around here self-resonates in the megahertz range.  One meter corresponds to 300 megahertz.  So if your coil is made of 10 meters of wire and let's say the propagation inside the coil is 95% the speed of light, perhaps the "action" is somewhere in the tens of megahertz range.  This is all just speculation for the fun of it.

I will just repeat, I suspect that the patent by Tesla was more of an academic exercise.  I doubt that his design saw any practical use because if it did we would surely know about it.  I would also like it if there was an "end game."  You know, something like a kid takes a handful of transistors and resistors and a few LEDs and builds a 4-bit up-down digital counter - he has an end game.  What is the end game for the bifilar pancake coil?

MileHigh

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #237 on: March 30, 2017, 11:42:32 AM »
@MH, the way that the interturn capacitance of a Tesla Bifilar coil is generally measured is to break the
"crossover" series connection between the inner turn of one winding and the outer turn of the second winding
(or, in the case of solenoidal coils, between the top of one winding and the bottom of the other).
Then you have two separate lengths of wire closely adjacent, forming a capacitor in the same way as the old
"gimmick" caps of low pF values formed from a couple of short lengths of insulated wire twisted together
that we used to see in ham radios and other applications. You are entirely correct that common meters
cannot measure the capacitance of the fully-connected coil.

As usual, the capacitance thus formed is proportional to the areas of the "plates" or wires and inversely
proportional to the spacing between the wires (usually just the insulation thickness in the close-wound
TBF winding.)
 
But does this method actually give the true interturn capacitance that the coil has when fully connected
and in an oscillating or pulsed high voltage circuit as Tesla intended it to be used in the patent?
I'll leave the answer to that as an exercise for the readers.

As to how the meters actually measure this capacitance, there are several ways. One way is to put the
DUT in parallel with a known inductance inside the meter, and then "interrogate" the tank circuit thus
formed with a pulse and see how the tank responds -- it will "ring" at its resonant frequency -- then
the inductance can be calculated in the usual manner. Another way is, as you said, to measure the impedance
at some particular frequency or set of frequencies and calculate back from there.

And has been stated many times by now, Tesla sought to reduce the reliance upon expensive, bulky, costly
and unreliable _external_ HV capacitors for the primaries of his air-core resonating transformers ("Tesla Coils",
magnifying transmitters, etc) by raising the self-capacitance of these primaries in the manner described in
the patent. Nowadays this issue is rather moot because of advances in capacitor technology but for Tesla
it was a significant factor. So the patent is more than just an academic exercise; it had real-world implications
and applications for Tesla and other experimenters and builders of his day. Today, there is nothing a TBF
winding can do that cannot also be done with an ordinary monofilar winding and some added external capacitance.
"IN EVERY COIL...", as Tesla says in the patent.


I'm glad to see that "some people" are actually _reading_ Tesla's patent instead of snipping sections,
ignoring others and taking quotes out-of-context. Maybe what I've been telling them all along is
beginning to sink in.

As far as the comments of "NEWBIES" like this Zephir character go... I encourage them to perform their
own experiments and attempt to support their wild and non-physical claims with results of their own, rather
than spouting jargon and posting links that are irrelevant to the matters at hand. Have these people ever
actually done ANY experimentation at all, I wonder? Certainly I don't recall zeeing any reports of such from
Zephir.

Tesla would roll in his grave if he could see some of the utter BS that is spouted in his name... or maybe he'd just LOL.

Offline Zephir

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #238 on: March 30, 2017, 12:59:46 PM »
Quote
I encourage them to perform their own experiments and attempt to support their wild and non-physical claims with results of their own, rather than spouting jargon and posting links that are irrelevant to the matters at I encourage them to perform their own experiments and attempt to support their wild and non-physical claims with results of their own, rather than spouting jargon and posting links that are irrelevant to the matters at hand. hand.
The attitude of yours is completely imbecille. You even haven't proven my links are irrelevant to my claims and what you call jargon is normal scientific language. You can make an experiments whole your productive life, yet not to get an inch closer to actual solution of overunity, because you're ignorant in your very heart and you're blocking certain type of information in your head. You shouldn't therefore block this information for heads of other people just because of warning example of yours.

You know, I understand perfectly the problem with you. In history of science it's very common situation, when the very productive and successfull people (like the Ernst Rutherford, who was Nobelist in his young age and who is founder of atom nuclei) became soon or later a most rigid part of establishment and they blocked the further progress (for example with cold fusion). In my country I personally know many similar people like you in person - for example  this guy is very capable electrotechnician and hobbyist, who enjoys youtubers with his wild experiments. But despite (actually just because)  of it he is one of most effective and dangerous trolls regarding overunity.

His videos are most widespread overunity fakes (1, 2) at youtube, which are polluting public overunity space and which are copied with another trolls mindlessly (you can still recognize them by his voice and Slavish accent easily). In this way, just the establishment of community becomes the most prominent brake of its further progress. The number of (failed) attempts for overunity device replications (Tesla coil with bifilar for example) fools the newbies and makes false impression of your qualification for overunity subject in layman posters here. But in fact you're way more dangerous troll, than the government silencing progress of alternative energy research, because you're acting inside and within overunity community. I insist, you should be banned from here because of your counterproductive behavior here. The greatest enemies of overunity community are these most respected internal ones.

Offline citfta

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #239 on: March 30, 2017, 01:47:17 PM »
Zephir,

I have given you several links to real experiments that show you are clearly wrong.  You refuse to look at them.  Why?  Are you so afraid your false dogma will be shown for what it is?

Show me even one example that clearly shows the current reversing when a coil discharges.  Just one.  Not a bunch of drivel about how someone should be banned because they don't agree with you.  Show me some real evidence done in a controlled way that supports your false idea.  I know you can't do it because it is not true.  All the tests that were done in the thread I have been trying to get you to read show the current does not reverse when a coil discharges.  Only the voltage reverses because the coil becomes the source instead of the load when power is removed from the coil.

You asked were I got such a idea.  I got it from the high school physics class I took.  I got it from the college physics class I took.  I got it when I studied for my first class commercial FCC license.  I got it when I studied for my advanced class amateur radio operators license.  And I got it again when I went back to college for my electronics degree.  I also saw it in action almost every day that I worked as an electronics tech in an industrial plant for 30 years.

If anyone should be banned it is those that come here and deliberately post false information to confuse those really trying to learn.  Are you one of them?  It sure seems so because you twist everything anyone else posts.  I have heard that really dumb argument before that insists education and training gets in the way of open thinking.  That is just plain dumb.  How can you possibly know when you have discovered something new if you don't know what has already been discovered?  You can't.  And that is why we see so much foolishness on DumbTube.  Because people with no education post videos about their great discoveries and others with no education believe them.

I have spent many hours the last 10 years or so trying to help people on forums like this to learn about electronics.  I have built over 10 of the Bedini Simple School Girls circuit.  Which is not the circuit you posted when you tried to claim it was not anything like the Accutron watch circuit.  I have helped close to a hundred other people wanting to learn electronics to get their SSG to work by slowly taking them through the process of debugging their system that didn't work.

A sure sign of someone that doesn't know what they are talking about is when they attack the other person instead of the topic being discussed.  So I expect you will follow your past pattern and attack me for this post.  That is the only thing you can do because you have no evidence to back up your claim that current reverses when a coil discharges.

Carroll

 

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