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Author Topic: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency  (Read 214613 times)

Offline tinman

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1470 on: May 08, 2017, 01:38:35 PM »
Not sure I want to read all this 'driberdrab' If you have a bifilar wound pancake coil will it have any inductance ? so if no inductance how has it got resonance ? surely any single wire has inductance but not bifilar wound has none as it's canceled out, I should know as T1000 had us on that one on the Dailly tread.

Of course a BPC has inductance.
Anyone that told you otherwise,needs some schooling.


Brad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Jimboot

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1471 on: May 08, 2017, 03:25:28 PM »

Fact is, I don't have to show anyone anything, and this is true for anyone.  If I want to show someone something I contact them and show them.  Fact is I don't speak in riddles, only the ignorant think I do.
Luvyawork mate.

Offline Jimboot

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1472 on: May 08, 2017, 03:28:39 PM »
Only a fool drives at night,without his head lights on.


Brad
Seriously. You blokes have more in common than you know.  Do a Skype video call ffs. Text is rubbish for comms.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1472 on: May 08, 2017, 03:28:39 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1473 on: May 08, 2017, 04:24:37 PM »
I used Xee2's inductance measures that show a 5% greater Micro-Henries of inductance in his series biflar then his single wound coil of equal turns and wire gauge on both a low and high perm ferrite toroid core.

I reviewed my inductance measurements of two air core bifilar and single wire coils and measured a 10% higher inductance in the series bifilar. The problem was I ran out of space on the bobbin for the single wire at 4 Ohms, while the bifilar measured 5. I divided the Ohms into the Milli-Henries for a ratio and arrived at a 10% greater inductance for the bifilar, twice the percentage of Xee2.

I think the extra difference may be a consequence of my "Home style wrap" so I plan to do one more test with two tight coils of equal turns on a High-Perm ferrite core.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline partzman

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1474 on: May 08, 2017, 07:35:41 PM »

It would be an untruth if I were to say that I have not taken any measurements.  Here's the thing....I am not looking for what you and others are looking for, I have very little interest in what many of you are chasing after. 


A scope will not tell me where I stand......  Where I am headed, comparing energy in and out is a waste of time.  A self powering device requires a mechanism.  Your measurement instruments will not reveal that mechanism to you, they, your measurement instruments, will inform you of what they were designed to inform you of, nothing more.  The concept of self powering as you and others present it, is of no interest to me.  I prefer my own dogma.




I disagree.  The problem I have with many of you is your perspective.  You all are preoccupied with systems which "dis-integrate" energy. I busy myself with systems which "integrate" energy.  This simple change in perspective forces one to recognize that there are no "precise measurement protocols" for systems based on integration...... 


I don't need your measurement methods to inform me whether I am making progress and or whether I am headed in the right direction, you cannot of your own accord reproduce, without my guidance, anything that I can demonstrate, with or without your measurement aids!


The sad truth as I have come to see it, you people can't see the forest for the trees.  The system gives what is demanded of it, you choose not to appreciate the manner by which it manifests.  You place demands on the system, force it to yield that which you want.....ignorance....  The system does not judge you, it does not correct you, it accommodates your ignorance!  These fields and forces were here long before man put pen to paper, attempting to quantify and qualify the infinite-unfathomable in a few lines of text.....LOL....  These fields and forces will be here long after the planet has rolled out of the sweet spot it now occupies, a spot which makes man the idea possible. 


It's all reactive, you know it, and yet....you run from it, chasing after .....LOL




Regards

I really can't say that I disagree with you on your points above.  I can say that I see a broad hint in your last statement and therefore would like to ask if you have developed a device that self runs?

Regards,

Pm

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1474 on: May 08, 2017, 07:35:41 PM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1475 on: May 09, 2017, 05:40:39 PM »
I have two projects on my test bench right now; Let me start with the math:

Xee2 has a series bifilar and a single wire coil of equal turns on two identical high perm cores.

The single wire coil measures 15.9 Milli-Henrys and the bifilar 16.8 Milli-Henrys of inductance.

We know that it takes 3600 Joules per second to generate 1 Tesla of magnetic force in a coil of 1 Henry of inductance, and that 1 Tesla is equal to 10,000 Gauss; Therefore:

16.8 mH divided by 10,000 equals 168 Gauss for the bifilar and 159 Gauss for the single wire at the following power input:

10,000 divided by 3600 equals 2.777. Multiplied by 168 Gauss equals 466.6 Joules per second or 466.6 Watts.

Multiplying the single wire Gauss by the same factor equals 441.5 watts.

Deducting the the 441.5 from the 466.6 gives us 25.1 watts.

So, the gain factor for the bifilar over the single wire coil with the high perm ferrite core is 25.1 watts. That's the power we would save to generate a magnetic field of identical force with the series bifilar wrap over the single wire coil of equal windings.

Bistander maintains the 5% difference in inductance measured by Xee2 between the series bifilar and single wire coil of equal turns and wire gauge is a result of the connection between the two bifilar coils. He may be correct, but the single wire coil has no way to benefit from this advantage, and clearly demonstrates a "Marked Difference" between the two types of coils!

Reply to bistander:

"I made the point that a more tightly wound coil would generate a stronger field than a sloppily wound coil of equal wire gauge and turns for the same input. Lets say the difference in inductance was 5%. We could equal the strength of the sloppy coil with the tight coil by reducing the input by 5%, right?

Lets say we feed 10 watts into both coils: We would gain 1/2 watt in savings, right? 100 watts would result in 5 watts savings and 500 watts would result in 25 watts savings, got it?

My power input calculations result in a savings of that amount with that amount of difference in inductance between the two types of coils. You say I divided when I should have multiplied. Your approach would throw the answer off in the wrong direction by an "Astronomical Parsec".

I was asked for a simple explanation: Greater inductance results greater efficiency, got it"?

Bistander complained the coils were not wrapped on the same core. I'm replicating Xee2's test with the two types of coils on the same core right now, and have finished the two wraps and am currently testing for accuracy.

Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1476 on: May 09, 2017, 11:49:53 PM »
Here's a digital still shot of my two types of coils on the high perm ferrite rod, along with my magnifying glass holder and "VICI" inductance meter registering 27 degrees Centigrade on the temperature scale. That's 80.6 degrees Fahrenheit, about perfect!

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1476 on: May 09, 2017, 11:49:53 PM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1477 on: May 10, 2017, 12:34:08 AM »
Bistander maintains the 5% difference in inductance measured by Xee2 between the series bifilar and single wire coil of equal turns and wire gauge is a result of the connection between the two bifilar coils. He may be correct, but the single wire coil has no way to benefit from this advantage, and clearly demonstrates a "Marked Difference" between the two types of coils!

Reply to bistander:

"I made the point that a more tightly wound coil would generate a stronger field than a sloppily wound coil of equal wire gauge and turns for the same input. Lets say the difference in inductance was 5%. We could equal the strength of the sloppy coil with the tight coil by reducing the input by 5%, right?

Lets say we feed 10 watts into both coils: We would gain 1/2 watt in savings, right? 100 watts would result in 5 watts savings and 500 watts would result in 25 watts savings, got it?

My power input calculations result in a savings of that amount with that amount of difference in inductance between the two types of coils. You say I divided when I should have multiplied. Your approach would throw the answer off in the wrong direction by an "Astronomical Parsec".

I was asked for a simple explanation: Greater inductance results greater efficiency, got it"?

Bistander complained the coils were not wrapped on the same core. I'm replicating Xee2's test with the two types of coils on the same core right now, and have finished the two wraps and am currently testing for accuracy.

Hey Sync
What are we measuring the inductance with to see the difference or is it a calculated value? Seems most are getting the same value but 5% could be possibly nicked off as they are really close sooo.  But if that little difference no matter what % is mostly more for the bifi then you may have something. But is there any advantage to the small increase of inductance in the bifi?

Mags

Offline Magluvin

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1478 on: May 10, 2017, 12:39:00 AM »
Sync, can u post a circuit from Bistander? Im just wondering what he is doing

Mags

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1478 on: May 10, 2017, 12:39:00 AM »
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Offline synchro1

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1479 on: May 10, 2017, 01:09:52 AM »
Mags,

My test measurements are .35 mH for the single wire coil and .38  mH for the series bifilar  on the same high perm ferrite core;. This is very close to the ratio measurement I got between the two air core coils, around 10%. Both these measurements were made with my Vici inductance meter pictured above with the coils and magnifier. This is a brand new meter with a fully charged battery!
« Last Edit: May 10, 2017, 09:29:42 PM by synchro1 »

Offline ramset

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1480 on: May 10, 2017, 02:28:30 AM »
since this is Evostars thread and Allen took part in him leaving here [his own thread]with rude behavior [which Allen [synchro1] is Now moderated by Stefan for]
here is what evostar wrote to Allen when he pulled the same nonsense at Evostars energetic  forum thread

Evostar reply to Allen [synchro1 here]
QUOTE
Allen Burgess,[synchro1 here]
With all respect I kindly but urgently ask you to start your own thread.

I do NOT like your words:
"you're a shameless scoundrel,
you deceptive trouble maker"

END QUOTE

to which Allen [Synchro1]replied

Allen Burgess
Quote
@evostars,

Poor baby.
end quote
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1480 on: May 10, 2017, 02:28:30 AM »
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Offline ramset

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1481 on: May 10, 2017, 02:44:20 AM »
magluvin
Since Stefan put Allen on moderation, perhaps he should decide what he posts in his forum[if at all]
this fellow is causing problems at energetic forum
why do this here too?

it is a liability to Stefan
maybe we should let him decide ?
I will ask him tomorrow [too late tonight

and I will also discuss the threats he has made against other members here
Personal vendetta's to destroy them and their reputations

some are threatening lawsuits


Offline nelsonrochaa

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1482 on: May 11, 2017, 12:12:30 PM »
Hi ,
 to ppl interest in this subject i left a very nice document that talk about some of the properties and advantages studied by Oliver Nichelson,  where he show some of the important points that he find in such coils with some comparison's between a bifilar and non bifilar coils. Is not a big document and for sure the interested people will enjoy read them .

Hope people enjoy ;)


Nelson Rocha




Offline padova

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1483 on: May 12, 2017, 01:23:02 AM »
I'd ask you about your "Alu-foil Levitation" pancake coil, some specifications, is it bifilar coil or single wound,
but I guess it's not open source for now?  :)

Offline nelsonrochaa

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Re: The bifilar pancake coil at its resonant frequency
« Reply #1484 on: May 12, 2017, 12:15:24 PM »
I'd ask you about your "Alu-foil Levitation" pancake coil, some specifications, is it bifilar coil or single wound,
but I guess it's not open source for now?  :)

Hi Padova ,
nice that you enjoy that video even i not publish that video in the forum . (I don't make any claims) :)
You know that actually, i did not work in opensource but i can answer that question without any problem :
 the coil is bifilar winding  ;)

Cheers

Nelson Rocha


 

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