Language: 
To browser these website, it's necessary to store cookies on your computer.
The cookies contain no personal information, they are required for program control.
  the storage of cookies while browsing this website, on Login and Register.

GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Donations

Please Donate for the Forum.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.(Admin)

A-Ads

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics

  • *Total Members: 83730
  • *Latest: allez9

  • *Total Posts: 517553
  • *Total Topics: 15429
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 4
  • *Guests: 15
  • *Total: 19

Author Topic: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets  (Read 29534 times)

Offline seychelles

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 630
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #105 on: March 23, 2017, 07:30:08 PM »
FOREST ,SIMPLE SIMPLE. SOFT IRON CORE..IT IS THE BEST MAGNETIC SHUNTING SHIELDING..
EASY TO GET EASY TO DRILL. I WILL DO IT MYSELF WHEN I GET BACK TO AUSTRALIA.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline sm0ky2

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3290
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #106 on: March 24, 2017, 07:29:54 PM »

Read Richard Willis patent


What exactly is it in this patent that we are supposed to discover?
What is unique about his patent?


This looks like a copy of Bendini patent. Slightly different wording
And no images?


The only thing Bendini does which is not covered by Willis,
is to loop the output back into the circuit.


Essentially - you have two coils, one kicks, one generates and
"pulls". It is the same wire as the first coil, so you can say the
two are in "series". One wound reverse of the first.
the two "ends".
Essentially, current that powers the motor combines with power
generated by the rotation of the same.


There is a timing circuit - for instance a reed switch would work.
Or any form of magnetorestrictive circuit, or simply a pickup coil
and a transistor.


While I myself have never seen a Bendini motor self-perpetuate,
(despite many unproven claims)
They can and do approach a state of "near unity".
Which cannot be said of many rotational motors/generators.


But, considering its' usefulness, we could throw the whole of
the electronics away and be better served with a Flywheel.




Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #107 on: March 25, 2017, 01:09:11 AM »
To come back on topic,


There were some nice explanations, about speakers, wood etc, basicly saying that above a certain PM fieldstrength no further optimation is possible.


Now, that was precisely my question, twice: What is this limit? Can it be calculated? Is there a linear relation to the coil pulse in joule?


I have to tell you, from what I see in my tests, the gain does not decrease progressively with bigger PMs.


Did you ever notice the tiny coils in speakers, compared to the PM size? Why is this ratio so diffrent from Motors containing PMs?


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #107 on: March 25, 2017, 01:09:11 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline telecom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 547
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #108 on: March 25, 2017, 11:09:37 AM »
I think there are two types of action - when the force is momentary vs the force is
constant.
The work calculations are not applicable to the momentary force action,
but they are applicable to the constant force action.
But by sending the projectile up against the gravity with a momentary force,
it becomes possible to calculate work on the way down, when the gravity force is constant.

Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #109 on: March 25, 2017, 01:23:27 PM »
I'm not getting it, gravity is constant, so why not removing it from the equation in the first place?


Again, what happens is: a coil gets a short pulse and is repelled from the PM. As the coil is moving away, several things happen: the coil genetates a secondary field, that is attracting the PM, but this effect vanishes at square over distance. Also, the end of the pulse must cause a BEMF in the coil, theoreticly also attracting the coil. if the pulse is too short this may indeed reduce the efficiency.


However, in a motor with alternating PM polarity, the secondary field and BEMF of the coil would be attracted by the next PM, but this causes indiction again, this say thertiary field, so that would at least neutralize the conventional losses due to the seconday field. In fact, offering the secondary field a better fluxpath may not only be used to neutralize the Lenz drag from the repelling PM, but even to add torque to the shaft. Well just a thought.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #109 on: March 25, 2017, 01:23:27 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #110 on: March 25, 2017, 01:30:43 PM »
Edit, uhm I said "but this effect vanishes at square over distance", what I meant is: The effect of attraction to the PM vanishes, while the coil keeps on generating current until it's out of the field entirely.


Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #111 on: March 25, 2017, 01:48:07 PM »
Uh, what was I thinking, need coffee...of course it should be "in a motor with non-alternating PM polarity...".


So the timing /RPM could utilize the current that is flowing while the pulse circuit is passive.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #111 on: March 25, 2017, 01:48:07 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline telecom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 547
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #112 on: March 25, 2017, 05:15:18 PM »
Uh, what was I thinking, need coffee...of course it should be "in a motor with non-alternating PM polarity...".


So the timing /RPM could utilize the current that is flowing while the pulse circuit is passive.

I only refer to the mechanical action where the transfer of the momentum occurs.
By the simple Newton formula F * dt =m * v
Where F is the repelling force between the coil and the magnet, seems to be proportional
to the strength of the magnet, dt - time of the capacitor discharge
m - mass of the coil and v - its speed.
Try to direct the coil upward. then on the way back down  it can make work.

Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #113 on: March 25, 2017, 07:44:23 PM »
Yes but gravity doesn't alter the net gain, if there is any.


But you nailed it precisely by "proportional to the strength of the magnet".


Basicly, or eminently, the repelling forces add up. This force sum is present right after the coil is loaded, and therefor the force is transfered as a physical shockwave. The inductive reaction of the coil on the other hand is a transition from zero to max, where it is zero while the coil is closest to the magnet (so it has the highest effect) and at max when it reached a certain distance already.


So by means of logic, the secondary field will always be a weaker field than the primary one, and a huge magnet brings a relatively big diffrence between the two fields.


So I would definitely say, this diffrence is the gain that can be extracted as energy. So far experiments have shown no degradation in the amplification by PMs with increasing size. I have some Microwave Oven magnets and may try a stack of four against a tiny coil. Nobody cross that line of railgun fire tho ^^.


Actually, I think Art Porter was right about "magnetic amplification".


As a simple test device, a piston/crankshaft/flywheel type would make the whole Lenz drag department a lot easier, compared to a rotor type.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #113 on: March 25, 2017, 07:44:23 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline telecom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 547
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #114 on: March 25, 2017, 08:17:29 PM »
Yes but gravity doesn't alter the net gain, if there is any.
Of course, but it can perform work on the way down.
We had some discussion on the another forum re ballistic pendulum.
For example a bullet, if discharged vertically, will achieve a potential energy of
5000 J ( for the weight 10 g and a speed of 1000 m/sec).
At the same time, a ballistic pendulum will show its energy as only 30 J.
So, it looks like to avoid losses of the kinetic energy, it has to be transferred into
the potential energy first.
( That was the conclusion on my part from that discussion).

Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #115 on: March 25, 2017, 08:50:33 PM »
Don't know exactly what pendulum you mean but shouldn't you compare just vertical and horizontal bullet discharge?


Anyway, one day I'll get it.


Meanwhile I'm thinking about solid state ways with PMs. Lenzless reluctance switching.


PMs are amazing. Imagine a Neo PM, 1 inch diameter, 3 inches high. It has like 1 Tesla at the surface. Now add a closwd iron fluxpath, 1 inch dia. and 6 inch high. Now the entire iron part parallel to the PM has 2 Tesla. Double the length, double the strength. That's saturation. Even with emagnetics you can't go higher than to saturate the core. I can't understand why people say PMs are too weak.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #115 on: March 25, 2017, 08:50:33 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline telecom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 547
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #116 on: March 26, 2017, 05:15:08 AM »
No intention to confuse anybody, ballistic pendulum is used to determine the energy of the bullet.
We 've discovered the energy anomaly -  energy of the bullet simply disappears when it hits it.
In any case, I'm really interested in what you are doing here,
probably the bigger the magnet, the better.

Offline Zephir

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 381
    • Reddit about Aether Wave Theory
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #117 on: March 26, 2017, 03:53:22 PM »
Quote
We 've discovered the energy anomaly -  energy of the bullet simply disappears when it hits it.
This is rather common situation, once the bullet becomes subject of friction. After then the energy of bullet isn't converted and utilized to kinetic energy/momentum of the ballistic pendulum, but to its thermodynamic energy, i.e. the heat content. The gun suppressors work (partially) in similar way.

Offline telecom

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 547
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #118 on: March 27, 2017, 12:29:33 AM »
This is rather common situation, once the bullet becomes subject of friction. After then the energy of bullet isn't converted and utilized to kinetic energy/momentum of the ballistic pendulum, but to its thermodynamic energy, i.e. the heat content. The gun suppressors work (partially) in similar way.
But I can drive the same bullet into the same piece of wood and spend only 5 J, not 5000 J
In addition, why conservation of the momentum works, and conservation of energy - not?
They use a conservation of the momentum there.
It seems to me that conservation of energy only valid when kinetic energy is directly
transmitted into potential, as if the bullet was shot vertically.
In this case it would go up to 500 meters.

Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Simple Experiment: Extraction of Energy from Permanent Magnets
« Reply #119 on: March 27, 2017, 12:45:32 AM »
if you don't mind, "bullets" brings up some bad memories to me, thanks.

 

OneLink