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Solid States Devices => Joule Thief => Topic started by: TheGeneralHackr on October 29, 2016, 05:57:07 AM

Title: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on October 29, 2016, 05:57:07 AM
I have posted before about this device probably about 3 years ago (in the over unity section), and along that time my progress on this circuit has been at a partial standstill.
The device if you didn't already know produces more voltage out then in (loaded I might add), it is a minimal voltage increase (at 1.5v) but its noticeably. Rises by a couple mv every day or so after the initial high voltage gain (of about 50mv).
That small mv gain is all at 1.5v input, but what if you raise the voltage? I raised the input voltage to 35VDC and within 5 hours the voltage gained by 2 volts, after that it slowed down.
That is a bit of the research I did into the circuit, I also currently have the voltage gaining while blinking 40 LEDs.

Anyhow off the topic of that, I just recently went back over all the responses of the original lcap post and there are many great points added, but I noticed no one was able to replicate the result I had and its due to me writing the wrong schematic. I've been replicating these circuits off of memory but when I tried to replicate them off my own schematic they didn't work.
So here is a updated parts list and schematic, scope shots and some replications I'm working on.
Parts List
2N2222A (Others work but not as well, I've tried 2N3904, 2N4401, 2N3055 and they work but not great)
0.47 uf Tantalum Capacitor
1Mohm Potentiometer (Mine measured 870 kOhm)
LED (Measuring 1-3 Mohm in reverse Bias)
1 to 1 Transformer (I have only had two coils work so far, the one I'm using now came from a Dell computer power supply. I have the Model no Somewhere)
1Kohm 1/4 Watt resistor
KBP307 Bridge Rectifier (Shown in Picture, May be listed on schematic)


Hopefully this information can be used to build a successfull replica.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on October 30, 2016, 02:08:40 AM
Bridge rectifier was wrote wrong here is the good schematic.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: Tink on October 30, 2016, 09:43:34 AM
The "AC to + diode" creates a short.
This device will most likely not work.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: Tink on October 30, 2016, 10:10:42 AM
The "- to AC diode" blocks the emitter flow to the negative pole of the battery.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 30, 2016, 11:20:43 AM

TGH,

after your last FWBR modification i got it to work (kind of).
I had to reverse the led and i had to also connect the emitter to minus (-)
My AC leads are reversed versus your diagram.
I am using 2x AA rechargeables, at 2.4V for the moment.

The collector signal is shown in the screenhot below.

Using a 470nF poly cap, so no tantalum.

Voltage slowly dropping on the batteries........


Regards Itsu
 
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on October 30, 2016, 04:00:39 PM
TGH,

after your last FWBR modification i got it to work (kind of).
I had to reverse the led and i had to also connect the emitter to minus (-)
My AC leads are reversed versus your diagram.
I am using 2x AA rechargeables, at 2.4V for the moment.

The collector signal is shown in the screenhot below.

Using a 470nF poly cap, so no tantalum.

Voltage slowly dropping on the batteries........


Regards Itsu
 
Yes, it should be grounded before the bridge and at the emitter of the transistor.
There should be 1-3Mohm resistance on the base, even if its not a led.
Your frequency is too high, I had around that same frequency in the scope shots but that was only when the circuit was running "wide open" The frequency should be around 5hz-10hz when the potentiometer is cranked up to 1 Mohm, you should hear a audible clicking sound. It should be around 5-10hz
If moving the pot up to 1 Mohm doesn't help try removing the 470nf and the potentiometer temporarily and replacing them with a single 470uf 16 volt electrolytic capacitor. (You should hear the clicking sound I'm talking about for around 10 seconds before it fades off)

Here are the images on how I connected the emitter to the ground and bridge rectifier.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 30, 2016, 04:53:22 PM


TGH,

your images are way to big, please shrink them down first using paint or so,  thanks.


oK, new screenshot shows a 12Hz signal which can be lowered (or raised) somewhat using the 1M potmeter.

The white led is visible blinking now (12Hz)

Batteries voltage is stable at 2.513V, slightly climbing, probably due to earlier heavier load.

The LED needs to be opposite as to what your diagram shows, else it won't work.

I will continue to monitor the batteries voltage......

Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 30, 2016, 08:33:33 PM

Batteries voltage at 2.525V and still climbing slowly.........

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on October 30, 2016, 10:39:17 PM
Batteries voltage at 2.525V and still climbing slowly.........

Itsu
Excellent I'm glad you got it to work. 12hz sounds about spot on.
If you raise the input voltage the voltage will climb faster in the long run
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 31, 2016, 10:23:28 AM

I left the circuit running overnight with a voltage of 2.528V, and this morning it was at 2.534V and seems to be stable now.

I will keep it undisturbed for the rest of the day.

I have a supercapacitorbank (100F at 15V) which i will "fill" to 5V and let it run from that for a while as a next step.


Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on October 31, 2016, 04:56:05 PM
I left the circuit running overnight with a voltage of 2.528V, and this morning it was at 2.534V and seems to be stable now.

I will keep it undisturbed for the rest of the day.

I have a supercapacitorbank (100F at 15V) which i will "fill" to 5V and let it run from that for a while as a next step.


Regards Itsu
As long as the super capacitor bank has a low leakage current it should work. I've tried 2.3V 100 Farad cap and the circuit can't produce enough energy to overcome the leakage current.
At least that's my theory
 Thanks Adam
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 31, 2016, 05:28:40 PM

Good to know TGH, it seems so at my setup to (to much leakage current).


After another day, the voltage with the 2x AA batteries was stable at 2.536V, so in 24 Hours it raised from 2.513 to 2.536 = 23mV.
I believe this rising was due to some chemical process in these batteries.

I "filled" my supercapbank to 6V and attached to the circuit.
The voltage started to drop immediately but i will leave it to run overnight again.

Video here:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SitWMhrKm_w


Regards itsu
 
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: verpies on October 31, 2016, 06:52:36 PM
Guys,

A capcoil has been already tried.  Why don't you try a coil in a capacitor, too ?
...a cored coil, of course, so the electric field of the cap can work on the core.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on October 31, 2016, 08:54:08 PM

Quote
A capcoil has been already tried

i did not realize we had a capcoil here, you do not mean these 2 vertical lines inside the transformer coils?   ;D

Quote
Why don't you try a coil in a capacitor, too ?

like in Vladimir Utkin his paper, here somewere:  http://www.free-energy-info.com/Utkin.htm


Anyway, the supercaps voltage is still decreasing, its now at 5.559V., so i will stop this as it seems pointless to continue.
Instead i have installed 4x AA recharcheables with a voltage of 5.094V...........
 

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 01, 2016, 01:59:35 AM
i did not realize we had a capcoil here, you do not mean these 2 vertical lines inside the transformer coils?   ;D

like in Vladimir Utkin his paper, here somewere:  http://www.free-energy-info.com/Utkin.htm


Anyway, the supercaps voltage is still decreasing, its now at 5.559V., so i will stop this as it seems pointless to continue.
Instead i have installed 4x AA recharcheables with a voltage of 5.094V...........
 

Itsu

With 5 volts it should rise about 2 to 3 times the voltage of the 2.5v in the same amount of time.
I don't know if you have noticed yet but as you increase the voltage the frequency increases, I'm thinking that may be the reason the voltage climbs faster?  (And the added voltage)
Ex- 1.5V 10hz
      3V 13hz
      6V 18hz
(I'm just guessing the 3V and 6V since I don't have a oscope but you get the point)
What's odd about the frequency is if you try and up the frequency while at a specified voltage ex 1.5V 10hz to 1.5V 20Hz the voltage will drop instead of gain.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 01, 2016, 10:52:44 AM

Quote
With 5 volts it should rise about 2 to 3 times the voltage of the 2.5v in the same amount of time.
I don't know if you have noticed yet but as you increase the voltage the frequency increases, I'm thinking that may be the reason the voltage climbs faster?  (And the added voltage)
Ex- 1.5V 10hz
      3V 13hz
      6V 18hz
(I'm just guessing the 3V and 6V since I don't have a oscope but you get the point)
What's odd about the frequency is if you try and up the frequency while at a specified voltage ex 1.5V 10hz to 1.5V 20Hz the voltage will drop instead of gain.


Hmmmm,  ok,   good to know again, as overnight, the 4x AA rechargeables dropped 2mV, so we are now at 5.092V.
I had it set at 12Hz like when at 2.5V, so i should/could try doubling the frequency to 24Hz or so.


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 01, 2016, 03:34:50 PM

Hmmmm,  ok,   good to know again, as overnight, the 4x AA rechargeables dropped 2mV, so we are now at 5.092V.
I had it set at 12Hz like when at 2.5V, so i should/could try doubling the frequency to 24Hz or so.


Itsu
If you keep the 1Mohm resistance the same and apply a higher voltage the frequency will increase on its own
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 01, 2016, 03:52:10 PM

Right,

from 12Hz @ 2.5V to 65Hz @ 5.092V.

I will let it run with this 65Hz @ 5.092V  for now.....


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 01, 2016, 10:40:52 PM
Voltage had dropped till 5.088V (4mV), so i have decreased the frequency till i saw the voltage rise again (battery recovery?).
That was around 17Hz, so i will leave it overnight this way (17Hz @ 5.089V).


There is a very narrow (100ns) pulse ontop of the battery voltage (5.089V) of around 800mV at every 17Hz pulse, which could (re)load the  batteries and thus partially compensate for the losses in the circuit, see screenshot.

Yellow is the battery voltage, blue the collector signal (end of the pulse).

 
Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 02, 2016, 10:21:58 AM

Not looking very promising, this morning the voltage was back to 5.088V.

I will try some other components like a tantalum capacitor to see if things can be turned around (bigger / wider pulse as mentioned above?).

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 02, 2016, 07:23:32 PM

I used severall (4) common mode chokes, from which only one produced a pulse train (6 pulses) instead of a single pulse every 12Hz (or how i set the potmeter), see screenshot.

I will keep this common mode choke for further testing.

Using different transistors then the 2n2222a like the MPSA18, BC337-40 or 2n1555 causes the pulse ontop of the 5V supply rail to lower or disappear, so i will keep the 2n2222a for now.

Itsu 
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 02, 2016, 11:12:45 PM
If you can you should post a picture of the coil your using, since it has 5 pulses instead of one. Maybe more charge at a faster rate?
About your voltage drop on the battery.
It shouldnt be dropping, there must be something set wrong. Maybe the pots set wrong? If it comes to it I can send you the original circuit I made years ago.
I had a test going for 6 months and every day I logged the voltage of the battery, it never went down below the starting voltage. Sadly I have no idea where my paper went where I logged the results on.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 03, 2016, 06:35:12 AM
I used severall (4) common mode chokes, from which only one produced a pulse train (6 pulses) instead of a single pulse every 12Hz (or how i set the potmeter), see screenshot.

I will keep this common mode choke for further testing.

Using different transistors then the 2n2222a like the MPSA18, BC337-40 or 2n1555 causes the pulse ontop of the 5V supply rail to lower or disappear, so i will keep the 2n2222a for now.

Itsu
Like you said maybe that top pulse (400ns) has something to do with recharging the battery's since other similar transistors didn't work as well.
You frequency seems too high on ch2 seems too high at 1.7khz, were you getting decreased voltage at 1.7khz?
Mine is around 10hz but that's on 1.5v instead of 5v
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 03, 2016, 06:43:17 AM
My results I got were all based off of 1.5VDC @ about 10hz. That's where I'm getting gaining voltage.
I'm probably sending a lot of mixed messages about the frequency, at least I feel like I am. Sorry about that.
You shouldn't adjust the frequency at all, just keep the resistance at 1M and vary the voltage.
Your voltage should no longer go down.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 03, 2016, 11:24:38 AM
Quote
If you can you should post a picture of the coil your using, since it has 5 pulses instead of one.

see picture below, the 3 in the background are the others i have used which only produce a single pulse.

This morning the voltage was dropped to 5.085V.


Quote
You frequency seems too high on ch2 seems too high at 1.7khz, were you getting decreased voltage at 1.7khz?

this 1.7Khz frequency is the frequency of the 6 pulses.  The repetition frequency of these pulses was still set with the potmeter to about 12Hz.


Quote
I'm probably sending a lot of mixed messages about the frequency, at least I feel like I am. Sorry about that.

correct, but no problem, i will get it eventually   :D


I will go back to 1.5V (single rechargeable) and set the frequency at 10Hz using this last common mode choke.
I expect to receive a 470nF tantalum cap any day now which i will use.

The led used is still at the opposite direction as in your diagram!!

Thanks for the info,   regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 03, 2016, 08:58:09 PM

It won't run on 1.5V (single AA), so i had to resort to 2x AA rechargeables again, meaning 2.544V.
Frequency is set at 25Hz..........

This lower voltage has caused the pulse train to dissappear, so we are back to a single pulse @ 25Hz.


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 03, 2016, 10:58:10 PM

The reason i put the frequency to 25Hz is because it is almost the double of 10Hz (where you started with 1.5V @ 10Hz) but more specific as at 25Hz the pulses kind of "locks in".
At somewhat lower or higher frequency is wobbles back and forth somewhat, but not at 25Hz.

So what is special of 25Hz?  Well its the half of 50Hz which is here in Europe the local grid frequency.

Putting the circuit to 50Hz even more stabilized the frequency of the circuit, so i think it kind of locks in to the 50Hz of the local grid.

Touching a 3th probe (purple) with my fingers shows there is a fair amount of 50Hz noise in my environment, see screenshot.

So how about your circuit, does it also locks in on the local grid frequency or a subharmonic of it?

Anyway, letting it run overnight at 50Hz presently at 2.544V.

Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 04, 2016, 10:24:11 AM

Nope,  no free lunch from the local grid environment, battery voltage had dropped to 2.542V this morning......

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 05, 2016, 04:51:01 AM
Mine runs around 13hz like your did but mines @ 1.5v.
I didn't have any grid noise when I was actually able to borrow a oscope.
It didn't really "lock" into the grid for say or at least I didn't notice.

Back a couple years ago I ran the circuit in a microwave just to see iif the voltage would still continue to climb and it did... I can do it again in a video if you would like.
I will borrow another oscope on Monday and post the waveform, frequency, p to p, RMS and so on if I remember haha :)
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 05, 2016, 05:03:23 AM

"The reason i put the frequency to 25Hz is because it is almost the double of 10Hz (where you started with 1.5V @ 10Hz) but more specific as at 25Hz the pulses kind of "locks in".
At somewhat lower or higher frequency is wobbles back and forth somewhat, but not at 25Hz."

Try just using a 1Mohm resistor instead of the pot. Then adjust your voltage. You should then see the same results as you started with. (The voltage gain)
I find that 1Mohm works the best at all voltages 0.5-35V

If you adjust the 1 Mohm pot any less then 1Mohm I have found you get voltage drain I probably should have mentioned that.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 05, 2016, 11:19:31 AM

Thanks TGH,

i will use a fixed 1M resistor  and see how low i can go using my bench PS.

I have reduced the frequency using the potmeter from 50Hz to 12.5Hz (it locks in at 50, 25 and 12.5Hz) and overnight the voltage stayed stable at 2.543V.
I will measure the potmeter to see what value it has now.


Seeing your signals would be nice for comparing, so if possible, yes, please try so.


Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 05, 2016, 09:33:35 PM

I measured the potmeter resistance in the 2.5V @ 12Hz position and it was 78K.

When substituting the potmeter for a fixed 1M (1.02M) the frequency dropped to 1Hz depending on what led was in.
So i had to increase the voltage again (4x AA = 5.090V) to get a 7Hz frequency.

I will let it run again overnight.

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 06, 2016, 04:02:21 AM
Okay, sounds good. I'll get those waveforms.
My 1Mohm pot  was actually .8M real resistance so that's what I'm using now since I don't have any 1M resistors on hand.
Maybe a .8Kohm resistor would work better then 1M.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 06, 2016, 03:48:46 PM

No increase overnight, instead i lost 1 mV, so now at 5.089V.

Adjusted my potmeter to be 800K and put back instead of the fixed 1M resistor.
Frequency went up to 8Hz, so i will leave it again running (8Hz @ 5.089V).....
 

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 07, 2016, 11:28:21 AM

This morning the voltage has dropped to 5.087V.

Still waiting for those tantalum caps, which could make the difference??

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 09, 2016, 11:14:13 AM

I installed a 39uF tantalum capacitor instead of the 470nF poly.
The frequency did not deviate much.

After 2 days running i have 5.085V in the batteries, so 2mV lower.

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 09, 2016, 07:50:13 PM
I installed a 39uF tantalum capacitor instead of the 470nF poly.
The frequency did not deviate much.

After 2 days running i have 5.085V in the batteries, so 2mV lower.

Itsu
Sorry I haven't been posting lately, I've been busy.
About the MV loss. Why don't you try the circuit the way you had it to start with when you had voltage gain
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 09, 2016, 07:51:29 PM
Sorry I haven't been posting lately, I've been busy.
About the MV loss. Why don't you try the circuit the way you had it to start with when you had voltage gain
I'm still working on getting a oscope
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 09, 2016, 09:04:18 PM


TGH,

no problem, i have it running here at the side, so take your time.

I believe te earlier voltage gain seen was due to the battery chemistry.
When you load a battery, which i did during the first tests were i had to find the correct coil connections etc., the voltage will rise momentarily when the load dissappears or decreases.

After a while the voltage will stabilize again and will drop under the minimized load as it does now.

So either i did not find the correct setup yet, or you also suffer(ed) from this battery effect.


Regards Itsu


Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 12, 2016, 04:01:05 AM

TGH,

no problem, i have it running here at the side, so take your time.

I believe te earlier voltage gain seen was due to the battery chemistry.
When you load a battery, which i did during the first tests were i had to find the correct coil connections etc., the voltage will rise momentarily when the load dissappears or decreases.

After a while the voltage will stabilize again and will drop under the minimized load as it does now.

So either i did not find the correct setup yet, or you also suffer(ed) from this battery effect.


Regards Itsu
You must not have found the correct setup yet, but I feel your getting close. Specific coils will only work.
Your voltage gain was the start of something, I have that same voltage gain but it keeps on going. Here's a link to a video I made awhile back showing some of that. http://youtu.be/Nz04HKLBrYU
Note: That's my original circuit just moved to a different prototype board, also the 1.5v battery you see in the box is not connected at the moment.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 12, 2016, 10:49:14 AM

Quote
You must not have found the correct setup yet, but I feel your getting close. Specific coils will only work.
Your voltage gain was the start of something, I have that same voltage gain but it keeps on going. Here's a link to a video I made awhile back showing some of that. http://youtu.be/Nz04HKLBrYU
Note: That's my original circuit just moved to a different prototype board, also the 1.5v battery you see in the box is not connected at the moment.


Thanks TGH,

i kind of expected you to say that  ;)


In the mean time i have changed the FWBR into a 4x UF4007 setup, but no behaviour change noticed, the voltage has dropped to 5.084V these past days.

I will make little changes in the setup keeping the batteries as undisturbed as possible to avoid false voltage changes.

By the way, your video says "private", so you need to change it into "hidden" or so for me to view it.

Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 12, 2016, 04:31:18 PM

Thanks TGH,

i kind of expected you to say that  ;)


In the mean time i have changed the FWBR into a 4x UF4007 setup, but no behaviour change noticed, the voltage has dropped to 5.084V these past days.

I will make little changes in the setup keeping the batteries as undisturbed as possible to avoid false voltage changes.

By the way, your video says "private", so you need to change it into "hidden" or so for me to view it.

Regards Itsu
Thanks, I changed the video listing to unlisted. You should be able to watch it
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 14, 2016, 10:45:27 AM

Thanks, i could see it now.
There you used a lithium type of battery and common mode choke of which i have used a similar one.

Not sure why the difference, i could try a lithium battery too, but doubt it wil change much.

Regards Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 14, 2016, 04:12:40 PM
TGH,

i noticed in your video that you seem to use a 9-led configuration for your led which did not show any output.
As you probably know, a led will produce some voltage when in bright light, so the inverse of what a led normally does.
With 9 leds you could see some notable voltage (>100mV).

Did you run your setup in the dark?  And if so does the voltage still rise?


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: verpies on November 14, 2016, 09:24:41 PM
As you probably know, a led will produce some voltage when in bright light, so the inverse of what a led normally does.
With 9 LEDs you could see some notable voltage (>100mV).
Excellent reminder!
I knew it but I forgot about it
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 19, 2016, 08:10:51 PM
TGH,

i noticed in your video that you seem to use a 9-led configuration for your led which did not show any output.
As you probably know, a led will produce some voltage when in bright light, so the inverse of what a led normally does.
With 9 leds you could see some notable voltage (>100mV).

Did you run your setup in the dark?  And if so does the voltage still rise?


Itsu
Those 9 LEDs are part of a different circuit
Yeah the circuit works in the dark it doesn't matter the time of day.
TGH
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 19, 2016, 08:48:06 PM

Thanks for info TGH.

My circuit is still running and in the last week it did not loose any voltage, still at 5.084V.
The led is blinking with a 12.5Hz frequency since i installed a 470nF tantalum capacitor.

But those are 4x 2000mAH batteries and the led is a minute load for them.


Will see how long this will run.


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 20, 2016, 12:13:10 AM
Thanks for info TGH.

My circuit is still running and in the last week it did not loose any voltage, still at 5.084V.
The led is blinking with a 12.5Hz frequency since i installed a 470nF tantalum capacitor.

But those are 4x 2000mAH batteries and the led is a minute load for them.


Will see how long this will run.


Itsu
Frequency sounds right and now there are the right values.
I am still trying to get a oscope I just haven't had the time lately that's why I've had lack of posting sorry about that.
Have you gained any voltage over the week?
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 20, 2016, 11:21:27 AM
As a matter of fact, yes, as the voltage had dropped to about 5.082 half way in the week and climbed up till the present 5.084V it is now.
 
But i do not think this is very meaningfull and falls within the margins of my DMM tolerances and batteries as they react to temperature changes.


We will see how it progresses.


Itsu
 
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 20, 2016, 04:30:25 PM
As a matter of fact, yes, as the voltage had dropped to about 5.082 half way in the week and climbed up till the present 5.084V it is now.
 
But i do not think this is very meaningfull and falls within the margins of my DMM tolerances and batteries as they react to temperature changes.


We will see how it progresses.


Itsu
Okay, let me know how it progresses
Thanks
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on November 21, 2016, 02:27:59 AM
As a matter of fact, yes, as the voltage had dropped to about 5.082 half way in the week and climbed up till the present 5.084V it is now.
 
But i do not think this is very meaningfull and falls within the margins of my DMM tolerances and batteries as they react to temperature changes.


We will see how it progresses.


Itsu
Im pretty certain it isn't because of heat, you can test that its not by using two brand new AA battery's at a certain set volrage. Have one connected to the circuit and one just sitting there and measure the voltage over a weeks time. I bet the voltage won't go up on the battery that's sitting there.
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on November 27, 2016, 09:46:42 PM

Not looking good, after another week, the voltage has now dropped to 5.081V.

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on December 04, 2016, 12:43:08 AM
I'm using 1.5V .8Mohm pot.
Maybe that will work?
You should be seeing some gain.
What config did you have it in when it worked?
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on December 04, 2016, 11:48:17 AM

After another week, the voltage has dropped further to 5.078V.

I could not have the thing run on 1.5V, i started with 2x AA rechargeables (2.4V), and there was some voltage gain, but i still think that was from the rechargeables
being recovering after loading them during earlier testing.
The gain stopped after a day or so.


I will see if i can get it to run on a single rechargeable AA (1.2V) or normal AA (1.5V) at 0.8 Mohm.


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: sm0ky2 on December 05, 2016, 06:31:23 PM
There are other things to consider as well.


Such as:


-contact point efficiencies
  i.e.
      Surface area / pressure
      Metal types at each interface
      Number of interfaces


-battery specifications and/or conditions
   Efficiency points for example a given battery
       may charge to a higher "voltage" or potential
       between its' two end-points, but not have a linear scale
       on its' available current, and the sustainability thereof.
   Or charge with less losses at a given impulse voltage/duration.


-or any other such unknown factor of your particular set-up
  that may cause system losses.


"Breadboards are bad,  mmm K"
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on December 07, 2016, 10:41:52 PM

Thanks Smoky,

i thought breadboards are a mandatory part of any overunity device because of their stray capacitance structure, similar like the need for using many different coloured clipleads  ;D


Anyway, i could not make my setup work with a single battery (1.2 or 1.5V), so i again settled for 2x rechargeable AA in series at 2.536V.
Using a red led its frequency is 6Hz, potmeter is set at 0.8Mohm.


After 5 days running it is still on 2.536V, sometimes shortly showing 2.537V (warming up of the batteries?).


When working on another project which involves white noise amplification, i notice that the DMM show a sudden increase like 2.540V, untill i shut down that white noise circuit.
So it seems that our little circuit is sensitive for pickup on nearby electrical fields.


Will be monitoring another few weeks.


Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on December 19, 2016, 05:32:26 AM
Thanks Smoky,

i thought breadboards are a mandatory part of any overunity device because of their stray capacitance structure, similar like the need for using many different coloured clipleads  ;D


Anyway, i could not make my setup work with a single battery (1.2 or 1.5V), so i again settled for 2x rechargeable AA in series at 2.536V.
Using a red led its frequency is 6Hz, potmeter is set at 0.8Mohm.


After 5 days running it is still on 2.536V, sometimes shortly showing 2.537V (warming up of the batteries?).


When working on another project which involves white noise amplification, i notice that the DMM show a sudden increase like 2.540V, untill i shut down that white noise circuit.
So it seems that our little circuit is sensitive for pickup on nearby electrical fields.


Will be monitoring another few weeks.


Itsu
Sorry I haven't been responding lately, my emails notifications have stopped showing up.
In 5 days if it hasent decreased I doubt it will.
Im going to throw a new aa battery on the circuit and see how it fares over time I'll post my results it week increments.

Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on December 19, 2016, 04:23:20 PM

Thanks TGH,

after 2 weeks of continuous blinking the led at 6Hz here, the dual AA rechargeables are still showing a steady 2.537V.

Itsu
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on December 19, 2016, 05:12:50 PM
Thanks TGH,

after 2 weeks of continuous blinking the led at 6Hz here, the dual AA rechargeables are still showing a steady 2.537V.

Itsu
Didn't it start at 2.536?
I just started mine last night starting voltage 1.622v
It dropped 8 mv to 1.614 right at the start (it usually does that for me)
Now its back up to 1.618 today I'll keep notifying the progress.
Thanks
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: itsu on December 19, 2016, 05:43:54 PM

Quote
Didn't it start at 2.536?

yes it did, it slowly increased to 2.537 tipping on to 2.538 for some days, now back at a steady 2.537V.
I think this is all within the tolerances of the components / DMM.

Lets see how your setup is doing.

Itsu
 
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: Reiyuki on December 19, 2016, 06:39:30 PM
itsu+generalhackr

Bedini often spoke a lot about battery chemistry.  When you're experimenting, it might be a good idea to keep a log of all the batteries you are using; some may work a lot better than others.
 - Battery chemistry (Alkaline, Lead Acid, Lithium Iron Phosphate, Nickel Iron, Zinc Air).    (for reference, I've only seen Bedini use Lead Acid and LiFePO4's)
 - # of cells  (probably doesn't matter but it could affect frequency)
 - Battery size (D, C, AA, AAA)    (might also affect frequency?)
 - Battery age and sulfation?     (sulfate crystals coating the plates could have an impact?)

Even if you don't get a self-runner right away, you can keep the circuit the same and try dozens battery variations to see the performance in each.  Maybe you'll find a trend or sweet-spot? :)
Title: Re: LCAP (Again) Possible Free Energy. (Voltage Gain Over time)
Post by: TheGeneralHackr on December 20, 2016, 01:26:38 AM
itsu+generalhackr

Bedini often spoke a lot about battery chemistry.  When you're experimenting, it might be a good idea to keep a log of all the batteries you are using; some may work a lot better than others.
 - Battery chemistry (Alkaline, Lead Acid, Lithium Iron Phosphate, Nickel Iron, Zinc Air).    (for reference, I've only seen Bedini use Lead Acid and LiFePO4's)
 - # of cells  (probably doesn't matter but it could affect frequency)
 - Battery size (D, C, AA, AAA)    (might also affect frequency?)
 - Battery age and sulfation?     (sulfate crystals coating the plates could have an impact?)

Even if you don't get a self-runner right away, you can keep the circuit the same and try dozens battery variations to see the performance in each.  Maybe you'll find a trend or sweet-spot? :)
Thanks for the input Reiyuki
I mainly use alkaline battery's myswlf but lithium ion battery's seem to have a faster recharge.
Carbon Zinc battery's had a interesting effect, they would self charge for months and eventually destroy themselves (eat through the zinc)
For me the number of cells in series bumps up the frequency and bumps up the recharge time.
@40v its gained 2 volts in a couple hours.
High output lithium ion seemed to work the best (I used one from a electronic cigerette lighter) but I'm currently using alkaline due to always using them.
Thanks I'll keep notifying of changes made and voltage gained.