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Gravity powered devices => Gravity powered devices => Topic started by: vikram_gupta11 on October 15, 2016, 05:22:12 PM

Title: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 15, 2016, 05:22:12 PM
In this sketch 10 numbered tubes will be mounted permanently on a seesaw in Horizontal direction .There will be  10 numbered 100 gram mass Iron balls and these Iron balls will move in these tubes.  we will attach two piston generators(linear generator) on the both end of each tube as per diagram.we will take a motor and this motor will work to shake this balanced seesaw in horizontal direction towards 5 centimeter(thrice in a second) back and forth .

I have used a running car example in this design .Suppose a car is running at the speed of 100km/hour and there are 10 numbered passengers in the car then each passengers speed will be also 100 km./hour.
Here in this design passengers are tubes Containing balls,car is balanced seesaw and speed is turning of seesaw.

Mathematical Equations:We will use F=ma and K.E.=0.5m(v*v) ,equations to understand this concept.

Suppose ,the overall mass of this system is 1.5 kilogram including balls,and tubes and motors and this seesaw is turning .05meter (thrice in second) in back and forth direction then using f=ma,
F will be 1.5*.05*3= 0.22 watt so the input to turn this total system will be 0.22 watt but to counter mechanical loss and inertia we will have to apply some more force so we will add 0.50 watt more and therefore total input will be now 0.22+0.50=0.72 watt .

we will take it as a 1 watt and if this balanced seesaw turn with this 1 watt force then each iron ball will also get 1 watt force  so the acceleration of each iron ball will be using f=ma and a=f/a 1/.1=10 meter/second .It means each ball's  speed will be 10 meter /second .

Now using equation k.E.=0.5m(v*v)  0.5*.100*(10*10)= 5 joule per second so each ball will move or accelerate with 5 joule energy to hit the both side pistons and and these pistons will work to move a generator to produce electricity.


we can take 5 joule /second as 5 watt also.

If we take only 20% efficiency of this piston generator then each generator will produce 1 watt and overall output of 20 numbered generators will be 20 watt which is 20 times greater then 1 watt input.

In this way this design will work. this design will work to multiply the force and anyone can try it .This is a complete 100% free energy device.

I have tested this design and it is working but the main problem is I don't have piston generators to get electricity but I can calculate and feel the speed of these balls .
This is completely an Overunity device.
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 17, 2016, 03:17:56 PM
The tubes will move at different angular velocity. Highest velocity of the outer tubes, and least velocity of the inner tubes because the displacement of each tube is different from eachother. This is however not important.
Inertia will decide how much energy input you need. And I do not see the point in using a seesaw. This mechanism does not provide any benefit to the system - it does not remove inertia from the weights.
The energy output of this device, including loss, is exactly the same as the energy input. Useful energy output is less than the input energy.


When you load the balls/tubes by draining energy out of them, the motor will have to move the seesaw like it was moving inside syrup. The consequenses are more energy input provided by the motor.


I like that you have nobel intensions, but this device will not provide more energy than it consumes. Really.


Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 18, 2016, 07:50:45 PM
Dear Sir,

Sorry,but i'm not convinced with you .I have tested it with some plastic bottles and rubber made bouncing balls and can calculate the kinetic energy of each balls.
Inertia will be not a problem in this device as this device is getting as much input as to counter the inertia and more above if mass is equally distributed in the device then as far as I think there should be no problem of inertia.
the balls will work to just transferring of energy when these balls will hit with the pistons .

vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 18, 2016, 09:21:39 PM
OK. How was you able to calculate the kinetic energy in the balls so accurate?


Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 19, 2016, 06:14:03 AM
Dear Sir,
I just calculate the kinetic energy of balls just with seeing the movement of balls as I don't have no other devices.I know  the problem about what you are talking but that problem will be never occurred in this system  because input energy and movement of Arms of the seesaw will work to counter that problem.

Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 19, 2016, 09:41:12 AM
Dear Sir,
I just calculate the kinetic energy of balls just with seeing the movement of balls as I don't have no other devices.I know  the problem about what you are talking but that problem will be never occurred in this system  because input energy and movement of Arms of the seesaw will work to counter that problem.

Vikram
So you think that the seesaw will cause inertia to go away?
Inertia is the force you have to spend to get any mass in motion - regardless of direction. It does not matter in which direction the mass is moved, you have to apply force to put it in motion.
You cannot calculate kinetic energy just by looking at a ball in motion. You need to know its exact mass, and its exact average velocity. You cannot decide these factors just by watching it moving.
I do not mean to be rude, but I honestly think you should go learn some more basic physics before you waste more time on this. Really.
Your device/idea is not going to be over unity. Believe me.


Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 20, 2016, 11:13:45 AM
Dear Sir,
Sorry, but it is very clear that you have not understood  what i want to say and you have not read the entire post thoroughly.I have mentioned already about this inertia problem and i'm not denying about it as I'm applying force to counter the inertia problem.

I'm just trying to get some piston generators so that I could build it.

please read carefully the entire post and tell me where I'm wrong in my calculations and in equations that I used to calculate the input force and output energy?

Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 20, 2016, 05:18:53 PM
Dear Sir,
Sorry, but it is very clear that you have not understood  what i want to say and you have not read the entire post thoroughly.I have mentioned already about this inertia problem and i'm not denying about it as I'm applying force to counter the inertia problem.

I'm just trying to get some piston generators so that I could build it.

please read carefully the entire post and tell me where I'm wrong in my calculations and in equations that I used to calculate the input force and output energy?

Vikram
If 1.5kg mass is moving 0.05*3 meter per second, the kinetic energy is 0.016875 Joule. Not 0.22 Joule.
You have a miscalculation of 1300%. I understand why you thought your idea is over unity.

You also say "F will be 1.5*.05*3= 0.22 watt". F= force, not energy.

Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 21, 2016, 05:56:54 AM
Dear Sir,
Now it is 100 % clear that you have not understood it and you have just driven this concept in wrong direction.
I'm not talking about the system 's kinetic energy but the kinetic energy of balls . the 0.22+ watt is an input force not energy and this 0.22+ watt will work to shake the whole system in back and forth direction.
when each tube will get 0.22+watt force then  the each ball's (having 100 gram mass ) kinetic energy will be 5 joule .

I'm 100% correct in my calculations and if you are not convinced then try this with a bottle and small rubber ball and shake this bottle towards back and forth direction .I 'm assure you will find your answers that Why I'm so sure that it is an overunity device.
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 21, 2016, 07:20:37 AM
Watt is NOT a force. Watt is Joules pr. second. Joules is ENERGY ;-)
Force is not energy ;-)
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 21, 2016, 08:11:50 AM
Dear sir,
Don't get illustrate with units .I know watt is power of unit but try to understand the concept.
what is the difference between watt and newton force  if we applying it on a object?No,difference.
1 watt=1 newton force =1 joule.

I have tested it and it will work and again say that you please try it with a plastic bottle and a small bouncing  rubber ball .Put the ball in the bottle and shake the bottle .you will find all answers and if possible then mounted permanently some 4 to 6 no.bottle+ ball on a  beam and make a balanced seesaw and shake this seesaw's left or right arm to the corner  with your handpower in horizontal direction just 5 centimeter back and forth  and notice the movement of balls.it will take  just 10 minutes  for your kind of Expert.

It will work. REALLY.
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 21, 2016, 08:24:34 AM
Dear sir,
Don't get illustrate with units .I know watt is power of unit but try to understand the concept.
what is the difference between watt and newton force  if we applying it on a object?No,difference.
1 watt=1 newton force =1 joule.

I have tested it and it will work and again say that you please try it with a plastic bottle and a small bouncing  rubber ball .Put the ball in the bottle and shake the bottle .you will find all answers and if possible then mounted permanently some 4 to 6 no.bottle+ ball on a  beam and make a balanced seesaw and shake this seesaw's left or right arm to the corner  with your handpower in horizontal direction just 5 centimeter back and forth  and notice the movement of balls.it will take  just 10 minutes  for your kind of Expert.

It will work. REALLY.
"1 watt=1 newton force =1 joule"? Where did you learned that? It is very confusing when people can't do their math right.[/size]
1Watt = 1 Joules per second. It has absolutely nothing to do with force.
A 100 gram object that is resting on a flat surface apply 1 Newton of force to the surface, but that does not mean it applies 1Watt.
I think you should be more precise in your equations and explanations. If not, you're just fooling yourself - and us.
Vidar


Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 21, 2016, 08:41:01 AM
 A 100 gram object is resting on a surface but what will happened when we will apply 1 newton force  or push this 100 gram weight with our handpower then this force will work to move it.
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 21, 2016, 03:40:05 PM
A 100 gram object is resting on a surface but what will happened when we will apply 1 newton force  or push this 100 gram weight with our handpower then this force will work to move it.
If you have a steel ball that weights 100g, resting on a flat surface, and you apply force to it so it starts to roll, the ball will accelerate untill the force is removed. Then the ball will continue to roll with the same velocity (If we neglect friction)


In the seesaw, the weights are moving back and forth with constant velocity (The average velocity is constant). When the weights has achieved this velocity at 0.15m/s, there is no need to apply more force to make it move if there is no friction.
The kinetic energy Ke in the weigth that is fasten to the seesaw is 1/2 * m(V*V). As you put on more weights on the seesaw, m increase.


Guess what amount of energy you have to apply to the seesaw to make it move at 0.15m/s with more than one weight. That is 1/2 * m*n(V*V), where n is number of weights. The applied force can be the same if you want, but it will take longer time to accelerate the seesaw weights to 0.15m/s as the total weight increase. When the weights has returned to its initial point, no energy is supplied except the energy required to fight friction.


I will recommend you to build this, and see what's going on. Measure the energy you apply to the motor as you increase the weights.
You will soon enough experience that the seesaw will stop moving as soon as the energy supply is removed. It will stop due to friction.
You will also experience that the motor has to be powered all the time because friction will make it necessary.


Now start to load the system with a bulb. The copper windings around the tube will resist the mass (magnet) inside to move. The movement of that mass will also try to stop the seesaw, because it will occur a lag in the movement of the mass - like they are moving in syrup. You have now no longer a frictionless suspension that holds the mass, but a shock absorber. Shock absorbers consumes energy and turns it into heat.


Now, the motor must work harder to sustain motion in the seesaw. This extra energy needed to sustain movement, is the same energy you take out on the bulb. No over unity.


Vidar

Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 22, 2016, 08:17:54 AM
The main problem is you are calculating kinetic energy without applying force .
just tell me only that  what will be the kinetic energy of a 100 gram ball if we apply 1 newton force on it?
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 22, 2016, 07:30:49 PM
The main problem is you are calculating kinetic energy without applying force .
just tell me only that  what will be the kinetic energy of a 100 gram ball if we apply 1 newton force on it?
The formula of kinetic energy is 1/2 * m(V*V). There is no way around this formula.
The force is applied in advance, so it is already included. Because without the force, there will be no velocity V.
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 22, 2016, 08:04:21 PM
Dear Sir,
I have started worked to build this device and will present a working model before this community soon.

Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 22, 2016, 10:28:03 PM
Quote
what will be the kinetic energy of a 100 gram ball if we apply 1 newton force on it
I forgot to answer this question.
Applying 1N to a 100g mass will provide an acceleration of exactly 10m/s^2. The kinetic energy will increase with time as the mass increase in velocity.
After 1 second the velocity is 10m/s, so Ke is therfor 1/2 * 0.1(10*10)= 5 Joule.
After 2 seconds, Ke is 20 Joule because velocity is 20m/s
After 3 seconds, Ke is 45 Joule because velocity is 30m/s
4 seconds, 80 Joule because velocity is 40m/s.


Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 23, 2016, 04:11:43 AM
 So tell me where I'm wrong ?I'm not wrong and my calculations are very much correct if you read the entire post carefully and this is 101% an overunity device.

Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 23, 2016, 01:16:53 PM
I think you should continue to build it. I can obviously not explain in words that you are wrong, because you deny the fundamental physics, so you have to experience this in practice.
I whish you a honest good luck with your project.


Vidar
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 26, 2016, 03:23:39 AM
 Dear Sir,
the model is almost done  I have tested it with my hand power and it is working after notice the velocity of balls and hitting the side wall of tubes. but I'm trying to attach a motor of 1 watt input force to run it and the kinetic energy of the balls are as per my calculations.

So now I'm confident that this will work.

Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 26, 2016, 06:51:09 AM
Hands ar far from accurate measurement tools. Hands doesnot even give you an indication.
Hook up the output from the seesaw directly back to the motor with wires. If the motor goes crazy and and don't stop to accelerate, you got over unity.
I guess the opposite will happen - the motor will stop.


Good luck
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: vikram_gupta11 on October 26, 2016, 11:23:19 AM
Dear Sir,
you mean ,the motor that is providing input will be stopped  when balls will strike with side walls of tubes as I would like to tell you that I don't have piston generators to get electricity out from the system.The only problem I have is non availability of piston generators.
Please tell me what is your indication .Is it about  input motor or about piston generators . if your indication is about piston generators then I assure you that this device will work and if it is about input motor then again I think you are wrong.


Vikram
Title: Re: Free energy with Seesaw and Kinetic movement
Post by: Low-Q on October 26, 2016, 08:58:10 PM
Do you have a supplier around that have plastic tubes? I thought if you wound magnetic wire around them, and put a magnet inside, they would act like a piston generator. I have tubes, magnets and copper wire, but I do not want to waste more time in building things I know doesn't work. But you are free to try it out when you have the necessary equipment. Maybe if you buy one flashlight that have piston generator, you could try the concept.


Vidar