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Author Topic: A PLACE FOR DEBATE  (Read 43647 times)

Offline MrMag

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #60 on: November 29, 2006, 01:04:20 AM »
Why would the man from atomic energy say anything else. After all, if Marks device truly works, this poor man from atomic energy would be out of a job.

Tim

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #60 on: November 29, 2006, 01:04:20 AM »

Offline starcruiser

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #61 on: November 29, 2006, 01:40:22 AM »
Guys,

Not to say the TPU is fact or fiction but what makes you think he was from the Atomic Energy Commission?

Haven't you ever heard of good Cop - Bad Cop? The supposed AEC guy was playing the good cop and trying to gather a little more intelligence on what he was upto wouldn't you think?

Also, If he really did develop the TPU and the Feds grabbed it prior they may want to know if he has developed something else in the mean time.

Carl

Offline raburgeson

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #62 on: February 10, 2007, 12:07:35 PM »
 Just got to vent, I've been quiet for a while. The Pennsylvania group hasn't managed better than 94 percent. That's more than a stones throw from overunity. We haven't has a self running coil at all. The bright news is the other side of the country is having luck in another project. We need a post set aside for frequencies. One: a list of frequencies that don't work. I got a feeling many of us have failed on the same ones. Well have a good day guys.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #62 on: February 10, 2007, 12:07:35 PM »
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Offline Loki67671

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #63 on: February 10, 2007, 12:33:00 PM »
Where is the PA group? I'm a local too.................Loki

Offline raburgeson

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #64 on: February 12, 2007, 05:49:03 AM »
Loki,

Except for our science guys in Pittsburg, we're spread out accross the state. Their is three of us in Erie county, two in Vanango, 2 in Crawford, 1 in Union city (don't know which county he's in) and 3 in Warren Co. That,s Northwestern Pa. and the other three corners are tracted by other people. Just join any group in your area. There is people working on this all over the state, Energy is needed badly all around the world. North Korea was promised help years ago and we didn't keep our promises and now they are desperate enough to try extortion to get us to play through so to speak. They don't hate people or want to mass murder they just simply need energy. At last check there are about 180 small groups around Pa. Hot spots Williamport, Greensburg, Pittsburg and Philadephia. Most groups are tech grads, just ask at a local good tech school near you to plug in.
I'm not talking about a High school tech. Any school that offers at least an Associates degree that's in your area. We need more science guys bad we've got E-engineers but we lost the only Physicist we had. He went to Norfork for a better paying job. We stay small to many people to much party not enough work done. Best bet find a group of 10 people or less, very close to home, helps keep the costs down.

Ok debate this question for me guys, does a standing static charge have a magnetic componet? I'd like to hear your views on this really.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #64 on: February 12, 2007, 05:49:03 AM »
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Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #65 on: February 13, 2007, 01:31:55 AM »
Voltage == e-field == tiny magnetic field arround wire...

Whats to debate?

Offline Grumpy

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #66 on: February 13, 2007, 04:41:18 AM »
A non-moving electric charge would not be considered to have a magnetic moment.  The term "non-moving" is a matter perspective, ,as evrything can be considered moving when compared to something else.  The whole universe is moving around.

A moving electron has been shown to have an intrinsic magnetic moment.  If you have moving electrons  and hence a current (i.e. charge carriers) they generate a magnetic field.

From Hyperphysics:
Quote
But how does the electron obtain a magnetic moment if it has zero angular momentum and therefore produces no "current loop" to produce a magnetic moment? In 1925, Samuel A. Goudsmit and George E. Uhlenbeck postulated that the electron had an intrinsic angular momentum, independent of its orbital characteristics. In classical terms, a ball of charge could have a magnetic moment if it were spinning such that the charge at the edges produced an effective current loop. This kind of reasoning led to the use of "electron spin" to describe the intrinsic angular momentum.


Add this to some of the things that Edward Leedskalnin wrote, and a current loop (or closed magnetic loop) gets a little interesting.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #66 on: February 13, 2007, 04:41:18 AM »
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Offline raburgeson

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #67 on: February 13, 2007, 09:06:49 PM »
No wire, a static charge in the atmosphere with no current. No potential, difference causing electron flow. Is there a magnetic componet?

Offline Grumpy

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #68 on: February 14, 2007, 12:59:23 AM »
I was refering to a static charge.

So, no. Why would it need to have a magnetic moment?

The electric field (potential) can exist without it's magnetic field partner.  (Ref. a paper by F. Mende)

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #68 on: February 14, 2007, 12:59:23 AM »
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Offline Dingus Mungus

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #69 on: February 14, 2007, 01:20:31 AM »
"does a standing static charge have a magnetic componet?"
If it carries a charge it carries voltage.

I'm not sure we all agree on what voltage means...

As I understand it voltage is potential difference between two points which causes current to flow. Static field voltage works the same way and doesn't really require a wire, just a secondary point to measure the electrical potential difference or voltage. If you meassure a electrical potential difference that means current can flow and when it does a magnetic field will be present.

If I'm mistaken please explain.

Offline Grumpy

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #70 on: February 14, 2007, 04:28:25 AM »
Current will not flow with just a difference in potential.  You must create a condition where two potentials move in opposite directions.  (i.e. both moving or one moving and the other fixed.)

A gradient will not create current even though there is a difference in potential between two points within the gradient.  For example, there is a potential difference of about 200 volts between your feet and your head (a gradient) - yet no current flowing between the two.

It take two to tango.

I see no reason for a stationary charge to have a magnetic component.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #70 on: February 14, 2007, 04:28:25 AM »
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Offline libra_spirit

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #71 on: April 06, 2007, 07:51:14 AM »
This has become an intresting thread!
As it is titled "debate," I will freely offer my own view as well. LOL!

On static charge
Does a static charge have a magnetic field? LOL! The question is impossible to find in nature, but really answers itself. If it were possible to have a static charge, would there be a magnetic field present?

I would offer the perspective at the atomic level where all is found to be near lightspeed spinning motions, and no such a charge can exist without motion. Therefore at the level of the atoms parts the answer is that no static charge is ever present without a magnetic field, or a canceled magnetic field.

The magnetic field in matter normally stays confined to the matter except in the magnetic elements nickle, iron, and cobalt, where excess magnetic fields normally radiate external to the atoms, or in the AG metals where current is flowing through the electron shell, Copper Aluminum ...

Thus in matter we see the magnetic field being cancelled within, and often the electric field may reach out further, and the apearance of static charge.

Observing the model of Wilbert Smith, the primary field is motion, or lightspeed spin as it first apears, then built on this the second quadrature force is electric and the third is magnetism. None can exist without the ones that underly it, so in theory we can have three levels of forces. Light, or torsion waves, then comes electric potiential, and last magnetism, a fully three dimensional force requiring a volume, normally a donut shape to manifest a distance cubed force.

Torsion and light propagate in the prime dimension as a field force and are stripped of any EM.

Normal electronics deals with electrons and valence orbits, or a shortage of electrons, and the flows of electrons between such atoms missing only one electron. The cold electricity is probably a Proton flow of photons between proton shells without the need for particles to move between atoms. These forces are 2 dimensional forces, or distance squared forces and do form a gradient across space between charged objects. However inside the atoms they are not static so the magnetic field is in fact always present just not necessarily radiant to a great degree until current begins to flow and electrons jump free of orbits. The magnetic field becomes a function of the current flow in wire, but the actual magnetic field originates in the particles spin motions, and the orientation that either cancels the magnetic field or does not cancel it.

The magnitude of the electric force should become obvious when we consider the strongest electric fields are being emitted from the loss or addition of a single electron in many atoms. Considering the number of electrons still having Proton mates in these atoms to neutralize them from radiating charge, the atom contains a tremendous charge within it.

The entire world of matter is held together by magnetism, and electric forces, and without these they would become light. Magnetism is ever present everywhere in either the scalar cancelling state or the active state at a level we can hardly fathom.

These are the E in Einstiens equation E = MC ^2 the root forces, and inside the atoms these forces are present in the three forms. Tempic, Electric , and magnetic. All the other forces are a result of these three interacting. Tempic being the one yet to be accepted by science as a real medium of propagation, but the one that perfectly explains Tesla's longitudinal waves, as well as torsion and light.

Electric force is a combination of the tempic and electric fields, where the electric field is in a state of changing modulation or gradient. It propagates along its electric vector carrying a tempic charge. Gravity is a combination of the same two forces where the tempic field is in a state of modulation or gradient and it carries an electric field along with it. Thus both drop with a distance squared function.

Light only responds to the tempic field and thus gravity having a tempic field gradient will bend light but EM having only an electric gradient will not.

On the Steven Mark device
On the Steven Mark device all I can say is the world is not yet ready to be handed something it has not comprehended as of yet. Groups like this one will change this, and it is not about what Steven did or didn't do, it's about what the larger consciousness of mankind is willing to accept and how long it takes to get beyond our present state of national economic function, the energy brokers, and shift the focus to mankind as one consciousness. Like the monkeys on seperate islands, when one person reaches comprehension then it will spread along the inner planes and sooner or later all will become knowers of the truth that has become present amongst us.

Recent work
Has anyone here yet identified the NMR pulses inside the kick pulses that pop up between coils at 90 degrees? I am guessing they are around 5 Mhz.

http://magnetism.fateback.com/Overunity.htm

Dave L



Offline Moab

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #72 on: April 06, 2007, 03:27:16 PM »
@ Dave,L

Thank you! That was a very refreshing read.
                                                             Moab.M

Offline z_p_e

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Disclosing Responsibly
« Reply #73 on: July 04, 2007, 06:37:57 PM »
btentzer wrote:
Quote
He PM'd me stating that his search for OU was over.  He solicited MY help.  Not the other way around.  ALSO, let me say, That being "OPEN MINDED"  does NOT mean believing "anything". 

Well, I was wrong on the solicitation. Apologies.

However, why did he seek you out in the first place? Was he looking for guidance, help? The language barrier?

Whatever the reason, you accepted the task, and that comes with a great deal of responsibility. In fact any time anyone posts a disclosure, they should do so responsibly...especially if the disclosure includes a claim of overunity.

Bruce, you are intelligent, there is no doubt, evidenced by your developments with raising shrimp. This is definately your domain.

Although I commend you for being so generous with your time and effort in accepting the challenge brnbade offered you, and with all due respect, you were taking a large step outside of your domain, and should have graciously referred brnbade to someone with more FE research and electronics experience. There are at least 4 candidates I can think of at the moment.

Based on the way things did play out with brnbade's disclosure, I can say with confidence that this person would have advised brnbade not to post anything yet, and would then solidify many things by asking for clarification and diagrams. Keep in mind that final drawings are not what I mean...just the basics.

Once all the bare minimums were in place, the disclosure post could then have gone forward...properly. This would have saved a lot of cafuffle in the process.

In the case with brnbade, none of these steps were taken, and the results speak for themselves.

I'm not placing blame, I'm just trying to illustrate that we need to be aware of the consequences of not having all our ducks in place before posting disclosures. And if we decide to help someone else in doing so, we have the same responsibility to ensure that it is done correctly, in a scientific-like manner. Not Phd level stuff, again, just the basics to start.

Cheers,
Darren

PS. I'll make a brief suggestion in a later post.

EDIT: Here is the post I promised...
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,2654.msg38296.html#msg38296
« Last Edit: July 05, 2007, 03:03:35 AM by z_p_e »

Offline Grumpy

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Re: A PLACE FOR DEBATE
« Reply #74 on: July 04, 2007, 08:17:21 PM »
I wihtdraw my statement about magnetic moment - everything has a magnetic moment due to it's inherent spin - everything - spin is torsion and that is where it all begins.

 

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