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### Author Topic: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?  (Read 136175 times)

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #195 on: December 09, 2015, 12:32:43 AM »
Interesting thanks OK doing math again.

He goes from 300 joules to 10.8 joules in 240 seconds. His average joules (lets give him straight line) is 82.3
Li-Ion sustains 160 joules for 3600 seconds.
82.3*240= 19752 joules per hour
160 * 3600 = 576000 Joules / hour
576000/19752=29 * times more power

Sorry I underestimated he actually needs 29 * 26 cells = 754 cells to 26 Li-Ion Cells.

Nink, I have to run off and do things so I can't check it now but think I see some problems with your text above.

>  He goes from 300 joules to 10.8 joules in 240 seconds. His average joules (lets give him straight line) is 82.3

I am not sure where you are getting the "300 joules" from.  The real way to do it is to slice the output up into vertical slices of say 10 seconds each.  You take the middle voltage and current measurement for each slice and multiply by 10 seconds to get a small amount of energy.  Then you add all of the energy values together and then take that total energy over 240 seconds and then divide by 15 to "spread it out" over one hour.  Then you take that associated average power and convert it into equivalent amp-hours at the nominal lithium-ion battery voltage of 3.6 to 3.8 volts, take your pick.

I think a straight line might be too much simplification.  If your volts and current decay in a straight line, then when you multiply the two together you do not get a straight line anymore.  So the average is probably less than you are thinking.

MileHigh

#### jbignes5

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1281
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #196 on: December 09, 2015, 12:34:35 AM »
It does make a difference if the device is not made to a standard and done in a real production way. It was an off the cuff test device that was not perfected like the already established and tested device to which he was comparing it to. It makes a huge difference to the quality of the material like separators and electrolyte like he said. Because of the water it has a terrible voltage cap. Meaning off gassing of the water as it gets electrolyzed in the process. Thats a big limitation and is the very reason they used non aqueous electrolyte in the li-ion battery. This limits the charging ability of the plates and due to the amount of substance be so great it limits the charge it can hold.

Again pay no attention to the link about the differences of li ion batteries and Caps. Seeing that it is clear what those differences are it does make a huge difference and a big difference as well.

See you rely on your cronies to do everything for you not one bit was done by you and this is my point. You are not a doer and certainly not an experimenter. You just like bashing others until they capitulate. saying some really awful stuff about people when you know nothing about them. You fling put down after put down instead of doing the work. I mean you couldn't even do the calculation yourself, how nice.

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #197 on: December 09, 2015, 01:13:50 AM »
Jbignes5 I stand by everything I say and you are a fool for ignoring the obvious - RMS is making an almost-beyond-belief mistake of not accounting for the output voltage of his device when making an energy measurement.  And don't you try to impugn my character.  You are just bashing me because you know that I am right and you can't admit it.  You are no better than the long list of free energy fakers that are trying to sucker money from people by making false claims.  Ask yourself how small struggling tech companies raise new funds.  It's a rhetorical question for you to ponder.

#### jbignes5

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1281
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #198 on: December 09, 2015, 03:39:32 AM »

You couldn't even do the math. I mean really? You had to get someone else to do it for you. Really? What a joke. I'm not ignoring the obvious. Anyways how do you know if it was wrong if you didn't have the math right there? Ahh thats the caveat.

Listen MH I will Tell you again like I told you before. Treating others with respect will get you a lot further then the way you bash people. What you have said right in your last statement is exactly my point! Prove that I'm a faker. Prove that I have scammed anyone out of money. You can't and I win again. Again you have shown your true colors and I don't reward indignant people with apologies. You bash and you fake your way through everything. I mean refer to my first statement here. This proves you are the sham, you are the faker and since you hide behind the great name of MILEHIGH you are the scammer. So high you head is swooning with logical fallacies and faking the ability to produce any work at all. Not one thing. Not even a patent. NOTHING, but drivel regurgitated formulas not knowing that your version of energy is invented and only a response and not the initiator. Someone makes a simple mistake and it is the end of the world. The end of your world. Sorry but new technology is here. It is being developed without your input and yes even if there are simple mistakes it doesn't invalidate the work being done.

Yes the video was about measurements which he admits were not scientific or exact right from the beginning. But the whole point to his videos is to watch them all from the beginning to know his methodology and inspiration to do and not armchair discovery. The main part was to show how simple he could make the caps and goes through that process but my guess is that the whole process is invalid because he made one little mistake. By the way his super capacitor is the same as the li ion cap I showed many times just with more natural materials and less poisonous chemicals. Obviously that doesn't make a difference to you. So when he comes out with his stuff I am sure you will think he is scamming people and not buy his device to store energy. You will cut your nose off to spite your face because maybe he made one little mistake, wow. But somehow is smarter then you who didn't come up with his ideas.

Your so ignorant of the way you come off to people. I mean really your form is sub par and so irritating to most that they just give up on this forum. You are effectively driving people away from this forum and reducing our chance to rescue this planet from the likes of you, who would rather go with poisonous materials in all the products we produce and stale old current drinking electronics. I bet you have a stake in the energy field. You must have a stake in the energy field and this forum is your way to keep value in a technology that is not sustainable in the least but you are heavily invested in. You tout that real starting businesses are loosing funding to scammers and free energy fakes and while I think there is a bit of truth to that "A BIT" you say it to garner support for your poor attitude with people on this forum. A comment was said about you trying to use more diplomacy but there is no such thing with you. If it says free it has to be a scam right? Yet the sun continues to shine and the trees continue to grow and stars continue to twinkle all for free. Our views are changing in the field of energy, get used to that. There is a shift away from current twords the potential that runs it all.

My hope for you is that you learn there is a better way to deal with people ands not all people are trying to scam others. Some actually want to help others get into this field into all of the fields and treating those people like they have no right to dignity while doing so is teaching exactly what the establishment wants you to do. Ignore everything no matter if there is a valid device or not. And thats what you do. You don't get paid by the "man" You are the "MAN". You are the reason we all are here searching for some path out of this hell you have created and are profiting on. Most people just want to live. Not to be worrying about how to feed their families or how to pay for energy. I mean if everyone had a stream behind their house who would need you? Who would be reliant on you to tell them the rules and where they could go and what they could do. You are the reason we are dying as a world. You shun the very thing that could save us all because you are living off everyone else and your cronies are doing the same. Even if this forum was the reason for you being here, why would you waste the time or effort to blow a fuse in your nut? Why would you be that interested in something you declare is a scam? Why bother at all? It's called self interest and the only self interest that will drive some one like you is a monetary fervor.

I also hope you understand why I pushed like I did. It was to show others of your intentions and the length you will go both in insults and eluding to crimes that have not been committed and that is what motivates others to fight with you. Your attitude to others is not helping in the least and maybe just maybe you would see that now. But I highly doubt you would self reflect in such a way. It would mean you need to reasses your tactics and change your approach to people.

It infuriated you that Robert deleted your posts and came here to shirk his attempt to say hey move on then. You can't do that can you. You can't let others be and let them go down their own road even when it has errors which I know Robert would have corrected himself on eventually. But see you don't know him at all and didn't take one second to try to know what he is and what he knows and what his channel is about.

#### Nink

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 393
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #199 on: December 09, 2015, 03:41:07 AM »
I did not count the clock down to zero as I really do not know what happens.  I decided to  just extrapolation his previous results (he was losing .01V and 1mA every 10 seconds just before he disconnected the clock so the best I think we can do is continue with this without additional data.  That dropped amps down to zero after 300 seconds. So this gives the EESD an extra 1095 joules per cell (avg 3.65 joules for 300 seconds).

That gives him 19752+1095=20847 Joules per cell. so the Li-Ion at 576000/20847 is still 27.6 * more power so approx 28 EESD Cells per Li-Ion Cell or 26*28-26=back to additional 702 cells.

The only way I can think to award more power is if he charged the EESD for longer.  I am not sure why he charged it for 3 minutes maybe a charge for 6 minutes will give him twice the amount of power so he only needs half that number of cells (I don't know).

I think the best thing at this point is for RMS to do is
1) Build an EESD with the same weight as the 3.6v 1150mAh Li-Ion Battery
2) charge the EESD to max power (as long as it takes)
3) Let the EESD run down to zero with a known load and record amps,  volts and time.  (if it takes 2 hours that is fine just time laps every 30 seconds )
4) Repeat the same experiment with the Li-Ion Battery.

I don't think there is any point in measuring a single cell it is not accurate enough.  If RMS can get more Watt Hours from his cell of the same weight we can easily do the math.

#### jbignes5

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1281
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #200 on: December 09, 2015, 04:01:38 AM »
I did not count the clock down to zero as I really do not know what happens.  I decided to  just extrapolation his previous results (he was losing .01V and 1mA every 10 seconds just before he disconnected the clock so the best I think we can do is continue with this without additional data.  That dropped amps down to zero after 300 seconds. So this gives the EESD an extra 1095 joules per cell (avg 3.65 joules for 300 seconds).

That gives him 19752+1095=20847 Joules per cell. so the Li-Ion at 576000/20847 is still 27.6 * more power so approx 28 EESD Cells per Li-Ion Cell or 26*28-26=back to additional 702 cells.

The only way I can think to award more power is if he charged the EESD for longer.  I am not sure why he charged it for 3 minutes maybe a charge for 6 minutes will give him twice the amount of power so he only needs half that number of cells (I don't know).

I think the best thing at this point is for RMS to do is
1) Build an EESD with the same weight as the 3.6v 1150mAh Li-Ion Battery
2) charge the EESD to max power (as long as it takes)
3) Let the EESD run down to zero with a known load and record amps,  volts and time.  (if it takes 2 hours that is fine just time laps every 30 seconds )
4) Repeat the same experiment with the Li-Ion Battery.

I don't think there is any point in measuring a single cell it is not accurate enough.  If RMS can get more Watt Hours from his cell of the same weight we can easily do the math.

I agree but he has done that already, well the company that he sold the tech to did. He was just doing this to get the word out and a subject to teach people about the excitement of experimenting. It wasn't a class to figure out the correct method to determine the charge since he didn't have a full cap to compare fairly.

If you will I have another video that explains his reasoning for doing his videos and yes that means this video too.

Here is a good video of the subject of super caps:

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #201 on: December 09, 2015, 04:19:31 AM »
Jbignes5:

Who are you to demand that I jump through hoops for you and make useless measurements when there is no point to doing that?  You came here in a huff and needed to burn off a lot of negative energy.  Do you feel better now?  Technically, all you really did was make yourself look like a fool.  Get your act together and stop this fantasy-land denial of the facts.

You stop impugning my character right now.  I said RMS made a huge blunder, a gaffe, an outrageous error, because it was an outrageous error.  If you don't like it, tough luck for you, some strong words are perfectly justified in this extreme case.  I will repeat to you:  Stop impugning my character.

I was doing RMS a favour letting him know about his error.  If he had any sense, he would have removed the clip and done a new one.  Do you know the famous story of the TED Talk where they let this Rodin coil guy come and give his spiel?  People were very angry about that and this second-tier TED Talk group got a lot of heat for letting some unknown guy get up on stage and spout off junk.  The TED Talk organization had to review its policies before permitting people give a talk, it was a big scandal.  Well, if RMS went to a seminar or annual meeting of developers of advanced capacitor and battery technologies and presented the data that he shows in that clip, then his reputation among his peers would be destroyed and he might even get laughed and booed off the stage.  It's time for you to wake up and stop being a belligerent ass about the most basic electronic concepts that nobody would question.  Really, stop it now and stop making a complete fool of yourself about these basic technical matters.

You are going to have to live in the real world because there is no escape from the real world.  What I said is true and no tantrums from you and no attacks from you on my character will change anything.  Look at the end of RMS's clip where he glibly states that his compounds outperform the compounds in a lithium-ion battery and realize that the truth is that he has not proved that in his clip.  Rather, he made a mockery of his work in that clip by completely failing to make a credible energy measurement.  His peers in the research sector would be completely aghast.  No nonsensical rebuttals from you - it's absolutely true.

There are many players in the realm of researching new capacitor and battery technologies.  RMS is just one of many, and his credibility has taken a hit by that clip.  I would love to see this stuff reach production and you calling me the "MAN" is just more nonsensical foolishness from you.

Gather your wits together because your big "energy burn" in all your postings was futile and nonsensical.  Nothing has changed, and RMS has presented junk data.  Science and engineering mean something real, and crazy tirades and nonsensical technical gibberish from the likes of you change nothing.

MileHigh

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #202 on: December 09, 2015, 04:59:03 AM »
I did not count the clock down to zero as I really do not know what happens.  I decided to  just extrapolation his previous results (he was losing .01V and 1mA every 10 seconds just before he disconnected the clock so the best I think we can do is continue with this without additional data.  That dropped amps down to zero after 300 seconds. So this gives the EESD an extra 1095 joules per cell (avg 3.65 joules for 300 seconds).

That gives him 19752+1095=20847 Joules per cell. so the Li-Ion at 576000/20847 is still 27.6 * more power so approx 28 EESD Cells per Li-Ion Cell or 26*28-26=back to additional 702 cells.

The only way I can think to award more power is if he charged the EESD for longer.  I am not sure why he charged it for 3 minutes maybe a charge for 6 minutes will give him twice the amount of power so he only needs half that number of cells (I don't know).

I think the best thing at this point is for RMS to do is
1) Build an EESD with the same weight as the 3.6v 1150mAh Li-Ion Battery
2) charge the EESD to max power (as long as it takes)
3) Let the EESD run down to zero with a known load and record amps,  volts and time.  (if it takes 2 hours that is fine just time laps every 30 seconds )
4) Repeat the same experiment with the Li-Ion Battery.

I don't think there is any point in measuring a single cell it is not accurate enough.  If RMS can get more Watt Hours from his cell of the same weight we can easily do the math.

I will just share a few thoughts but I am just about done with this topic.

RMS opened up the lithium cell.  Instead of taking scrapings from just one layer, he could very easily have scraped say five layers of both reagents and then weighed the whole thing on one piece of paper.  Then he could have done the same thing for his own reagents.  Put scrapings from five sets of reagents onto a single piece of paper and weighed them.  His error tolerance for his mass measurements would have gone from say +/-25% to perhaps +/-3%.

I don't see any real issues in only measuring one planar cell.  You can see in the buildup of the lithium-ion cell that each layer is approximately the same, so assuming one of 13 layers will have the 1/13th the amount of ampere-hours @3.8V is perfectly reasonable.  The real problem is the accuracy of the mass measurement which I addressed above.

Then I think it would be perfectly reasonable for RMS to measure the energy storage in only a single planar cell like he shows in his clip.  There is obviously the law of diminishing returns the longer he takes his measurement, so what's the difference in going say 480 seconds instead of 240 seconds?  Beyond that, there has to be a reasonable cut-off voltage anyways.  If the voltage is always decreasing, then an "RMS battery" would have to have a small boost converter built into it and the input voltage to the boost converter can only go so low.

So, with more accurate mass measurements (a trivial amount of extra work) and a longer discharge time (but not too much longer) and actually making the proper energy measurement then you would have some decent data.

No, I don't believe that charging his cell longer would put more energy into it.  Presumably the cell was fully charged for his "failed impressive test."  On the other hand, RMS makes a strange comment that a better electrolyte would have his cell produce a higher voltage and he seems to be strongly implying more energy output.  I would question that, presumably the chemical compounds have a finite amount of energy in them and if you are outputting at a higher voltage then for the same current you draw that much faster from your energy store.

It would not be too difficult to redo the clip properly.  The current clip can be analyzed for the amount of energy in his cell but the large error margin in his mass measurements takes away from the results.

I will just repeat that my gut feel is that his recipe does not shine way above the numbers for a lithium-ion cell.  It apears like the error margins in the first clip could easily push the data such that the RMS cell under-performs compared to a lithium-ion cell.   Plus the lithium-ion cell is manufacturable and like you said, the masses of the other components of the battery are to be determined.  Not to mention the number of charging cycles performance, storage life, temperature stability, internal impedance characteristic, manufacturability, and so on.  Who knows how many millions(?) of dollars it takes to go from a lab experiment to a shipping product.

MileHigh

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #203 on: December 09, 2015, 10:58:52 PM »
I attached a response to RMS, presumably it is invisible to all except myself and RMS.

I just checked and five minutes after the posting and he won't even let me see my own post.  Of course when I am on a cookie-free browser I can't see anything that I posted.

93:  You can act as crazy as you want without attacking people on this forum.  You keep on attacking people then the users on this forum will start flagging your postings and start to complain about you to Stefan.  Then you will end up with an iPad and nowhere to go.

#### tinman

• Hero Member
• Posts: 5363
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #204 on: December 10, 2015, 12:22:54 AM »
MH detail is bias ! Forget MH ! He lives on the brain power of others to sucking up all your energy is what his true intention is ! A  vampire of the creative mind and free will ................................................................................... ! He needs mental help ! In other words he is a nutter so why bother with what he says ? The idiot in him rules his life ! He is a real  fruit and nut job a one side coin that has no worth in experimental physics ...

If you want a free energy device with no moving parts no high voltage simple to make cheep safe than you need an electron propagator 1 amp in 10 amp out at any volts you like ! And that is a small one .. If you want the next version a self generator its a little bit more complex but very real and simple to make ... MH is not interested in the advancement of free will or new logics or technology ! He only lives to argue with people and will seek to constantly attack everything that works and he demonically abuses people because he is a very sick man !

Lets move on to infinity generators and never give MH the secrets of it ! Just ignore him !

Stop talking,and start showing.
Dose put up or shut up mean anything to you ?.

#### jbignes5

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1281
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #205 on: December 10, 2015, 05:29:16 PM »
Ok Let me show you how i see this happening and what is being done.

Taking all the "strange things" out of this video like aliens listen to his talk. Listen how this man is taking on the "MAN".

The old guard is falling and no amount of posts here is gonna save it. The truth is out there and you only need to open your eyes and look at the Proof..

Now I'm not advocating all of his subject matter but the part about the "man" is very telling, about posters with 6k posts, who work too hard and has an agenda motivating that superior egotistical will to work so hard to invalidate this field. You indoctrinate others but saying "See, they made a mistake and we made them look like a fool.". How droll your life must be, to be so into your click that you miss the important aim of communities like this. And yes even the very creative ones. If someone is committing a crime then yes by all means take care of that situation. But if nothing other then it is dream, think bigger, Love your fellow human, treat others with dignity, and for god sakes let us go into the realm of figuring out how to live better and be better able to care for each other. Some of us are here just for that reason. Not for making tons of worthless cash but for the betterment of Human kind.

You are the kind of being we need to weed out of our community of investigators. You say you think this is a scam type atmosphere. Fine! Move along and let the buyer beware. No amount of your neo-natzism is gonna dissuade us from working in this field.

Attacking others for the simple fact that they tried to sensationalize their work in a particular field or may have an error in their math is a bit gestapo like don't you think? Your rep MH has been tarnished. Not by me or anyone else. It has been tarnished by your own and your cronies actions. Live with it, admit it, and for gods sake get off the soap box. Grow up you school playground bully. Get over it. Super caps are real. And the ones that use graphite are far superior to even batteries when you take into account the shortness of charging times and the now equal capacity. Not to mention the cycle life. Mr. Smith is a pioneer and a very smart chap.

So how do we change the world then smart "man". How do we go about evolving our society into a caring loving world to live in? How do we repair this broken world we live in today? How do we go forward, instead of suspending time like we have for the past 120 years by thinking why bother thinking at all in this field? Why bother looking for the free lunch? Why bother post 6k messages of blather about crossing the t's and dotting the I's? Why waste the effort unless there is a payout for you and your ilk? Why?

If it means we must hear things like that I have shown in this video then we must listen and validate that real events, that most of our elected officials want to know if it is real, then so be it. We are asking the questions and getting some real disturbing information back that is REAL proof there is an agenda and how to handle that knowledge. We are forming a living community that will address you and your kind.

I mean really 6k posts and all you do is fling insults and innuendos left and right to disparage people to search for the truth and use it to live better. You deny people the simple right of human dignity and trash them egotistically and mentally. The abuse here is not from well meaning people trying to inspire others to look for better ways, it is from the ones trying to squash others in an attempt to cover up the lies. And yes some of those lies are in the field of energy. You squashed Tesla and anyone who dared go outside your box and now some very highly respected scientists who will not back down are squashing you back by showing the lies and getting us back to advancing as an world entity trying to survive this hell you keep pushing on us. We will not back down and you will not win. Period.

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #206 on: December 10, 2015, 10:18:40 PM »
http://money.cnn.com/2015/11/29/news/economy/bill-gates-breakthrough-energy-coalition/

Bill Gates has pulled together a multinational band of investors to put billions into clean energy.

The Microsoft co-founder and philanthropist announced his latest endeavor, the Breakthrough Energy Coalition, at the climate change summit in Paris.

"We need to bring the cost premium for being clean down," Gates said Monday in an interview with CNN's New Day. "You need the innovation so that the cost of clean is lower than the coal based energy generation."

Lowering the cost of clean energy to make it competitive with fossil fuels is the best way to get poor countries to make the switch without sacrificing economic growth, Gates said. Clean energy can make air conditioning, refrigerators, stoves and fertilizer more affordable for poor people.

"All these things that enable to modern lifestyle are very energy intensive," he said, noting that five years from now, "I see the price of energy actually being lower than today, and that's for clean energy."

The new Gates fund will be fed by a group that spans more than two dozen public and private entities -- including national governments, billionaire philanthropists, investment fund managers and tech CEOs.

"The renewable technologies we have today, like wind and solar, have made a lot of progress and could be one path to a zero-carbon energy future. But given the scale of the challenge, we need to be exploring many different paths -- and that means we also need to invent new approaches," Gates said in a statement.

Among the list of backers are Alibaba (BABA, Tech30) CEO Jack Ma, Mark Zuckerberg of Facebook (FB, Tech30), Meg Whitman of HP (HP) and Virgin (VA) Group's Richard Branson.

More than a dozen governments have also committed to double their spending on carbon-free energy development over the next five years in a complementary effort dubbed "Mission Innovation."

Twenty countries -- including the U.S., China and India -- have signed the pledge, which was announced in Paris alongside the Gates initiative.

President Obama called the Gates effort a "groundbreaking new public-private initiative."

According to government data, the U.S. spent about \$5 billion on energy R&D in 2013, compared to \$31 billion on health care research and nearly \$70 billion on defense research.

"Private companies will ultimately develop these energy breakthroughs, but their work will rely on the kind of basic research that only governments can fund," Gates added.

Related: Climate change will bring deadly heat to the Middle East

There is no fund raising goal for private investors in the Gates initiative. But the fund represents billions in money to seed promising ideas in large-scale clean energy production.

The fund says it will invest broadly and focus on five key areas: electricity generation and storage, transportation, industrial uses, agriculture and projects that make energy systems more efficient.

For example, Gates says more research is needed in new kinds of batteries -- "flow batteries" -- that he says hold more promise than current battery technology.

According to Gates, the goal is to spur new clean energy tech while combating climate change by "keeping global temperatures from rising more than 2 degrees."

Reducing global reliance on fossil fuels also holds the potential for massive economic benefits, Gates added.

"It would help millions more people escape poverty and become more self-sufficient," Gates wrote. "And it would stabilize energy prices, which will have an even bigger impact on the global economy as more people come to rely on energy in their daily lives."

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #207 on: December 10, 2015, 10:21:48 PM »
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/28/us/politics/bill-gates-expected-to-create-billion-dollar-fund-for-clean-energy.html

Bill Gates Expected to Create Billion-Dollar Fund for Clean Energy

WASHINGTON — Bill Gates will announce the creation of a multibillion-dollar clean energy fund on Monday at the opening of a Paris summit meeting intended to forge a global accord to cut planet-warming emissions, according to people with knowledge of the plans.

The fund, which one of the people described as the largest such effort in history, is meant to pay for research and development of new clean-energy technologies. It will include contributions from other billionaires and philanthropies, as well as a commitment by the United States and other participating nations to double their budget for clean energy research and development, according to the people with knowledge of the plans, who asked not to be identified because they were not authorized to discuss the fund.

The announcement of the fund, which has the joint backing of the governments of the United States, China, India and other countries, the people said, is intended to give momentum to the two-week Paris climate talks.

Negotiators hope to strike a deal committing every nation to enacting policies to reduce fossil fuel emissions. Mr. Gates, co-founder of Microsoft, will join more than 100 world leaders, including President Obama, in Paris on Monday to begin the talks.

If successful, the Paris meeting could spur a fundamental shift away from the use of oil, coal and gas to the use of renewable energy sources such as wind and solar power. But that transition would require major breakthroughs in technology and huge infrastructure investments by governments and industry.

Where that money would come from has been a question leading up to the Paris talks. Developing countries like India, the third-largest fossil fuel polluter, have pushed for commitments by developed nations to pay for their energy transition, either through direct government spending or through inexpensive access to new technology.

India has emerged as a pivotal player in the Paris talks. The announcement by Mr. Gates appears intended to help secure India’s support of a deal.

As secretary of state, Hillary Rodham Clinton pledged that developed countries would send \$100 billion annually to poor countries by 2020 to help them pay for the energy transition. Indian officials have demanded that the Paris deal lock in language that the money would come from public funds — a dealbreaker for rich countries.

This summer, Mr. Gates pledged to spend \$1 billion of his personal fortune on researching and deploying clean energy technology, but the people with knowledge of his plans said the new fund would include larger commitments.

In a blog post in July, Mr. Gates wrote: “If we create the right environment for innovation, we can accelerate the pace of progress, develop and deploy new solutions, and eventually provide everyone with reliable, affordable energy that is carbon free. We can avoid the worst climate-change scenarios while also lifting people out of poverty, growing food more efficiently and saving lives by reducing pollution.”

Mr. Gates met with Prime Minister Narendra Modi of India in September on the sidelines of the United Nations General Assembly meeting in New York. In a June meeting in Paris, Mr. Gates told President François Hollande of France that the Paris deal should include robust provisions on clean energy research and development.

“Bill’s been making that point for years, and he’s going to make it more emphatically in Paris,” said Hal Harvey, chief of Energy Innovation, an energy consultancy. Mr. Harvey noted that at the core of the emerging Paris agreement are plans and pledges already put forth by more than 170 countries detailing how they will reduce emissions.

“If you tote up the plans, you see a very significant demand signal, and Bill wants to see that we meet that cheaply,” he said.

#### MileHigh

• Hero Member
• Posts: 7600
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #208 on: December 10, 2015, 10:31:09 PM »
So Jbignes5, do you think the MIB death squads are going to go after Bill Gates and kill him?

You are still talking like a complete fool and the only attacker around here is YOU.  It's time for you to shut your trap about me and deal with the issues as presented in the thread.  You can barely admit that a man making batteries and capacitors seemingly can't measure the energy in his own batteries and refuses to measure the value of his own capacitors.  That is an an issue whether you damn well like it or not.

Quote
You deny people the simple right of human dignity and trash them egotistically and mentally.

You stop this garbage talk right now.

At 22:34 in the Robert Murray Smith clip he says, "We're still knocking the socks off lithium batteries, it's just ridiculous!"

Ironically enough, it is indeed ridiculous because his measurements and associated data are pure junk, and any electronic technician or free energy hobbyist that plays with batteries or any engineer should see this in real time as they are watching the clip.  On top of that, a preliminary analysis of the real data shows that there is a distinct possibility that he does not outperform lithium-ion batteries like he claims in the clip.  Jaws would drop if he presented that data in that clip at a conference.

#### MagnaProp

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 419
##### Re: A Perspective On The B Type EESD - Robert Murray-Smith - Any issues?
« Reply #209 on: December 10, 2015, 11:12:39 PM »
...Bill Gates has pulled together a multinational band of investors to put billions into clean energy....
He also holds patents for cooling our oceans. Sorry but the billionair club doesn't get involved unless there is gobs of \$ to be made. That's how they become billionaires in the first place. As energy becomes cheaper and easier to obtain, human consumption of said energy only goes up as well making any net benefit to the environment be zero. New energy solutions with no breeding control is a waster of energy, pun intended.