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## News announcements and other topics => News => Topic started by: bikelight on October 02, 2015, 02:53:16 AM

Title: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on October 02, 2015, 02:53:16 AM
Place a magnet ball or disc on a narrow triangle magnetic metal sheet (such as iron/steel), the magnet will rolling from sharp point to wide end.  Length of the sheet, the magnet will rolling on.

A simple way to move object from A to B without any energy.   I am thinking if the magnet is made of superconduct-coil, it may rolling very long distance, but I unable to test it.

Power of this device is decided by:
1.  How strong the magnet force.
2.  Angle of the sharp point of triangle sheet.
3.  Length of sheet.
4.  Thickness of the sheet.

Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on October 03, 2015, 02:13:07 AM

The narrow triangle sheet not only can be made as a stright line, also can be made as bending line or circle line.  The magnet will rolling along the line.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: Paul-R on October 03, 2015, 02:57:57 PM
Where are the magnetic poles of your two magnets?
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: DreamThinkBuild on October 03, 2015, 07:17:44 PM
Hi Bikelight,

Thank you for sharing.

The example you show of going over broken sections is what caught my eye.

If it can jump the gaps it might be possible to create a slight curve at the end of one strip and overlap it with start of the next strip.

I attached some pictures of ideas for testing or inspiring a new design.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 03, 2015, 07:55:07 PM
Very nice video.  This is like an inverted/reversed V-gate.  I have not seen this before.  Well done.

Bill
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on October 04, 2015, 03:00:51 AM
Hi

Thanks for everone and suggestions.

1.  I cannot tell where is a pole of the magnet when magnet is rolling.  If it is a ball magnet,  it will self-spinning (right or left turning all working.)

2.  To make it continues rolling, the main problem is how to release  the last big metal piece from the magnet and let the magnet starts a new round.

3.  I am thinking about to test the system using a super-conduct coil (as a super powered magnet ball).  If a magnet's force is very stronge,  the narrow triangle sheet can be extended very long,  for example 100 meters or more.  then it can be used to push object from A to B.  But I do not have the equipment to do this test.

I also attached another picture of possible shape of the narrow triangle sheet.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: SoManyWires on October 04, 2015, 03:55:16 AM
Hi

Thanks for everone and suggestions.

1.  I cannot tell where is a pole of the magnet when magnet is rolling.  If it is a ball magnet,  it will self-spinning (right or left turning all working.)

2.  To make it continues rolling, the main problem is how to release  the last big metal piece from the magnet and let the magnet starts a new round.

3.  I am thinking about to test the system using a super-conduct coil (as a super powered magnet ball).  If a magnet's force is very stronge,  the narrow triangle sheet can be extended very long,  for example 100 meters or more.  then it can be used to push object from A to B.  But I do not have the equipment to do this test.

I also attached another picture of possible shape of the narrow triangle sheet.

that is very interesting.

the magnet running off towards a greater metal surface area.

ya, that is a good idea seeing how long of distance can be achieved for the magnet to travel.
maybe the difference in the ramps diameter can be as gradient as possible to run a distance of 100 meters
though that does seem like its asking alot, could it do 2 meters?

the metal ramp also should be as flat as possible especially at the starting point,
if you have a laser pointer and a level,
or just roll a bearing on the floor to find out how correct to being a flat level surface there is to work with before fixing the ramp into place for testing.
also the other good suggestion mentioned above by someone else,
with the overlapping ramps, being that the greater metal surface tapers off in place of the next oncoming ramp with the magnet kept on a proper flat surface above the ramps.

congrats on the cool contact free bicycle lighting system too!

all the best
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 04, 2015, 06:22:18 PM
Well, I tried out my neo spheres on a pair of large tweezers, which was the only metal shaped as required available and...
the spheres jump right on up to the wide part...traveling about 3" in my case and also, spinning as it moves just like in his video.

I think I understand why it moves toward the thicker/wider metal but, I have no explanation for why the neo spheres spin like they do?
I suppose I could mark the pole orientation on my spheres and try launching them facing differently at the start and see if they still always spin?

This is a lot of fun to watch while experimenting.  So simple yet...something very complex is happening here I am sure.

Bill
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on October 07, 2015, 02:38:51 AM
yes,  I also hop expert in this field can explain why the ball magnet is self-spinning ans sametime rollling towards wide end.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: Nink on October 07, 2015, 04:43:54 AM
https://youtu.be/zqG-TL0WnjE?t=49
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on October 18, 2015, 03:19:10 AM
A simple generator based on this device.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: Pirate88179 on October 19, 2015, 12:14:47 AM
Nice design but, don't forget that if there is a load on that coil, Lenz will kick in.  It would have to be tested to see if Lenz creates more drag than the magnets can handle.  At some point, I am guessing that they will cancel each other out and stop the ball.

That is just a guess on my part as I have not tried this.

Bill
Title: Make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, continuously run design.
Post by: bikelight on November 28, 2015, 01:49:11 AM
When manget ball B in place B1 (dashed line), magnet ball cover sensor P, optical delay switch acts to cut off power of coil C, magnet ball will drop into groove H by gravity force, magnet ball will be back to original place for next run. The optical delay switch is controlled by a timer T, timer T will make sure coil's power cut off for few seconds, let magnet ball has enough time to drop and goes back to original place. then power coil again for next run.

Variable resistor R adjust current of coil to make sure coil has enough power to attract magnet ball B into B1 place.

Q and Q1 will generate electricity when magnet ball passes to charge battery (this battery is same battery to power coil C), so all system is self-supplied.

To make system works better, the last iron piece of triangle sheet A also can be made as a electrical magnet.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: SoManyWires on November 28, 2015, 02:09:38 AM
impressive considerations you've made since first noticing the ramp effect. well done.

providing the loop event can remain on its path through any points of resistance, it does appear to be taking useful advantage of gravity.
at least in optimistic theory for now.

just thinking a few ideas about this concept you are developing, and wondering if it might also work by adding peizo collectors at collision points to also collect energy without lenz concerns.

and also does it have to be that shape of ramp structure, could the loop be formed into a more radial path of travel.

thanx for sharing
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: sm0ky2 on November 28, 2015, 07:26:33 PM
Nice design but, don't forget that if there is a load on that coil, Lenz will kick in.
It would have to be tested to see if Lenz creates more drag than the magnets can handle.
At some point, I am guessing that they will cancel each other out and stop the ball.

That is just a guess on my part as I have not tried this.

Bill

Yes, there is a theoretical point where the two forces will cancel each other out.
But this is a counter balance to acceleration, which increases with acceleration.
So, the ball will not actually stop, but rather be restricted to a maximum acceleration.
As a factor of the diameter times the length of wire, over the length of the coil, times a materials property of the metal.

the magnetic attraction onto and off of the plate are said to be equal.
it takes just as much energy to remove the ball from the plate, as was acquired when the ball was attracted.
Therefore: the work function as the ball translates across the surface of the triangle,
as a result of varying paramagnetic potential - may be "free energy".
the coil may be able to harness some part of that energy
I say "may", because at the point where you place the ball on the triangle, there is less metal
the ball is more strongly attracted to the larger surface area after it moves.
that increase in attraction may offset the work function energy we are trying to harness.

only tests will tell
now we just need a way to "reset the ball".

the above design, is creative, however the mechanisms involved would require more energy than is generated by the coil.
if we could somehow harness the energy when the ball was attracted to the metal, then re-use that to remove the ball from the metal
then we could potentially have some left over. but the energy generated by one pass through a coil,
is much smaller than the energy required to remove the magnet from the steel.
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on November 30, 2015, 01:23:01 AM
Hi
Thanks for all replies and thinks.   (Below thinks are not tested).

1.  coil C is made of copper wire and plastic supporter, no any iron metal in it.  A coil if powered by a battery is will act as a magnet, one end of coil  is S or N, which will attract the magnet ball B into B1 position.  When power of coil C is cut off, the coil c is just a copper coil, will not attract magnet ball and release the magnet ball into groove H.   I am not sure this is right or not.  The coil C should use very litter energy to attract magnet ball B because B has own magnetic force.
e
2.  Coil Q and Q1 is for charge battery,  Q and Q1 should not powered by the battery because there is a diode stop power supply from the battery, only when magnet ball B is passing the coil Q and Q1, the battery will be charged.  because the coil Q and Q1 is not powered by the battery, the is no Lenz force to stop or slow down magnet ball B to pass.

Regards
Title: Re: How to make a magnet (ball or disc) rolling a long distance, simple device.
Post by: bikelight on December 10, 2015, 01:26:19 AM
Tested: Placed this system inside coils,  test shows it did generate electricity when the magnet ball passes coils on triangle sheet.  See picture of coils (4 coils, each 2500 turns, 0.14mm copper wire). 15mm magent ball.   The ball is smaller than I used because the diameter tube inside the coils.  So the magnet ball is not travel very far on triangle sheet.

youtube film for Q coil generator is