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Author Topic: Solar Panels  (Read 4352 times)

Offline jingwei3344

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Solar Panels
« on: August 26, 2015, 08:00:48 AM »
I am contemplating putting in solar panels but am surprised at the initial cost. Does anyone have any experiences they can share with regard to cost, suppliers, effectiveness, subsidies etc?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Solar Panels
« on: August 26, 2015, 08:00:48 AM »

Offline SoManyWires

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Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2015, 10:41:59 AM »
I am contemplating putting in solar panels but am surprised at the initial cost. Does anyone have any experiences they can share with regard to cost, suppliers, effectiveness, subsidies etc?

hi, there are several routes you can go with this.
if cheapest price is what you want, then is the option of trying to make your own panels.
that would involve some careful soldering and having the right supplies to properly seal the cells from any form of moisture ingress, regular silicon will not prevent all humidity from getting in, and it must remain clear and not haze.
you would want to have a curing table that vibrates for the panels to remove air bubbles during the curing process.
plus weather proof framing to mount the panels to the house. you would not want to use wood for the framing, unless you have no trouble repainting them because of weathering.
the cheapest way to seal the cells might be to use a proper type of clear UV proof heatsink material that most commercial panel makers use.
there are other sealants instead of using the heatsink material, though they are more expensive.

cells can be bought in stacks off places like ebay, and even cheaper if they are not perfect cells, such as the 85% grade chipped cells.
they still work, though it will not look so storebought with final results.
it is possible to get 5kw of cells for 1k of dollars.
the rest of the cost is framing and sealants, wiring and diodes to prevent the batteries from trying to 'charge' the panel, that would be bad.
(youtube)

most people would rather skip that approach, and just buy properly made panels.
one option is to buy used panels, though that could mean they have already seen much use, sometimes none at all.
25year average rating for the sealants and the cells about.
you would want multicrystaline cells, they can use the sunlight at greater angles away from sunlight than the other types.
and they also can work under a certain ammount of snow coverage, or low lighting conditions.

theres the grid tie inverter cost. and those might need to be professionally installed.

if off the grid, then its batteries.
reconditioning electric forklift batteries is maybe the cheapest for that.
there are new batteries that are being developed that will make solar a much more practical idea that it is already, you might already be aware of that.


there are companies that will install a large sun tracking solar setup in your yard, and they say it will make you 10k dollars or more per year, if you first invest somewhere around 80k upfront.

one could replicate one of those for much less cost.

be aware of any regulations in your area even just for what they allow before diving into the project.

there is fine print in those that could catch you off guard should you have purchased any of the supplies not from your area,
that could affect an installation being approved or not, or being able to qualify for any rebate.
they put too much fine print on these advertised programs.

passive solar is also something to consider.
for rather cheap project costs, the energy savings can be great.
passive solar its nearly limited to heating water or the house when there is useful sun.
there are commercial passive solar products that are not too expensive, if you prefer best results.
passive solar is not that difficult to make DIY. (youtube)
one idea could be just painting one side of some vertical or horizontal blinds black, manually adjusted according to the sun.
that adjustment could be automated with a little more effort.

to qualify for any local subsidies, DIY will have to be avoided, also to not void insurance.




Offline Magluvin

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  • Posts: 5775
Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2015, 02:34:18 AM »
Just cant win, can we. 

But I bet if it were a big company, there wouldnt be a problem such as this one below. :-\

Mags


http://theweek.com/speedreads/574027/homeowners-say-cant-use-solar-panels-because-theyre-powerful

Looking to slash their electric bill, retired couple Ron and Sarah Hall installed solar panels on their Southern California home. Nearly a year later, they haven't saved a dime.
The panels are considered too powerful, NBC Los Angeles reports, and were never turned on. A company called Solar City installed 36 panels on the Hall's Lake Elsinore house for free; they would make their money back by filling out rebates through residential energy conservation programs. SoCal Edison, however, would not let the couple activate their system because it exceeded California's standards for residential energy production. "They're saying that the system that I have will generate 128 percent, that's 28 percent over what they estimated," Ron Hall said.
The problem isn't necessarily the fact that the panels would generate wasted electricity, NBC Los Angeles explains. Instead, the state is concerned that homeowners could sell their excess energy. A SoCal Edison representative said that a homeowner who produces excess solar energy is considered a potential energy retailer, and becomes subject to commercial business regulations. Solar City has removed the panels, and said because of a design flaw, they miscalculated how much energy the Halls needed. The whole experience is one that the family would like to forget. "It's frustrating," Ron Hall said. Catherine Garcia

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2015, 02:34:18 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline SoManyWires

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  • Posts: 205
Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2015, 03:44:59 AM »
Just cant win, can we. 

But I bet if it were a big company, there wouldnt be a problem such as this one below. :-\

Mags


http://theweek.com/speedreads/574027/homeowners-say-cant-use-solar-panels-because-theyre-powerful

Looking to slash their electric bill, retired couple Ron and Sarah Hall installed solar panels on their Southern California home. Nearly a year later, they haven't saved a dime.
The panels are considered too powerful, NBC Los Angeles reports, and were never turned on. A company called Solar City installed 36 panels on the Hall's Lake Elsinore house for free; they would make their money back by filling out rebates through residential energy conservation programs. SoCal Edison, however, would not let the couple activate their system because it exceeded California's standards for residential energy production. "They're saying that the system that I have will generate 128 percent, that's 28 percent over what they estimated," Ron Hall said.
The problem isn't necessarily the fact that the panels would generate wasted electricity, NBC Los Angeles explains. Instead, the state is concerned that homeowners could sell their excess energy. A SoCal Edison representative said that a homeowner who produces excess solar energy is considered a potential energy retailer, and becomes subject to commercial business regulations. Solar City has removed the panels, and said because of a design flaw, they miscalculated how much energy the Halls needed. The whole experience is one that the family would like to forget. "It's frustrating," Ron Hall said. Catherine Garcia

greedy regulation writers somehow still being allowed kickbacks.

the fine print does not seem to be written in favor of the easily taken advantage of average person.

the system is a pathetic insult sometimes.

some electric companies will not allow purchasing of power fed back onto the grid. greedy.

and some electric companies will not allow purchasing of power fed back onto the grid at face cost value. greedy.

and those allowing purchasing, seem to in favor of creating a monopoly of who anyone can goto to purchase the needed equipment.
greedy.


what about all those windmills blanketing the landscapes in some areas as far as the eye can see, why are they not running sometimes even when wind conditions are not close to being dangerous operating conditions? greedy.

those windmills could easily be helping taxpayers to have a much lower electric bill every month, unless they are being manipulated by the intentions of greed.


same with fueling up at the gas stations according to what day of the week it is. greedy.


all this should not be allowed!


sociopaths disagree, they will do anything to make sure its always allowed.


important questions voters should be allowed to ask potential candidates, seem to never be allowed to be heard.

we know why that is.

greed.


Offline Pirate88179

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  • Posts: 8369
Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2015, 05:35:35 AM »
Just cant win, can we. 

But I bet if it were a big company, there wouldnt be a problem such as this one below. :-\

Mags


http://theweek.com/speedreads/574027/homeowners-say-cant-use-solar-panels-because-theyre-powerful

Looking to slash their electric bill, retired couple Ron and Sarah Hall installed solar panels on their Southern California home. Nearly a year later, they haven't saved a dime.
The panels are considered too powerful, NBC Los Angeles reports, and were never turned on. A company called Solar City installed 36 panels on the Hall's Lake Elsinore house for free; they would make their money back by filling out rebates through residential energy conservation programs. SoCal Edison, however, would not let the couple activate their system because it exceeded California's standards for residential energy production. "They're saying that the system that I have will generate 128 percent, that's 28 percent over what they estimated," Ron Hall said.
The problem isn't necessarily the fact that the panels would generate wasted electricity, NBC Los Angeles explains. Instead, the state is concerned that homeowners could sell their excess energy. A SoCal Edison representative said that a homeowner who produces excess solar energy is considered a potential energy retailer, and becomes subject to commercial business regulations. Solar City has removed the panels, and said because of a design flaw, they miscalculated how much energy the Halls needed. The whole experience is one that the family would like to forget. "It's frustrating," Ron Hall said. Catherine Garcia

That is total BS right there and why we should never allow the government, either state or federal, to have this much power over us.  Solar City, I believe, is one of Elon Musk's companies and they have done some great things in advancing solar energy.

Some folks can't even plant a garden in their yard without the EPA jumping all over them.  This crap has to stop.

So, this system made too much power?  Too bad and good for them.  Considering the lack of efficiency of solar and the high upfront costs involved this is a total BS argument.  What are cells now like 16-18% efficient?  Why even work on creating cells that are like 40% efficient if the government will not allow any one to use them?

Sorry, this type of thing really gets to me.  (Can you tell?)

Bill

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2015, 05:35:35 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline Magluvin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5775
Re: Solar Panels
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2015, 06:28:04 AM »
That is total BS right there and why we should never allow the government, either state or federal, to have this much power over us.  Solar City, I believe, is one of Elon Musk's companies and they have done some great things in advancing solar energy.

Some folks can't even plant a garden in their yard without the EPA jumping all over them.  This crap has to stop.

So, this system made too much power?  Too bad and good for them.  Considering the lack of efficiency of solar and the high upfront costs involved this is a total BS argument.  What are cells now like 16-18% efficient?  Why even work on creating cells that are like 40% efficient if the government will not allow any one to use them?

Sorry, this type of thing really gets to me.  (Can you tell?)

Bill

Hey Bill

I hear ya. So just imagine the lengths they would go to to stop a free energy device, other than solar. Solar is just too mainstream to get rid of it completely.

And I agree about if it produces a bit of extra power. So what. Its not 10 times what the might need. The extra percent over 100% gives headroom like an audio amplifier. Probably rarely if ever turn the volume all the way up, but the extra power is there if needed. To design  solar system that only provides a possible 100% of the total household needs is possibly pushing the system to its limits, which is not good either. Id like to see the criteria used to base those 100% assumptions. It just nuts

Mags

 

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