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## Solid States Devices => solid state devices => Topic started by: radiant_one on June 11, 2015, 04:55:42 PM

Title: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 11, 2015, 04:55:42 PM

This is the first video in a series which investigates the possibility of extraction of energy from the ground.

This has been done before by Thomas Henry Moray in the 1920's. The video demonstrates that a bank of 52 white led's can be lit brightly when an earth wire is connected. The power supply registers no change in the current supplied to the circuit whether the load is connected or not.
There is no overunity performance suggested or implied in this video.

Please subscribe to ensure future videos are not missed. Thank you for watching.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 12, 2015, 02:05:14 PM
Hi radiant_one. From the video it looks like the power supply voltage was around 12.2V and the current
was showing as 0.03A. Since the current meter only shows two decimal digits, the 0.03 could be anywhere
from 0.03A to 0.039A. Also those power supply meters are usually not so accurate, but taking those numbers
as shown, and using the minimum value for the current when the meter is showing 0.03 gives:
12.2V x 0.03A = 366mW
Divide 366mW by 52, because you say you have 52 LEDs, and you get 7.04mW available for each LED,
if you had 100% efficiency. In my experience with testing with similar LEDs, they can be quite bright already
when dissipating only roughly a mW or so. They can start to light up already with only very low microamps.
So each LED having up to 7mW available should be a lot of excess power. Even if the efficiency of your driver
circuit is only 50%, you would still have 3.5mW of power available for each LED.

When you connect the earth ground you provide something for the LEDs to work against, which allows them to
light brighter, but the power supply appears to be supplying more than enough power to be lighting all the LEDs
very brightly. LEDs can also light against just a length of wire if you tune to a suitable frequency. Since many LEDs
these days only require a small current to light up, just having a length of wire connected to the other end gives enough
current flow at the right frequencies, due to the resonating of the wire. I have done a lot of experiments along those
lines, and in my experiments I have found that the power is still being drawn from the power supply to light the LEDs,
whether connecting one end of the LEDs to earth ground or a length of wire or not. The earth ground or length of wire
does not seem to add any free power to the arrangement in my own tests. Since many modern LEDs can start to light
already with only very low current going through them in the low microamps range, this can be misleading if you don't
take that into account and also do all the measurements and calculations.

I have been experimenting recently with a circuit along the lines of Lasersaber's 'super joule ringer', and it will
light a few small LEDs with only very low input current from it's supply capacitor, in the range of 30uA or so
at 10V. That is still not over unity however if you calculate everything out and take into account the brightness of
the LEDs, at least in my own tests anyway. This could be misleading to someone if they didn't realize that some modern LEDs
can already be lighting quite noticeably at even only 100uW of power dissipation by the LED. At 1mW of power dissipation many
types of modern LEDs can already be glowing really bright.

All the best...
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: FatBird on June 12, 2015, 03:06:31 PM
@ Void

SUPER nice post that really explains it.

Thanks.                                                                                              .
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: gotoluc on June 12, 2015, 04:19:37 PM
Nice and clean demo video!

Looking forward in seeing the circuit.

Thanks for sharing

Luc
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 14, 2015, 04:02:56 PM

This is the second video in a series which investigates the possibility of extraction of energy from the ground.

This video describes the circuit and tuning demonstrated in video 1. In that video I lit 52 white led's when an earth wire is connected but the power supply registered no change in the current supplied to the circuit whether the load is connected or not.

There is no overunity performance suggested or implied.

Please subscribe to ensure future videos are not missed. Thank you for watching.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: synchro1 on June 14, 2015, 09:32:50 PM
Hi radiant_one. From the video it looks like the power supply voltage was around 12.2V and the current
was showing as 0.03A. Since the current meter only shows two decimal digits, the 0.03 could be anywhere
from 0.03A to 0.039A. Also those power supply meters are usually not so accurate, but taking those numbers
as shown, and using the minimum value for the current when the meter is showing 0.03 gives:
12.2V x 0.03A = 366mW
Divide 366mW by 52, because you say you have 52 LEDs, and you get 7.04mW available for each LED,
if you had 100% efficiency. In my experience with testing with similar LEDs, they can be quite bright already
when dissipating only roughly a mW or so. They can start to light up already with only very low microamps.
So each LED having up to 7mW available should be a lot of excess power. Even if the efficiency of your driver
circuit is only 50%, you would still have 3.5mW of power available for each LED.

When you connect the earth ground you provide something for the LEDs to work against, which allows them to
light brighter, but the power supply appears to be supplying more than enough power to be lighting all the LEDs
very brightly. LEDs can also light against just a length of wire if you tune to a suitable frequency. Since many LEDs
these days only require a small current to light up, just having a length of wire connected to the other end gives enough
current flow at the right frequencies, due to the resonating of the wire. I have done a lot of experiments along those
lines, and in my experiments I have found that the power is still being drawn from the power supply to light the LEDs,
whether connecting one end of the LEDs to earth ground or a length of wire or not. The earth ground or length of wire
does not seem to add any free power to the arrangement in my own tests. Since many modern LEDs can start to light
already with only very low current going through them in the low microamps range, this can be misleading if you don't
take that into account and also do all the measurements and calculations.

I have been experimenting recently with a circuit along the lines of Lasersaber's 'super joule ringer', and it will
light a few small LEDs with only very low input current from it's supply capacitor, in the range of 30uA or so
at 10V. That is still not over unity however if you calculate everything out and take into account the brightness of
the LEDs, at least in my own tests anyway. This could be misleading to someone if they didn't realize that some modern LEDs
can already be lighting quite noticeably at even only 100uW of power dissipation by the LED. At 1mW of power dissipation many
types of modern LEDs can already be glowing really bright.

All the best...

@Void,

How do you explain Dr. Stiffler's 3 coil ground resonant LED illuminator, which lights an LED with no input at all, just the ground?

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 15, 2015, 05:33:22 PM
@Void,
How do you explain Dr. Stiffler's 3 coil ground resonant LED illuminator, which lights an LED with no input at all, just the ground?

Hi synchro1. I have never looked at his stuff in much detail, but in that scenario you have to take
steps to rule out picking up EM fields from your bench equipment's transformers and wiring and wall wiring. I have made
a sensitive blocking oscillator (sensitive joule thief type oscillator) that would oscillate and very slowly charge a super capacitor
just from the 60 Hz AC field energy picked up from my bench equipment's transformers and wiring, even though the bench equipment wasn't
turned on. I confirmed the source of the power being 60 Hz AC by looking at the oscillator signals on my scope.
The sensitive oscillator would fire with a burst of high frequency oscillations at 60Hz sinewave zero crossing points.

I don't know if Dr. Stiffler ever put his circuits into the microwave while it was unplugged or in a metal enclosed box to test, or ran his circuit
while outside and well away from power lines, but that would have been some essential tests in my opinion.
All the best..

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: gotoluc on June 15, 2015, 06:07:50 PM
I agree, if radiant one could make a video with his circuit in a Faraday cage able to output the same amount as without it, then that would be a very good start!

Thanks for sharing

Luc
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 15, 2015, 09:45:28 PM
I agree, if radiant one could make a video with his circuit in a Faraday cage able to output the same amount as without it, then that would be a very good start!

Hi gotoluc. I don't think radiant_one really needs to do that at this point, as I explained in my calculations
above that the input power from his power supply is more than enough to power the 52 LEDs really brightly.
Stefan also commented on radiant_one's video that not seeing much change in the input power draw doesn't
mean that the load is not drawing power from the power supply. Adding the ground wire provides something for the
LEDs to resonate against better, but just adding a long thicker gauge wire that is not grounded will probably
work just as well, or almost as well. I believe that adding the wire adds capacitance to the LED's end connection, which it can
then resonate better against. I have had LEDs lighting with just a short wire attached to one end, but you have to tune to a
suitable frequency. When the LEDs are not in an ideal circuit arrangement to light up brightly, the driver circuit can
still draw about the same power. This has to do with what impedance the driver circuit is seeing. If there is a bad impedance
mismatch, much of the power will dissipate in the driver circuitry and coil windings instead of going into the LEDs. It is a mistake to
assume that because the input power doesn't increase when connecting the ground wire that the extra power is coming
from the ground. My testing with this has shown that the power supply power is where the power is coming from, even when driving a LED
with one end connected to a short wire. You just need to find the right frequency to get the LED and piece of wire resonating half decently.
That doesn't mean that in some special cases you can't get over unity from this type of arrangement, but in my testing anyway the input power
from the driver circuit is what is supplying all the power to the load.
All the best...
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: gotoluc on June 16, 2015, 06:32:38 AM
Thanks Void, I suppose you're right!... I have done similar experiments and also found pulsed circuits with the right parasitic capacitance show similar effects. It's difficult to know which effects is contributing but capacitance tuning is the most likely one.

Thanks for sharing

Luc
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: MasterPlaster on June 16, 2015, 10:15:05 PM
@Void,

How do you explain Dr. Stiffler's 3 coil ground resonant LED illuminator, which lights an LED with no input at all, just the ground?

In the back of my mind this is due to direct excitation of the PN junction and no magic there.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Dave45 on June 17, 2015, 02:05:30 AM
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Dave45 on June 17, 2015, 03:24:51 PM
Any idea's why there is a relation between the alligator clip and L2

Why it effects current draw
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Dave45 on June 21, 2015, 03:38:26 PM
Looking forward to your next vid.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 21, 2015, 05:01:19 PM

This is the third video in a series which investigates the possibility of extraction of energy from the ground.
This video provides more insight into the operation of the circuit detailed in video 1 and addresses some questions raised in this thread. Thanks for the feedback and comments here and on the videos on you tube.

In this video I show temperature measurements for the circuit unearthed and then earthed (with LED's lit).

There is no overunity performance suggested or implied.

Please subscribe to ensure future videos are not missed. Thank you for watching.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Dave45 on June 21, 2015, 05:56:05 PM
Sometimes just the circuit layout can give insight.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 21, 2015, 06:33:47 PM

It has already been mentioned that when you have a poor impedance match from the driver
circuit to a load, that more power can well be dissipated in the driver circuit components such as the
transistor, and also possibly in the coils. With a better impedance match to the load (LEDs), more power is transferred to
the LEDs. The input power may not change very much in either case. Moving the circuit board around or the aligator clip can vary
the impedance match to the LEDs, as does moving your hand at different distances from the circuit and connecting wires
of different lengths to the LED strings end terminal, whether the wire is earth grounded or not. Try connecting a long heavier gauge wire
that is not earth grounded and it will probably have a similar effect, even though it is not earth ground at its far end.

P.S. I have attached a picture of some LEDs lighting from a sinewave signal generator through one wire,
with only a short aligator clip lead wire connected to the other end of the LEDs. The LEDs will light a lot brighter
if I touch the end of the short clip lead with my finger, or if I attach a longer wire. When tuned to the right frequency,
the LEDs and short wire are resonating to some extent, causing a current to flow through the LEDs.
Is it energy from the air, or energy from the signal generator? My tests have shown that the input power from the signal generator
is where all the power appears to be coming from.

All the best...
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 27, 2015, 02:52:39 AM

Apologies everyone - there was an error on the original schematic.

Attached is the corrected circuit diagram. The placement of the diodes on the output is in parallel with LED array. Not in series.
This makes a massive difference because ground energy does not pass through a diode.

I have removed video 2 with circuit diagram and will be reposting a corrected circuit and tuning video 2 this weekend.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 28, 2015, 03:13:24 PM

The video describing the circuit and tuning has the corrected circuit diagram included. Otherwise much the same as before - excepted added a few video overlays to make it clearer.

No overunity performance is suggested or implied.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Hoppy on June 28, 2015, 05:10:24 PM

The video describing the circuit and tuning has the corrected circuit diagram included. Otherwise much the same as before - excepted added a few video overlays to make it clearer.

No overunity performance is suggested or implied.

Do the LED's light without the earth rod and with the LED chain connected directly back to the circuit ground line?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Pirate88179 on June 28, 2015, 07:49:49 PM

Above is my video lighting a 40" floro tube from the ground using no power supply other than the ground.

Above is a smaller 18" tube lit the same way from the ground only.

Above is 200 leds lit from the ground only.  I have since done 400 leds the same way.

Bill
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 28, 2015, 08:05:10 PM
Do the LED's light without the earth rod and with the LED chain connected directly back to the circuit ground line?

I have suggested a couple of times that radiant_one try connecting a long heavier gauge wire that is not grounded
at its far end, in place of his ground wire, but radiant_one seems to have just ignored this suggestion so far. I am pretty sure the LEDs
will still light with just a long ungrounded wire attached in place of the ground wire, although maybe not quite as bright as with the grounded wire.
I think it is all a matter of adding a suitable amount of capacitance to the end of the LEDs for the circuit to resonate against. I guess radiant_one won't try it
because he doesn't really want to put his theory about energy from the ground for his circuit to a test that might indicate otherwise. ;)
All the best...
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on June 29, 2015, 05:10:19 PM

This is video 5 in a series which investigates the possibility of  the extraction of energy from the ground. This video investigates aspects of connecting the circuit (see video 2) to the ground.

The video also demonstrates the suggested use of a heavier wire instead of the earth. The other suggestion to try using the power supply negative as a ground creates a direct DC path which quickly damages the components.

fyi - It appears my access to this forum was recently blocked for an extended period (see attached image). If I stop posting here in the future then such blocking may have become permanent.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Void on June 29, 2015, 06:01:47 PM

This is video 5 in a series which investigates the possibility of  the extraction of energy from the ground. This video investigates aspects of connecting the circuit (see video 2) to the ground.

The video also demonstrates the suggested use of a heavier wire instead of the earth. The other suggestion to try using the power supply negative as a ground creates a direct DC path which quickly damages the components.

fyi - It appears my access to this forum was recently blocked for an extended period (see attached image). If I stop posting here in the future then such blocking may have become permanent.

Hi radiant_one. Don't worry about the permission denied messages from this website. This website has had intermittent issues like that for quite some time.
I was getting the exact same error messages when I tried to connect yesterday. Maybe some administration or maintenance was being
conducted on this website at the time, or the website was just having issues.

Nice video. I would interpret the results a little differently than you, although I am not saying that I think my
interpretation is necessarily all correct, but I have tested with similar setups and based on my measurements the
power being drawn from the supply always appears to account for the amount of power dissipating in the LEDs.

The length of wire you connected in your video was not very long. In my own experiments, the wire gauge doesn't have to
be quite so heavy, but you should extend the virtual ground wire out to a length of about 20 or 30 feet or so to get better
results. I have found that even a 30 or 40 feet or so length of wire rolled up in a roll of about 1 foot diameter will work pretty well
to add a suitable amount of capacitance. As I have shown with my test with two LEDs with one end of the LEDs connected to just a short clip lead,
you can get LEDs to light with very little capacitance attached to them, but connecting to something with higher capacitance
such as a long heavier gauge wire, or a large block of conductive metal, or even when connected to a person's body can
work as well or almost as well as an actual earth ground connection. You may have to adjust the operating frequency to get best results
for a given amount of capacitance attached to the end of the LEDs.

A direct connection to earth ground appears to just provide a higher capacitance than a length of wire or a person's body. Since you are dealing
with an AC signal, as based on my tests there is a degree of resonance occurring, if you put a diode in between the LEDs and your capacitance source
such as a wire or whatever, then it will restrict or reduce the AC resonance occuring between the LED and wire. Resonance is typically an AC phenomenon in regards to
electrical circuits. So there is a different way to interpret what is occurring in the circuit without having to consider energy from the ground.
The fact that the LEDs will light about the same with various types of capacitance added to the end of the LEDs whether earth grounded or not
does seem to indicate that what is happening is not dependent on a direct earth ground connection to gain electrons from the ground or whatever.

All the best...

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: ATOM1 on June 30, 2015, 01:45:35 PM
Its a US GOVERNMENT BACKED FRONT !!! I sent in my unified field oscillator and they sent me an email telling me they had to had it over to there government and now block all my schematics !

WHAT DO WE DO ????

GROUND ENERGY WORKS !!!!

ATOM1
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: alejandroguille on July 08, 2015, 03:29:32 AM
Equal this ?

output coil works like these.

only this works less voltage.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: alejandroguille on July 14, 2015, 04:20:42 AM
?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on July 14, 2015, 09:50:12 AM
Equal this ?

output coil works like these.

only this works less voltage.

Thanks for these links. I think the first video is much the same. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gz8GkK1tygQ
It's a shame woopyjump did not pursue this further.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: GeoFusion on July 14, 2015, 08:09:12 PM
Hi there,
This is my experimentation on a Ground Dependent device collecting radiant for the system.
there is so much more to be done on this one, so many variants,
Yet a Inductor can be places in series with the blue coil for amplification.
Simple setup but has a odd yet amazing ways of work but much more has to be Figured out.
Why?
This could be one of the main components of a kapanadze device with spark gap.
the only thing it's missing now is a Ampere Amplifier synced with the pulses of the spark gap.

Take time to watch them all
here are the vids:

vid 1

Vid 2

Vid 3

Enjoy and let me know what you guyz think ;).

Cheerz
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on August 20, 2015, 05:28:46 AM
Hi there,
This is my experimentation on a Ground Dependent device collecting radiant for the system.
there is so much more to be done on this one, so many variants,
Yet a Inductor can be places in series with the blue coil for amplification.
Simple setup but has a odd yet amazing ways of work but much more has to be Figured out.
Why?
This could be one of the main components of a kapanadze device with spark gap.
the only thing it's missing now is a Ampere Amplifier synced with the pulses of the spark gap.

Take time to watch them all
here are the vids:

vid 1

Vid 2

Vid 3

Enjoy and let me know what you guyz think ;).

Cheerz

Thanks for sharing these videos. They were highly relevant to the topic of extracting energy from the ground!

I did a replication of your setup and of course referenced your prior video. See 'Convert HV to mains voltage via water capacitor, double arc and ground wire'

I think it is a concept worth developing further. If anyone has been down this road and knows how to ramp this up please comment.

Until then...no overunity performance is suggested or implied.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: TinselKoala on August 20, 2015, 05:53:50 AM
SIGH....
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: seychelles on August 20, 2015, 07:41:51 AM
great job tinsel great job lol..
;)
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: seychelles on August 20, 2015, 07:44:03 AM
so this lamp is let us say 15w and how much is this circuit consuming in WATS not mambo jumbo..
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: TinselKoala on August 20, 2015, 07:55:59 AM
so this lamp is let us say 15w and how much is this circuit consuming in WATS not mambo jumbo..

More importantly for replicators... is that screwdriver a Phillips, or a PoziDriv?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: gotoluc on August 20, 2015, 10:09:02 AM
More importantly for replicators... is that screwdriver a Phillips, or a PoziDriv?

Looks to be both  ;)

Luc
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: gotoluc on August 20, 2015, 10:44:47 AM
Thanks for sharing these videos. They were highly relevant to the topic of extracting energy from the ground!

I did a replication of your setup and of course referenced your prior video. See 'Convert HV to mains voltage via water capacitor, double arc and ground wire'

I think it is a concept worth developing further. If anyone has been down this road and knows how to ramp this up please comment.

Until then...no overunity performance is suggested or implied.

thanks for sharing your very clear to understand and clean experiment. The water capacitor is a very cool thing!

I would say to properly charge a 12vdc battery your battery charger output voltage would be regulated somewhere around 14.5 to 14.7vdc
So your input power is in the 18.5 Watts range.

I noticed the Ferrite of your Flyback seems to be cracked. Would this not affect the efficiency?

Luc
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 20, 2015, 10:47:35 AM
Radiant one, there is an old video with Dollard and some other legends, who discovered an attracting force from a light globe that was lit by a tesla coil receiver. They placed a paper card on a string near the lamp, and found that it was attracted to the lamp, although there was no electrostatic charge on the lamp. How about you dangle something like that near the lamp and the water capacitor to see if that shockwave you felt does something to the paper. Good video!
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 20, 2015, 01:42:48 PM
Here is the video, start watching at 20:00 to see the 'force' I'm talking about.  It uses a piece of copper foil, not paper as I previously thought.
The demonstration damn cool, I wish someone could replicate this part of their experiment. It seems to show a force from the HF powered light bulb that feels like a push to a human, but pulls in metallic objects. It doesn't seem to be of magnetic origin since copper is not attracted to a magnet.  I don't know of any scientific explanation for this. They seem to have shown that electrostatics is not responsible.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on August 22, 2015, 08:51:33 AM
Here is the video, start watching at 20:00 to see the 'force' I'm talking about.  It uses a piece of copper foil, not paper as I previously thought.
The demonstration damn cool, I wish someone could replicate this part of their experiment. It seems to show a force from the HF powered light bulb that feels like a push to a human, but pulls in metallic objects. It doesn't seem to be of magnetic origin since copper is not attracted to a magnet.  I don't know of any scientific explanation for this. They seem to have shown that electrostatics is not responsible.

I tried as you suggested, seeing if copper foil suspended from clear tape is attracted to the light bulb in my recent experiment (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSVIqUlAdYY)

Yes it is but the effect is much weaker in my setup than Eric Dollard shows. Still I'm sure his setup was consuming way more than 13watts input!!  Turns out my battery charger is on the way out and is only putting out 11.88v unloaded and 10.33v when bulb is brightest. I need a new battery charger.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 23, 2015, 03:06:30 AM
That is interesting. About the spark gaps, are two really necessary? What happens if you short the glass gap and just use the screw driver?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on August 23, 2015, 01:46:42 PM
That is interesting. About the spark gaps, are two really necessary? What happens if you short the glass gap and just use the screw driver?

No it turns out the first arc is not needed. I am compiling the next video and it explains what is needed from the arc.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 23, 2015, 02:25:31 PM
That video will good to see.
I'm not all that familiar with TV  flybacks but from memory some (if not all) have a diode in the output. This means that your 'Layden Jar' can build a voltage up from successive pulses,  and when this voltage exceeds the spark gap voltage, the current is dumped into the light globe.  If others try this with induction coils instead,  there needs to  be enough energy from the coil to charge the cap to the gap breakdown voltage during each pulse, thus keeping the coil discharge aperiodic.  Because if the cap can't discharge,  its stored energy from the pulse   will flow back and forth into the coil with a period of 2PI(LC)^0.5, wasting a huge amount of power in the large resistance of the coil's secondary. In this case ,unless the exciter is tuned very precisely to the same period or one of its close subharmonics, the cap may never build enough voltage to discharge.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: GeoFusion on August 23, 2015, 05:58:04 PM
Hi there guyz,

Nice work, replicating and trying the device out, yet I see you have managed to connect it differently but working as how it should.
Try this time to connect the ground line strait to the cold end of the Flyback, it will be the only connection to the cold end.
and the rest of the circuit is how you have it hooked up
and where you have the screw driver you could
place a separate ground that is 1 to 2 meters away from the the ground pin,
be experimental there ;) to see if there is difference. this is setup 1.
Btw the first SG is not needed in your setup because of how you have your setup a bit differently man ;),
check out on my schematix and my vids once more. try to replicate it as how I have, to see a difference. :) try it

And the other setup, connect the ground Only to the Aluminium wrap side of the salt water capacitor,
that is setup 2.

Important for builders, it would not matter if it's a screw driver or some other metal object for the experiment after the 2nd SG
, don't know if pure ferrite does anything different there, but I learned if the surface is large enough just like my bench iron plate, acting like a aerial plate,
the output is brilliant.

I will share with you the two setups I have down here in schematix, you will see a difference in how the wiring setups are.

There is so much more to figure out and we'll eventually figure something ;)
Any questions are good.

Cheerz~
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 24, 2015, 02:09:26 AM
Conventional theory would treat the large steel plate as a capacitance to ground, which essentially closes the loop for the flyback output. A good idea would be to have a similar bulb powered by DC next to the pulsed one to judge power output.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Hoppy on August 24, 2015, 10:19:12 AM
Conventional theory would treat the large steel plate as a capacitance to ground, which essentially closes the loop for the flyback output. A good idea would be to have a similar bulb powered by DC next to the pulsed one to judge power output.

Experimenting using these low to high voltage transformer circuits demonstrates how a ground and / or metallic plate connections can alter impedance matching, resulting in load lamp brightness variations. The overall electrical throughput efficiency of this type of voltage transformation arrangement is poor and clearly better efficiency is achieved by directly powering the lamp from the DC power supply.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: radiant_one on August 24, 2015, 01:19:29 PM
Geofusion thanks for putting up those schematics. My first video was like your 1st setup. The cold side of the flyback was connected straight to the ground.

I have put up another video called Radiant green arc (and electro-radiant shockwave) #1

This video describes a radiant green DC spark and how this causes a felt shockwave to be emitted from a lightbulb. The video utilises such an arc to partially light two 25w 240v bulbs. A few photos follow. Hoping the resolutions are better sized this time - thanks TinselKoala for last time!

There is no overunity performance suggested or implied.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Hoppy on August 24, 2015, 02:32:55 PM

This video describes a radiant green DC spark and how this causes a felt shockwave to be emitted from a lightbulb. The video utilises such an arc to partially light two 25w 240v bulbs. A few photos follow. Hoping the resolutions are better sized this time - thanks TinselKoala for last time!

There is no overunity performance suggested or implied.

How did you determine that the radiant green spark is DC?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: NickZ on August 24, 2015, 02:42:26 PM
The actual performance and efficiency of the circuit is low, and the ground line is not really adding anything extra to the circuit, nor is it extracting any "extra" energy from the ground.
The green streaming SG color most likely indicates that the copper wire end at the SG is burning and producing that green color.
In a like manner this very high voltage stream will also burn out any CFL, or LED bulbs in a short time. So, just what are we learning here? Low efficiency, and No extra energy from the ground, either. And all the bulbs will all get blackened and burn out.
So, what's the point?
A bulb connected to the grid, on just side, and the other side of the bulb to an earth ground will do the same, without all the un-needed HV. If there is no OU in this circuit, then what's the point,  Or, am I missing something?

A single transistor Joule Ringer circuit, is a much simpler circuit, and does more to light any bulb of less than 60 watts.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: GeoFusion on August 24, 2015, 04:11:28 PM
Hi there guyz :)

no problem, schematics are available. it's meant for humanity.
This discovery is very important for just a small device setup like this,
but It shows to have potential somewhere but needs to be experimented with alot and many variants and many errors in trail while at it ;). experimenters.
Nice work man ;),
See that you also felt the shockwaves coming out of the system while producing the correct SG type.
quite amazing :) it is, and without the ground it doesn't produce as much or nothing.
Yes, these are different sets of SG types as you can see, has to be played with alot and having the perfect distance for best output, frequency and impedance.
I am Familiar with those Green arc portion of the heavy radiant plasma arcs, For me it's also the burning of copper in beginning.
yet it shows there is some Amps within that SG :) in the formation of discharge. Very nice to able to make a pic of it.

I managed once to light up between device and  the ground line putting 25 TL Light bulbs each 15watts ( @~375 W), connected to the system, all are lit lit and
quite beautiful, some of them not fully lit but something brillaint though and lit up my garden like crazy ;). I will make a video soon of this one.
this is an example from my 3de vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRdG4_BkxPI

But right now also busy on ruslan/ akula/ Ibrahim schematics.
Check this one out , my second recording of the system, to see variants and how I use it, it gives many ideas.

Nickz and for others,
The device in it's low performance right now is to see the effect with the earth and how it performs.
It's not yet in stages for best output determination but that will come.
As you can see it has potential to become something and is a piece of the puzzle to Tariel Kapanadze's also.
Ofcource there needs more to be done on this and to be figuring out, but Only when experimenting and trying it out you will see what it does.
Sometimes  videos  ain't telling much until trying it our selfs.
an example In my second vid
See how I only touch the sement and my tent with the ground wire to make it arc and function.
You can see it Attracts. But attracts what?  it needs to touch a surface, A Mass that collects. Just like a tesla coil needs to connect his end to a mass.
It is taking particles from environment of equal force of what is being produced by the flyback and circuitry. that is what is flowing thru the ground wire and RF.
Check Tesla or Don Smith Theories.
When operating  this kind of devices, I never apply the system (Conventional) laws of electricity much, I have other perspectives, and learned alot on my own.
And learned from others how they go about there systems and having help from sources of unknown to many.
seeing a/c in another way how to use and d/c pulses in other systems too. but it's all about experimenting and trying it out.
I will never wait for someone to be done with something for me to have it, until someone does,
I will fully respect when someone achieves something or is busy and so close and near achievement.

Remember this is already done by using a 12V battery as input
( You will get shocked by radiant when touching the negative and positive sides of the battery when system is running)
lightly or heavy depending input and ground or mass attraction.
It's to show there is no SWER system involved here. I made sure of this.
remember a System just like Vasmus, that ground line, it's attraction, a tension.

never forget that I'm here to assist and help ;) If I do share something is because something I am sharing has potential and works.

Cheerz~
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: pomodoro on August 24, 2015, 04:41:54 PM
Cool video there. The green color is most definitely caused by some excited atoms of copper returning to the ground state and emitting their characteristic wavelengths as mentioned. Are you able to show a piece of metallic foil being attracted to the bulb?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Hoppy on August 24, 2015, 05:58:49 PM
Hi there guyz :)

no problem, schematics are available. it's meant for humanity.
This discovery is very important for just a small device setup like this,

Cheerz~

@ Geo,

What discovery? The earth is acting as part of the circuit, so what is so important or special about this? The green colour of the spark has already been explained above. There is no energy being extracted from the ground, at least none that can be satisfactorily demonstrated.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: GeoFusion on August 24, 2015, 09:46:58 PM
:)

Hoppy,
"at least none that can be satisfactorily demonstrated."

?... I think  you might be overlooking something here :) yet showing this device working is maybe not what you expect or want to see.

Yes, Earth forms a part of circuitry as it rotates just like a generator and recieving waves from the sun and inner sun constantly.
there is sufficient evidence on how these energies/ions/electricity and heat forms can be used.
I think I have shown alot in some of my videos to convince ppl already there is something :),
will not go in heavy discussion about it, we only need to understand
and see to use it in a usable form. :)
You know how a Tesla coil works right? Well place that knowledge onto this device.
Try to understand why the ground activates the ground  device that I have and without it doesn't operate.
and this is without grid connections what so ever, only battery.

What are Ions..how does it exist in nature.
What consist of  that powerful electric discharge during lighting strikes, where does that energy come from and generate and how.
You guest it :). This should be enough hints for sure.

ambient energy to usable, we just need to crank it up and see :).
Just know how to build a device that captures and vacuums and stores and amplifies.
This is just one device that can show it in a small scale for now.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: Hoppy on August 24, 2015, 11:21:24 PM
:)

Hoppy,
"at least none that can be satisfactorily demonstrated."

?... I think  you might be overlooking something here :) yet showing this device working is maybe not what you expect or want to see.

I'm referring to the setup capturing energy from the ground being satisfactorily demonstrated, not just the setup working by illuminating lamps from high voltage, which is to be expected. What might I be overlooking?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: NickZ on August 25, 2015, 01:51:57 AM
Geo":
Remember that Igor Moroz as well as Lasersaber played around with several HV systems, and several others tried as well, but never managed to have any of them self run.
What is new or different about what you're showing, concerning the ground? What potential does it have? As it just looks like an inefficient way to light up, and possibly burn out some bulbs, from too high a voltages. OR not?
Nelson's system did light some bulbs for a few seconds, using only a ground, and a kick start to get it going. I'd like to hear more about that, as he improves on it, and hopefully will obtain an even higher output from it.
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: nelsonrochaa on August 25, 2015, 02:05:22 AM
Geofusion thanks for putting up those schematics. My first video was like your 1st setup. The cold side of the flyback was connected straight to the ground.

I have put up another video called Radiant green arc (and electro-radiant shockwave) #1

This video describes a radiant green DC spark and how this causes a felt shockwave to be emitted from a lightbulb. The video utilises such an arc to partially light two 25w 240v bulbs. A few photos follow. Hoping the resolutions are better sized this time - thanks TinselKoala for last time!

There is no overunity performance suggested or implied.

I will like to do my own personal opinion about the subject of green color that you observe .

I do some tests with the same result green effect and is not a effect of cooper of wires, because i able to control  to show green or violet like you did when you approach the arc.

The green color is caused  when  a charged particle, most commonly an electron, travels through a dielectric (electrically polarizable) medium with a speed greater than that at which light would otherwise propagate in the same medium.

the green color is not green actually but blue, but our eye only can capture the green color.
Edwin Gray observe the same effect in their circuit combining "cold" electricity with high voltage .

As a charged particle travels, it disrupts the local electromagnetic field in its medium. In particular, the medium becomes electrically polarized by the particle's electric field.
If the particle travels slowly, then the disturbance elastically relaxes back to mechanical equilibrium as the particle passes.
When the particle is travelling fast enough, however, the limited response speed of the medium means that a disturbance is left in the wake of the particle, and the energy contained in this disturbance radiates as a coherent shockwave that show the green color .

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: TinselKoala on August 25, 2015, 02:28:33 AM
I will like to do my own personal opinion about the subject of green color that you observe .

I do some tests with the same result green effect and is not a effect of cooper of wires, because i able to control  to show green or violet like you did when you approach the arc.

This is a logical fallacy. The proper control experiment is to compare different electrode _materials_ under the _same_ conditions of arcing.

Quote

The green color is caused  when  a charged particle, most commonly an electron, travels through a dielectric (electrically polarizable) medium with a speed greater than that at which light would otherwise propagate in the same medium.

the green color is not green actually but blue, but our eye only can capture the green color.
Edwin Gray observe the same effect in their circuit combining "cold" electricity with high voltage .

As a charged particle travels, it disrupts the local electromagnetic field in its medium. In particular, the medium becomes electrically polarized by the particle's electric field.
If the particle travels slowly, then the disturbance elastically relaxes back to mechanical equilibrium as the particle passes.
When the particle is travelling fast enough, however, the limited response speed of the medium means that a disturbance is left in the wake of the particle, and the energy contained in this disturbance radiates as a coherent shockwave that show the green color .

Let's see someone produce a "green arc" when there is no copper involved in the electrodes producing the arc.

Quote
the green color is not green actually but blue, but our eye only can capture the green color.

That gets a ROFL for sure.  Can you support your claim with a spectrogram or two? Of course you cannot.

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: nelsonrochaa on August 25, 2015, 03:03:02 AM
Let's see someone produce a "green arc" when there is no copper involved in the electrodes producing the arc.

That gets a ROFL for sure.  Can you support your claim with a spectrogram or two? Of course you cannot.

Hi ,
Actually i give a opinion about this subject , and is naturally only one more opinion in a ocean of words like is normally in that kind of forum .
Is not supposed to be a claim because this was study in laboratory in 1959 and the the man that conduct that study have been awarded with a novel but ok , i can survive with the cynicism of your words .
I dont have a spectrogram , to you sorry .

Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: NickZ on August 25, 2015, 03:17:49 AM
That's easy to test, just use any other metal besides copper, like carbon for the electrodes, and there will probably be no green stream. Green, or greenish/blue is the color of copper burning. But, does it really matter? Normally, the green color indicates burning, so won't the same thing happen to the bulbs, causing them to burn out, as well.  Or not?
HV is not very suitable for lighting up incandescent bulbs, long term, as they won't work for long. The same thing goes with ungutted CFL or LED bulbs. Mine last about one minute... and another one bites the dust, goes up in smoke, etz.

Nelson:  You wrote, "As a charged particle travels, it disrupts the local electromagnetic field in its medium. In particular, the medium becomes electrically polarized by the particle's electric field."

The medium becoming "polarized" by the combined field effects, does seem logical, but, what does that actually mean? To become "polarized", in fact?  Or, more importantly, just how to put that polarization effect into practice?
Title: Re: Ground Energy Extraction (GndNrgEx)
Post by: GeoFusion on August 26, 2015, 10:25:34 PM
Hi guyz,

Check out the posted picture I uploaded,
It seems to have something similair to the ground system i'm working on and your replication Radiant_one.
Seems to have a feed back or a injection of 230V. See that the Choke near the load is important,
might be protecting inverter or something els.
This is worth trying in many ways. as we can see it's drivin by 2 Thyristors for pulsation, I wonder how this one will do.
the HV transformer we could place a Flyback for the test. as how I did. it's thoughts I am having on this :).
Anything that can variate the system to able to do something useful with it is welcome.
So let's see.

Nickz
"polarized"  having one direction of attraction, goes within one side flow within fields.
It will pull or repel, a force of energy around it depending coiling directions, types of mediums and types of drivin pulses and freq.

cheerz~