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Author Topic: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW  (Read 62269 times)

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #30 on: May 16, 2015, 03:53:09 AM »
Since I read this summary by User Allfather:
https://www.allmystery.de/themen/gw113123-1249#id14300533

And also the comparison between the placement of the components ontop of the roof-plate
between before the measurement day and at the dismantling day:
 Compare this:
https://www.allmystery.de/themen/gw113123-1262#id14304481

Now it is clear to me that it is just a Fake and the power came through the
upper support beam during the 10 day Demonstration.

Also the hole, that was taped again in the upper metal plate proves,
that there was a cable leading to the Generator from inside the tube...!

The hidden cable was then removed during the last few days before
the dismantling day and at that day the power came from a hidden
distributor cable from the next room. (hidden behind the red lift platform crane)

You can see here the guy with the Karo-Shirt, how he removes the cable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R2tZvGxkhA
Also the KWh-power meter was no longer connected ! Also a proof
that the power came from somewhere else !

So now the Gaia-Rosch KPP is proven for me as a Fake and busted
and I will no longer care about it.
It already has costs me too much wasted time...

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline Pirate88179

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #31 on: May 16, 2015, 03:58:13 AM »
Since I read this summary by User Allfather:
https://www.allmystery.de/themen/gw113123-1249#id14300533

And also the comparison between the placement of the components ontop of the roof-plate
between before the measurement day and at the dismantling day:
 Compare this:
https://www.allmystery.de/themen/gw113123-1262#id14304481

Now it is clear to me that it is just a Fake and the power came through the
upper support mean during the 10 day Demonstration.

Also the whole, that was taped again in the upper metal proves,
that there was a cable leading to the Generator from inside the tube...!

The hidden cable was then removed during the last few days before
the dismantling day and at that day the power came from a hidden
distributor cable from the next room. (hidden behind the red lift platform crane)

You can see here the guy with the Kao-Shirt, how he removes the cable.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7R2tZvGxkhA
Also the KWh-power meter was no longer connected ! Also a proof
that the power came from somewhere else !

So now the Gaia-Rosch KPP is proven for me as a Fake and busted
and I will no longer care about it.
It already has costs me too much wasted time...

Stefan:

I agree with those that think you should correct Sterling over there as he seems to think you believe this is the real deal for some reason.  As far as I know, you have been skeptical of this from the start.  Now it appears that most of us believe this to be a hoax/scam/trick...etc.

It will probably take Sterling another few weeks to come to this conclusion.

Bill

Offline markdansie

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2015, 12:32:34 PM »
Stefan:

I agree with those that think you should correct Sterling over there as he seems to think you believe this is the real deal for some reason.  As far as I know, you have been skeptical of this from the start.  Now it appears that most of us believe this to be a hoax/scam/trick...etc.

It will probably take Sterling another few weeks to come to this conclusion.

Bill
I did Bill and this is Stuarts Response


Regarding Stefan, how can you take his word for anything when he couldn't be bothered going (after receiving a personal invitation from Roberto to go) to dis-assembly day on some lame, very lame, ultra lame excuse.[/font][/size]Another pathetic lost soul. Handed to him on a plate to attend and investigate everything for himself, and he doesn't go.[/size]What does that say about him ?[/size]Even Roberto said, look Stefan it would have cost you 10% of your time you spend mucking around doing videos all the time, to come in person and see for yourself, and you just couldn't be bothered going.[/size]Why ![/size]Why ![/size]Why ![/size]He's a waste of space. Another armchair.[/size]Sums it up nicely, I guess.[/size]

[/font][/size]

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #32 on: May 16, 2015, 12:32:34 PM »
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Offline ramset

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #33 on: May 16, 2015, 04:05:46 PM »
Soo
Is this true ??
there was a personal invitation to witness the disassembly ?

I don't really follow peswiki hard to separate facts at times .. we even have anonymous clowns coming here bragging about making up stories and playing games with peoples lives over there ??

An invitation??

Offline markdansie

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2015, 12:08:01 AM »
peswiki also claim Pixi dust is involved. As you said had to sort out facts from fiction.


Here is some other information from a post on Revolution Green from our forum by a person called Smooth Criminal
There is so much reasonable doubt that unless Rosch allow a simple test of the torque on the drive shaft there is only one conclusion to draw.




 i'm here to spread some information we collected in german speaking forums over the last year or so that might not be known in the english speaking community..tbh i was quite shocked about the censorship und suppression over at pesn. reminds my of the dozens of missing commentary (most likely skeptic) on the gaia homepage ;) you would expect that ppl like sterling, who watched so many fe-scams first row walk free would get skeptic and smarter over time..[/font][/color]
----[/font][/color]
i would also used a 3mm or so small hole for the trick but u have to keep in mind that rosch never planned this so called 'dismantling day' it only came up several days or a week after the first visitor tours. it was propably foisted to them by gaia or allan.. i believe thats why they where sloppy because it was covered well by the support beam. they didn't plan ahead for 'dismantling day' as it was never intended to have one. thats why they need a week between 'measurement day' (lol) and 'dismantling day' to fix everything[/font][/color]
its grotesque on its own that they are so keen to remove that prototype as fast as possible.. makes you thinking.[/font][/color]
----[/font][/color]
i also want to bring to your attention a bizarre appearance from rosch CEO detlef dohmen at allmystery forum where he clearly states that gaia 5kw aukw is only 'toys and marketing' for them. their real goal is to make the big money with the big tubes and from in good faith investors. this big tubes start at 10mil. euro. they claimed to have several big kpp's running in the field (all of course far abroad) but failed to provide even a photo of them..[/font][/color]
another interesting thing to know is that rosch installed a 20kw tube at haslach group in kempten (germany) with a lot of pr-noise. we never heard about that project again. all indicators point to the fact that it was a miserable fail. we have good reason to believe from sources that its efficiency was around 20-30% wich is well within calculated physics.. this tube should be the big one you saw standing around in the livestream at the rosch facility in troisdorf/spich. they used very weird excuses why i didn't work.[/font][/color]
also worth mentioning is the first 12kw demonstration aukw rosch builded in belgrad/serbia. it seems to be the recycled plant from RObert SCHrade. from whom the word 'rosch' originated. (he's not active anymore in the rosch group) anyways.. they did a lot of obvious mistakes there.. they used some kind of bicycle chain to transfer the forces wich is ridiculous and the frequency was extremely stable at 49.99-50.00 wich indicated grid connection. they fixed this problem now in spich.[/font][/color]
c. beiser (technical director of gaia) was in serbia at least 4 times but couldn't find the trick. this visits of beiser constitute the starting point of gaias engagement in the aukw project. (before that, they (gaia) tried to build their own gaia-aukw with good member money. i don't have to mention that they failed. didn't make them any smarter) to make a long story short gaia have absolutly no idea whats going on from a technical point of view..(this whole gaia organization is anything but altruistic. but thats another story on its own)[/font][/color]

[/font][/color]
Kind Regards[/font][/color]
Mark[/font][/color]


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2015, 12:08:01 AM »
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Offline markdansie

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #35 on: May 17, 2015, 12:12:29 AM »
Soo
Is this true ??
there was a personal invitation to witness the disassembly ?

I don't really follow peswiki hard to separate facts at times .. we even have anonymous clowns coming here bragging about making up stories and playing games with peoples lives over there ??

An invitation??


No point in travelling across Germany given there were several days where things could have been renovated, changed and all evidence erased.
This is a very bold scam
Kind egards
Mark

Offline magpwr

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2015, 05:26:51 AM »
hi everyone,

I think i have come up with a super easy way to detect if it's fake or for real merely by looking at the device creator intention.

I think this quick 1-cent worth of suggestion of mine as shown below is gonna to be idiot proof or preventing anyone from becoming idiots in future-

Any free-energy device creator is looking for investor.It's fake right away.

If any free-energy device creator is intending to sell any assembled working device be it just 1 or more.This is likely the real deal.
 
-----------------------------

The only free-energy sales i've heard off is Don-Smith via video and Akula device sales to China buyers via video.
Although Tariel case was a sad one he gonna take it to his grave since he don't want the world to own this technology base on old translated video.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2015, 05:26:51 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline Pirate88179

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2015, 05:30:48 AM »

No point in travelling across Germany given there were several days where things could have been renovated, changed and all evidence erased.
This is a very bold scam
Kind egards
Mark

Mark:

For whatever it might be worth, I agree.

Bill

Offline TinselKoala

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2015, 10:42:35 AM »
@magpwr: While I think you are on the right track, your system isn't quite perfect.

For example, I will gladly sell the prototype Cheese Power demonstrator, and the complete secret of Cheese Power, for the trifling sum of 998 dollars US, subject to only two conditions: A signed NDA that says the buyer will not disclose the secret for two years after the purchase date, and the funds are to be remitted to me in _cash_ (Western Union wire transfer or similar).

I'll even offer a moneyback guarantee: if you are not satisfied that the device is exactly as I have represented it, you may return it for a full refund... as long as it is in working condition when returned. The NDA still will hold for the full two years of course.

Note that I am offering for sale 1 prototype of the Cheese Power demonstrator, along with a suitable chunk of Cheese, and all rights (except public disclosure for 2 years) that go along with it, like commercialization, patent rights, trademarks, etc. You buy it, it's yours to do with as you wish.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Frp03muquAo

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2015, 10:42:35 AM »
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Offline conradelektro

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2015, 11:04:42 AM »
Why the calculation in

http://revolution-green.com/rosch-smoking-guns-and-the-scientific-explanation/ or

http://pesn.com/2015/05/13/9602617_scientific-explanation-for-Rosch-KPP-buoyancy-system/

is wrong:

The first power calculation in the article is:

== Formula 1 ====   Thus, we get: N = 9.81 x 2 x Q x 0.5 x H x 3 = 9.81 x Q x H x n ====
Further down one calculates:
== Formula 2 === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec x 2 m x 5 x 0,9 = 14.7 kW  =====
There is the error of putting "2 m" in again, because 2 was cancelled by 2 * 0.5 in Formula 1.
Therefore the corrected Formula 2 is:
== Formula 2 corrected === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec  x 5 x 0,9 = 7.35 kW  =====
But there is a further error in "Formula 2 corrected", which is the factor 5, because of  "5 working wheels above each other".
If there are 5 wheels above each other the water rises from one wheel to the other only 0.4 meters and not each time 2 meters. Therefore we can calculate with one wheel a height H of 2 meters, or for 5 wheels a height of H 0.4 meters each. We can calculate with one wheel with H = 2, or we can calculate with 5 wheels with a H = 0.4. So, either H = 2 or H = 0.4 x 5, which is the same.
Finally we end up with a correct "final Formula 2":
== final Formula 2 === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec  x 0,9 = 1.47 kW  =====
In addition we have to factor in a bigger loss than 0.9 because of the very optimistic height H = 2. If the water rises 2 meter it encounters friction at the wheel and some water is lost because it runs through gaps.
Further there will be losses in the gear connecting the wheel with a dynamo and the losses in the dynamo itself.
Therefore we will get much less than 1.47 KW.
Please note: I have not criticised the calculation itself (although one should do that), I only corrected obvious errors.


Criticism of "Formula 1":
The formula stems from water turbines http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_turbine#Power and assumes that water is falling down through the turbine. But one is not allowed to assume the same efficiency if "bubbly water (water air mixture with 50% air) rises through a turbine" rather than "smooth water is falling through a turbine". Much higher losses by friction of "bubbly water rising" in contrast to "smooth water falling" have to be assumed. And if things happen slowly (as is necessary in the "bubbly water rising case"), the formula is overly optimistic, because the formula only works with rather fast moving water.

Greetings, Conrad

Offline markdansie

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2015, 12:59:55 PM »
Why the calculation in

http://revolution-green.com/rosch-smoking-guns-and-the-scientific-explanation/ or

http://pesn.com/2015/05/13/9602617_scientific-explanation-for-Rosch-KPP-buoyancy-system/

is wrong:

The first power calculation in the article is:

== Formula 1 ====   Thus, we get: N = 9.81 x 2 x Q x 0.5 x H x 3 = 9.81 x Q x H x n ====
Further down one calculates:
== Formula 2 === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec x 2 m x 5 x 0,9 = 14.7 kW  =====
There is the error of putting "2 m" in again, because 2 was cancelled by 2 * 0.5 in Formula 1.
Therefore the corrected Formula 2 is:
== Formula 2 corrected === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec  x 5 x 0,9 = 7.35 kW  =====
But there is a further error in "Formula 2 corrected", which is the factor 5, because of  "5 working wheels above each other".
If there are 5 wheels above each other the water rises from one wheel to the other only 0.4 meters and not each time 2 meters. Therefore we can calculate with one wheel a height H of 2 meters, or for 5 wheels a height of H 0.4 meters each. We can calculate with one wheel with H = 2, or we can calculate with 5 wheels with a H = 0.4. So, either H = 2 or H = 0.4 x 5, which is the same.
Finally we end up with a correct "final Formula 2":
== final Formula 2 === N = 9.81 x 0.167 m3/sec  x 0,9 = 1.47 kW  =====
In addition we have to factor in a bigger loss than 0.9 because of the very optimistic height H = 2. If the water rises 2 meter it encounters friction at the wheel and some water is lost because it runs through gaps.
Further there will be losses in the gear connecting the wheel with a dynamo and the losses in the dynamo itself.
Therefore we will get much less than 1.47 KW.
Please note: I have not criticised the calculation itself (although one should do that), I only corrected obvious errors.


Criticism of "Formula 1":
The formula stems from water turbines http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_turbine#Power and assumes that water is falling down through the turbine. But one is not allowed to assume the same efficiency if "bubbly water (water air mixture with 50% air) rises through a turbine" rather than "smooth water is falling through a turbine". Much higher losses by friction of "bubbly water rising" in contrast to "smooth water falling" have to be assumed. And if things happen slowly (as is necessary in the "bubbly water rising case"), the formula is overly optimistic, because the formula only works with rather fast moving water.

Greetings, Conrad
I published the correction at Revolution Green


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2015, 12:59:55 PM »
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Offline hartiberlin

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #41 on: May 18, 2015, 03:48:09 PM »
I made a locked thread with all the facts and pictures about the possible AuKW KPP fake from Rosch that prove it, here:

http://overunity.com/15773/gaia-rosch-aukw-auftriebskraftwerk-kpp-why-it-does-not-work

Offline memoryman

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #42 on: May 18, 2015, 09:28:57 PM »
Did anyone get a good photo of the alleged generator? Any real evidence that it is a motor?

Offline hartiberlin

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #43 on: May 19, 2015, 01:06:44 AM »
Well there is some news from Rosch,

Mr. Dohmen has posted today a PDF File with an excuse, why they had this hole
there in the upper top plate, he claimed, that it was only for the
Endoskopcamera.
See here:
http://freeenergynews.com/Directory/Buoyancy/Rosch/Bilder_Deckel_Kameras.pdf

But then, why did they need to put a new hole there very next to the generator,
when they already had a good big hole for the hose and the other internal webcam ?
This excuse does not make any sense..

But now I have looked closer into this new PDF File and I discovered some
new items, that I had not seen before and that are getting clearer now..

You can see in 2 pictures of this PDF File a cabledrum standing at the entrance of the
next room at the opened blue hall door...
The question now is, is that a 3 phase cable drum or just a normal
one phase 230 Volts AC cable ?

Was the generator at the dismantling day 3 hours powered  from the buoyancy
via the gearbox or was the generator also powered by the grid and worked as a motor ?

Interesting is to see the connection of the black generator cable.
At the public viewing they had connected at the end of the generator cable
such a 3 Phase connector bush.

Now in this new PDF File from Rosch you can see, that the generator cable is not connected
to any connector bush, but the cable ends are just unisolated and you see the raw copper.

Then I reviewed again J.D,´s videos again and I saw, that this black generator cable went
at the dismantling day directly into the right cabinet box at the REAR SIDE !
So it went probably there directly to the connection panel without a real connector bush,
but the copper cables were just fixed there inside the panel.

Too bad, we have not pictures yet from the backside of these cabinet boxes there..


If a visitor has pictured the back side of these cabinet boxes, please upload your pics.
Many thanks.
Please look at the enclosed pics.
Regards, Stefan.

Offline markdansie

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Re: How Rosch probably faked their 5 KWatt KPP AuKW
« Reply #44 on: May 19, 2015, 01:30:44 AM »
The Sting,
they took orders for 350 but according ti Gaias website nothing will happen till they get 500 orders. Red Flag"
"Therefore take this chance and be actively involved.Now The perfect choice for power plant, because we can only really get going if we have together the 500 piece
Fulfill your order - Step 1
Once we have the full 500 pcs, we will build the first seminar pattern and thereby create the operating and assembly instructions."

 

OneLink