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New Battery systems => Other new battery systems => Topic started by: Pirate88179 on May 02, 2015, 06:01:58 AM

Title: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: Pirate88179 on May 02, 2015, 06:01:58 AM
http://video.foxnews.com/v/4209384375001/tesla-unveils-latest-battery-pack-technology-powerwall/?#sp=show-clips (http://video.foxnews.com/v/4209384375001/tesla-unveils-latest-battery-pack-technology-powerwall/?#sp=show-clips)


Musk claims this new technology as a world changer.

I guess we will see.

Bill
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: Paul-R on May 02, 2015, 03:34:20 PM
Maybe its a a better battery, but that's  all.

The real  issue is: Do we know  or can we find out how to  make one at home?
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: mscoffman on May 02, 2015, 04:32:25 PM
Physical Battery Specifications for Tesla Powerwall are here. (no electrical connector information)  Web Link..

http://www.teslamotors.com/powerwall

Batteries are coupled to the hybrid grid tie inverter through what is known as a "battery charge controller
component" this component that is not included here. The charge controller is user programmed for the detailed
battery type. 12VDC lead/acid battery systems would be known as low voltage battery (high amps) systems.
These are known as a high voltage DC battery system. So these are the batteries only. While this installation is
not rocket science, these high capacity units are just waiting to take you out, so one must be careful and plan
each step.

There are literally hundreds of different grid tie inverters that need to have the utility power to be up to work
and so with a battery you will need one of other half dozen or so hybrid type inverters with *optional* grid tie
capability.

..S..MarkSCoffman
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: lancaIV on May 03, 2015, 08:53:41 PM
world changer ? blablabla
 
More than 90% of the world habitants in their households do not need more than an one KWh batteriepack,better Ultra-capacitor/battery-pack (f.e. CSIRO/AUS) for they daily electricity consume satisfaction.
 
www.oeko-energie.de (http://www.oeko-energie.de/) european life style
standart household 18 KWH per day versus intelligent household 3 KWh per day
 
and optimium way of life explored by - behaviour re-engineering
                   http://mtbest.net/ (http://mtbest.net/)
 
A really good example and a pioneer for the E.U.-administration "NearlyZeroWatt-building"-program -in execution and progress.
 
Down-under 0,8 KWh per day http://mtbest.net/household_efficiency.pdf (http://mtbest.net/household_efficiency.pdf)
 
           We need new battery concepts,battery materials ,really ?
        Let us go to that page http://home.earthlink.net/~fradella/green. (http://home.earthlink.net/~fradella/green.)
                                           Citing:
 
About 20 years ago, Fradella built a 300-watt demo version of a small system based upon this diagram.  It demonstrates regenerative bi-directional speed control and proportional braking. Regenerative battery charging automatically results whenever the motor is decelerated.  He has demonstrated it to countless manufacturers and researchers involved with EVs, propulsion, and robotics.  Average life of motor-cycle batteries in the demo has been about 10 years. These batteries were guaranteed to last only 90 days.
 
             Ten years life for a lead battery,not enough "saft" ?
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: mscoffman on May 03, 2015, 11:51:23 PM
Yes but it's the inital cost of the lead/acid commodity that creates the cost in this case.
It almost doesn't matter what you do with the battery afterwards as the majority of
the the cost involves creating the initial lead metal frame. So acid/lead battery lifetimes
are very sensitive to changes to the manufacturing process and are generally fully under
control of the individual battery manufacturer.

I think one wants to try to avoid problems of household energy availability during the
northern winter - holiday season for example. Then is not time for attempting to begin
reeducation for  peoples energy use, IMHO.

Lithium changes the initial cost data point. You know from your own experience
with battery powered equipment that battery lifetime seems is "getting good" in terms of
recharging cycles. This much different then when batteries use was first starting out.
New problems showing up in automobiles are not expected to be seen as readily in
housing use because momentum based mechanical bump and grind wear will not be
present in fixed siting applications.

..S..MarksCoffman
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: lancaIV on May 04, 2015, 02:04:16 AM
As market competition alternative:
7 KWh capacity +/- 700 US$
 http://news.stanford.edu/news/2015/march/aluminum-ion-battery-033115.html (http://news.stanford.edu/news/2015/march/aluminum-ion-battery-033115.html)
 
cheap aluminium production can bring the global market price per ton to 500 US$
(Russia production price +/- 750 US$/ton)
 http://www.topix.com/forum/com/cenx/TIP6DD2B8TJKTIRM8 (http://www.topix.com/forum/com/cenx/TIP6DD2B8TJKTIRM8)#!
the inventor: https://www.google.com/patents/US6551476 (https://www.google.com/patents/US6551476)

the electrical energy delivered by portable energy plants for 1 USCent/KWh
mini aluminium smelter

3 KWcontinous AC-Inverter +/- 500 US$
a. Shell Springboard award planar inverter
b. Rudolf Zoelde HSWR
 
and a battery PWM charger and condition controler 399 US$
 
total commercial worth less than 2000 US$
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: forest on May 04, 2015, 10:45:55 AM
IS this the real world changer ? For whom ? For educated bold elite maybe... who can afford all the costs beside the battery pack, solar panels, inverter and so on... The most important in my opinion for poor people is the energy used to cook and heat their homes - the most costly part, electric light is cheap.


If you watched Musk presentation you must know that the heat problem is postponed to later times because of large power demanding for it.


What we do need really !!!? Please comment. I seem I know the answer...maybe
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: forest on May 04, 2015, 11:13:02 AM
"For example, about fifty-percent of available energy is accessed by just one billion people, yet the negative impacts on the environment are being felt by the three billion who have no access to that energy.  Three billion have so little access to modern energy that they are forced to cook, heat and light their homes with methods dangerous to their health."


http://www.casinapioiv.va/content/accademia/en/events/2014/sustainable/statement.html (http://www.casinapioiv.va/content/accademia/en/events/2014/sustainable/statement.html)
Title: Re: Tesla unveils latest battery pack technology 'Powerwall'
Post by: lancaIV on May 04, 2015, 01:35:11 PM
Forest, at first:
between a Tesla Car Company modell and a TATA Car Company modell f.e. Nano is a price difference which show us the virtual "handling" from definitions like "world middle class" and "India middle class" social product afford,not to think about the "no/poor income class".
 
Elon Musk interests is to sell himself as "highland" but finally he is only serving for -
reciting Tom Chalky and Dick Fradella - the  waste civilisation satisfaction .
 
There are millions of people exploring cheap alternatives to resolve the future needs for the billions of low income world habitants,but this is not a Tesla Company issue.