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### Author Topic: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?  (Read 11488 times)

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« on: December 29, 2014, 12:16:02 AM »
Hello,

Its seems a stupid question!

Lets assuming, we want to design a coil? just a coil

the question:
how to apply the music rules in this  simple exemple?

If D is the diameter of the coil
H the height
n number turn

so acccording to ''squaring the circle'' sacred geometry term
H= pi/2*D   or   ( H= phi*D)

this is my favorite  pi value (pi=3.24=2*1.62)
so
H=1.62*D
how about the n  turn number? there is no chance in nature?

Any benefit from using numbers highly composites like D= 144 or 2880....25920...34560..?

I hope you had a nice Christmas with your family and all the best for the new year.
luc2010
« Last Edit: December 29, 2014, 04:55:57 AM by luc2010 »

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« on: December 29, 2014, 12:16:02 AM »

#### dieter

• Hero Member
• Posts: 938
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2014, 03:43:37 AM »
Hi Luc,

I am not sure if people understand what you mean.

A standing wave is the result of Resonance, maybe the same as Harmony. The coil itself has no Resonance, it needs a counterpart, for instance a capacitor. Very common is the socalled resonant tank circuit.

Personally I think capacitors are wasteing energy during transfer, but an other possibillity may be a second coil that is only electricly coupled, not inductively.

There is a lot of information about resonant circuits that can be googled. Whether the use of sacred geometry has an impact, I don't know.

Peace

#### MarkE

• Hero Member
• Posts: 6830
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2014, 04:03:55 AM »
Hello,

Its seems a stupid question!

Lets assuming, we want to design a coil? just a coil

the question:
how to apply the music rules in this  simple exemple?

If D is the diameter of the coil
H the height
n number turn

so acccording to ''squaring the circle'' sacred geometry term
H= pi/2*D   or   ( H= phi*D)

this is my favorite  pi value (pi=3.24=2*1.62)
Say what?  Pi ~= 3.14159265359
Quote
so
H=1.62*D
how about the n  turn number? there is no chance in nature?

Any benefit from using numbers highly composites like D= 144 or 2880....25920...34560..?

Best Regards
luc2010

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2014, 04:03:55 AM »

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2014, 04:33:37 AM »
Hi Luc,

I am not sure if people understand what you mean.

A standing wave is the result of Resonance, maybe the same as Harmony. The coil itself has no Resonance, it needs a counterpart, for instance a capacitor. Very common is the socalled resonant tank circuit.

Personally I think capacitors are wasteing energy during transfer, but an other possibillity may be a second coil that is only electricly coupled, not inductively.

There is a lot of information about resonant circuits that can be googled. Whether the use of sacred geometry has an impact, I don't know.

Peace

Hi dieter,

a standing wave is formed at particular frequencies and energy is recycled in the coil and interfering constructively with itself, reflected back in the coil and recycled and reused, rather than dissipated in the ambient as power loss.

may be i have it wrong? but
the waste is the current so the coils not the caps?

Best regards
luc2010

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2014, 04:33:37 AM »

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2014, 04:49:56 AM »
Say what?  Pi ~= 3.14159265359
Hello MarkE,
but pi 3.24 is not the only pi value, pi is not a constant value. There is are different pi value for squaring the circle "geometry term" and a different pi value exist for outer space as well. For example I cold rolled a sheet of steel 1.2m wide 2.4m long by 3mm thick into a cylinder and it grew in length by over 50mm. Pi at 3.14 is good for drawing plans but not practical for real world engineering.

Best Regards
luc2010

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2014, 04:49:56 AM »

#### MarkE

• Hero Member
• Posts: 6830
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2014, 05:21:53 AM »
Hello MarkE,
but pi 3.24 is not the only pi value, pi is not a constant value. There is are different pi value for squaring the circle "geometry term" and a different pi value exist for outer space as well. For example I cold rolled a sheet of steel 1.2m wide 2.4m long by 3mm thick into a cylinder and it grew in length by over 50mm. Pi at 3.14 is good for drawing plans but not practical for real world engineering.

Best Regards
luc2010
Pi is the ratio of the length of a circle's circumference to its diameter.  "Taxicab" geometry artificially defines a path that incrementally moves towards and away from the circumference of a circle resulting in a contrived artificially long "path" length for the circumference.  Pi, and its approximation of 3.141592653590 is fundamental to all AC electrical engineering.  Your assertion that it is "not practical for real world engineering" is flat wrong.

#### Pirate88179

• elite_member
• Hero Member
• Posts: 8368
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2014, 05:35:45 AM »
Pi is the ratio of the length of a circle's circumference to its diameter.  "Taxicab" geometry artificially defines a path that incrementally moves towards and away from the circumference of a circle resulting in a contrived artificially long "path" length for the circumference.  Pi, and its approximation of 3.141592653590 is fundamental to all AC electrical engineering.  Your assertion that it is "not practical for real world engineering" is flat wrong.

If it were not "practical for real world engineering", then the computer he is typing on would not work.

Bill

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2014, 05:35:45 AM »

#### CANGAS

• Full Member
• Posts: 235
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #7 on: December 29, 2014, 09:25:57 AM »
Hello MarkE,
but pi 3.24 is not the only pi value, pi is not a constant value. There is are different pi value for squaring the circle "geometry term" and a different pi value exist for outer space as well. For example I cold rolled a sheet of steel 1.2m wide 2.4m long by 3mm thick into a cylinder and it grew in length by over 50mm. Pi at 3.14 is good for drawing plans but not practical for real world engineering.

Best Regards
luc2010

Just how much metal-working experience have you had?

I have been guessing that it is not extensive. Tell me, have you ever learned the right way to bend a tube, such as a car brake line?

CANGAS 111

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2014, 06:43:11 PM »
You just gives me another reason, Why we dont have publicly Higth ''efficient'' working machines!!

quote:
'' Not amount of attestation of innumerable and honest witnesses would ever convince anyone versed in mathematical and mechanical science,  that a person had squared the circle or Discovered perpetual motion.''
Baden Powell, Essays and reviews, 1860

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #8 on: December 29, 2014, 06:43:11 PM »

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #9 on: December 29, 2014, 08:36:49 PM »
According to the mathematians:

Pi= 3,141 592 653 589 793 ....
Phi=1.618033...

my question is not how they came up with this?
in nature everything is proportional, its all about music if you prefer

so what is the ''perfect'' value used by nature?

pi=a/b
phi=c/d
(a,b,c,d are natural number)

why this so important?
because, we need to make a  music / standing waves

frequancy= wave speed/ wave lengeth

electromagnetic waves, sound waves.. its the same rule!

BUT in music, we have no ''perfect'' tuning and this is the topic,  so  my quetion is:
how to tune in the coil?

other exemple:

In the field of amplified speaker design,  there is a long-known secret about how to keep unintended standing waves from forming. sealed box enclosures are always built with interior proportions ''aproximating'' the golden ratio! and its inverse, such as 0.62*1*1.62.
(just fibonacci 0.62 + 1 = 1.62)

These proportions are widely considered  antiharmonic and optimal for eliminating standing waves inside a speaker box.
This works because standing waves cannot form when reflected at or near the proportion of the golden ratio or its inverse!!

Similarly, rooms and auditoriums built in this proportion will not echo and, along with non-reflective materials, avoid extraneous dissipation or cancellation of the original sound energy that can occur in interfering waves!!!

Best Regards and have a good new year
luc2010

#### MarkE

• Hero Member
• Posts: 6830
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2014, 09:10:08 PM »
According to the mathematians:

Pi= 3,141 592 653 589 793 ....
Phi=1.618033...

my question is not how they came up with this?
You have obviously Googled the values, which means you have almost certainly seen in articles on those numbers how they have been derived since the days of the Greeks.  So what part of the thousands and thousands of web pages that explain these two values is giving you trouble?
Quote

in nature everything is proportional, its all about music if you prefer

so what is the ''perfect'' value used by nature?

pi=a/b
phi=c/d
(a,b,c,d are natural number)

why this so important?
because, we need to make a  music / standing waves

frequancy= wave speed/ wave lengeth

electromagnetic waves, sound waves.. its the same rule!

BUT in music, we have no ''perfect'' tuning and this is the topic,  so  my quetion is:
how to tune in the coil?

other exemple:

In the field of amplified speaker design,  there is a long-known secret about how to keep unintended standing waves from forming. sealed box enclosures are always built with interior proportions ''aproximating'' the golden ratio! and its inverse, such as 0.62*1*1.62.
(just fibonacci 0.62 + 1 = 1.62)

These proportions are widely considered  antiharmonic and optimal for eliminating standing waves inside a speaker box.
This works because standing waves cannot form when reflected at or near the proportion of the golden ratio or its inverse!!

Similarly, rooms and auditoriums built in this proportion will not echo and, along with non-reflective materials, avoid extraneous dissipation or cancellation of the original sound energy that can occur in interfering waves!!!

Best Regards and have a good new year
luc2010
Except that you are wrong.  Where there are surfaces with non-zero reflectivity inside a cavity standing waves form: period.  The Phi ratio has many interesting qualities, but it does not eliminate reverberations.  The only way to eliminate reverberations in a cavity is for the walls to absorb incident energy completely.

#### Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #10 on: December 29, 2014, 09:10:08 PM »

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #11 on: December 29, 2014, 10:11:13 PM »
Hello,

They are just interested in the induction created by running a current or charge through a coil of any given length. What we (Tesla fellow not yet ) do and what natures does is tune into natural frequencies and run off the energy that holds together the fabric of existence!!!!

Best regards
luc2010

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #12 on: December 30, 2014, 05:07:31 PM »
Hi,

f= c/l
f=frequency
c= wave speed
l= wave lengeth

Any benifit from using this equation?
if l= coil lengeth

lets first we All agree on that?

Next step will be using all dimensions  from a harmonics of that value!
ln=n*l
......
thare is no "perfect" tuning so lets try with this one:

just intonation scale proportions:
24,27,30,32,36,40,45,48

heigth =40/24 diameter

number turn?

now how to do that?

Best Regards
luc2010

#### TinselKoala

• Hero Member
• Posts: 13918
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #13 on: December 30, 2014, 05:30:10 PM »
Unbelievable. You don't get to choose your 'favorite' value for physical constants like pi !

If you want to start making up numbers then you can "prove" anything you want.

Quote

Hi,

f= c/l
f=frequency
c= wave speed
l= wave lengeth

Any benifit from using this equation?
if l= coil lengeth

lets first we All agree on that?

Next step will be using all dimensions  from a harmonics of that value!
ln=n*l
......
thare is no "perfect" tuning so lets try with this one:

just intonation scale proportions:
24,27,30,32,36,40,45,48

heigth =40/24 diameter

number turn?

now how to do that?

Best Regards
luc2010

Unfortunately... the answer will require using the correct value for pi, as well as knowing such things as the diameter of the wire...

Once again there are many many calculators available on the internet that will tell you how many turns of a given diameter wire with a given insulation thickness you need to wind on a form of a given diameter, with a given inter-turn spacing, to arrive at a given physical length of wire and winding height and a given electrical length, resonant frequency when coupled with a given capacitance, etc. Unfortunately all these calculators use the same value for pi... and it's not your "favorite" one.

#### luc2010

• Jr. Member
• Posts: 92
##### Re: How to make a Music Electricity ( aka Standing Waves)?
« Reply #14 on: December 30, 2014, 07:33:06 PM »
Unbelievable. You don't get to choose your 'favorite' value for physical constants like pi !

I think when we want to caculate pi without computers assistance and using heigh "algebra" numbering system and without circular argument?   Just using some "primitive" tools and commun sense?
Yes, Its the "magic" of squring the circle!!

When Mathematicians and scientists agree that mathematics is le language of God, then why do we think that God would speak  an irrational language with us like the present irrational mathematical pi accepted by the mathematicians and scientists, which is also the most famous  mathematical constant and a symbole of our universe.

It should be rather a perfect rational mathematical  with full representation of our universe and the language of God which should be a rational mathematical language!!!