Language: 
To browser these website, it's necessary to store cookies on your computer.
The cookies contain no personal information, they are required for program control.
  the storage of cookies while browsing this website, on Login and Register.

GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Tesla Paper

Free Energy Book

Get paid

Donations

Please Donate for the Forum.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.(Admin)

A-Ads

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics


  • *Total Posts: 894759
  • *Total Topics: 15739
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 1
  • *Guests: 15
  • *Total: 16

Author Topic: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.  (Read 39010 times)

Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13968
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #30 on: December 29, 2014, 12:19:40 PM »
The here and now is fantastic TK,but the wright brothers had no such simulator,and yet there plane flew.
Simulator's are the wet dream of the real thing-there is just no comparison ;)
Not exactly true. The Wright brothers had a lot more going for them than people nowadays seem to think.
In the first place they had the irrefutable examples of powered, heavier than air flight from nature: Birds.
In the second place, they flew many many tethered kites and free-flight gliders and gathered solid numerical data from them, long before they strapped an engine to their best glider design and flew it as an "airplane" in level flight. They actually made sustained soaring flights in freeflight gliders, perfecting their pitch and roll control systems long before they ever attempted powered flight.
In the third place, they had solid data from previous researchers like Otto Lilienthal, and made mathematical extrapolations from that data: What we today would call "modelling" and ... yes.... simulation.
In the fourth place, they developed the Wind Tunnel, for _simulations_ testing their designs of airfoils, control systems and propellers. They used solid data obtained from _simulations_ using scale models in the wind tunnel, to develop their practical fullscale designs.
The Wright brothers used a totally scientific approach, including modelling and mathematical simulations, tested in their wind tunnel to _simulate_ actual conditions and actual structures in full scale.
http://wright.nasa.gov/airplane/tunnel.html

Quote

Im in no way infering anything OU here,in fact,this machine is very power hungry and inefficient. Im looking for effect,not efficiency.The one thing i have shown very clearly is the difference in drag between ferrite and steel core's. To me,that makes the whole exercise well worth it.But i am going to continue to look a little more at what is happening in regards to the magnetic field's,in fact,im quite enjoying working with this simple little machine.

I'm glad you are having fun! And I continue to maintain that the performance and details of your system can be simulated in a good simulator, and that the simulator will make predictions that you can then test in your real hardware. Simulations are only as good as their programmers... but there are some pretty good programmers out there. Do you think that, for example, your washing-machine motor or your lorry's starter motor or alternator were designed by trial and error, or by some engineers using simulators and formal (mathematical) models (which are simulators stripped of the fancy display hardware and software)?

From the NASA link above:
Quote
To obtain data, one of the brothers would look through the view window on the top of the tunnel and record the angles on the balance output dial in the test section. The brothers built models of their wing designs using materials available in their bike shop. Strips of 20 guage steel (1/32 inch thick) were cut, hammered, filed and soldered to produce various shapes. They made between one and two hundred models and made quick preliminary tests in October, 1901, to develop their test techniques and to investigate a wide range of design variables. Some of the models were used in combination to study bi- and tri-wing designs. Following the preliminary experiments, they chose about 30 of their best designs for more detailed parametric studies. In these experiments, only one design variable was changed between models. You can duplicate the wind tunnel tests of the Wright brothers by using our interactive wind tunnel simulation.
 At the end of their 1901 wind tunnel tests, the Wright brothers had the most detailed data in the world for the design of aircraft wings. In 1902, they returned to Kitty Hawk with a new aircraft based on their new data. This aircraft performed much better than the 1901 aircraft and lead directly to the successful 1903 flyer. Results of the wind tunnel tests were also used in the design of their propellers.
So I think you can see that simulation was indeed a very important part of the Wright brothers' development of the powered airplane.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #30 on: December 29, 2014, 12:19:40 PM »

Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #31 on: December 29, 2014, 12:37:29 PM »
tinman if you prefer doing everything as a hands-on experiment, that's fine.  Simulations can give you insights into what you are seeing and may give you additional ideas for what experiments you want to conduct.  I know a guy who for decades was dead set against simulations in his work.  Now he realizes that he cannot compete without using them.

Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5236
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #32 on: December 29, 2014, 01:04:29 PM »
tinman if you prefer doing everything as a hands-on experiment, that's fine.  Simulations can give you insights into what you are seeing and may give you additional ideas for what experiments you want to conduct.  I know a guy who for decades was dead set against simulations in his work.  Now he realizes that he cannot compete without using them.
It may be hard for me to put this in words that make sense to you,but i'll give it a try.
Here is my situation. my average working week is around 75-80 hour's,and most of that is away from home. About 14 month's ago,i had a lot of time to work on project's,but now my situation has change-financially far better off,free time next to zero. So i can have a lot of free time and enough money to get by but next to none to spend on projects,or i can have next to no free time,and heaps of money to burn-either way im screw'd. So not only do i see a simulator as some kind of cheat method to test devices,and a program that is based around only known outcome's,i also see them as a waste of my valuable time that could be spent building an actual device. Im a hands on man,and most of my computor time is spent right here on the forum's. Let's have a look at TK's last comment,and i'll tell you how i feel about that situation,and what may be happening.

Quote TK: So if you have someone showing a circuit (for example; could be a mechanical device, etc) that is claimed to be "OU" in some manner, and then that circuit is simulated by a circuit simulator like Falstad or LTSpice, say, and the simulator does _the same things_ that the actual circuit does, in terms of the claimant's measurements and phenomena, but the simulator also shows that it is not "OU", because the simulator can make more and more accurate measurements of various parameters ... who is right?

So what if the simulator is wrong?,what if it starts looking for thing's that arnt there just so as every thing adds up to known parameters. Simulators are based around known parameters,so what happens if the unknown happens to show up?-or will the unknow even show up on a device that is based around only the known?.Sounds to much like physics where they just chuck in some variables just so as things all line up. What about buoyancy,can it simulate something like the device in the discussion that Mark and myself are haveing on the !whats wrong with this! thread?.

I guess my biggest beef with simulators is spending time i dont have useing them,and then the fact that we are looking for the unknown,and the sim might just throw in some random junk so as it all makes sense with known parameters.

To easy to miss the big one useing a sim--that is my belief.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #32 on: December 29, 2014, 01:04:29 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13968
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #33 on: December 29, 2014, 01:27:05 PM »
Oh, I agree with Ibison's Law, all right. You aren't going to find anything that is "outside physics" with a properly constructed simulation. But you may indeed find that some of the things that are observed from an apparatus that _seems_ to produce "outside physics" results are in fact... not.

For example, take Gerard Morin's demonstrations. Plug his starting values and components into a good electronics simulator and you'll get the same results that he gets in real life. He claims that they show "overunity" or "free energy"... but the simulator will tell you that they do not actually show any such thing, because the sim can make more, and more proper, measurements than he can.  So the simulator can provide a good cross-check.

I've got a couple of "perpetually running" overcenter-springloaded things in Phun/Algodoo, that work without cheats. Since they don't actually work in reality, I think that this demonstrates that that particular simulation is wrong, probably because the precision of the math isn't that precise, rounding errors, etc.  Simulators are not always right, but so far, to the extent that they don't model reality accurately, it's not a problem with reality, but a problem with the simulator.

So I think we are actually in agreement about that part of the question. If you want to demonstrate something that is "outside known physics" like an overunity machine, or a buoyancy drive, then only a working model will actually fit the bill.  But a proper simulation will also be able to help you to avoid going down dead-ends, since you can simulate, test against model, make a change in the sim, re-test against model, until you find, or don't find, some deviation between what the sim shows and what the model does.

ETA: Demands on time are hard to deal with. One of the reasons that simulators are used a lot in "big science", and in the aircraft industry, is that they _save_ time, though. You can run a flight deck crew through dozens of simulated emergencies in a full-motion simulator in a few hours; you can simulate stresses and strains on a machined part in seconds, where it would take days to make an actual part and then test it to destruction. But sims take time to learn and program, and many people like yourself would just prefer to make the model itself. I'm like that too; I usually "build three times" and I prefer "sketching" in the actual metal, rather than drawing up detailed blueprints as the first stage of a build.

Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5236
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #34 on: December 29, 2014, 01:41:30 PM »
Maybe the time is comeing soon for a change or revamp of what we think we know.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaELad94KZs

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #34 on: December 29, 2014, 01:41:30 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #35 on: December 29, 2014, 01:42:55 PM »
Let me give you a practical example:  A few years ago Steven Jones reported that using expensive gear at BYU he was measuring 8X overunity on his JT variant.  He experimented by changing a couple of resistor values using potentiometers.  He observed on his oscilloscope waveforms that indicated his battery was being recharged by the circuit for part of each cycle.  The expensive oscilloscope reported more energy going back into the battery than coming out of it.  Eureka???

If one were to simulate his circuit without including the effects of his wiring and his oscilloscope probe set-up, one would not get over unity or anything that looks like Steven Jones reported results.  Does that make the experiment or the simulation wrong?  It means that one or both are wrong.  When two methods to observe the same thing yield different results then there is work to be done to see which if either is correct.   Back when this went on several people went about that by performing replications and simulations.  At least one I can think of showed that it was the experiment that was fouled up.  They showed how it was the scope probes and how they were being hooked up that were the problem. 

Another similar example is Rosemary Ainslie.  She too used an expensive oscilloscope to make measurements that did not agree with simulations of her reported circuit.  She too had measurements that showed current moving back and forth between the test circuit and the batteries.  Poynt99 was able to uncover the real circuit schematic by comparing simulations against Ms. Ainslie's reported results.  He was able to reproduce her results when he refined his model to include the electrical effects of her wiring arrangements.  Ms. Ainslie ultimately conducted experiments that included additional set-ups that Poynt99 suggested that were far less susceptible to corruption than her original set-ups that were left in place for comparison.  All measurements ended up consistent with Poynt99's simulations.  The new measurement set-ups showed the actual power draw from her batteries.  The mystery was incontrovertibly reconciled.

My message is:

1) Simulation is a tool. 
2) Simulation provides an independent view of what is seen in the lab. 
3) Both simulation and lab observations can be wrong.
4) When simulation and the lab line up we can be confident in each. 
5) When they don't agree we need to keep digging.

Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #36 on: December 29, 2014, 02:41:39 PM »
Hi TM,

You're hands on approach is what make you understand, modify & develop your setups... ;)
Just keep at it just like they did in the 1800's mate... 8)...they didn't have any scope/simu or what not... :o
But nature provided everything needed and still does... ;D

The video you posted is funny in a sence of... :P
"violating one of the universe's most fundamental laws"...no no no...violating one of men's most fundamental laws...lol... ::)

Ferrite is better when it comes to less drag on the system and i do hope you can get your hands on more of those cores type so you can build a complete generator setup...

Have a good one... :D
Would you care to compare the pace of technology development today with modern tools versus say 1860?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #36 on: December 29, 2014, 02:41:39 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline that-prophet

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 8
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #37 on: December 29, 2014, 04:54:55 PM »
free energy is super simple
you put DC power into a motor with a 100cm circumference pulley on it
you attach a belt, strap, rope or even a string in a pinch
and then attach at least one AC motor to a 1cm pulley on the same belt
you run the AC output through a full wave bridge rectifier to self power...
your DC input motor,,,,
then you have just created your first free energy electricity multiplier
satan will try to complain about torque, but it is no problem, just think about how easily an electric motor rotates,,,
you could have 10 - 100 AC motors attached, multiplying your input by 1000 - 10 000..
now dont you think this much output power could turn your input DC motor

Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #38 on: December 29, 2014, 05:02:18 PM »
free energy is super simple
you put DC power into a motor with a 100cm circumference pulley on it
you attach a belt, strap, rope or even a string in a pinch
and then attach at least one AC motor to a 1cm pulley on the same belt
you run the AC output through a full wave bridge rectifier to self power...
your DC input motor,,,,
then you have just created your first free energy electricity multiplier
satan will try to complain about torque, but it is no problem, just think about how easily an electric motor rotates,,,
you could have 10 - 100 AC motors attached, multiplying your input by 1000 - 10 000..
now dont you think this much output power could turn your input DC motor
Send your idea to PESN.  Ignore that in the ideal case the DC motor output power required is identical to the AC motor load, and that in the real world it will always be greater.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #38 on: December 29, 2014, 05:02:18 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5236
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #39 on: December 29, 2014, 10:35:06 PM »
Would you care to compare the pace of technology development today with modern tools versus say 1860?
Yes,we have gone from learning to thinking we can set ruel's and absolutes(the laws of physics) in what would be nothing more than a drop of water in the ocean as far as mans time here go's.Man has put the brakes on in his own advancements,with a set of laws he really knows nothing about yet.

So this is it Mark,we have come as far as we can go?. No light speed travel because man says it's not possable-->what kind of crap is that. Tell us why light speed is not possable Mark.

Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #40 on: December 30, 2014, 12:56:53 AM »
Yes,we have gone from learning to thinking we can set ruel's and absolutes(the laws of physics) in what would be nothing more than a drop of water in the ocean as far as mans time here go's.Man has put the brakes on in his own advancements,with a set of laws he really knows nothing about yet.

So this is it Mark,we have come as far as we can go?. No light speed travel because man says it's not possable-->what kind of crap is that. Tell us why light speed is not possable Mark.
I don't know where you get such ideas.  If anyone has evidence of new understanding that extends beyond our current understanding the vast majority of those in the sciences are thrilled to follow if not directly investigate.  The idea that science rejects reliable data in favor of dogma is one that I see frequently from people who are not in the business.

The key development of Western science has been the development of the scientific method.  The scientific method is incredibly adept at removing personal biases, agendas, or just plain mistakes from learning.  What we call physical laws came to become that way and stay that way only because of the mountain of evidence that backs them, and a complete and total failure to falsify them.  If at any point any of them are falsified then they will cease to be Laws.  Either a modification or a complete replacement will occur.  But for that to happen there must be commensurate evidence.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #40 on: December 30, 2014, 12:56:53 AM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline dieter

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 938
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #41 on: December 30, 2014, 05:19:52 PM »
One more aspect of the core material drag test:


Shape. A flat body, when facing the pole, has a rather high "grip", a round shape is more slippry since the final path is decreasing in size down to a line.
I think the shape is probably more important than the material, although a high permeability results is more  bearing friction, temporary unbalance, de- and re-accelleration and vibration and therefor losses.


Peace


Offline Qwert

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 924
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #42 on: December 30, 2014, 05:59:25 PM »
Yes,we have gone from learning to thinking we can set ruel's and absolutes(the laws of physics) in what would be nothing more than a drop of water in the ocean as far as mans time here go's.Man has put the brakes on in his own advancements,with a set of laws he really knows nothing about yet.

So this is it Mark,we have come as far as we can go?. No light speed travel because man says it's not possable-->what kind of crap is that. Tell us why light speed is not possable Mark.

 Tell us why light speed IS possable, Tinman.

Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5236
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #43 on: December 30, 2014, 10:18:23 PM »
Tell us why light speed IS possable, Tinman.
Anything that is not infinite has a limit,just as the speed of light dose. There idea or thinking that at light speed the ship would have infinite mass,and thus require an infinite fuel source is just rubbish. If the ship was to become infinite in mass,then so would the fuel source. You cant have one mass become infinite without the other doing so as well. But because the speed of light is not infinite,then neither is any mass that travels with it. Foe example-if some one was to switch on a torch for .1 of a second and switch it of again,and we could watch that beam of light travel through space,we would see a beam of light that was X mile's long-has a start and end-->it wouldnt be an infinite beam of light.

Offline MarkE

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6830
Re: Advanced and Delayed magnetic field's.
« Reply #44 on: December 30, 2014, 11:07:52 PM »
We observe in experiments that accelerating even very light particles to high fractions of C takes tremendous energy.  We observe that it takes exponentially more energy the closer to C that we get in good agreement with the formula:

Kinetic Energy = mREST*c2*(1/((1-v2/c2)0.5) - 1)

The limit of that denominator as v => c is zero, meaning that the kinetic energy of the mass becomes undefined.

Do you know of any experimental evidence that there is a finite upper limit on the kinetic energy of a mass at light speed or beyond?

 

OneLink