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Author Topic: Lenz free generator  (Read 378767 times)

Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #165 on: August 19, 2016, 11:54:38 PM »

Like most Ron, you take what the man says at face value.  snip

Anyway....the attached was produced by one of many machines that I built investigating this subject.

Regards


Interesting post erfinder, I liked that.


Now I must confess that the six pole zero force design was a flop. 


This is the induced voltage, shown below which is a near perfect sine wave of nearly seven volts pk to pk


Ron


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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #165 on: August 19, 2016, 11:54:38 PM »

Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #166 on: August 19, 2016, 11:59:55 PM »

Now I must confess that the six pole zero force design was a flop. 

Ron


So I took all the magnets out but two at 180 and got this...(below)


I have built a new four magnet rotor and while it doesn't have the speed yet (only 1700 RPM) it does have less induced AC voltage, just around the two volt mark, 1 1/2 volts positive and 1/2 volt negative.

Incidentally, these scope shots are done with the motor being brought up to speed and then the power removed, the shots taken on coast down.

Ron




Offline Magluvin

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #167 on: August 20, 2016, 01:32:22 AM »


Brad,


I am not entirely in agreement with JB's statement in his videos that this, 'Zero Force' is a non-generator.


Naudin showed way back when that this configuration can induce a voltage.


Ron

It makes sense to me that the output would be as you show in the scope. The one hump camel. ;)   Like if you have a magnet pass a coil with core in the more common manner, as the magnet approaches the core, the field is attracted to it more as it gets close. So the filed cuts the approaching side of the coil first, creating 1 phase of the typical ac sine output. And as the mag approaches tdc most all the field is in the core with less field cutting the windings and the voltage induced become 0v at tdc. Then as the field passes tdc, the field starts cutting the departure side of the core, giving us the other phase of the AC out.

So here we have the magnet only cutting the one side of the coil, thus basically only 1 phase out. But is there drag when the winding is loaded, as in lenz? Im just not so sure the config is lenzless as the coil is being induced by the moving mag, just as if the coil were in the typical on axis with the mag at tdc, the coil will repel an approaching mag, and pull on a departing mag. So each phase has an opposing affect on the moving mag as the coil gets induced.

What may be interesting is to wind just one 1/4(small section, not all the way around) of a toroid and spin a mag past the winding in the same way as you show, but the core a closed one. And if there is no induction to the toroid winding, then try a diametric in the hole of the toroid core. The one difference between having the magnet field cut the windings on the outside dia of the core vs inside is there would be no cog between the mag and the core, as if it is cutting the outside, there would definitely be cog because the mag is approaching and departing, where inside the hole of a round core, if the diametric mag is dead center, there would be no cog as the magnet is always the same distance from the core. So there would be possibly just pure lenz of just the induced winding? ??? ??

Follow me here....   If the field of a winding on a toroid core is only in the core, as they claim, then there will be no lenz effect on the magnet as the coils induced field cannot escape the core. As far as they say......    ;)   Im going to try that this weekend. See what happens.  I have some 3/8 dia 1/2in long diametrics and plenty of cores. For me what may be interesting is if the coil doesnt get induced with an outer dia mag pass, but if it does with the mag in the hole, then possibly this helps prove that a pri windings field does pass through through the hole of the core to cut sec windings on the other side of the core. ??? ;D All of that gave me this idea and it may prove well with what you are doing here.

Mags

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #167 on: August 20, 2016, 01:32:22 AM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #168 on: August 20, 2016, 05:50:26 AM »
Like this below....

Mags

Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #169 on: August 20, 2016, 04:57:35 PM »

It was a flop according to who?  A flop by what standard?  I too have a six pole machine, and like you indicate, mine also generates a sinewave which is cleaner in appearance than anything I have ever seen built by anyone!  That machine was the last one I built before I switched geometry.  That machine is dragless by the standard which is collectively agreed upon among those who only have eyes for the dragless condition.  If you got the machine wired up right, and the proper relation between the inducing and induced, yours should be dragless as well.  Be wise sir, investigate carefully before you conclude that there is nothing there, you are seconds from throwing away that which none have demonstrated here, save one, (me) I was ignored.


added.....


This design opens the door to what I have referred to in the past as the "rectangular transformation matrix".  That statement motivated the resident plagiarist to rush in and inform me that I was wrong.  That same individual wasn't able to generate the same conditions in his apparatus when asked, and still hasn't to this day.


Regards




Ah, I hadn't followed through with that. What I was implying was a failure by JB's concept of a "successful" replication with "no induced voltage". However you shine a light on a concept I had been disregarding. Thank you.


I had dabbled with the transverse coil induction method before now but had come up against Lenz being fully a participant. The rectangular transformation matrix could do with some further discussion


Ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #169 on: August 20, 2016, 04:57:35 PM »
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Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #170 on: August 20, 2016, 06:09:24 PM »


 we can speculate off forum.

Regards


thanks, you could check your inbox


Ron

Offline Magluvin

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #171 on: August 21, 2016, 02:16:12 AM »
Ok. Just did a quicky test before I go further. Rotor just spun up by hand.

First pic and scope shot is what I described in my last post. It was a core that was already wound to see possibly anything. And there ya go.

The second set with the core set up like the Orbo cores were in reference to the rotor. Some, but very little output

In the first set I want the winding to be tighter, like I said earlier about 1/4 of the core wound, but the larger core Im going to be using I want possibly 1/16, so when the mag passes, it doesnt brush the winding, as in the max field density only being over one portion of the coil at a time.

And the second set which is orbo positioned naturally doesnt put out much as the closest windings are moving inline with the field, so no cutting. Some though. What we did see in the scope shot are probably outer weak fields inducing from the magnet pass. If you can imagine it, you will see. So tiny output, due to weak fields at greater distance from the affected windings.


So after I wind a new core and test that, then make a setup with the diametric mag shown in the pics below and spin the mag in the core and see what we get without core cogging.  That core will have a bunch of little windings going around, so there is always output. Opposite sides of the core windings can be in series. Working on how many windings I want to do.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #171 on: August 21, 2016, 02:16:12 AM »
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Offline Magluvin

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #172 on: August 21, 2016, 02:25:18 AM »
Woops, one more thing...

With the Orbo setup as in the second set of pics above, they had the cores wound all the way from end to end, which may further reduce rotor mag influence of the winding output. But with the core I had shown above, if I turn the core on its axis so the winding is on top and the mag just crosses over the bare core at the end of the winding, I get greater output. Also if the windings are down I get the same.

Mags

Offline Dog-One

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #173 on: August 21, 2016, 02:02:05 PM »
Quote from: Erfinder
..., and yet, when we review the accepted literature, we find support, and the insane doesn't look so insane anymore.

Not only support, but it practically smacks one between the eyes with the obvious.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ukBFPrXiKWA

Though not everyone can see why a semi-permanent magnet would be a useful thing to have.

Instead, we do the same thing in our devices, day after day, paying for it at every instance.  Not so smart grasshopper.


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #173 on: August 21, 2016, 02:02:05 PM »
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Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #174 on: August 21, 2016, 04:53:16 PM »


The only time we truly fail, is when our effort is centered around the idea of copying and pasting, the term being thrown around is "replication". 


Regards


A misconception. This is the very basis of our learning process.


When we see something being done it brings out the questions...what did he do, how did he do it, what did he do it with? and the final question, can I do that?


For example if we never saw anyone ski then we should in all probability never give it a thought. But having seen someone ski then the questions start, ah, he is using two thin boards just a bit taller than myself... and somehow they are fastened to my boots... you know the story...then by refining the items used with the process of standing upright and sliding down the hill we are ski-ing. We have learned through replication. It is not a bad word.


Ron


« Last Edit: August 21, 2016, 11:47:52 PM by i_ron »

Offline tinman

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #175 on: August 22, 2016, 01:14:42 AM »


Brad,


I am not entirely in agreement with JB's statement in his videos that this, 'Zero Force' is a non-generator.


Naudin showed way back when that this configuration can induce a voltage.


Ron

That is correct Ron.
Any time there is an external magnetic field changing in time with regards to an inductor,will cause a voltage to be induced across that inductor--and so it becomes a generating coil.
If there was no induced BackEMF from the magnet in motion to that of the inductor,the current would go sky high.


Brad

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #175 on: August 22, 2016, 01:14:42 AM »
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Offline i_ron

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Re: Zero Force Motor
« Reply #176 on: August 22, 2016, 08:29:29 PM »

Hi erfinder, all,


with  erfinder's encouragement, he suggested I not give up on version 1,  I put the 6 pole rotor back in business.
 
 Adding a generating coil shows the nice sine wave on that coil.
 
 But this is where it gets interesting, lightly loading this coil does not upset the motor too much. Anything less that 300 ohms and the motor gradually slows right down.
 
 But... with a speed of 2045 RPM and a no load output of 4,86 volts... putting a 300 ohm load on the coil will, over several minutes, drag the RPM down to 2000 and the voltage down to 4.09 volts DC ((FWB, 1000 uF)
 
 It has just run like that for 30 minutes.
 
 A clarification, the motor draw is very much RPM sensitive, 300 mA at 1200 RPM, 200 mA at 2000 RPM. So there is no discernible input meter movement when connecting the load or disconnecting the load.


Ron

Offline Enjoykin2017

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #177 on: August 22, 2016, 11:49:15 PM »
Hi Guys !!

Let's start from the very begining.

Prime question is: "Does the test electrostatic  charge/s (electron/s) and permanent magnet (both poles) interact among themselves or not interact and why is so ??".

There is our small experimental setup: Take a glass tube. Clean it from greased sweaty hands with alcohol. Now rub one end of a glass tube with synthetic fabric, and suspend it for the middle by means of a rubber flagella to a rack and bring at in vicinity permanent magnet near the polished end of glass tube.

1. Is there exist any kind of ineraction or force between test electrostatic charge/s (electron/s) in close proximity of southern or northern permanent magnet poles ??

Guys now do the same, but with non polished end.

2. Any interaction or not ??

To undesrtand any electro-magnetic paradox it was quite necessary to understand on prime experiment does the electrostatic test charge and a magnet interact among themselves ??

.........................
pps: "Physics stands on a stable foundation of the facts, but not on drift sand of imaginary hypotheses", E. Rutherford.

Offline lancaIV

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #178 on: August 23, 2016, 06:53:17 PM »
"semi-permanent" ,Dog-One ? I think someone call this "Hybrid magnet" !
 
 The 45 Tesla Hybrid Magnet - Strongest Magnet Ever Built  It could pull your tooth filling out from half a mile away!
 

Offline forest

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Re: Lenz free generator
« Reply #179 on: August 23, 2016, 09:21:54 PM »
Just take example from EmJunkie thread and use the rised current in one leg of mutual transformer to create field around the resonant tank circuit or a lots of coils in some special configuration or non inductive position, basically without loading the input.[size=78%] [/size]
[size=78%]Looks like the Kapanadze aquarium box[/size]

 

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