Author Topic: The new generator no effect counter B. EMF part 2 ( Selfrunning ) (Read 612074 times)

lumen · « **Reply #540 on:** December 24, 2014, 04:16:25 PM »

Luc,
This idea I'm going with is to keep the field looped inside of the coil and use the "C" section to pull the magnetic loop out through the coil.
The area you want to cut down is probably long enough where the field loop will still retain well in the iron and would likely not greatly impact the design idea.
I appears you already have your own plan in this "defeat Lenz project" and should go with what you want in your design.
Small changes like this could make it work better and to be sure you might model it in a field simulator but sometimes just building is more interesting.

Keep up the good work!

T-1000 · « **Reply #541 on:** December 24, 2014, 04:29:51 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 02:39:55 AM

Water is an excellent analogy for electricity in terms of power and energy. When you do the Google search "electricity water analogy" you get about 468,000 results.

What makes magnet to have usable magnetic field for a life? Water is not comparable there...
Also when you start looking to magnet as power source in same way as Sun provides energy for solar panels, there are ways to convert magnetic field into electricity without external power source.

For doing that the same general principle applies like in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlx2PgESXhs

MileHigh · « **Reply #542 on:** December 24, 2014, 04:41:11 PM »

Quote from: T-1000 on December 24, 2014, 04:29:51 PM

What makes magnet to have usable magnetic field for a life? Water is not comparable there...
Also when you start looking to magnet as power source in same way as Sun provides energy for solar panels, there are ways to convert magnetic field into electricity without external power source.

For doing that the same general principle applies like in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlx2PgESXhs

When you are discussing power and energy, you don't have to have a magnetic field present. The water just needs to model the energy effects of the magnetic field. Example: Move a magnet past a coil to generate AC power. For the water version, you make a water pump that is "AC" - it moves the water back and forth with an AC pressure.

The fact that solar panels turn sunlight into electricity can easily be modeled with water. A water pump in a water circuit represents the solar panels.

A magnet is never a power source for anything. The power source is what moves the magnet past the coil.

MileHigh

P.S.: For doing that the same general principle applies like in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlx2PgESXhs

That clip is a nonsense clip. The guy does not have a perpetual motion machine. I read a few times that reporters requested that they be permitted to see the entire machine and he always refuses. He refuses because he knows that the reporters would find the power source for his machine. The power source could be something as simple as a small electric motor.

T-1000 · « **Reply #543 on:** December 24, 2014, 04:52:54 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 04:41:11 PM

A magnet is never a power source for anything. The power source is what moves the magnet past the coil.

The magnet and coil can be stationary for inducing current. As long the magnetic field gets weakened or strengthened in coil the Faraday law is followed. This can be done by changing magnetic flux resistance in core between magnet and coil or redirecting magnetic flux path to another magnet instead of coil. With proper design it is easy.
Then same magnet can energize coil then the induced electric current creates electromagnetic field which should be coupled between magnet and coil only and won't interfere with force changing magnetic flux path/resistance when proper geometry is applied in design.

Not sure if you get that but it is easy as soon experiments are done with designs mentioned in beginning of this thread and in http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2678.msg43489#msg43489

MileHigh · « **Reply #544 on:** December 24, 2014, 04:56:57 PM »

Quote

What makes magnet to have usable magnetic field for a life? Water is not comparable there...

This has nothing to do with power and energy. I said that water is an excellent analogy for electricity when you are discussing the power and energy issues.

Why does a magnet have a magnetic field that lasts for life? You should know the answer to this question already. I am not sure what your native language is but I am sure that you will find all of the information in your native language on the Internet.

As a general statement, if you are on this website and you are an experimenter that is doing research into free energy using magnets and electronic circuits, then you should already understand how and why a magnet can produce a magnetic field for thousands or millions of years. The reason for this has nothing to do with free energy and it is nothing special.

If you do not understand how a magnet works and why a magnet can produce a magnetic field then my strong advice is to spend one full day doing the research for yourself. Then come back to the forum with a full understanding of how a magnet works.

T-1000 · « **Reply #545 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:05:20 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 04:56:57 PM

As a general statement, if you are on this website and you are an experimenter that is doing research into free energy using magnets and electronic circuits, then you should already understand how and why a magnet can produce a magnetic field for thousands or millions of years. The reason for this has nothing to do with free energy and it is nothing special.

That is same mistake as it was when first conventional mechanical generator was ever created.
In fact I do not see single experiment of yours in this thread and the flooding of the forum with your posts are derailing topic. The unknowns in common knowledge was exposed in first Syrain's post and was ignored.. Typical.

MileHigh · « **Reply #546 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:16:56 PM »

Quote from: T-1000 on December 24, 2014, 04:52:54 PM

The magnet and coil can be stationary for inducing current. As long the magnetic field gets weakened or strengthened in coil the Faraday law is followed. This can be done by changing magnetic flux resistance in core between magnet and coil or redirecting magnetic flux path to another magnet instead of coil. With proper design it is easy.
Then same magnet can energize coil then the induced electric current creates electromagnetic field which should be coupled between magnet and coil only and won't interfere with force changing magnetic flux path/resistance when proper geometry is applied in design.

Not sure if you get that but it is easy as soon experiments are done with designs mentioned in beginning of this thread and in http://www.overunityresearch.com/index.php?topic=2678.msg43489#msg43489

Yes, but what you are saying is still nothing special, and the magnet is still not a power source. An external power source has to move a piece of ferrite in the core to change the flux going through the coil.

You must understand: I move a magnet with an external power source to make changing flux. I move a ferrite core with an external power source to make changing flux. It's essentially the same thing. There is nothing special there. This is an illusion that some of you are working on right now.

I move a magnet, or I move a ferrite core to make it look like I am moving a magnet - it's essentially the same thing. If you open your mind and open your eyes you should see this.

Quote

Then same magnet can energize coil then the induced electric current creates electromagnetic field which should be coupled between magnet and coil only and won't interfere with force changing magnetic flux path/resistance when proper geometry is applied in design.

This is the fantasy part that some of you want to believe. There is no "proper geometry" - no matter what if you want to output power from the coil, then you have to do mechanical work to output the power.

Go ahead an build something if you want. I think that Lumen and Gotoluc are doing that right now. You still will have to supply mechanical power if you want to output electrical power from the coil.

All that you have to do is carefully look at the design and find the basic function "hiding" inside of the design: I have to supply mechanical work to get electrical work out from the coil.

If Lumen abd Gotoluc do good builds and make proper measurements and avoid leading themselves down a garden path, that is what they will find.

In many ways this is a "failure of the imagination." You just have to look at the design carefully and you will see that it is nothing more than an ordinary generator. No matter how much you think you are "tricking" the flux manipulation, in reality you are just tricking yourself.

Generate electricity by changing the flux through a coil:

1. Move the magnet past the coil.
2. Move the coil past the magnet.
3. Move the ferrite core between the magnet and the coil.
4. Use a fancy "flux redirector system" based on a moving laminated transformer core.

The items above are all the same. You just have to open your eyes and your mind to see this.

T-1000 · « **Reply #547 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:18:36 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 05:16:56 PM

I move a magnet, or I move a ferrite core to make it look like I am moving a magnet - it's essentially the same thing. If you open your mind and open your eyes you should see this.

In this thread the magnet and the coil are stationary!
The piece of material between is deviating magnetic flux strength between them.

MileHigh · « **Reply #548 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:25:30 PM »

Quote from: T-1000 on December 24, 2014, 05:05:20 PM

That is same mistake as it was when first conventional mechanical generator was ever created.
In fact I do not see single experiment of yours in this thread and the flooding of the forum with your posts are derailing topic. The unknowns in common knowledge was exposed in first Syrain's post and was ignored.. Typical.

Bullshit. We are having a debate and it is on topic. Also don't give me this foolishness about "flooding the forum." "You are writing too much" is just nonsense on your part.

Don't give me this crap about "you don't do experiments either." You are fully aware that I have some knowledge about the types of things we are discussing on this forum. I have done hundreds of experiments.

I would be more than happy to discuss and debate things with you. But don't give me this crap were you say, "you are flooding the forum" or "you don't do experiments."

T-1000 · « **Reply #549 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:28:00 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 05:25:30 PM

Bullshit. We are having a debate and it is on topic. Also don't give me this foolishness about "flooding the forum." "You are writing too much" is just nonsense on your part.

Don't give me this crap about "you don't do experiments either." You are fully aware that I have some knowledge about the types of things we are discussing on this forum. I have done hundreds of experiments.

I would be more than happy to discuss and debate things with you. But don't give me this crap were you say, "you are flooding the forum" or "you don't do experiments."

Then show at least one experiment where coil and N-S magnets are stationary and the iron core is moving from the side and passing those magnets like in Syrain's design.

MileHigh · « **Reply #550 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:30:31 PM »

Quote from: T-1000 on December 24, 2014, 05:18:36 PM

In this thread the magnet and the coil are stationary!
The piece of material between is deviating magnetic flux strength between them.

So what?

Yes and the piece of material will require mechanical energy to make it move if you want to output power from the coil into a load.

Thought experiment: You are blindfolded and the two wires from the coil are on your tongue. Someone moves the magnet in front of the coil and you feel the voltage on your tongue. Then, the magnet and the coil are stationary! Someone moves a ferrite core between the magnet and the coil and you feel the voltage on your tongue.

Can you tell the difference? The answer is that you cannot tell the difference.

MileHigh · « **Reply #551 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:33:08 PM »

Quote from: T-1000 on December 24, 2014, 05:28:00 PM

Then show at least one experiment where coil and N-S magnets are stationary and the iron core is moving from the side and passing those magnets like in Syrain's design.

Look at the tongue experiment that I just described to you.

The only thing the coil cares about is seeing changing magnetic flux. You can move the coil, move the magnet, or move the ferrite core, it makes no difference.

Dave45 · « **Reply #552 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:37:12 PM »

This is the point of this build https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OSXbG2BmUw Thanks Jimboot.
When a magnet induces current in a coil the coils magnetic field opposes the magnet.
When iron is between the two at some point you get attraction which doesnt happen in a conventional generator.
So unless you have built it and know it doesnt work your talken trash.
Simple......................

T-1000 · « **Reply #553 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:40:14 PM »

Quote from: MileHigh on December 24, 2014, 05:30:31 PM

So what?

Yes and the piece of material will require mechanical energy to make it move if you want to output power from the coil into a load.

Thought experiment: You are blindfolded and the two wires from the coil are on your tongue. Someone moves the magnet in front of the coil and you feel the voltage on your tongue. Then, the magnet and the coil are stationary! Someone moves a ferrite core between the magnet and the coil and you feel the voltage on your tongue.

Can you tell the difference? The answer is that you cannot tell the difference.

In first post of this thread https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqWU12Db_MY - the kinetic energy is created by motor which is powered by the same generator it is running.
And I know the difference how much energy is required to turn generator shaft and how much energy it creates. It requires less energy to power motor than generator is giving on output when the magnetic flux is alternated by passing core instead of moving magnet or coil.
Also I am not going to waste time for proving it to you, you got all information already for building it. The most annoying thing here is finding posts every morning in this thread what has nothing to do with Syrain's generator and concepts how to make replication of it...

Dave45 · « **Reply #554 on:** December 24, 2014, 05:48:33 PM »

Im working on an alternator variant, need to order a pm for the alternator.
I figured this was the cheapest route to go since I have a few laying around.

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