Language: 
To browser these website, it's necessary to store cookies on your computer.
The cookies contain no personal information, they are required for program control.
  the storage of cookies while browsing this website, on Login and Register.

GDPR and DSGVO law

Storing Cookies (See : http://ec.europa.eu/ipg/basics/legal/cookies/index_en.htm ) help us to bring you our services at overunity.com . If you use this website and our services you declare yourself okay with using cookies .More Infos here:
https://overunity.com/5553/privacy-policy/
If you do not agree with storing cookies, please LEAVE this website now. From the 25th of May 2018, every existing user has to accept the GDPR agreement at first login. If a user is unwilling to accept the GDPR, he should email us and request to erase his account. Many thanks for your understanding.
Amazon Warehouse Deals ! Now even more Deep Discounts ! Check out these great prices on slightly used or just opened once only items.I always buy my gadgets via these great Warehouse deals ! Highly recommended ! Many thanks for supporting OverUnity.com this way.

User Menu

Tesla Paper

Free Energy Book

Get paid

Donations

Please Donate for the Forum.
Many thanks.
Regards, Stefan.(Admin)

A-Ads

Powerbox

Smartbox

3D Solar

3D Solar Panels

DC2DC converter

Micro JouleThief

FireMatch

FireMatch

CCKnife

CCKnife

CCTool

CCTool

Magpi Magazine

Magpi Magazine Free Rasberry Pi Magazine

Battery Recondition

Battery Recondition

Arduino

Ultracaps

YT Subscribe

Gravity Machines

Tesla-Ebook

Magnet Secrets

Lindemann Video

Navigation

Products

Products

WaterMotor kit

Statistics


  • *Total Posts: 524213
  • *Total Topics: 15608
  • *Online Today: 44
  • *Most Online: 103
(December 19, 2006, 11:27:19 PM)
  • *Users: 3
  • *Guests: 14
  • *Total: 17

Author Topic: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions  (Read 395800 times)

Offline Liberty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 524
    • DynamaticMotors
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #255 on: October 18, 2014, 04:27:50 PM »
LibertyThe wire(conductive path) dosnt pass through a constant magnetic field,it remains in a constant position in relation to the magnetic field,as the brush on the outer rim never changes position-thus the line(potential wire)between the outer brush and center brush is stationary(fixed) just as the magnetic field is.There is no increase or decrease of magnetic field strength,nor is there a moving wire passing over that constant magnetic field(as the two brushes are in a fixed position)-so there is no induction taking place.In order to fully understand as to how the HPG work's,we need to know what exactly a magnetic field is. And in order to know what a magnetic field is,we need to know how the HPG work's-the two go together in understanding each other.

The conductive path is constantly repositioning itself on a spinning disk (finding the path of least resistance) and is therefore in relative motion in respect to the magnetic field.  There is therefore constant movement as the conductive path is constantly repositioned on the surface of the disk while the disk is in motion, while in a constant magnetic field. 

Liberty

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #255 on: October 18, 2014, 04:27:50 PM »

Offline Magluvin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5832
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #256 on: October 18, 2014, 08:35:27 PM »
Probably one of the more interesting things about the homo polar motor is the fact that the ring magnet is able to spin with the disk and the disk still produces current. Now, is there any lenz braking happening while turning the disk with the ring magnet spinning with it while current is loaded from the disk? Is there resistance to turning the disk with the mag ring spinning with it? If there is, what is the wheel lenz braking against if the magnet spins with the disk?? If there is no lenz braking, and the faster we spin the wheel, the more current we get out without increasing drag, what does that mean to you?  One more thing. If there is lenz braking with using a disk, what can we replace the disk with to avoid it? ;)


Mags

Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #257 on: October 19, 2014, 01:19:22 AM »
The conductive path is constantly repositioning itself on a spinning disk (finding the path of least resistance) and is therefore in relative motion in respect to the magnetic field.  There is therefore constant movement as the conductive path is constantly repositioned on the surface of the disk while the disk is in motion, while in a constant magnetic field. 

Liberty
Liberty
I really do not think that this conductive path keeps jumping back up to reposition itself. This path between brushes would remain constant-no movement. That is like saying a light beam would bend if we spun a flash light around fast enough-just not going to happen.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #257 on: October 19, 2014, 01:19:22 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #258 on: October 19, 2014, 01:24:37 AM »
Probably one of the more interesting things about the homo polar motor is the fact that the ring magnet is able to spin with the disk and the disk still produces current. Now, is there any lenz braking happening while turning the disk with the ring magnet spinning with it while current is loaded from the disk? Is there resistance to turning the disk with the mag ring spinning with it? If there is, what is the wheel lenz braking against if the magnet spins with the disk?? If there is no lenz braking, and the faster we spin the wheel, the more current we get out without increasing drag, what does that mean to you?  One more thing. If there is lenz braking with using a disk, what can we replace the disk with to avoid it? ;)


Mags
Im guessing you mean a homopolar generator Mag's,not a homopolar motor.
So are saying there is a lenz force,and some are saying there is not. The only way to find answers is to build one i guess. As copper plate here is extremely expencive,i guess i will have to melt down some copper pipe,and make my own disk-say around 12 inches in diameter.Then to wind some very large coils for electromagnet's,as PM's that size would cost an arm and leg.

Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13968
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #259 on: October 19, 2014, 07:57:29 AM »
Probably one of the more interesting things about the homo polar motor is the fact that the ring magnet is able to spin with the disk and the disk still produces current. Now, is there any lenz braking happening while turning the disk with the ring magnet spinning with it while current is loaded from the disk? Is there resistance to turning the disk with the mag ring spinning with it? If there is, what is the wheel lenz braking against if the magnet spins with the disk?? If there is no lenz braking, and the faster we spin the wheel, the more current we get out without increasing drag, what does that mean to you?  One more thing. If there is lenz braking with using a disk, what can we replace the disk with to avoid it? ;)


Mags

You should buy a copy of Tom Valone's Homopolar Handbook. On the cover of that book is a photo of a large industrial homopolar dynamo, that is used in industry for billet heating and other things where you need huge currents but not much voltage. The way it works is that it is spun up to speed by hydraulic or other motive power, with peripheral brushes retracted off the disc. Then when it is at speed, with huge flywheel energy storage in the rotating disk, the peripheral brushes are slammed down onto the periphery of the disc and huge power is drawn off as very high currents for a few seconds as the rotation slows.

But in the text of the Handbook, you will find copies of the original research by Tom, and also the DePalma-Tewari documents, and a lot of other great information about homopolar dynamos. Many of the questions and problems posed in this thread are fully answered and explained in the Homopolar Handbook.

One of the more interesting things in the Handbook is the description of Tom's Master's thesis experiment, where he actually put an LED voltmeter _on the disk_  rotating with it. Can you guess his result?

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #259 on: October 19, 2014, 07:57:29 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline TinselKoala

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13968
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #260 on: October 19, 2014, 08:05:24 AM »
Im guessing you mean a homopolar generator Mag's,not a homopolar motor.
So are saying there is a lenz force,and some are saying there is not. The only way to find answers is to build one i guess. As copper plate here is extremely expencive,i guess i will have to melt down some copper pipe,and make my own disk-say around 12 inches in diameter.Then to wind some very large coils for electromagnet's,as PM's that size would cost an arm and leg.
Copper is nice because of its low resistance, and resistance is what kills homopolar dynamos. After all, when your generator voltage is only one or two volts maximum, it doesn't take much resistance to cut the current to nothing, even if there is a _lot_ of power available. But you don't have to use copper, you can use aluminum, it will work almost as well.
But there are plenty of torque-rpm graphs already available in the DePalma-Tewari work.


Offline vineet_kiran

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #261 on: October 19, 2014, 08:50:56 AM »

When you subject a current carrying conductor to extreme repulsion, conductor itself will bend but electrons will not be ejected out.   Why?

Does it mean that electrons are tightly held to mass of the conductor?   If moving electrons are tightly held to the conductor, how they will move? 

And why they are called free electrons???  (when they cannot jump out of conductor subjected to repulsion?)

Can some 'genius' answer it?

Movement of a large number of electrons is responsible for producing a strong magnetic field in a coil or in a PM.   Magnetic field produced by an individual electron would be very less.  Hence even if you bring a very strong repelling pole near a coil,   force experienced by individual electron will be neglible and it will not be ejected out of the coil.

If you create a very strong density of magnetic flux combining several strong magnetic fileds and bring a coil near it,  then individual electrons may experince strong force and will be ejected out of coil.

Same thing would have happenned in Philadelphia experiment, where a person entering into strong magnetic field started  emitting blue flame.    All electrons in his body would have been ejected out and his body would have got positively charged!
 


Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #261 on: October 19, 2014, 08:50:56 AM »
Sponsored links:




Offline Newton II

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 308
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #262 on: October 19, 2014, 11:55:31 AM »

If you create a very strong density of magnetic flux combining several strong magnetic fileds and bring a coil near it,  then individual electrons may experince strong force and will be ejected out of coil.



That would lead to an interesting experiment.   Take a lengthy wire, keep one end  immersed inside a strong magnetic field having very high flux density  and connect the other end of the wire to earth.   Electrons will be  ejected out from the wire at magnetic end creating a positive potential which causes  flow of electrons from earth to that  end of the wire.  But when electrons come to that spot,  they will be ejected out from that spot again.   So, a perpetaul flow of electrons is maintained in the wire from earth to magnetic end resulting in perpetual electric current!!!



Offline tinman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5231
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #263 on: October 19, 2014, 12:22:03 PM »

That would lead to an interesting experiment.   Take a lengthy wire, keep one end  immersed inside a strong magnetic field having very high flux density  and connect the other end of the wire to earth.   Electrons will be  ejected out from the wire at magnetic end creating a positive potential which causes  flow of electrons from earth to that  end of the wire.  But when electrons come to that spot,  they will be ejected out from that spot again.   So, a perpetaul flow of electrons is maintained in the wire from earth to magnetic end resulting in perpetual electric current!!!
Now wouldnt that be nice if it were true.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #263 on: October 19, 2014, 12:22:03 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline vineet_kiran

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 353
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #264 on: October 19, 2014, 01:32:14 PM »

That would lead to an interesting experiment.   Take a lengthy wire, keep one end  immersed inside a strong magnetic field having very high flux density  and connect the other end of the wire to earth.   Electrons will be  ejected out from the wire at magnetic end creating a positive potential which causes  flow of electrons from earth to that  end of the wire.  But when electrons come to that spot,  they will be ejected out from that spot again.   So, a perpetaul flow of electrons is maintained in the wire from earth to magnetic end resulting in perpetual electric current!!!


You can do one thing.   Take a wire which extends from earth to outer space.  Connect a photosensitive plate on one end of the wire at outer space and connect  the other end of wire to earth.    Photons from sun  falling on photosensitive plate eject electrons out from the plate by photoelectric effect.    Hence there will be a perpetual flow of electrons from earth to outer space producing perpetual electric current in the wire because sun's life is infinite compared to our lifespan.



Offline Liberty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 524
    • DynamaticMotors
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #265 on: October 19, 2014, 03:48:17 PM »
Liberty
I really do not think that this conductive path keeps jumping back up to reposition itself. This path between brushes would remain constant-no movement. That is like saying a light beam would bend if we spun a flash light around fast enough-just not going to happen.

You could be right about that Tinman.  But I find that induction in some form is always involved on the disk to create electrical charge on the disk from the motion and magnetic field.  It's more of a matter of how that separation of charge is tapped.  On the Faraday generator, he used a magnet on the area of the disk where the brushes were located (not on the rest of the disk), but as soon as the electrical potential on the disk escaped the magnetic field, it acted like an eddy current, and dissipated as loss and heat on the disk.  Tesla solved this by using a magnetic field on the entire disk to keep the charge separated.  Enjoyed the discussion and hearing others views.

Liberty

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #265 on: October 19, 2014, 03:48:17 PM »
3D Solar Panels

Offline Liberty

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 524
    • DynamaticMotors
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #266 on: October 19, 2014, 03:51:11 PM »
Copper is nice because of its low resistance, and resistance is what kills homopolar dynamos. After all, when your generator voltage is only one or two volts maximum, it doesn't take much resistance to cut the current to nothing, even if there is a _lot_ of power available. But you don't have to use copper, you can use aluminum, it will work almost as well.
But there are plenty of torque-rpm graphs already available in the DePalma-Tewari work.

I wonder if anyone has tried to use an inverter circuit to step up the voltage output right off of the generator output?  Seems like it would cut low voltage loss to only inverter loss.

Liberty

Offline Newton II

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 308
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #267 on: October 20, 2014, 12:06:50 PM »
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell's_equations

Quote :

"The other two describe how the fields "circulate" around their respective sources; the magnetic field "circulates" around electric currents and time varying electric fields in Ampère's law with Maxwell's addition, while the electric field "circulates" around time varying magnetic fields in Faraday's law."

"Maxwell's addition to Ampère's law is particularly important: it shows that not only does a changing magnetic field induce an electric field, but also a changing electric field induces a magnetic field."

While Maxwell's equations (along with the rest of classical electromagnetism) are extraordinarily successful at explaining and predicting a variety of phenomena, they are not exact, but approximations. In some special situations, they can be noticeably inaccurate. Examples include extremely strong fields (see Euler–Heisenberg Lagrangian) and extremely short distances (see vacuum polarization).

Offline sparks

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2528
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #268 on: October 20, 2014, 06:12:14 PM »
   In a circular particle accelerator they use magnetic fields to keep the charged particles from hitting the walls.  They accelerate them using efields and direct them by using bfields.    In copper there are a prime number of protons in the nucleus shielded by a large number of electrons in lower energy shells. The valence shell is always looking for electron pairs.  The atom is electrically neutral with it's 29 electrons and protons but due to electron pairing wants to loose one electron or gain one electron.  This makes for a good conductor as it is easy for the atom to give up an electron to a neighbor. The neighbor has eight and the donar 6.  The donar has a hole and the neighbor an excess electron.   An external force will easily overcome the pairing bond and move the excess electron to the atom with a hole.  This makes the electrons move in one direction while the holes move in the other.  To overcome the electron pairing and create a free electron you need only to affect the electron quantum spin properties.  Unlike in ionization where you need to add energy to the electron in order to free it.  Since electrons are spinnng they have magnetic dipole moments.  These dipole moments allow the electron to be effected by both the electric and magnetic fields. 

Offline Magluvin

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5832
Re: Magnet Myths and Misconceptions
« Reply #269 on: October 21, 2014, 03:13:13 AM »
You should buy a copy of Tom Valone's Homopolar Handbook. On the cover of that book is a photo of a large industrial homopolar dynamo, that is used in industry for billet heating and other things where you need huge currents but not much voltage. The way it works is that it is spun up to speed by hydraulic or other motive power, with peripheral brushes retracted off the disc. Then when it is at speed, with huge flywheel energy storage in the rotating disk, the peripheral brushes are slammed down onto the periphery of the disc and huge power is drawn off as very high currents for a few seconds as the rotation slows.

But in the text of the Handbook, you will find copies of the original research by Tom, and also the DePalma-Tewari documents, and a lot of other great information about homopolar dynamos. Many of the questions and problems posed in this thread are fully answered and explained in the Homopolar Handbook.

One of the more interesting things in the Handbook is the description of Tom's Master's thesis experiment, where he actually put an LED voltmeter _on the disk_  rotating with it. Can you guess his result?

Havnt bought the book yet.  But here is a review of his book, and the site it came from that seems to indulge in homopolar info.


" I have seen the "N" machine work. So have a lot of people. My only wish is that Bruce's dream for free energy for this planet does not die with him. If you are a tech type person please ignore the "naysayer" that debunks this info and experiment on your own.  Make your own conclusions by building your own "N" machine. I guarantee you won't be disappointed or be wasting your time. I also know Bruce Depalma will be smiling down on you...                                                                             Mike Galloway"




http://depalma.pair.com/valone.html


http://depalma.pair.com/index.html


Mags

 

OneLink