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New Battery systems => Crystal batteries => Topic started by: hartiberlin on April 14, 2014, 10:10:13 PM

Title: Allwest Power cell
Post by: hartiberlin on April 14, 2014, 10:10:13 PM
Hi All,
I am starting this thread here on Steve Allwest´s new Copper Magnesium Power Cells.

I hope he will be explaining here his great cells.

I have never seen such cells raise the short circuit current over time in my experiments,
so he just seems to have a very special battery developed.

I hope he will share here his invention with us.

Here is his Youtube channel:

https://www.youtube.com/user/Allwestconstruction/videos

and here is his latest video where you can see, how his cells
rise in output current when short circuited:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH1b4uU1w-8

Very well done Allwest !

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: e2matrix on April 14, 2014, 10:43:38 PM
Nearly all batteries are a chemical reaction.   When shorted they will heat up internally.   More heat will increase chemical activity (up to a point) and thus increase current.    Notice later in the video when the current dropped down quickly then slowly rose back up (as the battery heated up I assume).   
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on April 15, 2014, 05:53:35 AM
Hi Stephan,

Thanks for the thread

Obviously this is of interest for me as a hobby, I have been researching this for over 3 years off and on as time permits

There are other people that tried the early Allwest Power cells
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhSdrABm2cA
I have just expanded or exploited from the earlier versions, the real reason for the power with these new cells

You can see on some of my videos that the power level will stay for many hours 20+ with no depletion (cell being shorted), this is were I believe the galvanic portion of the cell is void and something else takes over

Back to chat when I get some time 












Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on April 16, 2014, 03:08:12 AM
This is an example of a cell raising in power over 8 hours

This is a private showing of a video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LpNqdndvpvo
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: hartiberlin on April 16, 2014, 12:27:57 PM
Hi Allwest,
sorry, the last video is set to private, youi have to set it to
unlisted, so also we can see it.

Well, I have never seen a crystal cell raising the shortcircuit current over time...

Does your cell get hot, when it does it ? That might explain the amperes rising...

Hmm... maybe you can do the ultimate test and use 8 cells in series =12 Volts output and power a 12 Volt 1 to 3 Watts
LED bulb with it and show us, how bright you get it ?

Looking forwad to a test to really see the power of these cells.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: PiCéd on April 16, 2014, 12:47:14 PM
Raising curent with short circuit ?
The question is to know what is the internal resistance, before and after the raising.
If after there is less internal (or the same in 1 hour for exemple) resistance than before it is realy intersting.
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on April 16, 2014, 08:14:23 PM
Reply

Hi Allwest,
sorry, the last video is set to private, youi have to set it to
unlisted, so also we can see it.
Try it now I just made it public

Well, I have never seen a crystal cell raising the shortcircuit current over time...

Does you cell get hot, when it does it ? That might explain the ampere rising...
As you know these cells can take a charge to greater levels of current, above 1 Amp, this very interesting in it self but the levels of current drop off like a normal battery
A rechargeable magnesium battery
What really interest me now is what happens to the cell when it bottoms out (this is what this video is about)
In this video the cell is not hot to the touch, this is what happens to all the cells at this point, when they are on a long short circuit test
They go down to a certain point and then just hang, after this, they fluctuate with the surrounding temperature,   I am sure it is self generating a little heat causing a temperature differential btween the copper and magnesium creating a TEG device, this is were I believe the galvanic action of the cell is void 

Hmm... maybe you can do the ultimate test and use 8 cells in series =12 Volts output and power a 12 Volt 1 to 3 Watts
LED bulb with it and show us, how bright you get it ? this will be easy fun when I get some time

Looking forwad to a test to really see the power of these cells.

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on April 17, 2014, 04:00:00 AM


This is a continuation of the last video, 33 hours still putting out power holding, (shorted)
unlisted video, see link below 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PfveaHOfm7E

After this I am going to put the cell on a trickle charge and see what happens

If any of you have not tried charging a cell like this, let me give you what I have found
When you charge it for any length of time and put it on the meter after the charge, the cell will most times read 6 Ma then go down to 1 or 0 Ma and stay there for awhile
After awhile being shorted on the meter the power will start climbing slowly at first then take off for the moon

When I was first starting to work on charging these cells I was very frustrated after a charge to have the power levels just go down to 0, until one day I left it on and came back to see the power level way up, other information on charging these cells if wanted

Also, if anybody has any ideas on how to charge these things, please make comments

Good luck to All


   
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Andy Shell on June 20, 2014, 06:12:11 PM
I have an Al, Cu cell that will triple in output current over 15-30min of being shorted out. I'll have to post the video of it this weekend.

From what I have compiled it is less likely a TEG and more likely heat &/or venting hydrogen is the byproduct of a chemical reaction between the anode and electrolytic causing an increase in current output. We can't rule out TEG but I've done extensive tests wet and dry & I have had this happen with and without cell temp increase. To claim TEG, I would like a scientific explanation of how the electrolytic is turning heat into current flow on an atomic/molecular level. Thats all.

Also, this high voltage anomoly is worth looking into. I suspect the extra 0.4v of the 1.8v is a result of bending the Mg ribbon into a U shape but wont know until I test it this weekend.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6cxcAdVgqQ


Andy
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on June 21, 2014, 05:35:10 PM
Very nice Voltage Andy

I have noticed a trade off in these types of cells, very high voltage and very low amps

Or the reverse

Good luck
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Andy Shell on July 18, 2014, 05:43:38 PM

I've tried a few different ways and have never been able to reach 1.8v with just Cu & Mg. I'm sure there is some trick to repititon of this anomaly but impossible to speculate on without a functioning stable unit. Very frustrating.

Just wanted to give an update on that.

Keep up the great work Steve!
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: hartiberlin on July 21, 2014, 09:29:05 PM
Hi Allwest,
any new LED test coming ?
We really would like to "see" the power of the cells.
Please show us lighting bigger sized LEDs with a few cells in series.
Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
P.S: Andy, 1.8 Volts is also not too bad,
what kind of Magnesium ribbon did you use ?
How many millamps was the short circuit current ?
Many thanks.
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Madebymonkeys on July 22, 2014, 12:43:07 AM
Hmm... maybe you can do the ultimate test and use 8 cells in series =12 Volts output and power a 12 Volt 1 to 3 Watts
LED bulb with it and show us, how bright you get it ?

Looking forwad to a test to really see the power of these cells.

I am not sure that's the ultimate test :-)
Why not just measure the voltage and current under a fixed load (or number of loads as separate tests) and get the power figures?
That, for me, would speak more than the 'brightness' of an LED. Incidentally, the perceived 'brightness' of an LED isn't linear with voltage or current - it's quite a poor indicator of the cells output power.

A couple of decent DMM's and some power resistors is infinitely more scientific  ;)
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on July 22, 2014, 04:30:41 AM
Hi Allwest,
any new LED test coming ?
We really would like to "see" the power of the cells.
Please show us lighting bigger sized LEDs with a few cells in series.
Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
P.S: Andy, 1.8 Volts is also not too bad,
what kind of Magnesium ribbon did you use ?
How many millamps was the short circuit current ?
Many thanks.

Hi Stefan,
I have been extremely busy with the business lately, so not much time to play with video's

I have been working with a new mag alloy lately with great results, "magnesium welding rod" it has an aluminum alloy in it that seems to keep the mag from corroding as fast with high powered cells that I have been making

Coil the rod to fit inside a copper pipe, cap one end,  try filling the pipe with potassium nitrate dry and see what you get

If you get it wet she will heat up, be carful

Just some ideas for you, take all necessary precautions

Do not try this unless you are a trained professional 

Best of luck
Allwest
   
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on July 22, 2014, 04:59:56 AM
I've tried a few different ways and have never been able to reach 1.8v with just Cu & Mg. I'm sure there is some trick to repititon of this anomaly but impossible to speculate on without a functioning stable unit. Very frustrating.

Just wanted to give an update on that.

Keep up the great work Steve!

Hi Andy

If you want high volts you should try mag with carbon, much higher than copper

Best of luck
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Andy Shell on July 22, 2014, 01:09:48 PM
Thanks Allwest! I've been trying to find a source of Mg Al alloy in a cylinder form for quite some time now! I'll have to look into pot nitrate.

I have been using Ni-chro, Cu, & graphite paper in my most recent cells. with graphite paper I get 1.8v for the first day or two but it drops to 1.5 after that. My last 3 youtube videos show this. I was trying to exploit the high voltage anomaly shown in the video a few posts up with just Mg & Cu but it seems a waist of time as Mg ribbon wire is so birttle.

Thanks again!

Andy
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on July 23, 2014, 03:29:45 AM
Thanks Allwest! I've been trying to find a source of Mg Al alloy in a cylinder form for quite some time now! I'll have to look into pot nitrate.

I have been using Ni-chro, Cu, & graphite paper in my most recent cells. with graphite paper I get 1.8v for the first day or two but it drops to 1.5 after that. My last 3 youtube videos show this. I was trying to exploit the high voltage anomaly shown in the video a few posts up with just Mg & Cu but it seems a waist of time as Mg ribbon wire is so birttle.

Thanks again!

Andy

Andy,
Your welcome for the mag welding rod tip
Let me know how the mag welding rod works, so far it has worked great in some test cells, much stronger than the mag ribbon 
Note: the KNO3 works like a salt bridge
I will look into using Ni-chro, Thanks 

Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on September 05, 2014, 03:45:24 AM
Hello All,

I have been working with some high amp cells, but what has impressed me the most is the low amp (20 MA) dry cell that has been running an LED for over a month holding .80 volts with no signs of depleting

I am not sure how to test this cell to see what it is capable of, the magnesium is showing very little signs of corrosion ( the magnesium I am using with this cell is a magnesium welding rod)

Right now I am measuring the volts while the cell is connected to the LED

Any help on how to long term test this would be appreciated

Thanks
Steve 
Title: Re: Allwest Power cell
Post by: Allwest on September 15, 2014, 12:03:22 AM
Working on new mix designs for the higher volts with some good results, 2.7 volts for one cell

Magnesium and graphite

When this cell is first created it hits about 1.8 volts and them climbs up to about 2.250 by itself when dry

After a couple of days I charged it for about 15min with the following results 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKa90lIVB-M&feature=youtu.be