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### Author Topic: 3v OU Flashlight  (Read 534267 times)

#### EMJunkie

• Hero Member
• Posts: 3322
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #525 on: May 09, 2014, 07:52:39 AM »
...

~A

Beautiful Work Avalon!

All the Best

Chris

#### FixedSys

• Newbie
• Posts: 28
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #526 on: May 09, 2014, 04:15:10 PM »
If understand correctly; these circuits comprise only two signal generators, one coil and one load. They are tuned using the signals.

Can I then expect a similar degree of success developing and experimenting with software that:

frequency = lower limit of soundcard (20Hz)
While frequency is lower than upper limit of soundcard (20KHz)
Generate a fixed duration burst of signals (two harmonically related sine waves?) out of the two soundcard channels (low or high Z?) into a coil/circuit, back out into a soundcard input (low or high Z?).
When the input signal falls below a fixed threshold; record the timestamp and frequency, increment the signal frequency by a factor (double?)
Loop

The frequency that created the longest interval between timestamps would then be the most interesting.

I'm thinking that the soundcard is the signal generator and the load, so what else would the circuit need besides a coil? Would the input or output impedance match the soundcard range at all?
I'm probably oversimplifying this, but how?

#### Vortex1

• Hero Member
• Posts: 518
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #527 on: May 09, 2014, 05:14:31 PM »
It would.
...and if you had a short HF low current winding there, its inductance would reflect the instantaneous width of that gap. A very useful information.
The MC34063 can extract this info as an easily integrateable pulse widths, when operating in constant current mode with constant load.

What is your idea how to utilize the kinetic energy gained by the core halves?

There are many ways to do this, but one way without complicating things too much would probably be to use the core halves themselves as generators by adding a bias, either extra current in one winding or PM.

Of course a completely separate coil / magnet would extract energy and also dampen the Q

#### itsu

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1845
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #528 on: May 09, 2014, 05:47:19 PM »

My potcores arrived (4.7cm / Al 9500) so i went for the 5.4 / 2.7mH setup using a pot core.
I used another fet (BS170), but there was no noticeable difference with the MJE13009 transistor

Screenshot is taken at 3.3V @310mA

5.4mH is at W2, but i tried many variations like swapping W1/W2, swapping the leads on W2 and/or W1, varying the voltage
and off course the pot meter.

Never did the leds want to stay on longer after removing the supply voltage.

Next i will try to move the MOSFET/transistor like suggested by Vortex1 here:
http://www.overunity.com/14524/3v-ou-flashlight/msg401301/#msg401301

Regards Itsu

#### lost_bro

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 282
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #529 on: May 09, 2014, 05:58:34 PM »
My potcores arrived (4.7cm / Al 9500) so i went for the 5.4 / 2.7mH setup using a pot core.
......
Regards Itsu

Good day Itsu

Have you tried to 'characterize' the 'ferro-resonance' frequency of this new POT core?

I agree with Vortex1 (ION) that one could spend an eternity trying to guess the tuning for this animal without  some kind of starting point for reference.

I would love to know if anyone has used a spectrum analyzer, like the Rigol seen in the Akula videos to 'characterize'  their cores?

To carry out a thorough analysis of the problem one must consider *all* of the datum .... maybe we should consider to look at it from the frequency domain perspective.  Apparently Akula did....

take care, peace.
lost_bro

#### avalon

• Full Member
• Posts: 160
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #530 on: May 09, 2014, 07:53:00 PM »
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.

The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.

Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.

~A

#### Grumage

• Hero Member
• Posts: 1117
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #531 on: May 09, 2014, 08:03:07 PM »
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.

The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.

Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.

~A

Dear Avalon.

What the Guys over at SETI would have called, the WOW signal !!

Keep up the great work.

Cheers Grum.

#### semenihin-77

• Full Member
• Posts: 161
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #532 on: May 09, 2014, 08:10:52 PM »
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.

The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.

Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.

~A

перебор.....

bust

#### Vortex1

• Hero Member
• Posts: 518
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #533 on: May 09, 2014, 08:15:27 PM »
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.

The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.

Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.

~A

Before you lose your voice it is important to note input current and voltage as well as output current and voltage even if into a load resistor, which I prefer. As an example, a 1 or 2 Watt carbon slug resistor of the proper value on your secondary will tell quickly if you have real power.

It is easy to get high voltage especially from a tank circuit or self capacitance of the output coil if unloaded. How is your secondary connected or is it floating? Best to supply the schematic you are currently using in your test and the probing points with a note.

CFL's are a bad choice for a load unless you have previously characterized it's light output. They can be lit with very low current high voltage, high frequency if you don't warm the filaments.

With the resistor, heating will tell the whole story and they are easy to characterize. The best is a low power incandescent 7 Watts or less, they are available up to 220 Volts. The relative brightness of such a lamp is an indicator of real power plus you can characterize it by temperature which is easy to measure with today's DMM's. Just glue the thermocouple to the bulb envelope and characterize it ahead of time by creating a chart of input power vs. temperature. Same for a resistor.

If you can get your circuit to sustain disconnected from the power supply for a very long time (hours or days), you have achieved it load or no load, as the chips and switching losses themselves are a load albeit small.

#### avalon

• Full Member
• Posts: 160
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #534 on: May 09, 2014, 08:43:36 PM »
перебор.....
bust
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.

~A

#### scratchrobot

• Sr. Member
• Posts: 401
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #535 on: May 09, 2014, 08:44:49 PM »
I am speechless over here.
I do no know for sure what I have found, but my 3v flashlight V2.0 went crazy.

The power supply is at 2.59V, but I now have over 1 kV on the secondary! (540V in the picture)
It is, obviously, a resonance, but at this stage I am inclined to think it is a magnetostrictive resonance excited by an external (primary) magnetic field.

Anyway, at 230V ~ RMS it looks like I have enough power to light up a relatively big CFL light bulb while having the circuit self-sustain.

~A

Good job
I got smoke from my scope

#### Vortex1

• Hero Member
• Posts: 518
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #536 on: May 09, 2014, 09:05:59 PM »
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.

~A

Well that is more interesting if the current was limited, but what was the value and voltage rating of your storage capacitor, they can store a lot of energy over time by charging up despite the current limiting of your supply, especially if you lost voltage feedback to pin 5, the duty cycle would increase and voltage on the rail would soar on that capacitor. Can you reference the schematic you are using.

Also a good forensic analysis of your coil winding technique would be an important post mortem so that it can be replicated.

#### avalon

• Full Member
• Posts: 160
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #537 on: May 09, 2014, 09:18:46 PM »
Can you reference the schematic you are using.
The schematic is on the page 5 of the Onsemi datasheet. The only difference is that I use a variable resistor on the feedback (22K) and there is the secondary coil.
The coils are 37mH primary and 57 mH secondary.

~A

#### croco31

• Newbie
• Posts: 13
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #538 on: May 09, 2014, 09:40:00 PM »
Hi all,
beware of the probe setting 1:1 or 1:10: i saw plenty of volts just because probe was set to 1:1 and scope to 1:10.
For the moment no positive result or my own clone of this LED OU circuit: it works fine as a standard step_up circuit.
When the output 1000µF is removed, the 34063 is always working at its maximum frequency: why removing it ?
Regards.

#### starcruiser

• Hero Member
• Posts: 693
##### Re: 3v OU Flashlight
« Reply #539 on: May 09, 2014, 10:09:57 PM »
I know, right?
Anyway, I am re-building the circuit again. At some stage the voltage increased even further and the coil started 'dancing' around the table. Then (with a big spark) both LEDs, MC34063, and a couple of capacitors gone up in smoke.
BTW, the power supply is limiting the current to 100 mA max so all that power didn't come from the PSU.

~A

Perhaps a bigger/larger load? Sounds promising though. keep up the good work!