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Author Topic: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)  (Read 1660750 times)

Offline chrisC

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #915 on: May 13, 2014, 05:28:49 PM »
WITTS does not and never has had any working technology such as they have claimed. ....


You speak with incredible arrogance.
cheers,
chrisC

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy


Offline MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #916 on: May 13, 2014, 05:31:45 PM »

You speak with incredible arrogance.
cheers,
chrisC
My statement is correct.  Even one time big Timothy Thrapp believer Sterling Allan has been warning people about Timothy Thrapp's scam:

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:World_Improvement_Through_The_Spirit_Ministries

"BUYER BEWARE: "I know people who have given Tim a lot of money and have never gotten anything for it." -- a pillar in the community, Sept. 5, 2012 "

The WITTS site itself is a hoot.  They claim to be responsible for most of modern technology.  If that were so then they would also be responsible for putting it into the hands to the very powers that be that they rail against. 

http://www.witts.ws/about-us/

Offline chrisC

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #917 on: May 13, 2014, 05:33:56 PM »
My statement is correct.


Yah, I agree. On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog...
cheers,
chrisC

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #917 on: May 13, 2014, 05:33:56 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #918 on: May 13, 2014, 05:40:02 PM »
Here are some more thoughts about my QEG 2.0 model:

1)  Core losses and eddy current Lenz drag have been ignored, so that means core losses would show up as a reduction
I think you mean increase here.
Quote
in the power dissipation of both the primary load and primary winding.  I previously estimated core losses at around 900 watts for a CEG putting out something around 10KW, so in my test run results the total output figure would remain the same and a core loss component of about 900 watts would be added and the dissipation for both the primary load and the primary winding would both need to be scaled downward appropriately.

2)  Lenz drag due to eddy currents in the rotor would increase the input torque, at this point by an unknown about. 
I think you have worked out the magnetic field strength.  If we also know the materials, then we know the conductivity and can compute the eddy currents and resulting Lorentz forces.
Quote

3)  I now believe I employed the arbitrary inductor model improperly for the primary winding of the CEG 2.0 model.  That may be the cause of the parasitic oscillations and the unrealistic behavior.  I'll have to do some more magnetic analyses to fix that. 
It could also be that the basic behavior is right but that the numerical approximations are not accurate enough.  At least for purposes of diagnosing the problem adding series and shunt resistances as you have already started to do could provide a good deal of insight.
Quote


Pmgr:

Because the coupling coefficient of the primary to secondary goes from a maximum, estimated.95, to a minimum of zero 4 times per rotor revolution.  I suspect power transfer from the primary to the secondary will be quite poor.  Because of that I decided to extract power directly from the primary.  The expect the coupling coefficient modulation is also the source of the frequency doubling you see in the secondary of your simulation.

Offline MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #919 on: May 13, 2014, 05:52:52 PM »

Yah, I agree. On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog...
cheers,
chrisC
Your average canine has a lot better character than many of the charlatans out there such as Timothy Thrapp.

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #919 on: May 13, 2014, 05:52:52 PM »
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Offline F_Brown

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #920 on: May 13, 2014, 06:01:20 PM »

I think you mean increase here.


I'm pretty sure I mean decrease.  This touches upon something that has been buggering me for a while now.  "Over-Unity" as well as "Under-Unity" are quite misleading buzz words.  With all factors about a device taken into account any proper efficiency analysis should show that the device operates exactly at unity.  If the COP deviates either way from unity, then the analysis is flawed; something is missing.  That is to say in a proper analysis all input sources are identified and quantified, and all output sinks are identified and quantified.

So my view on the core losses is that for the same input power, core losses would have reduced the power available to be dissipated by the DC resistance of both the primary winding and the load before the power even got that far, because the power has to go through the core first in order to get there.  Just as easily one could say for the same amount of power dissipated in the primary winding and load with core losses added on top, then the input power would have to be adjusted upward to accommodate that increase in the total output power. 

Quote

I think you have worked out the magnetic field strength.  If we also know the materials, then we know the conductivity and can compute the eddy currents and resulting Lorentz forces.It could also be that the basic behavior is right but that the numerical approximations are not accurate enough.  At least for purposes of diagnosing the problem adding series and shunt resistances as you have already started to do could provide a good deal of insight.

Yes, the damping circuitry is a band-aid and will affect the accuracy of the resulting simulation.  Ultimately, I would like to run the simulation without any "stabilizing" additions.

The FEMM analyses took into account the the properties of the M19 core material, although FEMM lacks the facilities to calculate eddy currents created by motion.  So some other application would have to be used to determine the magnitude of those rotor currents and drag forces they create.   

What I missed was to collect data on the saturation current level for the primary winding at various rotor angles and include that data in the arbitrary inductor model.  That's going to require another round of FEMM analyses and the creation of a third look up table to properly implement.

Also, I noticed I really should have run the FEMM analyses for the primary inductance and rotor torque out to primary current of 10 amperes instead of just 4, in order to have sufficient headroom for transient current spikes.  So for now it's one step back...


Pmgr:

Have you considered that the entire secondary of the QEG may be a "Red Herring" created by Timothy Thrapp, in order to misdirect people about where power may be successfully extracted from the device.

Offline F_Brown

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #921 on: May 13, 2014, 11:03:12 PM »
Well, I did a few more FEMM analyses and found that the saturation current for the QEG primary only varies from 4.5A when the rotor is aligned with a pole to 6.5A when the rotor is aligned in between poles.  So, I set the saturation current level in the arbitrary inductor model for the median value of 5.5A, and all the simulation problems went away.

I was able to remove all the "stabilizing" additions.  The QEG model 2.1 now runs 10 times faster, which is about the same speed the 1.0 version ran at, has exponential build up of current and voltage, has a roughly sinusoidal wave form in the primary, has asymmetrical cogging torque.  I think my tables are working as intended now.

More tests under way...

And I do still need to generate the saturation current vs rotor angle data and create a third table for that.   

I also slowed down the rotor drive to see what would happen

***

Date: Tue May 13 17:19:51 2014
Total elapsed time: 42.525 seconds.

RPM 6,000 Load 1k5 Tank 200 Hz

torque: AVG(v(nm))=-21.6878 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
load_rms_volts: RMS(v(load))=3476.13 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
load_rms_amps: RMS(i(load))=2.31742 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
load_avg_va: AVG(v(load)*i(load))=8055.65 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
load_avg_volts: AVG(v(load))=0.19909 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
load_avg_amps: AVG(i(load))=0.000132727 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9
coil_avg_va: AVG(84*i(l1)**2)=451.117 FROM 0.4 TO 0.9

13,677 watts input
8,507 watt output
0.624 COP

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #921 on: May 13, 2014, 11:03:12 PM »
Sponsored links:




Offline F_Brown

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #922 on: May 14, 2014, 12:55:23 AM »
Ari,

I tried to match your setup, with 30 ohm load, and about 900 watts draw at the motor.  This is what I got. 
I think it's in the neighborhood aye?

Date: Tue May 13 18:38:54 2014
Total elapsed time: 36.147 seconds.

Load 30 Ohms (in series with primary)
Rotor speed 100 RPS
Tank Resonance 200Hz

torque: AVG(v(nm))=-1.2249 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
load_rms_volts: RMS(v(load))=73.9814 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
load_rms_amps: RMS(i(load))=2.46605 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
load_avg_va: AVG(v(load)*i(load))=182.441 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
load_avg_volts: AVG(v(load))=0.00585677 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
load_avg_amps: AVG(i(load))=0.000195224 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8
coil_avg_va: AVG(84*i(l1)**2)=510.836 FROM 0.3 TO 0.8

769.7 Watts input to rotor shaft
182.4 Watts dissipated in 30 ohm load, COP 0.237
693.2 Watts dissipated in load and primary winding, COP 0.901

769.7 watts provided by a 85% efficient motor means motor
will draw 905 watts from mains.

Here is image of voltage and current waveforms across the load:
« Last Edit: May 14, 2014, 04:45:22 AM by F_Brown »

Offline Farmhand

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #923 on: May 14, 2014, 01:22:14 AM »
I'm pretty sure I mean decrease.  This touches upon something that has been buggering me for a while now.  "Over-Unity" as well as "Under-Unity" are quite misleading buzz words.  With all factors about a device taken into account any proper efficiency analysis should show that the device operates exactly at unity.  If the COP deviates either way from unity, then the analysis is flawed; something is missing.  That is to say in a proper analysis all input sources are identified and quantified, and all output sinks are identified and quantified.


You're quite right Mr Brown, if all input and outputs + losses are considered everything runs at unity. This only leaves one logical definition for over unity and that is anything with a C.O.P. of over 1.0 is over unity, this can be done as C.O.P. is a function of our input to actual output.

An example of very high C.O.P. devices are wind turbines and solar panels.

An example of a self runner is a solar system with storm shutters or solar position tracking where the shutters or the tracking motor is powered by energy collected by the solar panels themselves. Or a solar powered vehicle even. Self runners already exist.

I believe the holy grail is a machine that can self run 24/7 and output excess power by utilizing an environmental energy input so that the fickle sun and wind become obsolete.

However I don't think the QEG has any such facility for any free environmental energy to be input. Although there are other possibilities but not many people think of the actual mechanism of harnessing extra energy from a given source and set out to do so, most are hell bent on replicating shaky claims in the hope they will be the one to show over unity and save the world.

I wish all the thousands of minds would think in their own way about how energy can be utilized from the environment.

Some see lighting LED's for extended periods as useful, I wish them well but I don't agree, considering our environment is so rich in man made electrical noise LEDs can be lit in a lot of funky ways but OU it isn't and not very useful. If I run a bought from the shop 300 Watt inverter from one 12 volt battery with another next to it the unused battery can excite a coil and light an LED from one battery pole due to the HF noise. Ala Stiffler ect.

When my electric fence was in good shape and had no grass shorts I de energised it and scoped the open wires and ground, I was able to see three or more different frequencies on there. I can pick up the electric fence pulses on my scope from over 50 meters away by scoping the ground and a coil. I'm thinking of a way to calibrate the scope trace when the fence is working well without shorts from branches or breaks, so that I can diagnose the fence's operation from my experiment hut, check for shorts.  ;)

..

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #923 on: May 14, 2014, 01:22:14 AM »
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Offline MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #924 on: May 14, 2014, 02:02:39 AM »
COP and efficiency coefficients generally refer to the useful output divided by the expended input.  Output that is in the form of unused heat is usually considered loss.  For the same sunlight, a solar thermal collector where heat is the useful output is around 75% efficient delivering that heat to the heat transfer fluid, while PV where electricity is the useful output is constrained to about 20% for single layer modules.  For a machine like the QEG the idea is to be a generator.  Anything less than self-running makes it a complicated and noisy heater.

Offline ariovaldo

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #925 on: May 14, 2014, 04:41:38 AM »
One more simple update
Correction: In the video I said the capacitance was 0.125 uF and now is 0.83 uF, but isn't. It was 0.125, and now is 0.083




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Akf-DZU1_-o


Cheers
Ariovaldo

Free Energy | searching for free energy and discussing free energy

Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #925 on: May 14, 2014, 04:41:38 AM »
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Offline F_Brown

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #926 on: May 14, 2014, 04:50:47 AM »
Ari,

Did you mention the DC resistance of the primary and secondary windings some where?

And is your core the same dimensions as is mentioned in the QEG manual?

Cheers,

Fred

Offline ariovaldo

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #927 on: May 14, 2014, 05:02:43 AM »
Ari,

Did you mention the DC resistance of the primary and secondary windings some where?

And is your core the same dimensions as is mentioned in the QEG manual?

Cheers,

Fred
Tomorrow afternoon I can check the resistance. I had done that but I don't recall at this moment. The core has the dimensions as is mentioned in the manual. The intention is to get a HV probe and check the voltage across the capacitors.

Offline Hope

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #928 on: May 14, 2014, 10:36:13 AM »
Richard, yes I thought you are the crook HopeGirl. 
We don't have interns flashing underwear here, Bill has other places to be.


When you realize your wrong and you have made mistakes the adult thing to do is to admit it and apologize.  Not make a joke of your mistakes and ignore the consequences. 

Offline MarkE

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Re: Quantum Energy Generator (QEG) Open Sourced (by HopeGirl)
« Reply #929 on: May 14, 2014, 01:06:33 PM »

When you realize your wrong and you have made mistakes the adult thing to do is to admit it and apologize.  Not make a joke of your mistakes and ignore the consequences.
Richard, what part of my direct statement that I mistook you for Hope Girl do you not find to be an admission?

I didn't make a joke of my mistake.  I made a joke of your suggestion that I might confuse anyone with the handle Clinton for the ex President or former First Lady.

 

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