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Solid States Devices => solid state devices => Topic started by: ofgp.fdi on March 17, 2014, 06:44:54 PM

Title: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: ofgp.fdi on March 17, 2014, 06:44:54 PM
Hello,

we are interessted in doing things bringing people forward.
We read about the Bi-Torroid Transformer from Thane Heins. That sounds to good to be true. But there is only one way to know the truth.
We decieded to build our own one.
Here is the Video from the Transformator and how we tested it(Also with results)
http://youtu.be/j-dZj4-PU9s
We hope to help people who want to do the same thing and help them saving money and time.
When you have questions, please ask.

Kind Regards
O.F.G.P

Sorry for my english :)
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: dieter on March 27, 2014, 10:45:48 PM
hi, good to hear somebody is doing a BTT replication. Too bad youtube has declared war to me, in becoming pure PIDA by crashing my varioud browsers frequently, refusing to play, acting like malware by disallowing me to close that Tab (!)... Long story short, I would like to see less tube links and more fotos, diagrams and test data.


Since the BTT is so simple, I make one as a side project, tho I may not be able to test it without an oscilliscope. Well, actually I could just add a significant load like a few hundred watts, then turn all other devices off/disconnect them from mains, then go and watch the watt meter in the ceilar.


This is something I would like to discuss: the BTT claims to remain 90 out of phase, regardless of the load. But even although the power factor is then zero, the grid must provide the voltage and the amperes, which consumes energy. How much energy is required to provide a zero power factor? Is it really OU in the end of the day, or did we only fool the watt meter and keep our bills low? And in essence: can such a system be a closed loop, providing the reactive input power from the output?


Regards

Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: dieter on March 27, 2014, 11:11:41 PM
ok, now I managed to watch the video. And hey, I've already watched that. I wanted to add a comment but tube didn' let me, so here it is.


Hallo erstmal, ich weiss gar nicht ob Sie's wussten, aber... so you basicly say it didn't work. You show in the oscilloscope that the power factor becomes 1 under load, which contradicts other test results, like eg.:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivm8aaQu00w


Why did you make a 1mm Airgap? Thane stated that pressing two surfaces together is enough of an airgap. Also, your secondaries have 2 coils each, one 120v, the other 6 v... why? Are they bifilar? Did you mention the core material? Do you have access to ferrite or metglass cores (read: would you invest a couple of euros)?




Can you make a Test without the Airgap?





Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: gyulasun on March 27, 2014, 11:49:34 PM
 ::)
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: PiCéd on March 28, 2014, 03:05:01 PM
post 1:
If with no load you are not in phase and then with load you are almost (?) in phase, why not.
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: dieter on March 28, 2014, 06:00:54 PM
PICéd, read about Thane Heins' BTT bitorroid transformer.


I hope the original thread poster will show up here.
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: ofgp.fdi on April 15, 2014, 07:02:56 PM
Sorry for my late reply, i have a job that needs also my time.

I build the air gap because i thought the feedback must be lower than without an air gap.
So i thought without air gap the Power factor (PF) must even closer to 1.
Now i thing the air gap does not matter.

I tried many different loads from 0,5 Watts up to 300 Watts.
There was no difference at all in the PF.

My first experiments show the same fantastic results, low Watt, low Amps, and i thought WOW it works.
Later i realized there must be something wrong with my equipment, so i decided to buy all things that i need to measure it correctly. After all investments in measuring devices i saw there is no overunity.
I saw the videos with high frequenzy(FQ) and i make some tests with my Bi-Torroid Transfomer (up to 500Hz Rectangle)and i saw there is no difference, no overunity.
The only Thing that i noticed is that it was much more difficult to measure the corret Power at higher FQ !

My Bi-Torroid Transfomer is build with Core Iron(M 250-35 A) the best Iron i can get!

But this electric sheet of iron is not build for high FQ.

I don´t have a Ferrit core to make the experiment.

If somebody give me his Replication i can do the job to measure it, and show the results.
I think i have now the equipment to measure it correctly!

Kind Regards
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: MenofFather on April 15, 2014, 07:36:49 PM
Sorry for my late reply, i have a job that needs also my time.

I build the air gap because i thought the feedback must be lower than without an air gap.
So i thought without air gap the Power factor (PF) must even closer to 1.
Now i thing the air gap does not matter.

I tried many different loads from 0,5 Watts up to 300 Watts.
There was no difference at all in the PF.

My first experiments show the same fantastic results, low Watt, low Amps, and i thought WOW it works.
Later i realized there must be something wrong with my equipment, so i decided to buy all things that i need to measure it correctly. After all investments in measuring devices i saw there is no overunity.
I saw the videos with high frequenzy(FQ) and i make some tests with my Bi-Torroid Transfomer (up to 500Hz Rectangle)and i saw there is no difference, no overunity.
The only Thing that i noticed is that it was much more difficult to measure the corret Power at higher FQ !

My Bi-Torroid Transfomer is build with Core Iron(M 250-35 A) the best Iron i can get!

But this electric sheet of iron is not build for high FQ.

I don´t have a Ferrit core to make the experiment.

If somebody give me his Replication i can do the job to measure it, and show the results.
I think i have now the equipment to measure it correctly!

Kind Regards
I try on small ferite transformer core and on hight frenquency bit toroid transformer, then one secondary coil is shorted, other on load. I not get overunity. Get tipical transformation. I put in restangles of 12-17 volts into primary. Primary can be conected to capasitor. But maybe need first run it on normal transformer and then from normal transformer put to this bitt toroid transformer? Because it using reactive power and if I directly puting restanges it can not return power to supply maybe? And maybe need more prestision making that things, not like I made on small transformer.
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: dieter on April 15, 2014, 08:18:39 PM
Thank you for your answer. Meanwhile I made an improvised test. I noticed the "Heins-Wings" , (the outer core of you want) do at least have some kind of an effect, but probably not overunity. When I connected it to a 12 ac supply where it would normally draw 20 watts and way overload it, with the wings the wattmeter read only 7 watts. Then I tried something weird, I used the two secondaries in series as primaries and in series with a 100uF cap. The watts dropped to zero. Bringing the current out of phase with a cap may be an interesting feature, see also GotoLuc on youtube,about reactive generators, where he runs a generator-inverter pseudoclosed loop.  (luc choquette  , osä.)


Regards
Title: Re: Bi-Toroid Replication/Rebuild and Testing O.F.G.P
Post by: PiCéd on April 15, 2014, 08:31:16 PM
Quote
the Power factor (PF) must even closer to 1
It is exactely the contrary to the tests of J.L.N who was close to 0 (apparently).
So, there is nothing more for the one or the other.